Iliah Borg
Veteran Member
Maybe to wait for raw files? Mk3 is a very sharp camera given focus is OK. 5D has very weak AA filter, to the point it is prone to moire.
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Official D3 samples here
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echelon2004
Veteran Member
typical 12mp in general, iso200-800 on eos5D vs D3 iso400 (last two samples)
I think the high ISO shots look perfectly good, the low ISO seems to be lacking some detail which I would expect to be there.
Isn't the file sizes rather small as well? Maybe it's just too high compression...
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Anders
Some of my pictures can be seen at;
http://teamexcalibur.se/US/usindex.html
event photography and photo journalism
I think the high ISO shots look perfectly good, the low ISO seems to be lacking some detail which I would expect to be there.
Isn't the file sizes rather small as well? Maybe it's just too high compression...
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Anders
Some of my pictures can be seen at;
http://teamexcalibur.se/US/usindex.html
event photography and photo journalism
Iliah Borg
Veteran Member
David SL
Veteran Member
What does that have to do with the peach fuzz (ie. detail) clearly visible on the girls face at ISO 3200?I take it you have never used a camera without AA filter...about the peach fuzz but then I realized you were talking about the
ISO 400 image, I was looking at the ISO 3200 image!Still the
peach fuzz is there with every gob of detail. Some people see (or
don't see) what they want...the objective viewer can't deny the
detail retention is quite good for this jpeg engine , imagined
resolution loss from AA filter mumbo jumbo aside.
Of course I have compared jpg to raw between many cameras over the years, I've been a member of this site for almost 10 years check my posting history, you got me on the Leica though, not interested.
really? it looks a hell of a lot more detailed than any other 12mp camera image I've seen shot at the same ISO. I'd be happy to scrutinize samples you have that I may not have seen.
Regards,
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jean bernier
Veteran Member
Snappy service as usual.
Regards
JB
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Jean Bernier
All photographs are only more or less credible illusions
Regards
JB
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Jean Bernier
All photographs are only more or less credible illusions
Iliah Borg
Veteran Member
First of all, I totally agree with your point in regards to AA filter. 5D has a weak AA filter, and even available 1Ds series cameras can't beat Kodak SLR/n. Now I have a habit of removing AA filters from each and every camera I have.
Second, I agree with your point in regards to out of camera JPGs. Those are converted in an uncontrolled "average" way. Nikon made a huge progress in their in-camera JPG engine, but I think it is still a necessity to process in camera in a conservative mode when it comes to sharpening and to overdo noise reduction.
Lets see NEFs first.
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echelon2004
Veteran Member
Nothing of course, I still don't talk about the iso 3200 imageWhat does that have to do with the peach fuzz (ie. detail) clearlyI take it you have never used a camera without AA filter...about the peach fuzz but then I realized you were talking about the
ISO 400 image, I was looking at the ISO 3200 image!
peach fuzz is there with every gob of detail. Some people see (or
don't see) what they want...the objective viewer can't deny the
detail retention is quite good for this jpeg engine , imagined
resolution loss from AA filter mumbo jumbo aside.
visible on the girls face at ISO 3200?
the iso3200 sample's fine, the two bottom ones are the problem.
Interested or not, go to phils review of it and look at the last page of comparisions and read the note.
Didn't mean to be rude, sorry about that. But there's sometimes huge amount of usable resolution that you can pull from the raw which you can't see in the jpg. Sometimes the difference is very small, as it is with the D2x. I hope that the difference is really big on the D3 because this is not 12mp resolution at ISO400.
Different expectations obviously
But I'm sure the camera is excellent and that what I see, or rather, don't see will be fixed one way or another!
Cheers
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Anders
Some of my pictures can be seen at;
http://teamexcalibur.se/US/usindex.html
event photography and photo journalism
Todd Avery
Veteran Member
Interesting. I've seen LOTS of shots with + - 1/3 stop or so. Just never seen anyone pull it back 1.5 stops before. That's a lot of light to manipulate with that tool it seems.
I guess I just don't get the WHY of it.
I guess I just don't get the WHY of it.
David SL
Veteran Member
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Hi DKjos,
You may be right.
I’m more than happy to wait and see what the images from the production models look like. I’ll be particularly interested to see the comparisons done by DC Watch.
GMT+1 (BST)
You may be right.
I’m more than happy to wait and see what the images from the production models look like. I’ll be particularly interested to see the comparisons done by DC Watch.
--mpixel,
Your posts reflect a balanced, critical view of camera performance,
but I wonder if your observation about the 5D vs D3 and MKIII will
hold up. As I look at the Nikon 6400 ISO nightclub image I see the
cleanest 6400 I've ever seen together with decent detail, despite NR
on. The face and hat comprise the area of focus. Viewed on a 2560 x
1600 monitor, and printed at 8.5 x 11, these areas appear noise free
and detailed - each skin pore - each whisker - each hat thread and
even a hint of veins in
comparison is nice, but.. the ISO is one stop down, there's twice as
much available light, and there's more noise - especially chroma -
compared to the D3 image. The 5D image also holds no more detail.
Several things contribute to its sense of detail. Because this was
taken at 400mm, most of the picture comprises the area of focus, and
the image shows obvious signs of sharpening. The D3 image has no
such sharpened appearance. The MKIII comparative images at 6400
aren't even in the same ball game as 5D and D3. I realize we need to
wait for more objective comparisons.
GMT+1 (BST)
michaeladawson
Veteran Member
The 3200 sample is amazing for that ISO. Heck, the 6400 shot is truly amazing for that ISO. I shoot 3200 a lot so this is THE body to get. Nice to see that 6400 will even produce nice images in a pinch.
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Mike Dawson
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Peter EG
Well-known member
Version 0.18
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If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right. (Henry
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If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right. (Henry
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echelon2004
Veteran Member
You'll hate the eos1ds3 then
There's so much stuff in front of the sensor that it's amazing any light at all hits the photo diods
What worries me is that it is possible that Nikon and sony don't have the on-chip noise reduction as used by canon (some version of it obviously) but instead uses software anti aliasing and noise reduction...
Absolutely, then we will know for sure.
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Anders
Some of my pictures can be seen at;
http://teamexcalibur.se/US/usindex.html
event photography and photo journalism
betterliving
Veteran Member
I'm sorry, but I don't agree. mpixel appears to enjoy the gental Nikon bash. He comes to conclusions based on very thin evidence, and usually against Nikon.
Just an observation...
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David
Peter Nelson
Veteran Member
I use EV comp a lot as it's just an easy external setting to get the exposures correct. There are of course other way's to do the same thing, but for me dialing in a little EV like + .7 is fast and saves time and work later. I always shoot in NEF and Raw anyway as doing this allows for EV corrections later in the computer, but if I have lot of images to be corrected well this takes time so a little EV comp setting on the camera saves this time and work.
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Artist Eyes
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Artist Eyes
Peter Nelson
Veteran Member
Agreed!
Artist Eyes
--I was going to say the same Guy, the detail retention at high ISO is
nothing short of amazing in the D3. Their image processing gives a
great quality to the noise that does show up...and notice none of it
is chroma noise even in that dark ISO 6400 sample. Amazing. Now that
detail is preserved and noise is supressed admirably at ISO 6400 I
wonder what detractors will use to pick at the high ISO quality??...
and you know it is coming. DR ? Nope the dynamic range seems amazing
as well, with full saturation of tones even at ISO 6400. At this
point the D3 would have to have a major Achilles heal to take away
from the momentum it currently has commanded. With these samples
Nikon basically says "I told you so." to everyone that doubted until
now if they would wrest the best IQ crown from Canon, it's a done
deal.
Regards,
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Artist Eyes
bm bradley
Veteran Member
Hi Berine,
post process will handle any issues with the higher asa's. when I shot the fuji s2 and s3 I preferred the skin tones at 320 and 400 asa. to me photography these days is about the capture more so than it used to be 10 years ago. all I need is a 'workable image' of my concept and I'm off and running.
warmest regards -bmb
I am totally amazed by the ISO 400 images qualities. I am a MF digital back shooter but I can see the IQ gap between the D3 (and the future higher MP model) and the MF back is getting smaller and smaller. However I notice the first 2 images shot at ISO 200 are not any sharper (even much worse, especially in highlights details) than the ISO 400 images. I don't know why? Any comments?
LOL! Well the only thing we have to go on so far are the official samples. I suppose that I could have commented on all the unofficial samples that have been floating around, as many have done, but I prefer to comment on samples that Nikon themselves consider to be representative of the camera’s abilities.
Now please back up your accusation that I appear to enjoy a general Nikon bash and that, “ He comes to conclusions based on very thin evidence, and usually against Nikon.”
I don’t post in the Nikon forums too much and I rarely talk about Nikon at all so it shouldn’t be too hard for you to do… unless you were just making it up.
Let’s see this Nikon bashing of which you accuse me.
More like imagination.
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GMT+1 (BST)
I have seen hundreds of real real PJ low light samples with the 5D - it cant compare. The 5D images typically have much more color noise. The D3 samples here are another level.
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Small D200 gallery:
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Small D40 gallery:
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