D80 metering? What's the problem?

The building right in the middle is probably about 20-25% gray, so a spot would have given you about what you got, a bit overall dark image. You'd think MM would overexpose it?

MM has problems with really contrasty image where the center parte is surrounded by something either much lighter or much darker, since it overweigths the center part, and overcorrects.

Your image has some highlights but a lot of medium lighted area, it has metered for those, IMO.

--
rhlpetrus
equipment in profile

Even though I'm with you (and you helped me earlier on this by pointing out the focusing point issue), the system is not flawed technically, you've got to agree that something is wrong with Nikon's choice, since the camera is directed to photoenthusiasts and not to professional lighting technicians. Even Thom, Stafford and KR (ops) think the D80's MM is different from other Nikons. Maybe they could at least make it optional for us to choose between this "smart" version to a more pedestrian one.

Best, Renato.
--
rhlpetrus
equipment in profile

The "overexposure denial squad" haven't waded into this thread with the usual mix of ridicule and abuse, I do find it very odd (suspicious even) that no mainstream review has ever picked up on the fact that the meter is at the very least different to other Nikons

The D80 was my first Nikon, and was a big disapointment...only due to the wonky meter, but I have since bought a used D50, and its great, the D80 meter is unpredictable, all cameras have their weaknesses....Nikon users just need to learn that Nikons are not perfect either...simple

--

Sony A100 examples here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mangizmo/sets/72157600209437795/

My blog at... http://southwestwanderings.blogspot.com/

'Take nothing but photographs....leave nothing but footprints'

Vaughan....KodakP880/Sony Alpha100/Sony R1/Sony 717

--
rhlpetrus
equipment in profile

I used manual exposure 80%+ of the time with my D80 (as I still use a mechanical film camera on a regular basis). I also carry and use a hand held incident meter most of the time with any camera. So I really never discovered how dumb the D80 matrix metering is until months later when I can no longer return the darn thing!

I never had a problem with the D80 center and spot metering. Matches readings with my Sekonic 308s and reflected readings off a gray card. Very accurate. The matrix metering, however, works like a HEAVY center-weghted meter. I can't easily compensate for it as it underexposes or overexposes depening on what is on the center of the frame. Nikon should really provide a firmware update.

I think the D80 should have used the metering circuit of the D1, I find the D1 metering much more reliable. I think the D70(s) and the D200 did use the same metering as the D1 series. I find my self constantly cranking in some kind of EV adjustment on my D40 and my D80.

I have done some A/B comparison between the D40 and the D80 but I haven't seen much difference in the metering between them.

I agree, one way to keep the D80 costs below the D200, even having the "same"
sensor, was the cheaper meter
I think thats why the D50 has become more popular since its demise
people have realized it has a damn good meter

even the loathed K Rockwell has stated the D50 meter is " better" than the D80 or D40, FWIW

--
Frank

kodakuser said:

The D80 metering is fantastic...its amazing...theres no
problem...none whatsoever...what problem?...its you...you dont posess
the advanced highly powered brain required to master such a highly
sophisticated instrument...no no no ...you must understand its not a
point and shoot... you cant expect a camera to know what you
want....etc etc etc....
Just sell it and buy something else, thats what I did...even another
Nikon, but if you like Matrix metering, and expect it to work like
other cams (Sony A100 for example)...then you will always be
dis-satisfied with the D80
Go with your instincts, this forum nearly murdered me six months ago
for daring to suggest that Live View was a vaguely desireable
feature...if you feel that the D80 meter sucks ( I happen to
agree)..dump the cam
--
Sony A100 examples here:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mangizmo/sets/72157600209437795/

My blog at... http://southwestwanderings.blogspot.com/

'Take nothing but photographs....leave nothing but footprints'

Vaughan....KodakP880/Sony Alpha100/Sony R1/Sony 717

Click to expand...

Hey Man are you on Drugs or something?? The person asked a question - that's how we learn, by asking questions - and yes there is a problem with the D80's MM system, how can so many people have the same problem? I also have a D200 and it's definitaly not a point & shoot and it does not blow highlights like the D80. SO I WOULD SUGGEST YOU GIVE YOUR HEAD A SHAKE.

vagari said:

I think thats why the D50 has become more popular since its demise
people have realized it has a damn good meter
even the loathed K Rockwell has stated the D50 meter is " better"
than the D80 or D40, FWIW

Click to expand...

Doesn't the D50 have the same meter as the D80?

vagari said:

I agree, one way to keep the D80 costs below the D200, even having
the "same"
sensor, was the cheaper meter
I think thats why the D50 has become more popular since its demise
people have realized it has a damn good meter
even the loathed K Rockwell has stated the D50 meter is " better"
than the D80 or D40, FWIW

--
Frank

Click to expand...

I am not sure how they can save money on the meter. I guess the reason for the D80 meter is Nikon expects most D80/D40 buyers to put their subjects in the center of the frame!

It seems strange that others who own other nikon cameras (d50, d200) don't have this problem one is a lower level camera the other an upper level one I was considering down the road picking up a new or gently used d80 but this makes me wonder what is the natural upgrade.

Enjoy making sharing and preserving memories

Lens List
nikon 50 1.8, 35-70 2.8
Sigma 17-70 macro, 50-150 2.8, 70-300 apo macro

http://www.photoshopshowcase.com/ViewFlashMedia.aspx?AID=33775&AT=3

I think you should read my post again...I agree with you 100%...I had a D80 and that was the response I got here, I was being sarcastic...I think the D80 meter sucks big time

I note that the jerks that threw all the abuse at me for complaining about the meter and said that the D80 meter was perfect seem to have gone silent (at last)

I have a D50 now and a Sony A100....no metering issues with either cam, I lost alot of money when I sold my D80s (I bought two at full retail)....I just cant imagine why the reviewers havent picked up on this lousy meter

Oh and before anybody flames me, have a look at my blog..mostly shot with a Sony A100 at 0.0ev...never any issues bright days, dark days, high contrast situations, the D50 is just as good in this respect also

Hey and you know what really makes me laugh, when you read the reviews on this site for the Nikon D80 and the Sony A100, the Nikon metering is not criticised in any way, and the A100 gets a slating for underexposing....what ????, I have virtually never read of a user who has issues with the Sony, but the D80 metering has been an issue from day one...very strange

--

Sony A100 examples here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mangizmo/sets/72157600209437795/

My blog at... http://southwestwanderings.blogspot.com/

'Take nothing but photographs....leave nothing but footprints'

Vaughan....KodakP880/Sony Alpha100/Sony R1/Sony 717

so you went from a d80 to a sony? haha

get over it kid, go troll elsewhere. i have no problems with the way the d80 meters.
learn your gear
--
http://anthonyc.zenfolio.com/

Yes ! Of course !

Man can fight against all adversities.
But what for...
It's by far beter to buy a "normal" camera.
Picture made with a D80 is always a great surprise !!!

If you like it...

I like my nikon D50 and my lens mainly sigma would like to upgrade eventually to a D80 I thought but the metering issue is mentioned by more than one issue and even ken Rockwell takes note of this issue...

The D200 meter is perfect. The D80 and D40 meter are about the same, exposing for the shadows and requiring constant readjustment.

He goes on to say that the D50 is better at metering than the D80 or D40 it would be interesting to know why instead of just shooting downsomeone who sees a problem you don't great...

Enjoy making sharing and preserving memories

Lens List
nikon 50 1.8, 35-70 2.8
Sigma 17-70 macro, 50-150 2.8, 70-300 apo macro

http://www.photoshopshowcase.com/ViewFlashMedia.aspx?AID=33775&AT=3

Novens2 said:

The D200 meter is perfect. The D80 and D40 meter are about the same,
exposing for the shadows and requiring constant readjustment.

Click to expand...

I thought the D200 underexposes? I guess that is perfect if you shoot RAW; you can recover the highlights at PP, whereas you can't recover blown highlights. What if you shoot JPEGS? Aren't you better off with the overexposure, at least you can see your subjects, which is what most consumers would want rather than dark Aunt Wilma.

That's interesting, as Phil's review states that the D80 has the same meter circuit as the D50.

Could Nikon have tweaked the firmware some? If so why can't they tweak the D80 firmware to match D50 metering.

Or does it have something to do with the D80 sensor vs the D50 sensor if they share the same metering circuit.

Then again the D200 shares the same basic sensor as the D80, but uses the D1 type metering and all is fine with it. So what is really the problem with the D80 MM meter?

I am no engineer / technical genius
and have no explanation of this D80 situation

all I know is, the same situations that the D50 handles with minimal input, the D80 does take more compensation/ fiddling/ reviewing

I like having the 11 Af sensors and rarely use the middle one. spot metering is somewhat better, I don't see too much difference in center weighted

D50:

Same as D70. Better meter than D80 or D40-----------from K Rockwell's D200/ D50/D40/D80/D70 comnparision
FWIW

--
Frank

bwigg said:

That's interesting, as Phil's review states that the D80 has the same
meter circuit as the D50.

Click to expand...

Actually, I wasnt aware of that, it really must be the software then as the two cameras behave very differently...perhaps Nikon could offer a firmware update...and then those who prefer the way it is could just not update the firmware

--

Sony A100 examples here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mangizmo/sets/72157600209437795/

My blog at... http://southwestwanderings.blogspot.com/

'Take nothing but photographs....leave nothing but footprints'

Vaughan....KodakP880/Sony Alpha100/Sony R1/Sony 717

The quote was from ken and seems to agree with others who have issues with the D80 and it's need for consistent tweaking if the metering is consistent in it's behaviour you get used to it if it behaves differently in different lighting conditions you miss shots or miss take them. I hope the D80 meters at least as well as my d50 if not well I might look elsewhere....

Enjoy making sharing and preserving memories

Lens List
nikon 50 1.8, 35-70 2.8
Sigma 17-70 macro, 50-150 2.8, 70-300 apo macro

http://www.photoshopshowcase.com/ViewFlashMedia.aspx?AID=33775&AT=3