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Manual Monitor/Printer Calibration and Gamma

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Dave said:
Anything wrong with Profile Prism(
http://www.ddisoftware.com/prism/ )? It's only $69 and if you have
a scanner it may be what most people are looking for without
spending hundreds of dollars.
Click to expand...
Don't let price fool you. If you wade thru the posted messages on the profile prism Yahoo group you will find user after user who have said that profile prism has given them better and more accurate profiles than when they used Monaco, ProfilerPro, etc.....many lamented about spending hundreds of dollars on programs that can not do any better than PP for a fraction of the cost. You Dave have made the wise choice and saved a bundle.

BH
 
Bill,

Can you provide a link to the Yahoo prism group?

Thanks.

Mike.
Bill Harris said:
Dave said:
Anything wrong with Profile Prism(
http://www.ddisoftware.com/prism/ )? It's only $69 and if you have
a scanner it may be what most people are looking for without
spending hundreds of dollars.
Click to expand...
Don't let price fool you. If you wade thru the posted messages on
the profile prism Yahoo group you will find user after user who
have said that profile prism has given them better and more
accurate profiles than when they used Monaco, ProfilerPro,
etc.....many lamented about spending hundreds of dollars on
programs that can not do any better than PP for a fraction of the
cost. You Dave have made the wise choice and saved a bundle.

BH
Click to expand...
 
Thanks! Now I feel better about my purchase!

I guess it takes about a week to be delivered via the mail. No rush cuz Amazon is packing my S9000 for shipment right now! YEA!

-Dave
Bill Harris said:
Dave said:
Anything wrong with Profile Prism(
http://www.ddisoftware.com/prism/ )? It's only $69 and if you have
a scanner it may be what most people are looking for without
spending hundreds of dollars.
Click to expand...
Don't let price fool you. If you wade thru the posted messages on
the profile prism Yahoo group you will find user after user who
have said that profile prism has given them better and more
accurate profiles than when they used Monaco, ProfilerPro,
etc.....many lamented about spending hundreds of dollars on
programs that can not do any better than PP for a fraction of the
cost. You Dave have made the wise choice and saved a bundle.

BH
Click to expand...
 
John,

I've done a little research, not bunches but a little, and everything I read sounded good. I believe the trick to using Photo Prism is a really good scan. Right now I have a cheapo scanner and if that doesn't work I'll take it to Kinko's or Officemax or something like that.

From my perspective I don't see much difference in using a scanner to calibrate or a dedicated unit(like Spyder). The dedicated units might be a little simpler and faster just because you get the sampling and the scan all at the same time. I only have 3 color devices to scan(not including different paper types) so it's a no brainer for me. If you had to do color profiles all the time then it might be worth spending the extra cash. I'm your average Joe-schmoe who has flat-out spent enough on a printer and paper here lately. This "extra" $69 was even hard to swallow but I believe it will be well worth it.

Read some of the other posts and see what other people think. A guy right here in this thread said I made a wise choice. He said it even competes with some of the big guns out there. Besides, Mike Chaney is one smart moe-fo to even have put Qimage together. He really has a good grasp on what people are looking for and has nice implementation to boot! His software is probably the best low-budget, high-functionality, and technically superior software I've ever seen for the price. High BANG low BUCK! Gotta love it!

I wouldn't say you are fussy! I'm a programmer so I'm pretty anal about things myself. I've just learned that if you do enough web searching that you can find some really good items that do the same things as more expensive items. I'm hoping this product won't let me down! Everything I've read indicates I made a good purchase. We'll see!

Take Care,

-Dave
John Lund said:
In our case, cost is outweighed by simplicity and accuracy. I'm not
talking about "close is good enuff...we need it exact and on time."

Fussy huh!?

JL
Dave said:
-Dave
Vincent said:
Vincent said:
J. Lund said:
Color fiends...

I need to make perfect color prints and am willing to spend the
money and some time to get there. What color management systems
give you the best bang for the buck? Is there a concensus on which
brand to buy? I was thinking about the MonacoEZcolor system.

What is the best way to go if you don't have time to sit there and
run a long series of tests?
Click to expand...
This link will take you straight to the software.
Click to expand...
http://www.monacosys.com/monacoezcolor.html

or have a look at Ian Lyons excellent site and read his reviews.

http://welcome.to/computerdarkroom

Vincent

--
Vincent Oliver
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
...f8 and be there!
Click to expand...
 
Thanks Dave and Bill,

I'll go hang around the prism profile group some and see where it goes from there.

JL
Dave said:
I guess it takes about a week to be delivered via the mail. No
rush cuz Amazon is packing my S9000 for shipment right now! YEA!

-Dave
Bill Harris said:
Dave said:
Anything wrong with Profile Prism(
http://www.ddisoftware.com/prism/ )? It's only $69 and if you have
a scanner it may be what most people are looking for without
spending hundreds of dollars.
Click to expand...
Don't let price fool you. If you wade thru the posted messages on
the profile prism Yahoo group you will find user after user who
have said that profile prism has given them better and more
accurate profiles than when they used Monaco, ProfilerPro,
etc.....many lamented about spending hundreds of dollars on
programs that can not do any better than PP for a fraction of the
cost. You Dave have made the wise choice and saved a bundle.

BH
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
This is a great web site.

While trying to calibrate my monitor, I realized that only adjustments to gamma and brightness are discussed. The monitor contrast setting directly effects the calibration process as well. Does anyone have information on how to set this?

thanks
George
Dave said:
Here is a good web site for manually calibrating your printer and
monitor. Can someone try this and let us know how it works? I
don't have my printer yet or I'd give it a try.

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

Check out the main page for some more good stuff:

http://www.normankoren.com

Hope this helps somebody...

-Dave
Click to expand...
 
Most recommend that you set your Contrast to MAX!!!
George Klein said:
While trying to calibrate my monitor, I realized that only
adjustments to gamma and brightness are discussed. The monitor
contrast setting directly effects the calibration process as well.
Does anyone have information on how to set this?

thanks
George
Dave said:
Here is a good web site for manually calibrating your printer and
monitor. Can someone try this and let us know how it works? I
don't have my printer yet or I'd give it a try.

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

Check out the main page for some more good stuff:

http://www.normankoren.com

Hope this helps somebody...

-Dave
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
When color calibrating your system you first need to decide if you want your prints to have accurate color or simply be "good enough". For many, the second choice is fine. If you don't mind that a red shirt prints slightly magenta or a yellow flower prints slightly green then you probably don't need to spend $500 on a calibration system. Set your monitor to 6500K, run some test prints and tweak the printer settings until the prints look reasonable.

Keep in mind, however, that no amount of tweaking will allow you to equal the results of a profiled system. By "results" I mean creating prints that accurately match what you see on your monitor. For example, what do you do if the highlights in your print are too red but the shadows have not enough red? The color controls in printers (and monitors) do not allow you compensate for this. You have to decide if the shadows or hightlights are more important, correct for that using the global color corrections in the printer setup, and then live with the incorrect color in the rest of the print.

This is where profiling comes in. A profile can correct for variations of hue at different luminosities. A profiled system also ensures that what you see on your monitor matches what you get in your print. This saves you from having to run multiple test prints each time you change to a different type of paper or a new batch of ink.

Monaco EZcolor and the Color Vision Spyder are two of the popular entry level profiling packages.

Osman
Dave said:
Here is a good web site for manually calibrating your printer and
monitor. Can someone try this and let us know how it works? I
don't have my printer yet or I'd give it a try.

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

Check out the main page for some more good stuff:

http://www.normankoren.com

Hope this helps somebody...

-Dave
Click to expand...
 
Thank-you Osman...you just confirmed what my research showed.

I want better than "good enough," therefore I need to profile my entire input - output system including the different papers I will be using. Therefore I have just stepped up for the MonacoEZclor bundle at $398. Sounds expensive but so is my time, paper, ink and patience.

Cheers,
JL
Osman E. said:
Keep in mind, however, that no amount of tweaking will allow you to
equal the results of a profiled system. By "results" I mean
creating prints that accurately match what you see on your monitor.
For example, what do you do if the highlights in your print are too
red but the shadows have not enough red? The color controls in
printers (and monitors) do not allow you compensate for this. You
have to decide if the shadows or hightlights are more important,
correct for that using the global color corrections in the printer
setup, and then live with the incorrect color in the rest of the
print.

This is where profiling comes in. A profile can correct for
variations of hue at different luminosities. A profiled system also
ensures that what you see on your monitor matches what you get in
your print. This saves you from having to run multiple test prints
each time you change to a different type of paper or a new batch of
ink.

Monaco EZcolor and the Color Vision Spyder are two of the popular
entry level profiling packages.

Osman
Dave said:
Here is a good web site for manually calibrating your printer and
monitor. Can someone try this and let us know how it works? I
don't have my printer yet or I'd give it a try.

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

Check out the main page for some more good stuff:

http://www.normankoren.com

Hope this helps somebody...

-Dave
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--...f8 and be there!
 
Well, I wasn't about to spend the money they want for the Monaco EZcolor and Color Vision Spyder($300-500) just to profile my system. I've taken a cheaper route which, I hope, will produce the same or maybe even better results.

I ended up purchasing Profile Prism from DDI Software for $69 and a good scanner for $105(after taxes). Total = $174. If I had a scanner that actually worked then I would only have had to spend $69 which is FAR more reasonable for a home user. The scanner is rated #1 at PC World - Microtek ScanMaker 4800.

By going this route not only did I "save" some cash but I also have a scanner that I can use for scanning photos and a make shift paper copier. High BANG lower BUCK! I already have a profile for my monitor from the manufacturer.

I'll let you know how everything works out once I get my printer and Profile Prism software. Everything I've read says this configuration will compete quite heavily with Monaco and Spyder which are low BANG high BUCK applications.

-Dave
Osman E. said:
Keep in mind, however, that no amount of tweaking will allow you to
equal the results of a profiled system. By "results" I mean
creating prints that accurately match what you see on your monitor.
For example, what do you do if the highlights in your print are too
red but the shadows have not enough red? The color controls in
printers (and monitors) do not allow you compensate for this. You
have to decide if the shadows or hightlights are more important,
correct for that using the global color corrections in the printer
setup, and then live with the incorrect color in the rest of the
print.

This is where profiling comes in. A profile can correct for
variations of hue at different luminosities. A profiled system also
ensures that what you see on your monitor matches what you get in
your print. This saves you from having to run multiple test prints
each time you change to a different type of paper or a new batch of
ink.

Monaco EZcolor and the Color Vision Spyder are two of the popular
entry level profiling packages.

Osman
Dave said:
Here is a good web site for manually calibrating your printer and
monitor. Can someone try this and let us know how it works? I
don't have my printer yet or I'd give it a try.

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html

Check out the main page for some more good stuff:

http://www.normankoren.com

Hope this helps somebody...

-Dave
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Dave,

I hope for your sake it works for you. Sounds like you will have a tidy outfit for home use etc.

My needs on the other hand are somewhat greater. I am setting up a digital darkroom for the university where I work. The demands of the job in quality and time are pretty stressful at the best of times so I am spending the employer's money to buy the best, fastest, most accurate system I can for a budgeted amount of money.

I must admit it is more than I could afford on my own time so I am working with a 2gig PC, Epson 2450 scanner, Epson 1280 printer and am getting going with a Canon G2 camera before I step up for a full DSLR system.

So buying the $398 MonacoEZcolor bundle so that I can build individual profiles seems like a logical thing to do at this stage.

I will be interested in hearing how your system works out and if you are around, I'll keep you posted on my progress here. It is all very exciting for an oldtime film shooter and darkroom rat to be going this route.

Having run some of my own tests for print quality etc. from all media: slides, color neg, straight from camera etc....it is going to work out great!

Actually, I am really stoked about how well it is going!

Cheers,
JL
--...f8 and be there!
 
I just posted this in another thread but thought it's more suitable here:

No recommendation here but I am also trying to profile my printers with Profile Prism as Dave will be doing. I have an Epson perfection 1200 which was top rated in its time about 2yrs ago or so. With my W98SE and my HP970 I am having the most frustrating time trying to get a decent profile. I am following the Prism directions very carefully, getting, I think decent scans, etc., but the profile generation calculations just seems to give up during the last phase and ends up with totally unacceptable tone curves. I spent many hours trying different scan settings with the same failures. I was hoping this to be a straightforward procedure since I also have a Canon S800 to calibrate together with lots of different papers. I may try "scanning" with my camera.

Anyone else tried Prism out there?? I wrote to DDIsoftware but no reply as yet.

I'm trying to get onto the Yahoo site but having trouble authenticating at either my end or their's. I hope I solve my problem.
John Lund said:
Dave,

I hope for your sake it works for you. Sounds like you will have a
tidy outfit for home use etc.

My needs on the other hand are somewhat greater. I am setting up a
digital darkroom for the university where I work. The demands of
the job in quality and time are pretty stressful at the best of
times so I am spending the employer's money to buy the best,
fastest, most accurate system I can for a budgeted amount of money.

I must admit it is more than I could afford on my own time so I am
working with a 2gig PC, Epson 2450 scanner, Epson 1280 printer and
am getting going with a Canon G2 camera before I step up for a full
DSLR system.

So buying the $398 MonacoEZcolor bundle so that I can build
individual profiles seems like a logical thing to do at this stage.

I will be interested in hearing how your system works out and if
you are around, I'll keep you posted on my progress here. It is all
very exciting for an oldtime film shooter and darkroom rat to be
going this route.

Having run some of my own tests for print quality etc. from all
media: slides, color neg, straight from camera etc....it is going
to work out great!

Actually, I am really stoked about how well it is going!

Cheers,
JL

--
...f8 and be there!
Click to expand...
--MSChecan
 
John,

I hope it works out too! Right now I have my fingers crossed. I needed a new scanner anyway so even if this doesn't work I'll only be out $69.

Bottom line, it WILL work one way or another or I'll end up bugging the heck out of Mike Chaney at DDI Software. I subscribe to the Profile Prism forum on Yahoo so I'm sure I'll be able to get some answers there. I know they are having a rough time profiling an Epson 1280 and they are beta testing the next version of PP right now. Should be interesting!

If it means anything, if I was spending someone elses money I would buy the best myself. I wouldn't dink around with trying to get something of lower value to work. Seeing how this is a "home" setup and I'm not demanding perfection I thought I'd give the cheaper route a try first. If I had $300-500 to chalk up to dedicated profiling I would spend it right now. Perhaps in a few months if I can't get Profile Prism to work I might consider it.

-Dave
John Lund said:
Dave,

I hope for your sake it works for you. Sounds like you will have a
tidy outfit for home use etc.

My needs on the other hand are somewhat greater. I am setting up a
digital darkroom for the university where I work. The demands of
the job in quality and time are pretty stressful at the best of
times so I am spending the employer's money to buy the best,
fastest, most accurate system I can for a budgeted amount of money.

I must admit it is more than I could afford on my own time so I am
working with a 2gig PC, Epson 2450 scanner, Epson 1280 printer and
am getting going with a Canon G2 camera before I step up for a full
DSLR system.

So buying the $398 MonacoEZcolor bundle so that I can build
individual profiles seems like a logical thing to do at this stage.

I will be interested in hearing how your system works out and if
you are around, I'll keep you posted on my progress here. It is all
very exciting for an oldtime film shooter and darkroom rat to be
going this route.

Having run some of my own tests for print quality etc. from all
media: slides, color neg, straight from camera etc....it is going
to work out great!

Actually, I am really stoked about how well it is going!

Cheers,
JL

--
...f8 and be there!
Click to expand...
 
Marq,

Your scanner may not be able to generate a good enough scan. This is actually my biggest fear with Profile Prism. From my understanding if the curves don't work out then something is scanning incorrectly with the colors.

If you scan with your camera make sure you do it outside on a well lit day. Try to avoid any shadowing and bright spots. They key with using a camera is to have even lighting across the entire pallet. Perhaps a slightly overcast day would be best. In the Yahoo forum someone made mention that scanning with a camera doesn't really work out that well. A good quality scanner is best. Have you tried taking your pics to Kinko's or Officemax to have them scan it? I believe they have good scanners there. Might be worth trying.

Hope this helps,

-Dave
MarqChecan said:
No recommendation here but I am also trying to profile my printers
with Profile Prism as Dave will be doing. I have an Epson
perfection 1200 which was top rated in its time about 2yrs ago or
so. With my W98SE and my HP970 I am having the most frustrating
time trying to get a decent profile. I am following the Prism
directions very carefully, getting, I think decent scans, etc., but
the profile generation calculations just seems to give up during
the last phase and ends up with totally unacceptable tone curves. I
spent many hours trying different scan settings with the same
failures. I was hoping this to be a straightforward procedure since
I also have a Canon S800 to calibrate together with lots of
different papers. I may try "scanning" with my camera.

Anyone else tried Prism out there?? I wrote to DDIsoftware but no
reply as yet.

I'm trying to get onto the Yahoo site but having trouble
authenticating at either my end or their's. I hope I solve my
problem.
John Lund said:
Dave,

I hope for your sake it works for you. Sounds like you will have a
tidy outfit for home use etc.

My needs on the other hand are somewhat greater. I am setting up a
digital darkroom for the university where I work. The demands of
the job in quality and time are pretty stressful at the best of
times so I am spending the employer's money to buy the best,
fastest, most accurate system I can for a budgeted amount of money.

I must admit it is more than I could afford on my own time so I am
working with a 2gig PC, Epson 2450 scanner, Epson 1280 printer and
am getting going with a Canon G2 camera before I step up for a full
DSLR system.

So buying the $398 MonacoEZcolor bundle so that I can build
individual profiles seems like a logical thing to do at this stage.

I will be interested in hearing how your system works out and if
you are around, I'll keep you posted on my progress here. It is all
very exciting for an oldtime film shooter and darkroom rat to be
going this route.

Having run some of my own tests for print quality etc. from all
media: slides, color neg, straight from camera etc....it is going
to work out great!

Actually, I am really stoked about how well it is going!

Cheers,
JL

--
...f8 and be there!
Click to expand...
--
MSChecan
Click to expand...
 
Dave said:
Well, I wasn't about to spend the money they want for the Monaco
EZcolor and Color Vision Spyder($300-500) just to profile my
system. I've taken a cheaper route which, I hope, will produce the
same or maybe even better results.

I ended up purchasing Profile Prism from DDI Software for $69 and a
good scanner for $105(after taxes). ...
Click to expand...
Profile Prism looks like a good program. It should allow you to profile your printer and input device. Howerer, there is still one "hole" left: profiling your monitor. Your scanner and printer may be producing accurate color but if your monitor does not display those colors correctly then all is for naught. You said that you got a profile from the monitor manufacturer so you may be in the ballpark. But monitors change over time. You would also need to make sure that all of the monitor setting are the same as when the profile was generated. Hopefully the manufacturer also gave you this information. I profile my monitor about once every couple of weeks. I have heard of people doing it daily. You may yet need to buy a monitor profiling package...

Osman
 
John,

I have all the same compnents as you except I have the Epson 1270 and my PC only has 1.5GB (still pretty good :). I have Monaco EZcolor and it works quite well. Make sure you get the Monaco Sensor with the Monaco software. Getting a good monitor profile is the most important step!

Osman
John Lund said:
Dave,

I hope for your sake it works for you. Sounds like you will have a
tidy outfit for home use etc.

My needs on the other hand are somewhat greater. I am setting up a
digital darkroom for the university where I work. The demands of
the job in quality and time are pretty stressful at the best of
times so I am spending the employer's money to buy the best,
fastest, most accurate system I can for a budgeted amount of money.

I must admit it is more than I could afford on my own time so I am
working with a 2gig PC, Epson 2450 scanner, Epson 1280 printer and
am getting going with a Canon G2 camera before I step up for a full
DSLR system.

So buying the $398 MonacoEZcolor bundle so that I can build
individual profiles seems like a logical thing to do at this stage.

I will be interested in hearing how your system works out and if
you are around, I'll keep you posted on my progress here. It is all
very exciting for an oldtime film shooter and darkroom rat to be
going this route.

Having run some of my own tests for print quality etc. from all
media: slides, color neg, straight from camera etc....it is going
to work out great!

Actually, I am really stoked about how well it is going!

Cheers,
JL

--
...f8 and be there!
Click to expand...
 
Sounds encouraging Osman,

By choosing the Monaco bundle I opted for the works including sensor plus targets for the scanner. I thought at very least the Monaco set would get me into the ballpark relatively hassle free...if not cheaply. I am glad to hear from someone that it works for this system.

So far I have found that it is a killer outfit...now if can just get up this mountain of a learning curve to proficiency in the digital darkroom, I will be a happy guy!

thanks,
JL
Osman E. said:
John,

I have all the same compnents as you except I have the Epson 1270
and my PC only has 1.5GB (still pretty good :). I have Monaco
EZcolor and it works quite well. Make sure you get the Monaco
Sensor with the Monaco software. Getting a good monitor profile is
the most important step!

Osman
Click to expand...
--...f8 and be there!
 
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