Sony Alpha versus the Nikon D80,which is best?

Fine to go with instinct. As for making do, I am sure Lance
Armstrong could have made do with a bike from his local shop, the
F1 drivers could make do with last years engine, my office could
make do with DOS etc etc etc but they don't for a reason which that
when you are in competition, and make no mistake, being a pro
shooter means you are in competition, making do just doesn't cut it.
I am in competition with others....but on ability..not on how snazzy my camera/cameras are. I feel the KM system is good, it works for me. Thats it...if it didnt, trust me I would be somewhere else.

Clients dont know much about SLR cameras/brands gear, or honestly care at all. They wouldnt know a kit lens from a G one.......! They are interested in results...the pictures....

I don't own an A-100 because at the moment I dont need to..at some point I may well pick one up.......aside from weaker high ISO, it would make very little difference to what I do.

Handling is a crucial factor and these cameras IMO handle better than their rivals.
Refusing to "go mainstream" for the pure self satisfaction of that
is a sign of rank amatuerism. A true professional in any field has
one and only one criteria in choosing a tool. Is this the the best
tool that I can afford for the job ? Whether it is mainstream or
not just doesn't come into it.
The mainstream companies do not offer me the tools that I feel comfortable with. That is why I do not use them. Its as simple as that. It doesnt mean I could not use them, it means I decide not to.

Be careful with your words dayo......amateur means photography for a hobby..for pleasure. Professional means for income (and I class pleasure too), it has no indication of ability.

I am earning an income from photographer..are you? Bearing in mind you are not.....I very much doubt that your comments have any real meaning..other than an ex KM (bitter one at that) user who shoots Nikon now mostly (fine your choice).........ex smoker syndrome.

dont come here and tell me what is or is not good enough.

What matters is if the photographer is good enough.....always has always will.
It is rather boring that none of the Premier League teams turn out
in wellies for their matches don't you think?
You miss the point....so much that its not even worth trying to point it out.
I have no love affair with any system. I will give my opinion as I
honestly see it and couldn't give a rats you-know-what about what
the fanboys think.
I am afraid that I class you as a nikon fan.....why, on previous posts you refused to accept any areas the D40 may or may not deliver. And you come here to tell us what is or isnt good enough for people? C'mon now........

Camera collecting is fine..but not to be mistaken with photography.
--



Clint is on holiday! Soon to return! ;-)
 
I am in competition with others....but on ability..not on how
snazzy my camera/cameras are. I feel the KM system is good, it
works for me. Thats it...if it didnt, trust me I would be somewhere
else.
As I wrote Amstrong could have made do but certainly didn't and had the best money could buy. Was that because he had no ability? Of course not. Anything that give you an edge in a situation of cut throat competition has to be grabbed. Some take it too far and cheat. In any case, you feel the KM system does the job for you which is fine. I never stated that it couldn't.
Clients dont know much about SLR cameras/brands gear, or honestly
care at all. They wouldnt know a kit lens from a G one.......! They
are interested in results...the pictures....
Of course are are only interested in results. However if a G lens can produce something extra, someone with THE SAME LEVEL OF ABILITY will impress the client better and probably get the job.
I don't own an A-100 because at the moment I dont need to..at some
point I may well pick one up.......aside from weaker high ISO, it
would make very little difference to what I do.
Which is great.
Handling is a crucial factor and these cameras IMO handle better
than their rivals.
Perhaps they do. However handling can easily be worked around but there are other critical factors that may not be so easy to overcome.
The mainstream companies do not offer me the tools that I feel
comfortable with. That is why I do not use them. Its as simple as
that. It doesnt mean I could not use them, it means I decide not to.
My statement was on not going mainstream for its own sake which was what your original statement implied.

Quote "I respect Nikon (just about), Canon (never for me..but capable), but never will they grace my camera bag for working photography. Why? Because I dont go with the mainstream.....thats my choice." END QUOTE
Be careful with your words dayo......amateur means photography for
a hobby..for pleasure. Professional means for income (and I class
pleasure too), it has no indication of ability.
Nowhere have I stated it has anything to do with ability. Amateurs can actually produce far better work than professionals in many fields because professionalism means commercialism which translates to maximising profit as in "do as little as possible for the money"
I am earning an income from photographer..are you? Bearing in mind
you are not.....I very much doubt that your comments have any real
meaning..other than an ex KM (bitter one at that) user who shoots
Nikon now mostly (fine your choice).........ex smoker syndrome.
I don't. I am a total amateur. Sold a handful of images but that is really irrelevant. I count myself as a pure amateur.

I gave my opinion to an open question in an open forum. I am not bitter at anything or anyone and totally at ease with myself. There are more important things than which gear some person uses to me.
dont come here and tell me what is or is not good enough.
My post was not to you in the first place Barry. However, I see absolutely nothing wrong in stating my opinion. I never slated or flamed any product or brand and simply told the OP which of the two options he was considering I felt he should go for with a suggestion on a possible third. I do not see why you find that so offensive.
What matters is if the photographer is good enough.....always has
always will.
Of course but the tools also matter. It applies to any field of endeavour.
It is rather boring that none of the Premier League teams turn out
in wellies for their matches don't you think?
You miss the point....so much that its not even worth trying to
point it out.
Contrarily, I completely get the point.
I am afraid that I class you as a nikon fan.....why, on previous
posts you refused to accept any areas the D40 may or may not
deliver. And you come here to tell us what is or isnt good enough
for people? C'mon now........
That is how you saw my post on the D40. Go back and read it and point out where I stated it doesn't have any shortcomings as far as a certain class of user was concerned. My point was simply that it has a target market and if they are happy with it, why should anyone moan about it if they are not in the market for it in the first place.

I made a suggestion based on my opinion. Why don't you make a suggestion based on yours and just leave it at that?
Camera collecting is fine..but not to be mistaken with photography.
I make no representations about my photography apart from that I indulge in it for my pure pleasure. As an amateur hobbiest, there is an element of collection and any honest hobbiest will readily admit to this. You may be a "true photographer" whatever that means. For the record, I am an amateur hobbiest and yes, I do indulge in the odd camera collection.

--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
I doubt they would notice the difference.....a photographers eye is far more critical than any client....because we know what to look for......esp since being on this site!

Its a non issue.......is my 50mm at f8 sharper than the kit lens? Yes.......do I care? No! Would people notice? Not unless I were doing billboards......and even then.......unlikely.
Perhaps they do. However handling can easily be worked around but
there are other critical factors that may not be so easy to
overcome.
Handling is very personal, and its up to the OP to make a choice...I hate butter beans.......you might love em!

The 30D is a great camera....but to me it handles badly.....and its a dust magnet, for some reason...
Quote "I respect Nikon (just about), Canon (never for me..but
capable), but never will they grace my camera bag for working
photography. Why? Because I dont go with the mainstream.....thats
my choice."
Cos as I said mainstream is not my cup of tea..............and yes as a bonus I would much rather my rivals dismiss me for what brand I am using (as one did.....jokingly)........I dont mind because I know what I have to do....and thats take their business away. And it wont come down to what badge is on the camera either!

I was thinking of picking up a samsung for a play about.....and to have some fun ;-)
I gave my opinion to an open question in an open forum. I am not
bitter at anything or anyone and totally at ease with myself.
There are more important things than which gear some person uses to
me.
I dunno I detect something here ;-)
I make no representations about my photography apart from that I
indulge in it for my pure pleasure. As an amateur hobbiest, there
is an element of collection and any honest hobbiest will readily
admit to this. You may be a "true photographer" whatever that
means. For the record, I am an amateur hobbiest and yes, I do
indulge in the odd camera collection.
I am not suggesting you are a poor photographer...far from it..but that your inclinations and ideas are not really tuned into what really matters.

We all know C&N have the most depth in their systems...but so what?

I dont use polarizers, 98% of scenic shooters do........

Why because I want to do my own thing.......and I got a few shots published......so it seems you can take a not well trodden path and come out with great satisfaction.

(watch dead poets society, see what I mean) ;-)

--



Clint is on holiday! Soon to return! ;-)
 
He's probably aged visibly by now.
So where does all this leave us, can the A100 take a photo of a horse or not?
Greg
 
I doubt they would notice the difference.....a photographers eye is
far more critical than any client....because we know what to look
for......esp since being on this site!

Its a non issue.......is my 50mm at f8 sharper than the kit lens?
Yes.......do I care? No! Would people notice? Not unless I were
doing billboards......and even then.......unlikely.
Pixel peeping is an affliction we have here. I for one do not. As for the benefits of pro glass, I just gave a guy a comment on his shots at th NikonCafe site where I just had to tell him they were not up to scratch. Why, he used a 70-300 VR and too slow a shutter speed trusting in the VR. One or even half a stop more speed would have made the difference. Even a client would notice.
Perhaps they do. However handling can easily be worked around but
there are other critical factors that may not be so easy to
overcome.
Handling is very personal, and its up to the OP to make a
choice...I hate butter beans.......you might love em!
Yes it is.
The 30D is a great camera....but to me it handles badly.....and its
a dust magnet, for some reason...
I don't like Canon's handling and to be honest, I have an irrational aversion towards the brand stemming from my non mainstream days - Mac, KM, Paintshop until forced to Elements by switching to Mac. However, I will point an aspiring pro shooter towards the brand for reasons I set out before.
Quote "I respect Nikon (just about), Canon (never for me..but
capable), but never will they grace my camera bag for working
photography. Why? Because I dont go with the mainstream.....thats
my choice."
Cos as I said mainstream is not my cup of tea..............and yes
as a bonus I would much rather my rivals dismiss me for what brand
I am using (as one did.....jokingly)........I dont mind because I
know what I have to do....and thats take their business away. And
it wont come down to what badge is on the camera either!
Anyone that dismisses another no the brand is a joker and wouldn't last long same as anyone that dismisses a tool for the simple reason that it is mainstream which thankfully is not the case for you : )
I was thinking of picking up a samsung for a play about.....and to
have some fun ;-)
As long as it can deliver the goods and doesn't give an edge to your competition, why not?
I gave my opinion to an open question in an open forum. I am not
bitter at anything or anyone and totally at ease with myself.
There are more important things than which gear some person uses to
me.
I dunno I detect something here ;-)
Fair enough. That is a conclusion you have reached for several reasons too complex to dissect. I cannot, and will not try to, change that.
I am not suggesting you are a poor photographer...far from it..but
that your inclinations and ideas are not really tuned into what
really matters.
Fair enough. That is a conclusion you have reached for several reasons too complex to dissect. I cannot, and will not try to, change that.
We all know C&N have the most depth in their systems...but so what?
Well depending on the subject matter the OP shoots, this may matter a great deal.

The advice to go with the big boys was not because that is what the majority use but for support as a pro. I remember walking the length and breath of Athens, Greece in the Summer of 2004 searching for a shop that carries products for a certain brand. I never found one and never got my probelm resolved.

I was there for pleasure and not shooting was not going to be the end of the world. Turn it into someone there on a commision to shoot the Olympics and it becomes a totally different story.
I dont use polarizers, 98% of scenic shooters do........
I don't use "protective filters" as a matter of course as some do but a large chunk of shooters do. There is always scope for individualism.
Why because I want to do my own thing.......and I got a few shots
published......so it seems you can take a not well trodden path and
come out with great satisfaction.
Of course.

--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
He's probably aged visibly by now.
So where does all this leave us, can the A100 take a photo of a
horse or not?
Greg
LOL

I have given my opinion and several others have.

In the meantime, i have been taking on the Knights of the Holy Order of Minolta led by Barry :- )

He should just step around the carcasses and go get an Olympus!
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
He's probably aged visibly by now.
So where does all this leave us, can the A100 take a photo of a
horse or not?
Greg
LOL

I have given my opinion and several others have.

In the meantime, i have been taking on the Knights of the Holy
Order of Minolta led by Barry :- )

He should just step around the carcasses and go get an Olympus!
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these
events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
Sigh.........and it goes on and on!

Remember the Barry and his sidekick Ken post? lmao ;-)
--



Clint is on holiday! Soon to return! ;-)
 
Your web site his very beautiful:
http://dakanji.com

Dayo wrote to Barry:
I hope you are not going to banish me. My posting habits are as
follows for your understanding.
But let me tell you something if it can help.

Dayo you're going to be banish by your remarks (not by someone !)

I don't would like to speak for Barry Fitzgerald (he don't know me and I don't know him except across the treads).

If you know what I'm saying !

--
Michel J
 
Mainstream Huh! 10 years ago GM and Ford were king - Toyota was the Sony of the car industry. Now isToyota No 1. thru innovation. In camera IS will be the deal breaker and Canikon are facing a huge decision as to how they justify abandoning in lens IS to their user base who have spent mega bucks on each IS lens.
 
Sigh.........and it goes on and on!

Remember the Barry and his sidekick Ken post? lmao ;-)
That went on forever and degenerated into sveral different squabbles. I think that's when Michel J decided I was just a troll and you, that I was a blind Nikon groupie with an axe to grind with the A Mount. Opinions harden very quickly on these boards.

I had actually wanted to write '... his sidekick "Microsoft" Ken' but thought that might make him mad as people tend not to see the funny side of cheeky posts and swiftly fix bayonets and charge.

--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
Your web site his very beautiful:
http://dakanji.com
With posts like that, I might even start to think you must be Einstien reincarnated ;-)

Built with Gallery2 and customised over time. G2 is free from http://gallery.menalto.com

Why don't you join the community at Capture360.net? Most of the handful of active members are &alpha-Mounters.

I assure you, I don't have a pathological hatred of the &alpha Mount...really.
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
I assure you, I don't have a pathological hatred of the alpha
Mount...really.
...wow !

--
Michel J

PS: sincerly I loved your photos. But take care...
 
Mainstream Huh! 10 years ago GM and Ford were king - Toyota was the
Sony of the car industry. Now isToyota No 1. thru innovation. In
camera IS will be the deal breaker and Canikon are facing a huge
decision as to how they justify abandoning in lens IS to their user
base who have spent mega bucks on each IS lens.
Eventually both C & N will incorporate inbody AS into their cameras, its rumoured that the new D3x will have it. I don't see them abandoning IS lens where there are benfits for it, especially in telephotos.

You ought to check the price of some of their exotic glass which has both IS & SSM. They are still cheaper than comparable Sony lenses which have neither. Putting it bluntly most Sony lenses are outdated and are in need of SSM. Until Sony addresses issues like lenses & their extortionate prices they are not going to make any inroads in C&N's market share.
 
As for AS, SSS, VR, IS or whatever each one calls it, ignore it.
When the chips are down, pro spec fast glass is what delivers the
goods. Buying slow glass and hoping AS will make the difference
will lead nowhere. Of course fast glass with AS is the bomb.
However, the "AS advantage" is just a smoke and mirrors IMHO. Do
not for one instance let that determine your choice at all.

The Knights of the Order of Minolta can now let rip....Got my
shield up.
Well, you don't necessarily NEED autofocus, but it sure is nice to have.

--
My gallery for your perusal:
http://www.pbase.com/gipper51/root
 
Many thanks to all of you who took part to answer my question. I expected,perhaps, one reply but certainly never dreamed that I would get so many.Some of the dialogue is quite amusing and suprised me at the sometimes,heated debate! The Troll thing really amuses me!!!!

Anyhow,just to let you all know that I am still not 100% sure, but will probably go for the Sony.

I went into Wilkinsons Cameras this morning and the guy showed me a Sony with the 18-200 lens on and it felt really lovely and I have been thinking about it all day!
Once again,many thanks to you all.
 
Pentax K10D is only a good option if you're shooting RAW only.
JPEGs produced by the camera can tend to lack sharpness and detail.
--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
You would have thought so by Phils thorough review.
Except that he forgot that there are two distinct Jpeg modes as
listed in the Manual. Bright and Natural. Natural being the
default!.
The K100D got unanimous praise for its Jpeg process because its
default is Bright.
the manual which was not read says more contrasty sharpened and
saturated image are found with the bright mode.
Phil did mention those modes in his review of the K10D. He states that they are tone curve settings, which makes sense from their names.

He did compare them in this review - but - both produced similar dynamic range, very limited compared to the competition.

This setting does not sound like it would overcome the K10D's lack of sharpness in JPEGs problem.

I would like to verify what it is in the manual that you mention but unfortunately I cannot find any downloadable version? Seems strange to me not to have one, every other brand does!
So it does produce sharp images with a simple setting change.
Also it has arguably the most untouched image, weather sealing,
cheaper lenses, two control wheels and a host of other modes which
are nice and unique to the camera.
Cheaper lenses, yes, but a very limited selection in the current line-up (15 lenses, by memory?). Whilst ex-production lenses (e.g. 50mm F1.4) are available at larger retailers such as B&H, in the UK it is very rare to find such lenses.

Hence why the K10D has gadgets for metering manual lenses, because that's what you're stuck with!

--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
 
He said, that Image-Quality Wise, in low iso (up to 400) the Alpha runs circles around the D80. above 400 Iso - the D80 runs circles around the Alpha. you should just decide if your shooting is mostly low iso, and then the alpha is probably the winner, or if you're likely to use iso 800-3200 (especially considering the Alpha doesen't have 3200) - and then you should choose the nikon.
 
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
Yes I saw that, it was probably you and Barry F that tipped the scales, but I'm not quite sure how.
Greg
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these
events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these
events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
--
http://dakanji.com

'I make statements based on fact not predictions.'
KMSEA: 12:33:17 PM, Saturday, November 12, 2005 (GMT)

'Human nature being what it is, and unlikely to change, these events will
no doubt be repeated in the future.'
Thucydides 400 BC
 

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