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Steadman Uhlich

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I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and "ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames" "trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting 'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the "outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to communications....they can still make their points without causing anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple. Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
 
YES!

In a forum oft devoid of leadership thanks for taking the lead, Steadman.

-JNS
 
I too, have grown weary of the negativity. I am mostly a "lurker", but have gained an incredible amount of valuable information on this forum on many subjects. I began following this forum before the D30 even came out, and have watched the posts steadily take a turn towards hostility. Lets make an effort to refocus and get this forum back on track for what it was meant to do - share information/ideas/hints/tips/tricks/tech support/etc.....

Chris
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
 
I have noticed the same thing, and it seems to have increased lately. Lets all make an effort to keep this forum to what it is intended to be about, digital photography...

Sincerely

Anders Jelveus
 
As much as I look forward to input (both pro+con), I too have seen a drastic change during the past few months. But when you ask why then the answer is in the postings themselves. Questions about operation of equipment that is not only in the manual but also printed in the quick reference guide that comes with the cameras ends in people complaining about how awful their equipment is when MOST other members know they are only embarrassing themselves.

I feel what's needed is the use of a more constructive approach; you'll certainly get answers from the pros rather than a spiralling slanging match (some are funny, some offensive)

If only the members with a gripe/problem/issue started with the word, HELP: "can't get this to work", then they are not going to get the constructive advice that they so desperately need.

Knowledge is power.
 
Steadman,

Well put and thanks for saying it so clearly and gently.

However, I fear that you are pushing water uphill in the area of electronically enabled interpersonal communication. That is not to say that one should not attempt the uphill push, just that maybe don't expect it to get to the top and stay there without continual effort to coral it.

I have been constantly amazed at the depths of anger, rancor and outright viciousness that the electronic communication world seems to engender.

I try very hard to not say anything that is not, on it's surface, perceivable as well meant advice. It is not always easy to ignore the barbs returned.

I too have been around this forum for several years. I just did not post at all as I was not so certain in those earlier days that I had much to add. Or at least that there were (and still are) many that were better listened to than I. I guess I have overcome my electronic shyness.

I guess I don't perceive that the forum is any better or worse than it used to be, just now there are more people than ever. The price you pay for being on the leading edge of a tidal wave of change.
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
--GSmithCreate an image today that will make someone's day today.
 
The irony of all of this is that the Canon forum (as opposed to the Canon SLR) is the antithesis of this forum. In general it is more welcoming, supportive, and helpful instead of being rife with insults and flames.
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
 
Hear Hear, well put Steadman... your posts are always
interesting and to the point.
Steadman Uhlich wrote:
Mook
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
 
Steadman,

well said. You took the words out of my mouth. the insulting, and useless ramling has taken its toll on this forum to the point, where you rarely find useful bits of information. And the disgusting language used here makes it a sore to read.
Dr. Y. Chachad
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
--Sincerely,Y. ChachadShoot The World http://www.pbase.com/chachads
 
Agreed Steadman, I have been a culprit on occassion.

regards,

Adi
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
 
hmmm...

i was away for a week or so, with no access to the internet... so i guess i missed the "****" post...

overall, i've complained numerous times about the quality, or rather the lack of, of this forum...

it seems to be a more or less a new thing... i remember that once this forum was nothing like this...

i rarely see posts from the people i did a year ago... these were the people that used to post productive suggestions and critique... this forum was a great place to learn and share experiences... i don't really know what happened to it, but i hope that this stops and stops quick...

my buddy and i have talked a lot about setting up our own forum for canon dslr users... we keep coming back to the idea, and than just never following up on it (too lazy, too busy etc...)... maybe now is the time to act...
 
Hi Steadman

I totally agree. However I find it hard to do anything about it. The only threads to reach the 150 message limit are the flame wars so they don't get ignored.

Since I have all the equipment I need for the forseeable future, I'm more interested in talking about the pictures I can take with that equipment than in the latest news on D60 AF speed. But to do that, I should post in the Samples and Galleries forum which is the appropriate forum. Or I could post here and get ignored (case in point: http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=2263286 ). OK, they aren't great pictures and I posted at the height of the D60 announcement frenzy, but I didn't get a single comment...

So the only incentive for me to stay here is to share the experiences I've had with my camera and other equipment (which I love doing, btw.). I can also hope that somewhere in all the D60 noise there is actually a piece of information I can use. But that's not enough for me if I have to wade through all the harsh comments at the same time. Harsh comments that often tell the posters of the only posts that I find interesting to go somewhere else.

It's also been a while since I've seen a post from some of the regulars here. Mike Flaherty springs to mind. Have they left?

I think that the prospects are pretty dark for my continued participation here... I'd love to see the tone in here improve, though.

Kind regards,
Hans
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman
Click to expand...
 
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman

Thanks so much for this post. Perhaps your gentle reminder of how things can be on this forum will defuse some of the anger that seems to be a large part of this forum.
Click to expand...
You are right, if those of us who like to be here to learn and to share information, will simply ignore the more rancerous postings, we can go back to enjoy this forum.
Ingrid
--Carpe Diem
 
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.
Click to expand...
 
I was following the Olympus SLR forum for about 2 months. Compared to them, the Canon forum is a bunch of sweet pussycats.
But I totally agree with Steadman.
IngridA said:
Steadman Uhlich said:
I hope you read this and consider it carefully.

In the last few days I have seen so many "negative" posts and
"ugly" remarks made on this forum that I really could not believe
it was the same forum I once knew. (ahh...remember the good old
days?)

Recently (it appears to me) there have been numerous "flames"
"trolls" and insults (such as "****") comments coming out of
members. Thread after thread ends up being some kind of insult or
insinuation log.

It doesn't have to be that way. Really.

This forum (Canon SLR Talk) started over a year ago and was
consistently a great place to go for helpful hints, interesting
'net conversation,' and lots of useful information. There was a
certain kind of "kindness" prevalent. People generally respected
the forum rules (posting most pics on the samples Forum) and
generally respected each other as "citizens" of the forum.

Sadly, there have been so many posts lately that take a different
tone. Some end up in arguments that are ridiculous to the
"outside" observer.

Yes, this forum is a public place and everyone has a right to
express an opinion (just like this one)...but...one of the things
that seems to be true is that if people use a "polite" approach to
communications....they can still make their points without causing
anger or childish attacks.

Look....we all visit here for a reason. Some to learn, some to
share, some to show off. Some just lurk. Some contribute. Some
just wanna fight.

My suggestion is simple...share...contribute...and most
importantly...use the "golden rule" and treat people as you would
want to be treated.

As to how to "clean up" this forum and get it back on a friendly
basis?

Simply put...just ignore those who post inflamatory posts. Simple.
Just ignore it and move on. This forum has such a volume of new
threads that it will just push those few "bad apples" into the
oblivion of the archives.

Soon enough, this thread will vanish in the archives too. But I
hope you will take to heart the message.

Good light to you,

Steadman

Thanks so much for this post. Perhaps your gentle reminder of how things can be on this forum will defuse some of the anger that seems to be a large part of this forum.
Click to expand...
You are right, if those of us who like to be here to learn and to
share information, will simply ignore the more rancerous
postings, we can go back to enjoy this forum.
Ingrid

--
Carpe Diem
Click to expand...
 
I have read a couple of your replies to threads asking about camera equipment in which you have suggested they buy cheaper equipment and giving the money to a soup kitchen. I am not sure that trying to make people feel guilty about their planned purchases is helpful. It has been the cause of flame wars in past threads.

Perhaps the forum would be much more polite if we ALL refrained from value judgments about forum mebers equipmemnt choices.
 
Hi Andrew.

We all have bad days and sometimes write stuff we later regret. Generally Steadman's posts are helpful and polite and that is what counts, IMO.

Kind regards,
Hans
Andrew Grant said:
I have read a couple of your replies to threads asking about camera
equipment in which you have suggested they buy cheaper equipment
and giving the money to a soup kitchen. I am not sure that trying
to make people feel guilty about their planned purchases is
helpful. It has been the cause of flame wars in past threads.

Perhaps the forum would be much more polite if we ALL refrained
from value judgments about forum mebers equipmemnt choices.
Click to expand...
 
Hans Kilian said:
We all have bad days and sometimes write stuff we later regret.
Click to expand...
In general, is it possible to go back and edit foot-in-mouth posts made during lapses of judgement? A remorse/edit button would be nice. This option exists in other fora I've visited.

-Jagan
 
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