A630 crop test (2 img.)

Hi folks

I took my A630 (got it 4 days ago), out in the countryside today, just to see what I can expect from 8mp. I wasn't doing an ISO test OR low ambient light test, just to see if I can crop a little more (due to only 4X zoom) compared to my A700 6X lens.





First image is the whole frame (large superfine) downsized to 640x480
right out of camera....just resized...no pp.
Second image I cropped what you see and downsized the crop to 640x480

I think this was a good test for cropping, because I didn't have time to compose the way I wanted. I had to quick pull off the highway,put my coffee in cup holder,wind the window down, grab the camera with right hand, turn it on, and hope lens extended in time....and then zoom !!!
(hard to stop in gravel on side of road, don't have anti-lock brakes).

Anyway, I'm surprised at the detail retained after cropping(20% of original ????), I can see the woman's face quite clearly, considering what little I used from the original image. I used full 4X zoom ...so I know lens is sharp enough (same as my A700).

Im going to make some more tests and see how higher ISO's and various apertures effect the printed image.

have a nice weekend !!!
regards; Terry

Excellent shot Terry, and great crop. The A630 has excellent IQ , as your photo demonstrates. )
--
Cheers,

Bryan P.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/29386469@N00/

The best thing that could poke you in the eye....is your viewfinder.

Wow!

-This helps me with a question i've had as to whether the 630/640 i'm considering buying as an adjunct to my S3is would be able to deliver an actual cropped image as good as a 12x zoomed image . . . and your excellent example makes me believe it is!
Thanks

Hi All

thanks for your comments !!.

The reason I posted the images this way, was to give you an on screen comparison, so you can see both at the same time. I have my monitor set at 1024x768 so "relatively" speaking the cropped image should be approx. 5 1/2 x 7 1/2 " (on screen)....I measured mine!!. To bad you can't just "peel" it off screen and have a finished print

I wanted you to instantly be able to "judge" the two images at the same time (no scrolling),just click to enlarge instead.

I'm quite satisfied with the results, and did some more testing last night and actually turned the original image 90 degrees (so horizontal becomes vertical), and made a 8 1/2 X 11" borderless print using slightly less than 40 % of full image. Absolutley excellent results and is visiblly still sharper and more detailed than my 6mp dslr with kit lens !!!

I also tried (had to know), about using Canon's safety-zoom feature, and best descriped as the following.

When you select digital zoom (1.6x for large superfine) on A630 you ARE using it AT ALL TIMES.....it ADDS 1.6 to ANY zoom (even without touching zoom lever (0 zoom). in other words you DONT have up to 4X zoom and THEN ADD digital zoom AFTER reaching max optical zoom. Safety zoom is ON ALL the time...even at 0 (zero) optical zoom.

The results are typical of digital zooming, and better done in pp (IMO)
I did NOT use any digital zoom in my crop test!!!

Picture info (forgot to add in original post): This is not your typical Mennonite "buggy", but rather more of their version of a pickup-truck.

They use these in all seasons, to do "junk removal", shopping, deliveries, etc. Also they have rubber tires for "high speed" haha !!! hiway driving because they roll easier and easier on horses. Skinny wooden wheels tend to get stuck in mud faster.....you should see their "station wagon".

hope this help, you in deciding if the A630 is good enough for you.

regards Terry

Hi Again

Here is another example of my cropping test from yesterday.

Same method as first test.....both downsized





I also have a few crops taken from edges of frame, to test for off-center sharpness, and same results (lens is sharp even wide open).

I'm pleased to know that if I'm stuck and can't fill the frame for some reason (eg. physical obstructions, NO trespassing, angry bull), and 4X zoom doesn't quite do it (like those 12x zooms).....I can crop later and still get a reasonably quality 8 X 10 !!!!

thanks for looking, and if I can be of any further help, just ask and I will be only to happy.

regards Terry

Hi

This is the last crop test I'll post. This is just to give you an idea of the edge sharpness. This was taken with no zoom just to test for distortions at edges and. I have other images shot at f/2.8 and believe me, they are also detailed and sharp (IMO). I have to save my "free" space on my acount for other tests I want to post.

I like to do my testing on real life subjects, rather than "resolution charts", as I think these crops give you a better overall image idea and are more "fun" to print anyway





My next post (new thread), will be samples of dynamic exposure latitude for those interested. I use custom colors for all my shooting, because I try to "capture" the scene...just as I saw it. I don't like turning down contrast settings just to help retain a "limited" dynamic range in the first place.

I have found that turning down the saturation(-1), gives much better results and a much more natural colour "look" to final image,(IMHO), and have set the green level to (-1), as well (custom color/RGB levels ).

have a nice day !!

regards Terry

Tremendous vindication of the amazing performance of the A630. Hey, you could give yourself eyestrain, looking for purple fringing!
filibuster (Bromsgrove, Worcestershire, UK)
http://www.pbase.com/filibuster

Hi

yes you could......I have to ADD it in pp if I really want it !!!!

I'm very pleased with the ability to shoot even higher contrast subjects like trees and such, against grey cloudy skies.(almost pure white) like when doing the barn yesterday. Even wide open at any zoom, I have no problem with CA and the "Purple Monster"

I have a harder time keeping my shots on the level, perhaps Canon could put a bubble level obtion visible in LCD in shooting mode...ha ha !!!!!

Terry

Slarty42 said:

I have a harder time keeping my shots on the level, perhaps Canon could put a bubble level option visible in LCD in shooting mode...ha ha !!!!!

Click to expand...

Hi Terry. I use the A630’s adorable little cousin, the A640, and always keep the ‘Tic-tac-toe’ grid lines on. It certainly assists with levelling those verticals and horizontals.
Rgds
Keith

filibuster (Bromsgrove, Worcestershire, UK)



http://www.pbase.com/filibuster

Hello Keith

I think those tic tac toe lines are there for helping composing with the "rule of thirds". I have used them on several occasions with the A/620/700 and found them to be helpful to keep things on the level.

Sometimes in difficult scenes, (very dark), or when in some wierd contortions I subject myself to (even with LCD bent/twisted), I find myself trying to line up a roof top or other crooked structure with the lines, a lost cause when NOTHING in scene is straight (no horizon). I have actually used duct-tape and affixed a small bubble level on top of A700 as an experiment, with excellent results. (my crude workaround hahah !!!).

If I do manage to "botch" a shot, I know now, I can rotate image later and crop.....and don't have to tell people my sensor was mounted crooked from factory......ya right !!!!

I'm sure your A640 performs better for cropping than my 2mp less 630,and you also can enjoy the same sensor/lens to better advantage.

BTW: wonderful "fun" thing to shoot movies in color accent mode, eg. green grassy farm field and b&w cows or color swap= blue cows and brown skies .....that's what senility can do !!!!!!

regards Terry

Hello All

It's raining now, so I had the perfect opportunity to do some ISO tests with the A630 (don't mind getting wet for you nice people !). Please disregard my composing skills, as I just got up, and most importantly.....I haven't had my morning coffee yet !!!!!!!

I thought I'd test the macro, ISO, and of course various crops all in one shot. All images are crops of original full size images and then downsized.
NO noise removal software used, (don't have any !)
aluminum stepstool with rain drops...ISO 200, 40% crop



clothespin on line....ISO 400, 30 % crop



sissors blade (sitting on glass tabletop), ISO 400, 40% crop



Please make your own judgements from my tests, as I only present them to give you an idea of what I managed to do (soaking wet). I tried to have dark shadow areas and blacks as well as bright objects....not very scientific in the least, (like a controlled series of increasing ISO of same subject).

IMHO, I feel that I can live with 8X10's at ISO 200 uncropped images, and 5X7's at ISO 400 (8X10 IF I don't pixel peep). I didn't use ISO 800 because I normally use my dslr for anything above 200, and this was just my own test to see what the A630 is able to do "outside" on a rainy day.

regards/cheers; Terry

Hi slarty42,

I have been reading your posts on cropping the A630 images, and compliment you on your efforts to illustrate the fine results from this camera/method. I have been considering buying the A630, and your tests help me to confirm this plan. I use a Panasonic LZ5, TZ1 as well as the older Canon S410, but find something missing in all of them. The 12x zoom is nice, but the LZ5 is small for my hands and hard to hold for extended periods. Can you comment on the ergonomics of the A630?
PS, it looks like you test show better detail than my 12x images.
Thanks,
Wilson
--
35 years in film, 5 years in digital. finally got smart

Hi Wilson

sorry to make you wait for reply !...and thank you for your kind words.

My friend has an LZ5, and with his large hands,is a little hard to hold,but has commented how much easier it is to hold (even with 1 hand)my 630. The A630 uses 4 AA batteries, and he said this extra "bulge" on the right side, provides a much better grip, and less chance of dropping it.

In other words....you tend to curl fingers around battery compartment and squeeze the 630 rather than "pinch" the LZ5.

The cameras are close to equal weight, but because of the two additional AA batteries(NMH),the 630 seems to be better balanced (I find this also). I think there is more surface area to choose from,(where to place fingers), when holding the camera. It's hard to explain, but it just "feels right".

with my right hand I can turn power camera on and operate zoom lever and all the controls with thumb, leaving my left hand free.

The shutter 1/2 and full press are very distinct, and positive in their actions, a good balance of firmness. The power switch is "sunken" in from body, but yet easy to activate with ball of finger (won't turn on by accident in a belt pouch). I always put camera away with switch in playback position....lens wont extend in pouch...extra safe !!!!

I might mention that the tilt/twist/bend/multi-angle LCD screen is a blessing for me, as I no longer have to be a contortionist to get those macros and low level shots. (my knees and back no longer "crack" as much in public...hahah !!! ).

I have been cropping to as little as (20%) to TRY to indicate to people, just how much detail can be retained, for those who have 6-12 x zoom cameras, and they can judge for themselves.

If you are thinking of getting a A630, you will be pleased to know that you can share SD memory and batteries between them.

I hope this helps you !!

regards Terry

When comparing IQs between the smaller sensored compacts I've always said that a cropped high resolution shot by either the A630/A640 would paractically negate the benefits of the 6X lens and you've done a great job demonstrating that.
--
Regards,
Hank

Thanks for the comments Terry, they are most helpful, and confirm exactly what I was thinking. I have discussed this with my tolerant wife, and she has softened to the extent that I will now get my 7th digital camera (this one confirms what I like, and corrects what I didn't like in previous cameras).

I have had good results from the others to date, but look forward to the A630 as being the one to bring on our Alaska trip this August.
Thank you for your detailed response.
Wilson
--
35 years in film, 5 years in digital. finally got smart

Hello again

You are most welcome. I would like to mention that after doing extensive cropping tests(and printing 8 1/2 x11's) with the A630, and digging out my old 8080 jpg's, I find that,they are identical for all practical purposes.(IMO).The detail retained by both is truely remarkable straight out of camera.

The one advantage of the A630 I really enjoy having, is it's ability to adjust all image parameters (sharpness,contrast,saturation), and the individual levels of RGB. This allows me to "match" the out of camera jpg's colours to a very high degree with my dslr.(or other P&S's). This may help you if you so choose, if you prefer the look of any of your 6 other cameras. (this feature is so over-looked...hardly any mention in posts).

You may also choose positive film from menu, which if desired can come very close to your 35mm days of shooting "slides". or spend a little time and set up custom colour to "emulate" your favourite film. I have set mine to "pretend" it's Ansco 100.....ha ha !!!!

I shall go so far as to say that I can with every confidence substitute my A630 for my dslr when shooting ISO 80-100 when intention is to produce 8 1/2 X 11" borderless prints.

If you require any more info or tips, that I use regarding A630, feel free to email me anytime.

best regards; Terry (50 years in film...next 50 digital !!!)

H All

This is not a crop test,but rather a means to show you visually an "effect" that I want to ADD to some images, I will shoot later to emulate a "looking through a screen door".

This is how I produced the screen door (look !!).

I went to my first post and used my A630( macro,f/2.8,ISO 80,) and did hand held shot of my laptop 15" LCD screen. It's not all camera lens distortions....BLAME ME....not holding it perpendicular to display !!!



then cropped and downsized and converted to sepia and got this.



I used the pixels of laptop LCD to make the screen door "effect",that I wanted, but they aren't completly straight. I lost track of how many generations I put the original image through,(all those jpg losses),but I ended up with a nice(IMHO), 5x7 experimental image. I have a bunch of wooden oval frames with yellowed glass (1890's I'm told), I want to mount appropriate "fake" photos in.

Any ideas,suggestions for an easier way to achieve this, would be most appreciated

regards/cheers Terry

Hi Terry,

Thanks for the email offer, it will be fun to compare notes on tips and hints. I just ordered my A630 today, so I will be a member of the "A" family soon. As much as a 12x zoom is fun, the IQ does not live up to Canon, and your cropping technique sounds like a great way bridge the gap. Have you used the Canon "safe zoom" yet? As I understand it, it allows a controlled digital zoom, keeping the ratio below the loss of detail level (like 1.6x for the A630), and still IQ levels that could be cropped to "simulate" further zoom. Is this correct? If you have tried this, would you email me an example? I have to wait for a week or ten days for delivery, but my curiosity is peaked.
Email address is "[email protected]" What is yours?

I am so lax when it comes to creative manipulating pics with the idea of later framing, but I do like clean sharp images.
Thanks again for your interest.
wilson
--
35 years in film, 5 years in digital. finally got smart

First let me congratulate everyone who buys an A630. I had the pleasure of using one for a couple of weeks, and must say I was simply blown away by the image quality for a non-dSLR. The tilt and swivel LCD could quickly spoil you when lining up a tough macro shot or shooting candids (though the LCD itself is of terrible quality). The RAW firmware hack has the potential to turn this into a mind-boggling bargain. And the AA batteries in my previous A-series Canons saved more than one picture with a trip to a convenience store.

OTOH, I had a A710 IS to try side-by-side with the A630. In any close comparison the A630's IQ easily bested the A710, except where the A710's IS kicked in to correct blur.

In the end, I ended up with a Panasonic TZ3. As much as tried to rationalize I couldn't stretch the term "pocketable" to encompass the A630 w/ 4 AA's. The A710 couldn't match the TZ3's wide or tele range, or its stunningly effective IS (hand-holding 280mm-equiv. at ISO100 and 1/30sec is a revelation).

Hi All

This will be my absolute last crop test, so you can judge what a 8mp 1/1.8" sensor can do. I'm sure you A640 and G (?) owners can do even better.

Actually, I was out doing a quick test see what results I'd get using auto WB with mixed direct sunlight and shade. Trees always seem to work for me!

reference photo (full image....downsized)



Then I did the cropping part and I think this is the smallest(tightest) area in my crop test series. I picked the top left section, so worst conditions (near edge) so any softness or distortions would show up.
1/40 ,f/3.2 ISO 80, no zoom.



I got carried away here and converted to sepia look, because there was too much green for my liking. please judge the image for it's intended purpose (crop detail retention), and NOT my skills at pretending I'm any kind of artist.

QUESTION: based on my crop, what would the largest print I could make of the WHOLE image,and still have detail you see here ?

I'm planning on doing another thread to show color "accent" and "swap" examples.......these little camera's "FUN FACTOR" built in features, make it difficult to put stop playing and get serious, at least for me !!!!!!!!!

regards Terry