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High Iso article

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Great article but it doesn't really compare the noise levels on different sensor sizes. It's actually a comparison of the various noise reduction systems.

I really would have liked to see a comparison of RAW images from cameras like the Canon 400D, Panasonic FZ50 (1/1.7" sensor) and Panasonic FZ8 (1/2.5" sensor).

And then a comparison between camera noise reduction and software noise reduction would be the logical next step.
So I'm eagerly waiting for the High ISO Modes part II article :)
 
Simon,

great article, and thank you to DPReview for doing their best to push the manufacturers in the right direction.

It is often stated that with more/smaller pixels, while you do have more noise, you can average over more pixels. So theoretically- a noisy 12Mp will give you in-effect a somewhat cleaner 6 Mp image if reduced (properly).

At about 6 Mp, you get an eye clean 8x10" print from even the best printer. So- perhaps you can add a comparative normalized noise metric at a standard pixel number, say 6 or 7.1Mp?

i.e. how would, let's say the Sony W200 compare to the venerable Fuji F30 if compared at an equivalent 100% view at 6Mpix.
--

 
Gennadiy Tsygan said:
This article reinforces the point brought up many times before- the
importance of the sensor size. However, "Features Search" in
Buying Guide on dpreview desn't offer "minimum imager size" as one
of specs to choose from. I'd rather see "Megapixels" taken out, as
their number is increasingly irrelevant.
Click to expand...
We're in agreement. However, I contend that with the 8-10-12 megapixel 1/2.7" pocket cameras, megapixels is QUITE relevant! The bigger the MP, the worse the IQ... :-(

--
Charlie Davis
Nikon 5700 & Sony R1
CATS #25
PAS Scribe @ http://www.here-ugo.com/PAS_List.htm
HomePage: http://www.1derful.info
'I brake for pixels...'
 
tom_so said:
Gennadiy Tsygan said:
This article reinforces the point brought up many times before- the
importance of the sensor size. However, "Features Search" in
Buying Guide on dpreview desn't offer "minimum imager size" as one
of specs to choose from. I'd rather see "Megapixels" taken out, as
their number is increasingly irrelevant.
Click to expand...
this indeed would be very helpful, as i was looking for exactly
that information.
Click to expand...
Hey, Phil...if I've counted correctly, 5 people like my idea!
tom_so said:
(plus, i discovered that if you
take party pics in B&W the noise actually makes them look cooler!)
Click to expand...
Yes. ISO 3200 pix taken with the R1 are ugly in color, but the noise in B&W looks like Tri-X film! Can be very artsy-pfhartsy...

But then the R1 has nice BIG photosites. :-)

--
Charlie Davis
Nikon 5700 & Sony R1
CATS #25
PAS Scribe @ http://www.here-ugo.com/PAS_List.htm
HomePage: http://www.1derful.info
'I brake for pixels...'
 
waste of time imo

it's like a car review site saying V8s are gas guzzlers
 
Frank C. said:
waste of time imo

it's like a car review site saying V8s are gas guzzlers
Click to expand...
Yeah i think we got it the first time.

So nice of you to look down from that high horse just to spread a little joy 'round here :)

S
--
Simon Joinson, dpreview.com
 
Thomas K. said:
hopefully no more "but MY compact also has high iso8976" (-:

DSLR rules!!!
Click to expand...
My compact only gives decent results up to ISO200...



...but I don't care because I rarely have to use high ISO modes ;-)

I do care about high ISO modes when using my DSLR (400D).

None of my three lenses have image stabilisation and only my 50mm/F1.8 is faster than the FZ7 lens.

 
Tom Christiansen said:
chuxter said:
Tom Christiansen said:
Some stuff is just too complicated to put in searches; this may be
one of those.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Tom Christiansen said:
Or not. Depends on how well it's presented?
Click to expand...
Yes, you're right. I just don't know how much trouble it's worth.
Without an open codebase, even those willing to scratch the
itch are left at the mercy of those with "better" things to do.
Click to expand...
Open codebase? No, I think not. I'm thinking of something better than what's there now, but well short of your extreme suggestion.

In the end, it's Phil that decides how much trouble it's worth, not you and me...

--
Charlie Davis
Nikon 5700 & Sony R1
CATS #25
PAS Scribe @ http://www.here-ugo.com/PAS_List.htm
HomePage: http://www.1derful.info
'I brake for pixels...'
 
chuxter said:
chuxter said:
Yes, you're right. I just don't know how much trouble it's worth.
Without an open codebase, even those willing to scratch the
itch are left at the mercy of those with "better" things to do.
Click to expand...
Open codebase? No, I think not. I'm thinking of something better
than what's there now, but well short of your extreme suggestion.

In the end, it's Phil that decides how much trouble it's worth, not
you and me...
Click to expand...
By open codebase, I didn't mean that anybody would be able
to change how things work. I only meant that if the code
weren't all locked away, that we could see it, then anybody could
send a patch to Phil that actually implemented a suggestion.
It would still be up to him (or to whomever) whether they cared
for the idea. That's not at all radical, at least in my world.
A Corewars-style free-for-all, now that would be radical. :-)

--tom
 
Sorry if I'm misinformed, here, but I've looked at the images that come from my wife's F30 and I NEVER see images as noise-free as the ones posted in the article. Are they not 100% crops? Or do I possibly have a setting wrong on the camera? Or is it possible that I've got a defective camera? Are the F30s images really supposed to be that close in terms of noise to the 30D? I've got an older D30 and the IQ doesn't come close between the two. D30 still has better IQ and less noise.
 
Phil,

Sadly, the news following Simon's high ISO article are 2 12 MP compact by Casio and Panasonic. A co-incident? According to the news, the 12 MP Panly has ISO 6400!

I don't see any light on this subject yet.

I start to like/love DSLR despite it size and cost.

Daniel.
Phil Askey said:
That's our hope and something we mention every time we meet up with
the decision makers from the various camps, sadly many merchants
still sell by megapixel.

--
Phil Askey
Editor, dpreview.com
Click to expand...
 
Kodak just announced that they'll be releasing a camera later this year sporting a new Kodak/IBM 5MP CMOS sensor. Apparently the new sensor has superior noise and light sensitivity. Perhaps there's hope for sanity in the marketplace after all.
danfok said:
Sadly, the news following Simon's high ISO article are 2 12 MP
compact by Casio and Panasonic. A co-incident? According to the
news, the 12 MP Panly has ISO 6400!

I don't see any light on this subject yet.

I start to like/love DSLR despite it size and cost.

Daniel.
Phil Askey said:
That's our hope and something we mention every time we meet up with
the decision makers from the various camps, sadly many merchants
still sell by megapixel.

--
Phil Askey
Editor, dpreview.com
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
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