Seems like the H9 is for "serious" amateurs or pros

It looks as if you can get really good images if you don't just point and shoot.
Extra care must also be taken in manual.
This may be THE camera for AAK, Olga, and the like.

If I get one, I will certainly also keep either my H1 or F707.

Those cameras I can P&S in auto and get good results (with perhaps a bit of Photoshop).

When I have time, I do go off auto, but I am almost the photographic equivalent of tone deaf (image blind??). I also don't practice enough.

I was a physicist and then an engineer, so I understand all of the factors at play. (I also did image processing using the first digital algorithms - it took many hours to process an image circa 1968). My problem is that before I can set up manual to get a bird shot, the critter has died of old age.

Unfortunately for SONY, I think they may have (unintentionally) targeted too small a customer base with the H9. The sensitivity to conditions sounds fixable either with new firmware or the H11.

I don't think you have read the early posts regarding the H-9. I posted many of the first pictures on this forum from that camera, and believe me - they were ALL point and shoot. I think they were amazing.

The thing is you can do either. I had the F-707 and the F-828 - so cameras are not new to me. I loved both of those, but I will never regret selling them and buying the H-9. It is a completely different camera - and it just blows me away every time I use it. - Pointing and shooting!! When I want to get creative - the H-9 is a responsive camera in Manual or any mode you might wish to use.

I never do any photoshop work on my pictures. They appear exactly as they came out of the camera.

Look them up on this site. You will be looking at P & S pictures.

Niikinut

mangurian said:

It looks as if you can get really good images if you don't just
point and shoot.
Extra care must also be taken in manual.
This may be THE camera for AAK, Olga, and the like.

Click to expand...

No, no, no... Please do not think that way. I, for example, unlike AAK, do not use manual. With the H9 I use Av or P mode. It's just as easy as Auto.

mangurian said:

When I have time, I do go off auto, but I am almost the
photographic equivalent of tone deaf (image blind??). I also don't
practice enough.

Click to expand...

I have to admit that you would need a little bit of practice. But you'll need that no matter which camera you choose.

mangurian said:

I was a physicist and then an engineer, so I understand all of the
factors at play. (I also did image processing using the first
digital algorithms - it took many hours to process an image circa
1968). My problem is that before I can set up manual to get a
bird shot, the critter has died of old age.

Click to expand...

LOL! Join the club! I'm just not that swift to calculate all that stuff. I've used manual in the past, with my dslr, but that's if I am in one spot where the lighting does not change, or I have a friend telling me what settings to set.

Please do not be discouraged. It's not as hard as you think. You can always stick with P mode and you have it made!

Olga

Hi

I have putchase the H9 so I can start learning how to use a camera manually.

But I most say it also takes great shots on Auto, take a look at my first post.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=23188804

I love this camera and I am looking forward to learning how to use it.

Playing around with full auto (green camera icon on the dial) I find it not so bad. You have to turn on face recognition for really full auto. I do turn of the focus light since it is unnecessary and just irritates people. Even in full auto, you can still adjust exposure if needed. You will occassionally not get the ideal shot but when comparing to other cameras, you won't get the perfect shot with them either. I find that most on this forum don't even try the auto functions. I didn't take face recognition seriously until I tried it. With odd lighting situations like backlighting, it really helps making sure that the exposure and focus of the primary face is correct and it does so quickly. The only problem is that with flash photos is that it will go to ISO 400 too soon. ISO 400 on this camera is pretty good though but it would be better if it stayed at lower ISOs longer.

Olga, What's AV and AP? Is it simple enough for me to try?
thanks, Doris

Isn't face recognition an automatic?
Doris

Doris Mansfield said:

Olga, What's AV and AP? Is it simple enough for me to try?
thanks, Doris

Click to expand...

Doris,

1. P is Program mode. Right on the dial. It's like Auto but lets you change some things if you so wish. It sets both Aperture and Shutter speed on its own.

2. Instead of Av I should have said A. Aperture mode. Again right on the dial. To start out with I try to keep Aperture at the lowest number it would go (depends on the zoom). The lower the number the more light the camera lets in.

In A mode, you set the aperture and the camera calculates the shutter speed. The danger with that is that the shutter speed that is calculated could be quite low and you may not notice. With low shutter speed you will get more blur. (Unfortunately this happens often to me when I don't pay attention.)

The nice thing about digital is that the film is free. You can experiment and see how it works.

Olga

When you are in full auto, you go to the menu and one of the options is to turn on face recognition. It defaults to off. It is only availible in full auto but you have to turn it on. When it recognizes a face, a green square goes around the face. If it recognizes several faces (up to 8) it goes by the largest assuming this to be the primary target. I had to play around to find this. You would think that it would be automatically on with the option to turn it off.

Interesting thoughts and while the H9 may take a bit longer to learn or get accustomed to, I would not hesitate to get one even though I still consider myself very much an amateur. When I got my H1 I did not know aperture from shutter speed and while I did get very good results in many situations from full auto mode, I soon found myself moving to program and then to manual. Now with the H5, on occasion I will try sports mode or aperture/shutter priority but usually part way through the exercise I end up saying to myself….why am I doing this? Since I generally know the shutter and/or the aperture I want for a particular shot, why freeze one and let the camera decide the other when I know that I can get the EV to the setting I want and the histogram where I want it much more easily if I am in full manual. If I still can’t get EV or histogram where I think it should be I can change the ISO. Once I got a basic understanding of the concepts and practised (and failed many times) it all seemed to fall together. I do agree however, it is easy to freeze when it comes to getting a quick action shot and sometimes it is necessary to revert to program mode or use it for casual shooting if you don’t want to have to think too much. I can't imagine the H9 being a lot more difficult to handle than the previous H models but from what I have read, it is different from the H1 or H2/H5 and there is a learning curve.

Bill

--
http://www.pbase.com/willvan
Sony H5 H1 DH1758 M3358
Fuji F30 A303

Pictures made in manual, aperature or shutter mode will give you better pictures!

I don't get it why people buy a cam like the H9, which isn't cheap, to make only point and shoot pictures.

I can do all those things. Once in awhile I like to relax and jus point and shoot. I also like to see what will happen if I hand the camera to my wife in auto mode. Some people buy such a camera for the zoom not wanting to learn more. The H9 does fairly well and in fact produces some pretty good results in auto. Learning how the performs this way may surprise some. Even in auto, the exposure is adjustable in case of difficult circumstances. The scene modes may work, haven't tried them. The settings for fireworks are quite standard so it will be interesting how that works.

I will try. I just put the dial on A. I can't see a number but see how it changes as I turn the dial.

In A mode, I also turn the dial but don't see anything different. What am I looking for?
Doris

Cool. Thanks. This is one of the reasons I bought the H-9.
Doris

I bought it so I could grow into it. Like anything else, if it's available we learn to use it.

There's actually a very good reason for people to buy the H9 as a point-and-shoot. Perhaps they don't take pictures often. Or just want to use it on a trip, or for their children's school play. They don't want to learn photography, they aren't worried about great art, they just want to take snapshots.

So why the H9 instead of a good pocketcam? Becuase no pocket camera has 15X zoom. And they mostly have dreaful, weak flashes. I can't think of a much better digicam to take shots of your kids' sports in burst mode, or of a school play with Auto ISO!

I like to exploit the tools I have. Many people just want a camera with a big zoom!
--
=~ AAK - http://www.aakatz.com
=~ Author of The White Paper
=~ http://www.aakatz.com/whitepaper