Macro.. Decissions Decissions HELP !

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is, what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Hi Guy,

Is the Canon 100mm F/2.8 Macro not on the board because of price?
That really has been my favorite lens for Flowers and insects.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=386876

Is one example of what It can do. It could have easily had the rose in question take up the full frame, but I like the background, and wanted a little bit in the frame as well.

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

Hi Guy,

You refer to wanting to take "really close macro images" implying that you want 1:1 magnification or higher. You alslo indicate your subjects will be flowers and possibly insects. One major consideration is working distance. Insects, butterflies, etc., won't allow you to get too close, so this is an important issue.

The 50 mm lens, with extension/macro adapter to get you to 1:1 magnification will have an extremely short working distance, and I think would eliminate this from consideration for what you're wanting to do.

The 100-400 with extension tubes and/or 500D will give you reasonable magnification with a reasonably working distance, but won't get you near 1:1 magnification.

You don't mention it, but probably one of the better choices would be the 100/f2.8 USM Macro lens. It gives you 1:1 with a working distance of about 9" and is an extremely sharp lens. With extension tubes, you can get up to 2:1.

Another option would be the 180 macro lens, which will also give you 1:1 mag., but with increased working distance. Bigger, heavier, more expensive than the 100, but also a choice to consider.

Bellows is a logistically difficult way to go.

You might go ahead and purchase John Shaw's book "Closeups in Nature" as it goes into a multitude of areas, including equipment.

Good luck!

Don
http://www.dlcphotography.net

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

I would get the Canon 100 2.8 marco, well I will get someday when I have the money. WJF

Member said:

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set

Click to expand...

Not your best choice. To get the magnification you want, you'd be using the tubes with one of your zoom lenses. The problem is that everytime you change the zoom setting you must refocus. Plus both of these zooms have a relatively small maximum apeture. The tubes will cause a further reduction of light in the viewfinder, making framing, focusing, DOF determination, etc. that much more difficult.

Member said:

B. 500D

Click to expand...

A very good choice, IMHO. Used with the 100-400 zoom it will do what you want with plants and allow you to take phots of fair-sized bugs. Not enough though for those little tiny guys. But very convienent and gives you the option of framing by simply zooming, which will more than compensate for the very slight loss of image quality incurred through the use of the extra glass.

Member said:

C. Bellows

Click to expand...

Not currently an option on EOS cameras AFAIK. And even if it were, bellows are very awkard and probably overkill for what you want to do.

Member said:

D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

Click to expand...

The 50mm is not a good option for what you have in mind - not enough distance between you and the camera for lighting those flowers and for sure the bugs aren't going to let you get that close. The 100mm, as indicated by others in this thread, would IMHO be a very good option. More expensive than the 500D and an extra lens to carry, but excellent quality and will let you do all that you want to do as far as flowers and bugs. And I like mine so much that I use it a lot for things other than close-ups. If its too expensive, you might want to shop for a used older non-USM model or consider a third-party lens, some of which many find very good (do a search in this forum for brands/comments). More costly, but really wonderful, is the 180mm macro.

Member said:

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

So I didn't mention it because I forgot.. I have just got a mail from a freind who said I want closeup images as apposed to Macro.. apparently there is a difference ?.. well it still stands that I would like to get the hairs on a stamen, the hairy legs of a spider and an ant carrying a blade of grass.. well that sort of thing anyway... so the bellows are out the 50mm is out.. it is a race between the tubes, the 100mm and the 500 d.

Still no clear winner though ?

Mark Jamison said:

Is the Canon 100mm F/2.8 Macro not on the board because of price?
That really has been my favorite lens for Flowers and insects.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=386876

Is one example of what It can do. It could have easily had the rose
in question take up the full frame, but I like the background, and
wanted a little bit in the frame as well.

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

I don't know. I can't imagine not having my 100mm F/2.8 macro for closeups.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=368729

Is another example. That is a closeup of a Bee, obviously, and no cropping or sharpening was performed on the picture.

I Know Don Cohen used/uses extension tubes on his closeups, and has gotten some rather amazing shots with them.

Guy Churchward said:

Still no clear winner though ?

Mark Jamison said:

Is the Canon 100mm F/2.8 Macro not on the board because of price?
That really has been my favorite lens for Flowers and insects.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=386876

Is one example of what It can do. It could have easily had the rose
in question take up the full frame, but I like the background, and
wanted a little bit in the frame as well.

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Mark Jamison said:

I Know Don Cohen used/uses extension tubes on his closeups, and has
gotten some rather amazing shots with them.

Click to expand...

Thanks!

I'd agree overall that the 100/f2.8 USM Macro is a great lens for any type of close-up work: flowers, insects, butterflies, etc. What I like about extension tubes is that they can be used with any lens: with the 100 macro, they'll get me to 2:1 magnification; and they turn the 100-400 into a quasi macro lens in addition to its usual telephoto job.

The tubes are a $120 accessory. They don't substitute for the 100 macro lens, but should be looked at as an accessory to be used with it, or with other lenses.

I mention the tubes because the original poster already has the 100-400, and this would give him some macro capability with a minimum expense.

Best regards,

Don
http://www.dlcphotography.net

I'd suggest 500D and 1.4x teleconverter.

The 500D is a really nice acc., and the converter can make your 100-400 longer also, which is a piece of glass you will buy sooner or later. These two can give you pretty much close to 1:1(not counting the 1.6x multiplier of D30 itself).

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

--Darkness is made up of dark particles.

What about the Tamron f/2.8 90mm Macro lens? All but the first 8 pics in my macro gallery were shot with it. Any opinions of this lens?

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

--Stay Focused http://home.attbi.com/~keylargographics

Guy Churchward said:

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-
A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D

Click to expand...

I would (and plan to, eventually) purchase both of these.

Member said:

C. Bellows

Click to expand...

Too awkward to use for moving insects. I would consider this setup for "specimen" photography.

Member said:

D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

Click to expand...

No working distance, plus it goes "only" to 1:2. For bugs, the longer the focal length the better.

JCDoss

Guy Churchward said:

OK.. not a new subject but please give me the benefit to a multiple
choice.. I have the following

Canon EOS D30
Canon USM 24-85
Canon L Series 100-400
Sigma 15mm Fisheye
Sigma 15-30

I want to take really close macro images. I have the choice of :-

A. Kenko Tube Set
B. 500D
C. Bellows
D. Canon 50mm Macro Lens

The subject will be almost exclusively flowers but potentially
insects as well... so which do I choose.. My Phot friend have
confused me and I cannot get a straight answer.. so here it is,
what I have and what do I need ?

Guy

Click to expand...

Guy,

I read all the posts so far, and you have been given several options and lots of great information.

The difficulty is that macro encompasses such a vast range of potential that there is actually not one "single" solution for all possible uses. For example, you don't even need a macro lens to get great closeup images of most flowers. With a reasonably good zoom lens like the 100-400 IS, you can get amazingly good images of most flowers. With the addition of something as simple as a closeup filter like the 500D, you can shoot butterflies and larger insects. When you go to the true macro lenses you can get much closer and larger magnifications, but to do the ultimate in non-microscopic macro you will need to use extension tubes, bellows "and" reversed lenses. The downside of this is that your subject will be very difficult to frame, you will need probably two flash units or perhaps a good ring flash, a tripod an lots of luck.

Just as an example of the possible, here is a photo of a tiny golden ant taken by Charles Chien, who has refined the process to an art form. This was done with a reversed lens, bellows, extention tube, a couple flashes and lots of time a patience. Is it worth it? You bet it is, but be prepared for a length learning curve and buy a good set of knee pads!

Best regards,

Lin

http://204.42.233.244/photos/ant.jpg--http://204.42.233.244

Lin Evans said:

The difficulty is that macro encompasses such a vast range of
potential that there is actually not one "single" solution for all
possible uses> Just as an example of the possible, here is a photo of a tiny
golden ant taken by Charles Chien, who has refined the process to
an art form. This was done with a reversed lens, bellows, extention
tube

Click to expand...

Agreed. I'm in the same boat trying to decide. I already own the 100-400 a set of 3 kenko extension tubes, and a good prime 50mm.

After much deliberation, I almost bought the Canon MPE 65mm, but after some more consideration, I decided I don't have the patience required to focus/light with those small working distances at 5:1.

I'm 99% convinced that I'll go with the Canon 100mm f2.8, that coupled with the extensions, should be all I need.

Yes, Charles is one of the macro kings! I've seen a few of his MPE 65mm shots, as well as his reversed lens shots... wow

Steve

If you are, like me, fairly new to macro/closeup, I'd support the suggestion of the Tamron SP 90mm F2.8 Macro. It is inexpensive and flexible, but still provides 1:1 and is pretty sharp. All the images in my linked page below were done with that lens.

Brgds
--Ian S http://www.rainpalm.com/orch01.htm

In your position I would buy the Canon 100 macro.

But if you want to spend a lot less the Sigma 50 macro at $210 is probably the "best buy" in this area. Here is a shot I took with one in November...
The famous "one eyed Illinois fly" shot:



Good Luck!
--Dave Werner

Hi Guy, I also have the following. Canon EOS D30, Canon L Series 100-400, Sigma 15mm Fisheye. I also have the 100mm f-2.8 Macro. The 100 mm is the best lens that I have. This includes the 28-105, 17-35, and the 50 1.4.

I have been doing some macro shots at work with it that just blow me away. As a walking around lens it ain't to shaby either.

--Ron Warren