ledittmar
Senior Member
I have an auto-mobile, but I won't trust it without my trying to control the steering and the little pedals on the floor.
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More 400D grief
- Thread starter AC1
- Start date
Melvin Partido
Forum Enthusiast
Although I really love my Canon Rebel "XT", I can look back to my first Canon AE-1. If memory serves me right, you would just match up the "needle" and take your picture. So much easier than.
"Any other suggestions welcome! "
no you're right to chase down canon until they provide you with the camera you paid for - the one that gives you perfect images everytime from the green square autozone - no hassle click and voila.
Whatever you do don't spend any time or money on learning exposure/phtography - especially when there is 'full auto' mode to rely on! who needs to right? They did put that green square right up there on top afterall.
I mean really mate! I can barely see your post as legitimate - you're thinking about the 30D??! - because you can't get the green square on the 400D to shoot neon? Doesn't ring true.
And the post I commented on yesterday (different person) had this same almost unbelievable overconfidence of opinion from someone who kows absolutely nothing and says as much - and your post is the same (exactly)
You read all of this forum 'after' you buy a 400D?
You buy a dslr and loudly complain of blurry (and dark) shots??! - wondering why?!?! You've read much of the forum and still apprently wonder what to do - so you wonder loudly with a provocative thread title.
Let me say that again - You take blurry shots - wonder why - and then wonder if the 30D might be the way to go. Give me a break. There seems to be a fair likelyhood that this is a fairly well thought out, though ultimately inconsistent contrivance to me rather than a realistic mentality for someone to hold. Then again, there is, nout queer as folk.
So yeah I'm suggesting that you and not a few others are shams (held with 55% confidence... lol ) - the similarities sugget a strategy, perhaps even the refining of one, it is difficult to then discern what exactly it might be but given 400D sales figure demographic breakdowns I'll bet it should be something along the lines of scare th s* t out of new to dlsr buyers. "I might buy a 30D" seems bizarre and to be fair I can't see how such an angle would play in a cunning mud slinging enterprise - could it be saying to a new to dslr buyers - "oh I can't afford to get a good one without spending $1200 so I might as well buy a p&s" - which I'll assume canon doesn't have quite the sales precentage command over. Because if A1 had drawn the obvious conclusion - that he should actually stick with a high feature set p&s camera - well... where would that leave his ability to post loudly about his considered appreciation of the 400d exposure problems.
Oh and aren't the "oh my god my 400D underexposed" threads spread too evenly or something - is it one per day. better fix that. Here's the new regime boys 3 - 0 - 0 - 2 - 1 ....
no you're right to chase down canon until they provide you with the camera you paid for - the one that gives you perfect images everytime from the green square autozone - no hassle click and voila.
Whatever you do don't spend any time or money on learning exposure/phtography - especially when there is 'full auto' mode to rely on! who needs to right? They did put that green square right up there on top afterall.
I mean really mate! I can barely see your post as legitimate - you're thinking about the 30D??! - because you can't get the green square on the 400D to shoot neon? Doesn't ring true.
And the post I commented on yesterday (different person) had this same almost unbelievable overconfidence of opinion from someone who kows absolutely nothing and says as much - and your post is the same (exactly)
You read all of this forum 'after' you buy a 400D?
You buy a dslr and loudly complain of blurry (and dark) shots??! - wondering why?!?! You've read much of the forum and still apprently wonder what to do - so you wonder loudly with a provocative thread title.
Let me say that again - You take blurry shots - wonder why - and then wonder if the 30D might be the way to go. Give me a break. There seems to be a fair likelyhood that this is a fairly well thought out, though ultimately inconsistent contrivance to me rather than a realistic mentality for someone to hold. Then again, there is, nout queer as folk.
So yeah I'm suggesting that you and not a few others are shams (held with 55% confidence... lol ) - the similarities sugget a strategy, perhaps even the refining of one, it is difficult to then discern what exactly it might be but given 400D sales figure demographic breakdowns I'll bet it should be something along the lines of scare th s* t out of new to dlsr buyers. "I might buy a 30D" seems bizarre and to be fair I can't see how such an angle would play in a cunning mud slinging enterprise - could it be saying to a new to dslr buyers - "oh I can't afford to get a good one without spending $1200 so I might as well buy a p&s" - which I'll assume canon doesn't have quite the sales precentage command over. Because if A1 had drawn the obvious conclusion - that he should actually stick with a high feature set p&s camera - well... where would that leave his ability to post loudly about his considered appreciation of the 400d exposure problems.
Oh and aren't the "oh my god my 400D underexposed" threads spread too evenly or something - is it one per day. better fix that. Here's the new regime boys 3 - 0 - 0 - 2 - 1 ....
magicmikey
Forum Enthusiast
That's uncalled for. In the original post, he said, "Over the last couple of days I've been weighing up my options inc reading the extensive discussions here. There is some very useful and helpful experince to tap into (hence just signing up today) but boy are there some camera snobs out there too!"
He said he read extensive discussions here.
Far out. There are some weird people around here aren't there. Some of you strike me as straightforward, knowledgeable and willing to help. To you guys (and you know who you are), thanks for your help so far.
But to those of you who think I'm a troll, well I suggest you settle down and return to your paranoid little boxes. I'm a veteran user of other forums (sailing as opposed to photography) so I know what a credible thread looks like from new user who has just started to get into a subject and ventured into online discussions.
I am baffled that you think it is so strange for someone to follow the sequence of:
1. using compact cameras for years
2. reading DP review for several months as part of making a decision to buy a camera
3. having other friends with a camera like a 350D and reasonable knowledge but by no means all the answers
4. buying my first DSLR with great expectations
5. being somewhat dissapointed by the initial results
6. coming BACK to DP review to re-read the reviews and look at forum discusisons to see if I'm on my own
7. taking some comfort from finding that I'm not alone with this problem
8. wanting to ask some questions hence registering and posting on the forum for the first time (today)
9. despite having entry-level experience to the DSLRs I do have a scientific and fully-functional brain and an intellectual job and the ability to spot a helpful answer from a feacetious one
10. considering what several other users of this forum have done i.e. returned thei 400D and opted for the 30D - and doing so with eyes wide open as to the implications
But to those of you who think I'm a troll, well I suggest you settle down and return to your paranoid little boxes. I'm a veteran user of other forums (sailing as opposed to photography) so I know what a credible thread looks like from new user who has just started to get into a subject and ventured into online discussions.
I am baffled that you think it is so strange for someone to follow the sequence of:
1. using compact cameras for years
2. reading DP review for several months as part of making a decision to buy a camera
3. having other friends with a camera like a 350D and reasonable knowledge but by no means all the answers
4. buying my first DSLR with great expectations
5. being somewhat dissapointed by the initial results
6. coming BACK to DP review to re-read the reviews and look at forum discusisons to see if I'm on my own
7. taking some comfort from finding that I'm not alone with this problem
8. wanting to ask some questions hence registering and posting on the forum for the first time (today)
9. despite having entry-level experience to the DSLRs I do have a scientific and fully-functional brain and an intellectual job and the ability to spot a helpful answer from a feacetious one
10. considering what several other users of this forum have done i.e. returned thei 400D and opted for the 30D - and doing so with eyes wide open as to the implications
magicmikey
Forum Enthusiast
That looks great. Is that shot straight out of the camera or post processed? If it's post processed, all it proves is that the shots can be adjusted. If not, you're XTi does a lot better in those circumstances than mine. I can assure you my XTi would not expose properly in the Auto mode in that situation and would need post processing. (I, personally, would use manual mode in that situation anyway but that's not the point of this thread.)
Michael
Michael
magicmikey
Forum Enthusiast
Why is it so hard to be civil and helpful? If you don't want to help, then skip these threads.
Collin85
Forum Enthusiast
AC1,
I understand your concern, and I agree that the Auto mode on the 400D is most probably sub-standard. I, like many believe the 'underexposure' issues are simply due to Canon's paradigm of preserving highlights in shots. This isn't necessarily bad, just different. However I do agree that they shouldn't instill this method in it's Full Auto mode. My S3-IS took much better Auto images than my 400D.
Like already mentioned, the easiest way to counter this underexposure is to move to Program mode (which is essentially Auto in that it still chooses the shutter speed and aperture), but you get to set exposure compensation, choose your metering, change ISO etc. Once you are in P, simply compensation for the underexposure by setting the EC notch to +2/3 and see how that affects your results. Adjust as you see fit.
In my opinion, I never found Auto terribly useful, even in P&S. It's great for when you've got great light and your subjects are stationary. Basically Auto is great for happy snaps (and hence why happy snap cameras like the IXUS/SD range only come with Auto). But once you've learned the ropes on camera control such as changing the shutter speed and aperture, you should find yourself using Auto less and less.
I came to the 400D from the S3-IS, and before that a small A510, and had already learned about those controls. I've only used Auto a few times on my 400D to take some test shots, but apart from that, I stick almost exclusively to Av, M and sometimes Tv. I think once you've really got the dSLR learning curve under your belt, Auto will become a no-go zone. Until then, use exposure compensation in Program!
Good luck!
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Collin
I understand your concern, and I agree that the Auto mode on the 400D is most probably sub-standard. I, like many believe the 'underexposure' issues are simply due to Canon's paradigm of preserving highlights in shots. This isn't necessarily bad, just different. However I do agree that they shouldn't instill this method in it's Full Auto mode. My S3-IS took much better Auto images than my 400D.
Like already mentioned, the easiest way to counter this underexposure is to move to Program mode (which is essentially Auto in that it still chooses the shutter speed and aperture), but you get to set exposure compensation, choose your metering, change ISO etc. Once you are in P, simply compensation for the underexposure by setting the EC notch to +2/3 and see how that affects your results. Adjust as you see fit.
In my opinion, I never found Auto terribly useful, even in P&S. It's great for when you've got great light and your subjects are stationary. Basically Auto is great for happy snaps (and hence why happy snap cameras like the IXUS/SD range only come with Auto). But once you've learned the ropes on camera control such as changing the shutter speed and aperture, you should find yourself using Auto less and less.
I came to the 400D from the S3-IS, and before that a small A510, and had already learned about those controls. I've only used Auto a few times on my 400D to take some test shots, but apart from that, I stick almost exclusively to Av, M and sometimes Tv. I think once you've really got the dSLR learning curve under your belt, Auto will become a no-go zone. Until then, use exposure compensation in Program!
Good luck!
steelgunner = DarkPicture = troll. Don't feed the troll!
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Collin
magicmikey
Forum Enthusiast
What is your problem? People don't have a right to ask questions about why their camera doesn't work the way they expected. Are all threads that are perceived as negatives written by Nikon users or Pentax users? What would even be the point?
I am a long-time Canon customer. I used Canon F-1's when all the pros around me were using Nikons. (I did newspaper photography, as well as freelance magazine work and the occasional wedding.) With the exception of the Pentax ZX-5 I used for 10 years, all my cameras have been Canons. (In addition to the F-1, I've owned the Powershot A50, Powershot A40, Powershot A80, Powershot G6 and my wife owns a S2-IS. Now, I own an XT and an XTi.)
The XTi can be a most frustrating camera for a new user. Let's try to help them not give them a hard time because they don't know how to use it.
Yes, some people just don't understand enough about how they work but some people are having understandable problems. A few helpful suggestions might take care of some of this.
Michael
pceh777
Well-known member
AC1 - that sounds pretty much like the route I took too.
Please see my previous thread and try to ignore the rudesness of some of the comments here. It didn't used to be like this and I'm sure it will settle down again soon.
This forum used to be a really great place to get some constructive and positive feedback. I think people are just getting a bit snippy with the whole"underexposure" issue.
Hang in there, practice and maybe post some pics.
Regards
Phill
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pceh777
http://www.pbase.com/tuell
Please see my previous thread and try to ignore the rudesness of some of the comments here. It didn't used to be like this and I'm sure it will settle down again soon.
This forum used to be a really great place to get some constructive and positive feedback. I think people are just getting a bit snippy with the whole"underexposure" issue.
Hang in there, practice and maybe post some pics.
Regards
Phill
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pceh777
http://www.pbase.com/tuell
The OP is just looking for help. Why be consdescending? Perhaps your own insecurity over your photographic abilities is the cause...
To the OP: Send the camera in to Canon and have it checked for your peace of mind, or, exchange it for a new one. Get one you are happy with. If you're still not happy, pick up a 350D; it does not have this issue, or, as some call it, "conservative" metering." Contact me if you need some help/advice. I'll be glad to help. I don't have the childhood inferiority problems of steelgunner, so there won't be any name calling from me.
http://www.boxfoto.com
To the OP: Send the camera in to Canon and have it checked for your peace of mind, or, exchange it for a new one. Get one you are happy with. If you're still not happy, pick up a 350D; it does not have this issue, or, as some call it, "conservative" metering." Contact me if you need some help/advice. I'll be glad to help. I don't have the childhood inferiority problems of steelgunner, so there won't be any name calling from me.
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http://www.boxfoto.com
Bambi Brown
Leading Member
Bambi Brown
Leading Member
It's not the question. It's the obvious pattern.
magicmikey
Forum Enthusiast
Again, what would they gain?
Do you love Canon so much that they can't be criticized?
tycfung
Leading Member
Can you post some of your pics? This will give us more information on what's going on. If you can preserve the EXIF data, that'll be great too. Right now, image blurring and underexposure can be seen in a variety of situations which are not due to technical problems, but due to photographic technique.
For example, shooting an outdoor winter scene with lots of snow typically leads to underexposure. So do indoor pictures where the subject is far away from the camera and beyond the range of the flash. We can't really diagnose the problem unless we have a look at the picture.
DSLRs, like any other camera, work well with auto mode, but they don't work miracles. They can't make a dark room entirely light, and if you have a long hand-held exposure, they won't reduce blurring due to camera movement. (Even image stablization systems will only reduce the blurring, not totally eliminate it in all situations)
For example, shooting an outdoor winter scene with lots of snow typically leads to underexposure. So do indoor pictures where the subject is far away from the camera and beyond the range of the flash. We can't really diagnose the problem unless we have a look at the picture.
DSLRs, like any other camera, work well with auto mode, but they don't work miracles. They can't make a dark room entirely light, and if you have a long hand-held exposure, they won't reduce blurring due to camera movement. (Even image stablization systems will only reduce the blurring, not totally eliminate it in all situations)
Steven - you are among the not-so-bright in this forum. He doesn't have to use the OP's camera to know that blurry pictures are the result of camera shake. The advice given was correct.
http://www.boxfoto.com
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http://www.boxfoto.com
ledittmar
Senior Member
I am sure you are right about people, they don't like to read that their choice of anything they spent a $1000 for is inferior. There must be a lot of cameras and or people out there that need help. I had a Pentax Spotmatic back in the 70s that always underexposed, I shot ASA 400 most of the time. I had to set the meter on it to ASA 200 to get the exposer that I desired. With this 400xti we need to watch where we point the meter or adjust it accordingly..
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