-
Welcome to the new forums! Please read this first. For known issues we are working to resolve, click here.
E3 price range? $1000, $2000 or more?
- Thread starter Frank43
- Start date
Agreed, points don't matter that much. I typically shoot center point only anyhow. However, how quickly any one of those points finds focus is of great importance.
But like you said it is specsmanship. I wonder though, what is the AF point limit before the already small viewfinders of DSLR's become too cluttered.
Give me 200!!! Uh, yeah.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
But like you said it is specsmanship. I wonder though, what is the AF point limit before the already small viewfinders of DSLR's become too cluttered.
Give me 200!!! Uh, yeah.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
Cephalotus
Veteran Member
...what the "E-3" will be, it is absolutely impossible for Olympus to make a camera that will fit more than maybe 20% of the wishes people here are expecting from their personal dream camera...
We will (hopefully) know more about the E-3's specs in some month and then everyone can decide if it is a camera for his needs or if it isn't...
and there will be lots of whining and teeth gnashing no matter what it will be...
The forum will go mad with unsatisfied people, that's the most easy prediction to make about the E-3...
We will (hopefully) know more about the E-3's specs in some month and then everyone can decide if it is a camera for his needs or if it isn't...
and there will be lots of whining and teeth gnashing no matter what it will be...
The forum will go mad with unsatisfied people, that's the most easy prediction to make about the E-3...
D Q E
Veteran Member
Too right - I'm not going to upgrade just for more detailed pics - I want a better photographic tool.
Yep, it should be in the lenses that need it, not the camera.
I'm just as interested in a better Mode A.
--
mumbo jumbo
D Q E
Veteran Member
I don't want to pay a premium either, but I definitely want LiveView.
If you're after large and bright VFers, you're barking up the wrong tree with FourThirds.
The problem with the size avantage is that it's a SMALL advantage - Live View is an huge advantage.
--
mumbo jumbo
Erik37
Veteran Member
those who look for cameras of that level put a
lot of importance to # of AF points, or so is my
impression from reading posts on this site, so I
think Oly need also a competitive # of AF points.
Personally I'm fine with fewer.
Just my two öre
Erik from Sweden
lot of importance to # of AF points, or so is my
impression from reading posts on this site, so I
think Oly need also a competitive # of AF points.
Personally I'm fine with fewer.
Just my two öre
Erik from Sweden
D Q E
Veteran Member
D Q E
Veteran Member
. . .too hard to see an LCD in bright light. I don't like the feal. IT shows trails when you move the camera. It feels disconnected.
If I had a ton of money I would own one, for some interesting shots, but I would never, ever spend the extra dough on that feature in my only DSLR. And if Olympus is pinning their fortunes on it their ship is sinking, because the vast majority of DSLR don't want it, and I have never (although it is limited experience) met a working pro who would invite it.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
If I had a ton of money I would own one, for some interesting shots, but I would never, ever spend the extra dough on that feature in my only DSLR. And if Olympus is pinning their fortunes on it their ship is sinking, because the vast majority of DSLR don't want it, and I have never (although it is limited experience) met a working pro who would invite it.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
DougJGreen
Veteran Member
If Olympus manages to deliver a 10 MP DSLR that provides the image quality, at normal and high ISOs, the autofocus performance, continuous frame rate, build quality, and viewfinder quality of a Nikon D-200, while maintaining the ergonomics of the E-1, and they can deliver this camera for $1500, they will have gone a long way toward stopping the defections that are clearly happenning all the time. That should be quite straightforward. It might be said that such a camera is a "me too" or "too little too late", but the fact is, Olympus has nothing remotely CLOSE to this level of a camera today.
But I am afraid that they are trying to throw the deep ball and come up with something dramatically different and better on some exotic features (such as high speed wireless, sustainable video frame rates, and live view). In doing this, they will clearly have to expend quite a bit of critical engineering resources. And I am afraid that in doing so, they will neglect some of those VERY CRITICAL issues I listed in the first paragraph.
The bells and whistles are nice, but Olympus first needs to deliver on the fundamental basics of a high performance DSLR. And that means substantially improving the AF performance, the low noise high ISO performance, and the frame rate, at a level of resolution deemed adequate for professional work. The rest is all gravy, but if they can't deliver these basics, they ought to just bail on the high end segment.
But I am afraid that they are trying to throw the deep ball and come up with something dramatically different and better on some exotic features (such as high speed wireless, sustainable video frame rates, and live view). In doing this, they will clearly have to expend quite a bit of critical engineering resources. And I am afraid that in doing so, they will neglect some of those VERY CRITICAL issues I listed in the first paragraph.
The bells and whistles are nice, but Olympus first needs to deliver on the fundamental basics of a high performance DSLR. And that means substantially improving the AF performance, the low noise high ISO performance, and the frame rate, at a level of resolution deemed adequate for professional work. The rest is all gravy, but if they can't deliver these basics, they ought to just bail on the high end segment.
Well posted. And I would throw on some form of image stabilization, wehter in lenses, like a stabilized version fo the 50-200 to start, or n the body, like in their P&S cameras.
Your post is probably more correct than any. I would imagine that the best selling DSLR Oly has produced for the E system is the E500. Why, because it offers a robust tradiatinl feature set.
Get back to basics, then release the fundamentals.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
Your post is probably more correct than any. I would imagine that the best selling DSLR Oly has produced for the E system is the E500. Why, because it offers a robust tradiatinl feature set.
Get back to basics, then release the fundamentals.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
Louis_Dobson
Veteran Member
With a smaller sensor size they will not catch up with Nikon at high ISO noise, and over there in the pro world Nikon is being slaughtered because it cannot keep up with CANON on the noise front due to a smaller sensor.
Olympus will have to produce cameras with USPs (Unique Selling Points) and worse high ISO noise performace. And 10MP is entry level now, so they'll have to go a bit further than that.
USPs? Light weight, LV, fast shooting due to light mirror / shutter, dust buster that works, full weather-proofing.
And for that you are going to have to lump some noise.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
Olympus will have to produce cameras with USPs (Unique Selling Points) and worse high ISO noise performace. And 10MP is entry level now, so they'll have to go a bit further than that.
USPs? Light weight, LV, fast shooting due to light mirror / shutter, dust buster that works, full weather-proofing.
And for that you are going to have to lump some noise.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
D Q E
Veteran Member
D Q E
Veteran Member
Yes
Yes
10 should be fine - it's FourThirds, remember.
I don't care about the number of points, but C-AF needs to be improved.
The E-1 has never been too slow for me - but the new cam will need more poke to handle the higher data rates.
I think they need to go faster - smaller image size, shutter and mirror should mean faster operation. Olympus should aim for 10fps.
Whatever fits the bill - 1GB wouldn't be unreasonable.
I hope not - who wants a shaky view?
Yep
We'll get that anyway
Of course.
--
mumbo jumbo
DougJGreen
Veteran Member
I didn't say that they needed to be competitive with the best available. Just ALOT better than they have been. IMHO, Nikon D-200 class is BARE MINIMUM to play in this arena circa mid-2007.
But HOW MUCH worse? Right now, they have a HUGE gap. They need to close it substantially, or else the rest of the unique selling points are simply trying to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.
But how much is some? Right now, Oly's best cameras are a full 2 stops less sensitive than the Nikon D-200 / Canon EOS 30D class, not to mention even further behind the full framers. And those guys aren't standing still either. That's simply too much of a gap. If they can't halve that difference, it's time to hang it up and admit that the 4/3 architecture is too limited to make a serious pro-class DSLR and stick to consumer level cameras.
When I ahve gone to camera shops and tell them I use 4/3 they always ask why. Not because there is poor ISO performance, but becasue there is NO prodfessional upgrade path. They say the same thing about Pentax. Right now the only two brands that are taken seriously are Canon and Nikon.
I knwo the D2X doesn't sell really well, and that Canon is kicking Nikon's tail in the pro market; however, there is something to be said for establishing some credentials as a professional system. Nikon has done it. There "meat and potatoes" is the ten megapixel D200/80 combo though.
Coming up short is not an option. They need a D2X type camera, and one underneath it. The lower model will generate the actual sales, but the upper model will establsih that they are capable of producing a pro camera.
What is wrong with using pixel binning to get high ISO? Have it 12 through 800 ISO, and bin to eight for 1600-3200.
As far as the pro veiwfinder, if they can make the me-1, then why not magnify the VF in the camera. Place a magnifying optic before or after the prism, and give it a huge eyepoint. It seems simple to me.
Use the small mirror to give the camera a ridiculous FPS, and exploit the crop factor to advertise it as more athletic, see lighter to carry down the sidelines at an NFL game.Sure a detachable screen for studio work is nice addition, but 10MP, what?? Are you serious.
We are all entitled to disagree. I think a 10MP live view camera aimed at pros would absolutely sink 4/3. So many people would jump ship afterwards it wold be ridiculous.
People are waiting for a smaller, lighter D2X clone that is even smaller and lighter in light of the AOV 4/3 gives. It can be done, and it needs to be done. Olympus is losing credibility fast. The E1 is a great camera, but it is old. They have to do what the market wants for once. Then get back to innovating.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
I knwo the D2X doesn't sell really well, and that Canon is kicking Nikon's tail in the pro market; however, there is something to be said for establishing some credentials as a professional system. Nikon has done it. There "meat and potatoes" is the ten megapixel D200/80 combo though.
Coming up short is not an option. They need a D2X type camera, and one underneath it. The lower model will generate the actual sales, but the upper model will establsih that they are capable of producing a pro camera.
What is wrong with using pixel binning to get high ISO? Have it 12 through 800 ISO, and bin to eight for 1600-3200.
As far as the pro veiwfinder, if they can make the me-1, then why not magnify the VF in the camera. Place a magnifying optic before or after the prism, and give it a huge eyepoint. It seems simple to me.
Use the small mirror to give the camera a ridiculous FPS, and exploit the crop factor to advertise it as more athletic, see lighter to carry down the sidelines at an NFL game.Sure a detachable screen for studio work is nice addition, but 10MP, what?? Are you serious.
We are all entitled to disagree. I think a 10MP live view camera aimed at pros would absolutely sink 4/3. So many people would jump ship afterwards it wold be ridiculous.
People are waiting for a smaller, lighter D2X clone that is even smaller and lighter in light of the AOV 4/3 gives. It can be done, and it needs to be done. Olympus is losing credibility fast. The E1 is a great camera, but it is old. They have to do what the market wants for once. Then get back to innovating.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
Louis_Dobson
Veteran Member
is very close to the D80.
Hopefully the E3 will be fairly close to the D2X.
However the D2x is being hammered for noise...
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
Hopefully the E3 will be fairly close to the D2X.
However the D2x is being hammered for noise...
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
Louis_Dobson
Veteran Member
And they need more than 10MP.
And yes, they need D2x and D200 price point equivalents. However, if they are like the D2X and the D200 they will get slaughtered. They something clever - size and LV in my opinion.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
And yes, they need D2x and D200 price point equivalents. However, if they are like the D2X and the D200 they will get slaughtered. They something clever - size and LV in my opinion.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
Honestly, I think you were on to it earlier. Slaughter em with FPS due to the small mirror.
As far as slaughtered goes, the D2x doesn't fair well itself. The super E3 needn't either. It sholdn't be there to sell well, becuase barring a miracle it won't. It just needs to say 12+MP and xxFPS, or in translation, a professional E series camera.
I don't think live view is the worst thing ever, I don't need it. But I know that a lot of pros see a camera with LV as a toy-- especially if it has an articulated screen, which will always sacrifice the durability hardcore pros want.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
As far as slaughtered goes, the D2x doesn't fair well itself. The super E3 needn't either. It sholdn't be there to sell well, becuase barring a miracle it won't. It just needs to say 12+MP and xxFPS, or in translation, a professional E series camera.
I don't think live view is the worst thing ever, I don't need it. But I know that a lot of pros see a camera with LV as a toy-- especially if it has an articulated screen, which will always sacrifice the durability hardcore pros want.
--
'There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics.'
Benjamin Disraeli (1804-1881)
Louis_Dobson
Veteran Member
except I think they need LV (which might sell it, because it certainly won't sell without it).
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/acam
http://www.pbase.com/acam/
Keyboard shortcuts
- f
- Forum