rumor?

CARL ZEISS is making lenses for Sony; the 85mm F1.4 and 135mm F1.8
have been rated as the finest glass that money can buy!
Have these two lenses in the A mount even been rated or independently tested yet?

As far as the finest glass money can buy, that's unlikely. Though they will probably be ok.

Walt
 
Thisi s the first time I have ever heard that somebody needs a more quiet camera for landscape. First time ever.

IMO, people need to figure out what they need and performance and then determine which features will get them there.
And, if my Minolta dies, I will buy a Samsung (may be in the
meantime they will adopt the 10Mp and Pentax AS).
You mean like the A100?
I feel many others will do that.
If Sony don't wants to keep prosumer crowds, bad for Sony, there
are other brands on the market.
So, because Sony has not brought out a dSLR with an EVF, you conclude that Sony is abandoning the "prosumer" market?

You are entitled to your opinion, but your logic is baffling to me.
--
GiorgioPM
 
As far as the finest glass money can buy, that's unlikely. Though
they will probably be ok.

Walt
"Finest glass ever" is probably a stretch,, but "ok" sounds more
like a Canoikon exec's wishfull thinking.
Well, I'm hardly a Canon shooter, only canon I have is two micro bellows lenses which I use with my minolta gear. I do have one Nikon body, a F1, for my astrophotography. Use it with Celestron telescopes.

Ok means many things. Obviously you think there is something wrong with ok, I don't.

Wait until the zeiss glass is out and being generally used before you worship it. It has it's own compromises.

Walt
 
Well,

I like the Sony's competence in the electronics & minolta slr-knowhow, but you might admit yourself that for launching a competitive FF-camera one has to have more than just 2 lenses in their bag.

I'm still not sure the if the "Minolta" was a good decision for Sony. The Nikon mount should have been a much better solution for them.

I wouldn't have no problem with a FF-Sony camera and Nikon FF-lenses at all, the Zeiss-lenses with Minolta mount are simpla the uncertain future I can't rely much on. Besides, they won't be cheap for sure, you might believe.
 
No way! Nikon would be way too pricey for Sony to buy out. Sony had to buy a brand that had the expertise and quality, yet was not already in a strong position.

dSLR requires excellence in lens optics, which Minolta has, plus excellence in electronics, which Sony has. Perfect match!

Only two lenses?
There are tonnes of quality lenses from Minolta!

Sony has so far re-released a handful of these...
  • 16mm F2.8 Fisheye
  • 20mm F2.8
  • 35mm F1.4 G
  • 50mm F2.8 macro
  • 100mm F2.8 macro
  • 135mm F2.8 STF
  • 300mm F2.8 G
  • 70-200mm F2.8 G
However; by the time a full-frame Alpha dSLR is released, you will see a lot more of the great Minolta lenses in the line-up.
  • 100mm F2.0
  • 100mm F2.8 Soft Focus
  • 200mm F2.8 G
  • 200mm F2.8 Macro G
  • 400mm F4.5 G
  • 17-35mm F3.5 G
  • 28-70mm F2.8 G
maybe even the 70-210mm F4.0

And hopefully some of those will be revised and improved!

--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
 
Regardless of the ability to hold it over your head, at your waist or whatever, the large rear external evf is not going to replace the flip mirror slr soon.

Two different beasts. They may co-exist but they won't exclude each other either. The evf in all it's glory is slow and not real time. That's it's problem for dealing with "action," not it's lack of resilution, etc. TVs are cruddy low resolution devices, you can see that in frame captures. But in action where the images are moving and rapidly replaced, you can't see that. Same as following an image. However, the current evfs depend on the sensor to capture and scan and dump the image and then the display to scan the image to the display, after processing. Like it or not, the truth is current evf displays are not displaying what is happening now, but is playing what just happened. In tracking an event or a flying bird, or a soccer penalty kick, you don't see it until it's started moving. You then need to add your own reaction times to the event - and you miss.

People who assert that you see a "real time" histogram are also looking at a slightly but past time histogram. If you stop to analyze it, then shoot, then you still get a "new" image. works fine in non-dynamic scenarios. But the histogram that represents the picture you capture is the one taken from the picture you capture.

People argue the mirror box less design can take advantage of different/better lens designs. So? The current makers are barely keeping up with demand for existing lens designs and a few new aps-c types. Look at the delays in bringing the Sony/KM lenses back into volume production (and that problem started years ago) and the very few truly new designs. That a "new" design might be supportable in theory doesn't mean it's an economic reality.

There's nothing terribly wrong with using an evf camera to capture landscapes for later usage. Painting from a photograph results in the painter re-interpreting/recreating the image. He or she won't do it in millions of colors and millions of dots.

But leaping from that to saying the current crop of evf cameras relace dslrs in sports and action or wildlife type uses is also being silly. They don't. Usable, yes. Replace the megabuck dslr/lens combinations? No way.

Of course maybe those pro sport shooters don't mind carrying $50,000 in gear weighing 40 pounds and chasing the football game up and down the field when a $500 2 lb. kit would actually do the job.
 
What about having a magnification button? Giving x10 or even x100 magnification on some part of the EVF.

A truly live-preview, EVF camera would be great for events photography - i.e. like the R1 except with interchangeable lenses and a much faster processor.

Especially if it had the KM A2's 640x480x3px EVF, which Sony now have.

--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
 
It would be perfect for me to have an entry level FF EVF.
And there is your problem. We are years, maybe decades, away from
this and for a number of reasons. The two big ones I can think of
are that FF is going significantly more expensive than APS-C for a
long time, thus prohibiting an "entry level FF" camera.
FF entry level camera cannot currently be as cheap as APS.
But an EVF FF could be $1500 and EVF APS could be $500.
The second is that people buying entry level want to take snap shots and you
just miss to many with EVF. I have a friend with an EVF P&S and
she is regularly upset with the shots she was just a second off on
or missed completely.
About that I know and agree.
But not everybody has children paying football or “hunts” birds.
There are many landscapers that don’t need such a speed.

Any case, if you spend $1500 for a FF, you can spend more $500 for a fast OVF.

Moreover, if FF would be produced in large quantity the cost would be reduced (the cost is given by the R&D and production equipment, that any case Canon has to pay, because already has FF to produce). May be (not sure but may be), a FF replacing in body IS (used APS size) could be cheaper.
--
GiorgioPM
 
What about having a magnification button? Giving x10 or even x100
magnification on some part of the EVF.
Minolta DiMAGE cameras already had this feature.
A truly live-preview, EVF camera would be great for events
photography - i.e. like the R1 except with interchangeable lenses
and a much faster processor.

Especially if it had the KM A2's 640x480x3px EVF, which Sony now have.
Waiting for something like that.
--
GiorgioPM
 
FF is not always is more expensive, if you consider the whole system.
If you consider only printing in large formats (over 17" wide) it may be true.

But there are many people used to shoot diaps in the film age.
Images 1600 pixels wide are sufficient for a projected image.

That means you can use 2x or more digital zoom with 24-105 instead of to buy an additional 70-200 (EVF helps in digital zoom).

This case an entry level FF ($1500) system would cost same as a $500 APS, but having 2 big advantages:
  • The full FF IQ in the most landscape used focal range.
  • The possibility not to change the lens when you need a 200mm and are
in a windy dust environment.

--
GiorgioPM
 
What about having a magnification button? Giving x10 or even x100
magnification on some part of the EVF.
Minolta DiMAGE cameras already had this feature.
Cool!
A truly live-preview, EVF camera would be great for events
photography - i.e. like the R1 except with interchangeable lenses
and a much faster processor.

Especially if it had the KM A2's 640x480x3px EVF, which Sony now have.
Waiting for something like that.
It would make sense for them to release another prosumer compact; Konica Minolta and Sony were both the biggest producers of prosumer compacts! There were rumours of more advanced CMOS technology a while back, better than what was used in the R1, faster.
--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
 
What about having a magnification button? Giving x10 or even x100
magnification on some part of the EVF.
Minolta DiMAGE cameras already had this feature.
Cool!
A truly live-preview, EVF camera would be great for events
photography - i.e. like the R1 except with interchangeable lenses
and a much faster processor.

Especially if it had the KM A2's 640x480x3px EVF, which Sony now have.
Waiting for something like that.
It would make sense for them to release another prosumer compact;
Konica Minolta and Sony were both the biggest producers of prosumer
compacts! There were rumours of more advanced CMOS technology a
while back, better than what was used in the R1, faster.
I feel it would be more convenient both Sony and consumers a compact DSRL (like A100) with EVF (an EVIL), because Digital cameras become obsolete more fast than lenses.
A cheap full plastic but with full DSRL qualities (plus EVF) woud be OK.

An EVF camera don't needs to have a sophisticated body like a mirror one and will last very well 3-4 years (and after that period will be obsolete any case).
--
GiorgioPM
 
However; by the time a full-frame Alpha dSLR is released, you will
see a lot more of the great Minolta lenses in the line-up.
  • 100mm F2.0
  • 100mm F2.8 Soft Focus
  • 200mm F2.8 G
  • 200mm F2.8 Macro G
  • 400mm F4.5 G
  • 17-35mm F3.5 G
  • 28-70mm F2.8 G
maybe even the 70-210mm F4.0

And hopefully some of those will be revised and improved!

--
Stuart / the Two Truths
http://www.flickr.com/photos/two_truths/
http://two-truths.deviantart.com/gallery/
from your lips to sony's ears! Any source for the above, or just hopefull thinking?
 
The problems you describe are a non-issue if you shoot RAW, which you should with an expensive pro-level full-frame DSLR. OTOH, using EVF instead of a OVF introduces several other problems that can not be fixed in post-processing, such as slow focus (contrast-detection instead of phase-detection), and losing the sharp high-detail bright viewfinder.

--
Yours etc.
Torsten Balle Koefoed

http://www.elgsdyr.dk
 
FF entry level camera cannot currently be as cheap as APS.
But an EVF FF could be $1500 and EVF APS could be $500.
I'm not sure how you figure this. $1500 is roughly half the cost of the Canon 5D which is the most "economical" of the FF cameras out today. If the #1 seller of Digital SLR cameras in the world cannot generate enough volume to lower the price on their "low-end" FF then I am not sure how you figure anyone can get down to $1500.

And that is before we factor in the cost of the R&D to move the whole thing to EVF from OVF.
About that I know and agree.
But not everybody has children paying football or “hunts” birds.
There are many landscapers that don’t need such a speed.
You are right, of course. Although my guess is there a lot more "generalitsts" who want the speed then there are guys are who are just landscapers. Granted, I have no proof, just a feeling.
Any case, if you spend $1500 for a FF, you can spend more $500 for
a fast OVF.

Moreover, if FF would be produced in large quantity the cost would
be reduced (the cost is given by the R&D and production equipment,
that any case Canon has to pay, because already has FF to produce).
May be (not sure but may be), a FF replacing in body IS (used APS
size) could be cheaper.
Producing in large quantity is not really the issue. Selling in large quantity is. The problem here is that FF will likely never again be the top seller. APS-C gives great results for most photographers these days, even many pros. Due to it's reduced size, a camera with it will always be cheaper and that is true for many reasons, not just sensor size. Since it will likely always be cheaper (and I am guessing a lot cheaper), APS-C will pretty much always outsell FF and my guess is that sales difference will always be large.

There is the issue. If the manufacturers can't sell it in big volume, the price will probably not come down like you are thinking. Sure, someday the technology behind it will get cheaper and the price will come down but so too will APS-C. We are already seeing cameras for sub $800 prices in a market where just a bit over year ago Canon made big news with the first sub $1000 camera. If the rumors are true and Sony is working on a model in the "3D" range below the A100 that will likely be a sub $600 camera. The specs are already out on the Nikon D40 which is targeting the same market.

All of these cameras will do better with the mass market than a FF camera would, even if you could get the FF price down to $1500. The average guy who wants to move to a DSLR so they can get better quality than their current P&S just won't pony up twice the money for FF with the current quality of APS-C. At least, I don't believe they will.

--
http://www.pbase.com/bobfloyd
 

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