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ISO quick tips for shooting indoor evening party

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Jojojama

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I am the designated photographer at an indoor, evening event for my 13 year old son. (I'm going to be taking mostly candids in a modestly dimly lit room, though I could imagine asking kids to stand together for shots, etc.) I have a 20D and a pretty good collection of lenses, as well as a new 580ex flash that I purchased for the event. I tend to take outdoor scenery photographs, and I'm really looking for a few words of sage advice so my wife doesn't kill me when she sees the results.'

1. Which lenses should I bring along? I'd rather just lug along one or two, rather than my whole collection. I have a 50 and 85 prime, a 17-40:, 24-105L, and 70-300 IS (the newer, non DO version). Which ones would you think I would end up using the most?

2. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time fussing with settings. I also haven't used flash that much. I know I'm asking a stupid question, but would you all suggest setting Camera at P and forget about it, or is there a particular aperture setting/flash setting you find works well for this set up and these kids of events?
 
Jojojama said:
I am the designated photographer at an indoor, evening event for my
13 year old son. (I'm going to be taking mostly candids in a
modestly dimly lit room, though I could imagine asking kids to
stand together for shots, etc.) I have a 20D and a pretty good
collection of lenses, as well as a new 580ex flash that I purchased
for the event. I tend to take outdoor scenery photographs, and I'm
really looking for a few words of sage advice so my wife doesn't
kill me when she sees the results.'

1. Which lenses should I bring along? I'd rather just lug along
one or two, rather than my whole collection. I have a 50 and 85
prime, a 17-40:, 24-105L, and 70-300 IS (the newer, non DO
version). Which ones would you think I would end up using the most?

2. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time fussing with settings.
I also haven't used flash that much. I know I'm asking a stupid
question, but would you all suggest setting Camera at P and forget
about it, or is there a particular aperture setting/flash setting
you find works well for this set up and these kids of events?
Click to expand...
Given the situation, I'd set ISO 800, P mode, FEC at +2/3, and use primarily the 17-40L, switching to the longer stuff for distant candids if you think you'll need such shots at this event (I do this a lot at some events, not at all at others). I'd put the 580 at a 60°-90° angle up with the catch light panel out.

--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
 
I had a party at a hotel last weekend in a large meeting room , a diner follow by a dance. It was poorly lit.

I used my 17-40L with 550ex and lightsphere II and a few shot with the 100m F2.

My setting was manual mode, 1/125, F5 and iso 400. Point your flash on the ceiling and get really close to the people. Check your lcd and histogram often, verify if your subject are in focus. To be safe you can try F8 for a large DOF.

Serge
Jojojama said:
I am the designated photographer at an indoor, evening event for my
13 year old son. (I'm going to be taking mostly candids in a
modestly dimly lit room, though I could imagine asking kids to
stand together for shots, etc.) I have a 20D and a pretty good
collection of lenses, as well as a new 580ex flash that I purchased
for the event. I tend to take outdoor scenery photographs, and I'm
really looking for a few words of sage advice so my wife doesn't
kill me when she sees the results.'

1. Which lenses should I bring along? I'd rather just lug along
one or two, rather than my whole collection. I have a 50 and 85
prime, a 17-40:, 24-105L, and 70-300 IS (the newer, non DO
version). Which ones would you think I would end up using the most?

2. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time fussing with settings.
I also haven't used flash that much. I know I'm asking a stupid
question, but would you all suggest setting Camera at P and forget
about it, or is there a particular aperture setting/flash setting
you find works well for this set up and these kids of events?
Click to expand...
--
Serge
http://www.WebPhotoCanada.com/
 
Jojojama said:
1. Which lenses should I bring along? I'd rather just lug along
one or two, rather than my whole collection. I have a 50 and 85
prime, a 17-40:, 24-105L, and 70-300 IS (the newer, non DO
version). Which ones would you think I would end up using the most?
Click to expand...
From your description, I would bring the 17-40L + the 85mm prime.
Jojojama said:
2. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time fussing with settings.
I also haven't used flash that much. I know I'm asking a stupid
question, but would you all suggest setting Camera at P and forget
about it, or is there a particular aperture setting/flash setting
you find works well for this set up and these kids of events?
Click to expand...
P mode should work. However, I'd bet that by putting the camera into the M mode with the flash on, 1/100 @ f/5.6 would work just as well. I would start ISO at 200 and up the ISO when you want to see more ambient light. Lee's recommendation of the positive FEC is on target. I usually use +1/3 to +2/3. I would recommend shooting direct flash with no bouncing. Depending on the room surfaces, you will add another variable to the picture. I would shoot the 85mm with available light only. Try to use f/2-f/2.5 with at least 1/125 shutter speed. Use whatever ISO to give you proper exposure.

--
Ray Chen
http://www.arrayphoto.com
 
I would go with the 17-40/4L and the 580EX

I'd set my 20D to:
ISO400
M f5.6 1/60s
Evaluative Metering (the dot within the circle and the square)
Custom Function 14 to 1 (Average)
White Balance to Flash (the lightning bolt)
AI Servo
Continuous Drive
Set my focus point(s) according to composition

I'd set the 580EX to:
ETTL
2nd Curtain Sync
FEC +1/3

Now here is the trick:

Using the flash will freeze the subject provided that the ambient light on the subject does not visibly affect the exposure after the flash fires. I will adjust shutter speed + - to balance background and ambient light to the flash exposed subjects. If my shutter is too fast I'll have pix with dark or black backgrounds with only the flashed subjects exposed. If my shutter is too slow the subjects will continue to expose after the flash fires resulting in motion blur. So I'll take a guess at the intial shutter speed, check the image in my LCD and adjust it until I get a pleasing amount of background lighting while still maintaining blur free subjects. Don't be afraid to go down to 1/15s or slower if the lighting is really dark.
--
http://imageevent.com/chetcarson
 
Flash Exposure Compensation

The ETTL system is programatically evaluating how much light to put on a scene for a good exposure. You can adjust this by setting FEC. If the camera selects an output resulting in what you think is flash underexposed, you can correct for it with a positive FEC.
--
http://imageevent.com/chetcarson
 
i don't think the 17-40 will be long enough, considering you are taking pictures of people and candids

17-40 is wider and will encompass more in the frame, but who wants to take a picture of a big room with some people in it? take the 24-105 this will help you fill the frame with your subjects, which are the people, not the entirety of the room.

the f/4 aperture of the 24-105mm lens will have a better "blurred background" effect than the f/4 aperture of the shorter lens.

i would personally try to go flash-less, but that's just my style. if you get experimental halfway through the night, try ISO3200 to see if you can't get a hand-holding shutter speed with the IS in your lens. if you want to try without flash, just go to Av mode, crank up the ISO and open up the aperture as wide as you can.

if you do use the flash, i would recommend using a slower shutter speed (try M mode, 1/15s, f/8.0, ISO800) and turn on 2nd curtain sync (in the custom function menu)

2nd curtain means that the flash fires at the END of the exposure, not the beginning. it gives photos a different effect that i find pleasing.

also, since you have that external flash be sure to diffuse the light or bounce it off the ceilling

of course, you've heard a lot of different advice so far, so the only thing you SHOULD do is go practice, experiment with different modes. that's what's fun about photography anyway. take all this advice practice with your dog or some other unwitting patsy and see what method takes the best pictures. that's how i know that with my lenses and my camera, 1/15s, f/8.0 and ISO800 is a good exposure value for flash photography. may not work for you, just gotta try
 
SNGX1327 said:
i don't think the 17-40 will be long enough, considering you are
taking pictures of people and candids

17-40 is wider and will encompass more in the frame, but who wants
to take a picture of a big room with some people in it?
Click to expand...
My experience is that 'candid' within the confines of a home is up-close and lends itself to exersizes in perspective encompassing elements of the room's setting and activities as well as portraits. The wider end of 17-40mm allows for more possibilities in this regard while 35-40mm is fine for portraits in tight (this being on a crop body).

If the 35/1.4L or 35/2 are available then I would opt first for ambient light work but since the appropriate FL options are f4, the solution includes doing the work with flash which should help obtain a pretty good keeper ratio.

--
http://imageevent.com/chetcarson
 
Take the 24-105.
"M" mode, 1/60 @ f/5.6 & ISO 800 is your basic setting.

Turn on your 580EX and take a test shot. Adjust flash compensation as needed for a good histogram.

When to vary the settings:
1. If subjects are static, with IS you should go down to 1/30th or even 1/15th.
2. If lots of DOF is not needed, open up to f/4.

If the ceiling is less than 12', bounce the flash.

If using direct flash, try to keep the subjects several feet away from walls to reduce harsh shadows.

Don't use direct flash with the camera turned to portrait orientation. Keep the flash on top.

Use freshly charged NiMH batteries for the flash for fast recycle. Shoot several shots of each subject to reduce risk of closed eyes.

Use 1st curtain synch. The risk of 2nd curtain is that with slow shutter speeds, the subjects may think the pre-flash is the flash and blink.

The basic setting should do for most shots, but the slower the shutter speed and the wider the aperture, the better the balance between ambient light and flash.

Finally, use AWB.

--
Gary
http://garyjean.zenfolio.com/
 
chetcarson said:
SNGX1327 said:
i don't think the 17-40 will be long enough, considering you are
taking pictures of people and candids

17-40 is wider and will encompass more in the frame, but who wants
to take a picture of a big room with some people in it?
Click to expand...
My experience is that 'candid' within the confines of a home is
up-close and lends itself to exersizes in perspective encompassing
elements of the room's setting and activities as well as portraits.
The wider end of 17-40mm allows for more possibilities in this
regard while 35-40mm is fine for portraits in tight (this being on
a crop body).
Click to expand...
that's a good point, i guess it depends how big the room is. if it is an open basement the 24-105 would be better, if you are all standing around a kitchen or dining room table, the 17-40 would be plenty.

however, i still think the 24mm end is wide enough for such a setting. like i said, it helps you to unconciously fill the frame with the subject, as many times people simply default to the widest zoom range on the lens.

plus i like the 24-105!

so that still has my vote
 
good info.

Thanks.

José
Gary Jean said:
Take the 24-105.
"M" mode, 1/60 @ f/5.6 & ISO 800 is your basic setting.
Turn on your 580EX and take a test shot. Adjust flash compensation
as needed for a good histogram.

When to vary the settings:
1. If subjects are static, with IS you should go down to 1/30th or
even 1/15th.
2. If lots of DOF is not needed, open up to f/4.

If the ceiling is less than 12', bounce the flash.

If using direct flash, try to keep the subjects several feet away
from walls to reduce harsh shadows.

Don't use direct flash with the camera turned to portrait
orientation. Keep the flash on top.

Use freshly charged NiMH batteries for the flash for fast recycle.
Shoot several shots of each subject to reduce risk of closed eyes.

Use 1st curtain synch. The risk of 2nd curtain is that with slow
shutter speeds, the subjects may think the pre-flash is the flash
and blink.

The basic setting should do for most shots, but the slower the
shutter speed and the wider the aperture, the better the balance
between ambient light and flash.

Finally, use AWB.

--
Gary
http://garyjean.zenfolio.com/
Click to expand...
--
2N and the All-bokeh team: 35/85II/135L
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/canon_1dmk2n
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/canon_30and20d
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/maxxum_7d
 
I'm surprised to see what you all are using. I start (camera in M mode) at 1/250, f/4 or 4.5 and ISO 400. Flash set to manual and bounced, with the card up. The flash in ETTL mode will try to correctly expose the subject.

Adjust from there, but not much is usually needed. If the room is really dim and or there is a very high ceiling, it's possible that the flash won't be able to correctly expose the subject and drastic adjustments might be needed. More likely, the problem will be that the BG is a tad dark. I actually kind of like it that way.

--
Sonoma County, CA
 
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