D50/SB-800/17-55 church shooting advice

Hi,

I'll be shooting a church event this Saturday night. I'll be with my D50 and newly acquired 17-55 DX and SB-800. As the ceiling is very high, there is no point to use bounce flash. What's the optimal recommended setup for SB-800? I'll be using M mode with 125/f2.4-f5.6. Should I use a diffusion dome or simply the built-in bounce card? How about header angle of SB-800 then? I'll be mainly shooting people.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

I think some kind of a diffuser or soft box is what you want. The built-in bounce card is mainly for using the flash straight up, and you said yourself the ceiling is too high for that. The plastic snap on diffuser will provide better results than without, but for professional results, you'll want a more diffuse light source.

I recently ordered a gary fong lightsphere II after going to a wedding and seeing the hired pro using the original lightsphere on his D1x and SB800. It does lose a lot of light, since it's omnidirectional, so if you want any kind of range, you'll need a more direct solution like those I mentioned above.

I have a SB-600, but I have a similar question too.

In this case, would you recommend shooting straight ahead with a diffuser (I just purchased a Sto-fen tupperware box)?

kevm14 said:

I think some kind of a diffuser or soft box is what you want. The
built-in bounce card is mainly for using the flash straight up, and
you said yourself the ceiling is too high for that. The plastic
snap on diffuser will provide better results than without, but for
professional results, you'll want a more diffuse light source.

I recently ordered a gary fong lightsphere II after going to a
wedding and seeing the hired pro using the original lightsphere on
his D1x and SB800. It does lose a lot of light, since it's
omnidirectional, so if you want any kind of range, you'll need a
more direct solution like those I mentioned above.

Click to expand...

--
I shoot with both N i k o n D 5 0 & C a n o n R e b e l X T

I do a lot of shooting inside a church and the light is always an issue. I've used a flash and found that even at 40 feet, I still see red eye. I've used diffusers also but I try and restrict their use to less than 25-30 feet.

When I am shooting a live event, I try to be as un-obtrusivce as possible and that means no flash. I've been very happy with the results I get with the D50 using ISO 800 and the 50 mm F 1.8 lens. Our church has decent light and this has turned out to be adequate for most circumstances. The 50mm also is a good focal lenth because I can get just wide enough from the back and can step forward while I take a picture if I want to focus on a narrower field of view. I am much happier with the results I get without flash than when I use a flash.
--
Sean

activin said:

I have a SB-600, but I have a similar question too.

In this case, would you recommend shooting straight ahead with a
diffuser (I just purchased a Sto-fen tupperware box)?

Click to expand...

During the church shots, I the hired pro was using some Quantum flash with a parabolic reflector and a diffuser. I noticed for the portraits he seemed to angle it up a bit. Not sure why. Perhaps habit, or old rule of thumb. Maybe he wanted some light fall off toward the bottom of the people. I don't know. I don't think the 45° trick effects the image nearly as much as it does when you use a less diffuse light source, so it may not matter much. As an engineer, I don't just want to know WHAT works, but WHY it works. Sometimes that can get annoying for those who just "know" but the reality is, I think they get angry not because I'm asking but because they don't know themselves.

I hope those more experienced chime in.

No definately bounce it. But what you need to do in combination with that is drag the shutter a bit. The amount you can do will vary depending on your technique ,the amount of movement of the subject, and distance. A frosted diffuser works well. Aim the flash slightly back (one click, semi towards you) and try to stay within 10-15 feet. Also use color correction to match the ambient light. Another important thing to note when shooting with the d50 is that you can shoot 1.5 stops under and boost it in NX later with excelent results. Keep several sets of batteries handy because the flash will be working harder.

Here is an example of a church with low light. Camera D50 SB600 F4 ISO800 1/50th

Also here is a very good resource that should help.

http://www.planetneil.com/faq/flash-techniques.html

$5 max to make.

This is what you want.

http://www.abetterbouncecard.com/

Its the "a better bounce card". Many are going to this as it does what other bounce/difusers do but better. I have the lightsphere Pj and it does work but you lose a more light. The difuser that comes with the sb800 does much the same. But the "better bounce card" is cheap tomake and works great.

You can do a search on these forums and you will see others talking about it. One thing that it has going for it is that since it is built on the head rotated, it works the same in vertical as it does in horizontal.

You can get the foam sheets in the craft section of Wal mart for one.

dav
e

kevm14 said:

I think some kind of a diffuser or soft box is what you want. The
built-in bounce card is mainly for using the flash straight up, and
you said yourself the ceiling is too high for that. The plastic
snap on diffuser will provide better results than without, but for
professional results, you'll want a more diffuse light source.

Click to expand...

I really don't think the snap-on diffuser is going to have any softening effect on the light source if there's nothing to bounce off of. If you aim the flash (with diffuser) directly at the subject, the area of the light source is essentially the same as without the diffuser.

If the OP wants to soften the light, he either needs to bounce it (umbrella, large bounce card) or fire it through a large diffuser (shoot-through umbrella, soft box.
larsbc

Mark Twain said:

Hi,
I'll be shooting a church event this Saturday night. I'll be with
my D50 and newly acquired 17-55 DX and SB-800. As the ceiling is
very high, there is no point to use bounce flash. What's the
optimal recommended setup for SB-800? I'll be using M mode with
125/f2.4-f5.6. Should I use a diffusion dome or simply the built-in
bounce card? How about header angle of SB-800 then? I'll be mainly
shooting people.

Thanks in advance,
Mark

Click to expand...

I use Sto-Fen snap-on diffusers with my SB600. If the ceiling is too high to bounce, I still use the diffuser and angle the flash up by about 60 degrees. Some of the light is reflected and retransmitted by the sides of the diffuser, so that it is no longer just a single point of light, and that does a better job of softening the light than aiming directly.

Better yet when the ceiling is too high is a Lumiquest Pocket Bouncer. It greatly increases the amount of light that is sent toward the subject. It attaches to the flash with velcro and really works well. Usually, however, I don't have time to put it on in the heat of battle and I just use the Sto-Fen as I described above.

Incidently, I have three different color Sto-Fens. White for using with white balance in flash mode, gold for matching with incandescent, and green for matching with flourescent.

And, a flash bracket is essential for eliminating red eye and bad shadows behind the subject. I use a StroboFrame 350 and an SC29 cable with my SB600. It gets the flash way up above the camera and allows you to flip the flash so that it remains directly above the camera when using either portrait or landscape orientation.

I wouldn't even dream of photographing a wedding without my bracket, Sto-Fens, and Pocket Bouncer!

--
Russ

I make very cheap but effective diffusers. Art supply stores sell what is called Plastic canvas. It's thin pliable sheet about the size of a place matt for about $0.79. Many styles. I cut a strip about 1/4" wider than the flash head appox. 7-8" long. enough to make a nice easy loop covering the head. Attach top and bottom with velcro and there you go.

With something like this you can angle it up 1 click and you get a nice even light with no harsh shadows.

I have several styles which give different effects and works a treat.

Don
--
Don

larsbc said:

I really don't think the snap-on diffuser is going to have any
softening effect on the light source if there's nothing to bounce
off of. If you aim the flash (with diffuser) directly at the
subject, the area of the light source is essentially the same as
without the diffuser.

Click to expand...

I think there is a small difference. I admit it might be invisible outside. But inside in all but the largest of spaces, there is usually something to bounce the light off of, and the plastic diffuser cup that comes with the SB800 is a step in the right direction (light goes all over) for somebody that has nothing but what shipped in the box.