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Canon bashing

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trizt said:
Canon made some design choices, and I can guarantee that they made
them after carefully analysing the market and these are the cameras
that they believe will earn them most money at an acceptable risk.
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Absolutely.
trizt said:
Now go and answer my serious questions instead of bashing each
other ;)
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Which questions?
--
Regards,

Robert
 
Ed Bigelow said:
Your reply seems to be ad hominem with limited forced choices.

It would appear image quality isn't your primary interest?

Ed
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Ed, you have it back-words. Canon doesn't appear to have image quality as their primary interest.

They put a 10mp sensor in for marketing purposes at the cost of image quality. If they had image quality in mind they would have left the 7.1mp sensor and RAW. Then when you add D!gic III and IS you would have a great image quality even though they put a slow lens on it.

We want RAW, an f/2 lens, tilt swivel LCD, and a wireless remote period.
 
As so many others I would like to find my optmal camera in a thread in the Open Talk forum. I still think that the G7 is so much better (for me) than other cameras, but all bshing makes me unsure... I would like to find good arguments from "bashers" why I should or should not go for it :)
 
there's enough canon bashing for the last few days. but is this all being heard ? how do we know about it ? the changes in the G7 is so drastic that this reaction seems expected! (more than the panasonic noise issues.)

{I was looking for a good cam in G7 - all that G6 reviews for a couple of years now made the G7 expectation so good. I really like the flip, and raw (even though i might shoot most of the time in jpeg, all extreme lighting conditions might favour a raw usage, esp since this is a Prosumer cam and not a dslr - there will be some conditions sometimes, when yu know yu'd better click it in raw to extract every bit of detail and have control over as many factors as you can for PP). I have used other P & S and found that the flip is very useful for the low angles (i like the a lot of those low angle stuff). S3 looks good at the current prices and the excellent video performance that its churns out. its a totally different camera - but i changed my mind, g7 would have been IT :( the price is also way too high - i can get 2 s3s for that!!! }

so how long is this canon-bashing going to continue ? frankly, I've been reading all these threads (without replying though). the points are valid. but is there some way to stop this or making it more effective without boring others ? others might be put off by reading only G7 threads, and the G7 issue is something which we can't do a thing about now!
 
too many here get their shorts in a bind because they think that a camera maker is punishing them...deliberately omitting features that THEY want.

how ridiculous!
trizt said:
Canon made some design choices, and I can guarantee that they made
them after carefully analysing the market and these are the cameras
that they believe will earn them most money at an acceptable risk.
Click to expand...
 
kellert said:
too many here get their shorts in a bind because they think that a
camera maker is punishing them...deliberately omitting features
that THEY want.
Click to expand...
Punishing? Can you give an example?

I've read a lot of posts from both sides over the last few days and not one of them has given me that impression.

--
‘Lose civil liberties or suffer terrorism’ is a dilemma.
‘Which lens should I buy?’ is a choice.
 
I think it's pretty common. When Sony introduced the R1 a lot of the same talk came from F717 and F828 users about what was omitted blah blah..

When it turned out that the R1 is an excellent camera in its own right, things simmered down. There were tradeoffs but they proved reasonable, and there are still people using their 828s etc because they prefer them for different reasons.

The G7 should be given a chance and not dismissed simply by its on paper specs.
 
if you want to break it down, it is, in fact "representative sample testing". i've interacted w/ canon users throughout california, washington state, oregon and various parts of asia. these were not necessarily tech-geeks on a website, but consumers that i would peg as more indicative of canon's true base...buyers of cameras that actually use them for vacations or creating art or using on the job. not measurebators and equipment nerds. is it controlled or scientific testing? no.

but it's certainly more than you or any other RAW whiner has produced.

i stand by my 5% hypothesis.

i admit to the shortcomings of my unscientific study/observation/hypothesis, but don't criticize unless you can prove me wrong or you have an unscientific observation of your own.
tomjar said:
kellert said:
i'll try and make it really simple for you. this 5% # is my opinion
and i base it as an "educated guess" against my own experience of
talking with other photographers using the powershot line. sort of
like representative sample testing.
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This is funny. Do you really belive that the people you talked to
qualify as a representative sample of anything?
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trizt said:
As so many others I would like to find my optmal camera in a thread
in the Open Talk forum. I still think that the G7 is so much better
(for me) than other cameras, but all bshing makes me unsure... I
would like to find good arguments from "bashers" why I should or
should not go for it :)
Click to expand...
Don't listen to others. If you think the G7 is the right camera for you, go for it! There will never be a perfect camera. I'm only disappointed because I miss some very useful features.

What I like:
+ IS
+ 35-210
+ 2.5" LCD, 207.000 pixels
+ hot shoe
+ closest focus distance 1 cm
+ AF assist lamp
+ optical viewer (better than nothing)
+ it looks great (i hope it also feels great)
+ size and weight
+ control dial (like Canon SLRs)
+ DIGIC III

What I don't like:
  • no RAW
  • no tilt/swivel LCD
  • no top LCD
  • lens could be faster
  • price!
  • battery life (220 pictures)
  • no remote control
--
Regards,

Robert
 
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1010&message=19104501

You wrote:

'i'd like a body similar to A610/20 (don't find s80 body very comfortable) w/ even better build, 28-100mm w/ best optics available, swivel screen, RAW, digic III for faster response times, better high iso, full manual contols, neck strap compatible, and matte black color only. basically, a street shooter's dream.
no need for any more than 8mp.

now that's not too much to ask for, is it?'

--
Regards,

Robert
 
Seems to be popular nowadays.
Also let's demand apology for the crippled cameras and missing features.

In the end we may get some kind of compensation or just sue canon for all our pain and suffering ...

... or one can just go and buy camera from another brand. What a terrible thought :)
kellert said:
how ridiculous!
trizt said:
Canon made some design choices, and I can guarantee that they made
them after carefully analysing the market and these are the cameras
that they believe will earn them most money at an acceptable risk.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
i only wanted that to keep you whiners quiet.

how's your poll coming along? is it making you feel good about your unnecessary decision to shoot in RAW? you whiners are so insecure.
Peter G said:
Note the last two items. RAW and swivel screen. :-)
Peter G said:
S80 replacement...

i'd like a body similar to A610/20 (don't find s80 body very comfortable) w/ > even better build, 28-100mm w/ best optics available, swivel screen, RAW,
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Click to expand...
 
the primary interest of these whiners is working a RAW image of a test chart, pixel-peeping it at 500%, looking for artifacts or any other "abnormalities" and then reporting their findings in these forums, only to cry about the lack of RAW in canon's latest digi cam offering.

i know it's a generalization, but those protesting the loudest are the ones that aren't very good photographers themselves. they are merely equipment junkies that lack any kind of artistic direction.
Ed Bigelow said:
Your reply seems to be ad hominem with limited forced choices.

It would appear image quality isn't your primary interest?

Ed
Click to expand...
 
Jacom said:
It may be Canon Bashing in this forum but if you look at most of
the other forums you will find all the latest releases are being
bashed just as much, as were almost all releases in the past. I
just wonder if all the bashers really know anything about
photography or just like to make themselves heard.

I use Raw on my Canon DSLR very very occasionally but in 99.9% of
the time I use jpg. Usually the only time I use raw is when I have
to under expose by several of stops because there isn't enough
light and then using raw I can extract a better picture from it
than I can using jpg.

I have quite a few friends with various makes of digital P&S
cameras and DSLR's and out of them not one uses RAW and that
includes a person who makes his living from wedding photography. If
you must have tthe utmost quality from you camera and you really do
need to use raw all the time then a camera like the G7 or any of
the compacts certainly aren't the cameras for you. A top of the
range DSLR would be more likely to fit the bill assuming you can
afford to pay many times the price for a body, lenses and
accessories.

With a little experience a person can get great shots from any of
the digital cameras on the market today and if they can't then in
most cases its not the fault of the camera just the operator.

The fact is that if a camera doesn't have all the thing you want
from it then simple don't buy it.
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kellert said:
if you want to break it down, it is, in fact "representative sample
testing". i've interacted w/ canon users throughout california,
washington state, oregon and various parts of asia. these were not
necessarily tech-geeks on a website, but consumers that i would peg
as more indicative of canon's true base...buyers of cameras that
actually use them for vacations or creating art or using on the
job. not measurebators and equipment nerds. is it controlled or
scientific testing? no.
Click to expand...
OK, fair enough.
kellert said:
but it's certainly more than you or any other RAW whiner has produced.
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You like namecalling, don't you? Very mature, speaks volumes about you. Besides, I am certainly no RAW whiner (show me where I complained about the lack of RAW in G7 on its own).
 
kellert said:
those protesting the loudest are
the ones that aren't very good photographers themselves. they are
merely equipment junkies that lack any kind of artistic direction.
Click to expand...
Here we go again... How do you know that?

Let me guess this time, from your personal experience perhaps?

-Virvatulet
 
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