EOS 5D vs. D200 - Mini review

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EOS 5D vs. D200 - Mini review

Having used both the "TIPA 2006 Best D-SLR Expert" and the "TIPA 2006 Best D-SLR Professional" I thought I´d share my impressions with the forum. If someone finds this to be interesting or helpful in any way feel free to comment.

First impression + Handling

Better design, better control layout on the D200. On / off switch at the fingertip, nice grip, solid construction. The EOS sports a strange "direct print" button next to the viewfinder (makes me wonder is this a 200$ point and shoot?), blue instead of neutral (=white) lettering. The EOS doesnt look like a 2500 EUR camera to me. Body finish is not as nice as on the Nikon. Weight is approximately the same. The Nikon has an on board flash for whatever its worth (command mode with other flashes or something). I never used the integrated flash because it didnt work with most of my lenses. Bjorn Rorslett recommends glueing the flash on the body and dont bother.

Viewfinder

Big bright finder on the EOS. This is the first digital SLR I´m able to focus manually with confidence. The D70s was tunnel vision, the D200 acceptable, not better than that.

Sensor and Image Quality

Better resolution, much (!) better detail rendering (visible in foliage in landscape shots for example), excellent high ISO performance. Where the Nikon started to get mushy at ISO 400 the 5D is crisp with film like noise at ISO 1600. Wow! Dynamic range on the CMOS Canon seems to be wider than on the Sony / Nikon CCD . With the Nikon I could expose for sky - OR - ground. The EOS manages both. Highlights roll off soft like in film. Spectacular!

Full frame vs. Crop

This is like coming home. I never liked DX. Yes, there is vignetting on a full frame camera when shooting a fast lens wide open - However, not worse than on the film cameras people used for decades. It does add to the image. If I dont want vignetting I´d shoot stopped down with a flash or high ISO. Wide angles are wide angles, a normal lens is a normal lens again including a big smooth out of focus area. If you shoot at the tele end mostly I guess Nikons crop format is just fine. Personally I like fast wide to normal primes. Nikon has NONE for their DX cameras - Instead they keep bringing 18-XXX amateur zooms every 6 months or so... Canon just released a 50/1.2 L ultrasonic prime. They also have an ultrasonic 24/1.4 and 35/1.4 + a lot of less expensive 1.8 to 2.8 primes. Considering zooms both Nikons and Canons lineup are comparable in my opinion while Canon updates their models more often.

Speed

Nikon shoots up to 5 frames per second, the EOS does 3. If speed is critical like in professional sports photography I´d go for the Nikon. Otherwise 3 fps is fast enough or probably faster than most people ever need. Me included. The built in AF drive seems faster on the EOS. I didnt go through excessive testing on this one though. My testing lens (Canons cheapest prime, 50/1.8 II) focused fast and precise. Good job.

Battery

I´ve shot 3 Gigs of photos and the EOS battery still is full. The D200 wanted to be recharged after 3 GB.

Weather sealing

The EOS 5D isnt weather sealed, Canons L lenses are. The D200 is weather sealed, Nikkors are not (or "officially not"). I wouldnt trust the D200s weather sealing though (lens mount, flash). Neither would I leave my expensive glass exposed to heavy rain or dust.

Conclusion

What I´d really like to see is a canon sensor in a Nikon body. This wont happen. Judging from Image Quality alone and available professional grade lenses Canon wins for me. Back in my Nikon days people were bashing Canon for looking "plasticky" and being market leader "just because of aggressive marketing". This is rant. I do know better now.

Below are samples from my first day with the 5D and a 50/1.8 II lens around the house. (Nothing spectacular. Just some pics to illustrate this mini review...). I think all of these were shot wide open or near wide open.

Thanks for looking.











 
EOS 5D vs. D200 - Mini review

Having used both the "TIPA 2006 Best D-SLR Expert" and the "TIPA
2006 Best D-SLR Professional" I thought I´d share my impressions
with the forum. If someone finds this to be interesting or helpful
in any way feel free to comment.

First impression + Handling
Better design, better control layout on the D200. On / off switch
at the fingertip, nice grip, solid construction. The EOS sports a
strange "direct print" button next to the viewfinder (makes me
wonder is this a 200$ point and shoot?), blue instead of neutral
(=white) lettering. The EOS doesnt look like a 2500 EUR camera to
me. Body finish is not as nice as on the Nikon. Weight is
approximately the same. The Nikon has an on board flash for
whatever its worth (command mode with other flashes or something).
I never used the integrated flash because it didnt work with most
of my lenses. Bjorn Rorslett recommends glueing the flash on the
body and dont bother.

Viewfinder
Big bright finder on the EOS. This is the first digital SLR I´m
able to focus manually with confidence. The D70s was tunnel vision,
the D200 acceptable, not better than that.

Sensor and Image Quality
Better resolution, much (!) better detail rendering (visible in
foliage in landscape shots for example), excellent high ISO
performance. Where the Nikon started to get mushy at ISO 400 the 5D
is crisp with film like noise at ISO 1600. Wow! Dynamic range on
the CMOS Canon seems to be wider than on the Sony / Nikon CCD .
With the Nikon I could expose for sky - OR - ground. The EOS
manages both. Highlights roll off soft like in film. Spectacular!

Full frame vs. Crop
This is like coming home. I never liked DX. Yes, there is
vignetting on a full frame camera when shooting a fast lens wide
open - However, not worse than on the film cameras people used for
decades. It does add to the image. If I dont want vignetting I´d
shoot stopped down with a flash or high ISO. Wide angles are wide
angles, a normal lens is a normal lens again including a big smooth
out of focus area. If you shoot at the tele end mostly I guess
Nikons crop format is just fine. Personally I like fast wide to
normal primes. Nikon has NONE for their DX cameras - Instead they
keep bringing 18-XXX amateur zooms every 6 months or so... Canon
just released a 50/1.2 L ultrasonic prime. They also have an
ultrasonic 24/1.4 and 35/1.4 + a lot of less expensive 1.8 to 2.8
primes. Considering zooms both Nikons and Canons lineup are
comparable in my opinion while Canon updates their models more
often.

Speed
Nikon shoots up to 5 frames per second, the EOS does 3. If speed is
critical like in professional sports photography I´d go for the
Nikon. Otherwise 3 fps is fast enough or probably faster than most
people ever need. Me included. The built in AF drive seems faster
on the EOS. I didnt go through excessive testing on this one
though. My testing lens (Canons cheapest prime, 50/1.8 II) focused
fast and precise. Good job.

Battery
I´ve shot 3 Gigs of photos and the EOS battery still is full. The
D200 wanted to be recharged after 3 GB.

Weather sealing
The EOS 5D isnt weather sealed, Canons L lenses are. The D200 is
weather sealed, Nikkors are not (or "officially not"). I wouldnt
trust the D200s weather sealing though (lens mount, flash). Neither
would I leave my expensive glass exposed to heavy rain or dust.

Conclusion
What I´d really like to see is a canon sensor in a Nikon body. This
wont happen. Judging from Image Quality alone and available
professional grade lenses Canon wins for me. Back in my Nikon days
people were bashing Canon for looking "plasticky" and being market
leader "just because of aggressive marketing". This is rant. I do
know better now.

Below are samples from my first day with the 5D and a 50/1.8 II
lens around the house. (Nothing spectacular. Just some pics to
illustrate this mini review...). I think all of these were shot
wide open or near wide open.

Thanks for looking.
...and there are many positive sides of FF. I wouldnt mind if Nikon had a FF alternative. Personally I have a need for the 5 fps and the extra reach of the DX. My 70-200 VR plus TC17 converter would have to be a 180-510 F4.8 for the FOV on a FF. I also think that the current price for a FF body that isnt quite optimal (5 fps, a little higher build quality would be enough), coupled with the price of these primes (24 1.4, 35 1.4, 85 1.2) is just to expensive.

Photos, like the one you showed, with very little DOF, is refreshing, as we are not used to see them anymore. But I wonder if its not going to be an effect that risks to turn into a cliché when over used. In the film days we had access to this shallow DOF effect too, but it wasnt used that much. (The difference in DOF vs DX is 1 1/3 stop for those who dont know)
(Samples with the D200 and the 85 1.8)





--

http://www.pbase.com/interactive
http://tri-xstories.blogspot.com
 
EOS 5D vs. D200 - Mini review

Battery
I´ve shot 3 Gigs of photos and the EOS battery still is full. The
D200 wanted to be recharged after 3 GB.
I can't comment on the other things since I don't really care for Canon vs Nikon stuff. I'm happy with my D200 and that's everything that matters for me.

But I can comment on battery life. This weekend at the Nürburgring I shot 10Gb+ in RAW. I used my LCD lots, because I constantly searched and deleted out of focus pictures. I used 2 batteries, while the last one still had 20% left when we returned home. Besides that, I used the 70-200 2.8 with VR turned on the whole day.

I don't really see why you only got 3Gb?

--
Frank Lenaerts
http://www.mirrorshades.be
 
you didn't mention one of the biggest shortcomings of the 5D which is well acknowledged on the Canon forum, namely, the constant need to clean dust off of the 5D sensor because somehow the 5D sucks it up like a Hoover.
--
http://brick.smugmug.com/
 
There are several weather-sealed Nikkors btw. Officially as well.
--
Be there, wait in anonymity, then disappear.

Cartier-Bresson
 
Thanks for the review,

I heard the D200 'shortcomings' already from colleagues of me. I was able to use a 5D. I could not see the pictures I shot printed, I just tried it out with what I believe a Canon 24-70L and reviewed by camera screen.

Personally I feel the D200 is on everything better, except that it is not full frame and high (800+) ISO shots are better, it was for me even noticable when compared on the camera screens of both cameras.

D200 is better sealed, I used the D200 already several times in light rainy conditions (with sb-800) flash, and it was no problem. Focus of D200 is faster in my opinion. I also prefer the 'Nikon' colours above that of Canon. Handling and feel is also nicer of the D200. I felt the Canon a bit as a FF consumer market oriented camera, no bad meaning I just feel it is not aimed at people who have to use it daily for a profession.

5D is a wonderful camera, it is the first 'payabable FF' I just wonder if it will cost Nikon (marketing) a lot to beat it with their first (payable) FF camera by means of quality and price, I do not think so.

D200 is working perfect for me now

--
Curiosity is the key to creativity - Morita Akio
http://www.fotopropaganda.com
 
D200 is better sealed, I used the D200 already several times in
light rainy conditions (with sb-800) flash, and it was no problem.
Honestly in light rainy conditions you could use a D50 and it would still not be a problem.
 
In the film days we had access to this shallow DOF
effect too, but it wasnt used that much. (The difference in DOF vs
DX is 1 1/3 stop for those who dont know)
The Thing is not that you have to use it on every picture but that you can if you would want to. I have been in the position where with DX I just could not make the picture I wanted. With FF you have more options. And with MF you even have more.
 
Might be, never used a D50. But I used a 5D and compared with the
sealing of the d200, I wouldn't use a 5D in any kind of rain.
Actually I use a 20D and have used it in rain, swimming pools etc...It is just not an issue. When it is raining hard or your gonna shoot while they spray water on you through a hose or something like that. Then sure you need weathersealing. Otherwise it is just not an issue.
 
In the film days we had access to this shallow DOF
effect too, but it wasnt used that much. (The difference in DOF vs
DX is 1 1/3 stop for those who dont know)
The Thing is not that you have to use it on every picture but that
you can if you would want to. I have been in the position where
with DX I just could not make the picture I wanted. With FF you
have more options.
Or less - for instance if you are doing a group photo with two rows in low light and need DOF.

And with MF you even have more.

--

http://www.pbase.com/interactive
http://tri-xstories.blogspot.com
 
Reading at your review, I can tell you were already bias before you even tried the cameras. For example, " I never liked DX". So I do not consider it as a good and fair review.
 
In the film days we had access to this shallow DOF
effect too, but it wasnt used that much. (The difference in DOF vs
DX is 1 1/3 stop for those who dont know)
The Thing is not that you have to use it on every picture but that
you can if you would want to. I have been in the position where
with DX I just could not make the picture I wanted. With FF you
have more options.
Or less - for instance if you are doing a group photo with two rows
in low light and need DOF.
If that isn't the most ridiculously contrived circumstance I've ever heard of - and one in which there wouldn't be a problem anyway. Even if you couldn't use flash then you need how much space bertween rows? 2 feet, say? Double that up for safety, 4 feet. Keeping to only moderately wide angle (35mm say) you can get that @ f1.4 & 14 feet or f2.8 and 10 feet with a 35mm sensor.
And with MF you even have more.
Rule 1 in photography - everything is a trade-off. THE best image quality posible comes from 8x10" or larger negatives, but the lenses for these cameras are limited, the cameras are big and heavy, exposures are long if you need to stop down to get DOF and the cost per shot is high.

Conclusion: Shoot with the bigest format that is practicle and affordable to you. If that's 1/1.7", 4/3rds, APS-C or what have you then so be it, but remember that you've chosen that size as a trade-off.
 
I totally agree that if you are considering the image quality only (may be ISO 400 and above) 5D is much better choice. Even better than 1DII N and 1DsII. So from your point of view it's perfect.

I love DX sensors because it gives me 12MP (D2X) after crop and I do care about only wildlife. That means I need only a 300mm f/4 lens to get that 10MP 500mm angle of view while full frame need 450mm f/4 equivalent to get 10MP image and 500mm. This means you need better support and bigger lens. Weather you call it cropped or magnified the DX is a great thing for wildlife.

--
Jemini Joseph

http://www.birdsimages.com
 
people were bashing Canon for looking "plasticky" (snip). This is rant. I do
know better now.
The complain is about people picture, because this is where this artefact is truely visible and distracting, and rarely elsewhere. But it is there ... See your own minireview. There is only one people picture: the one showing a woman looking at the LCD of her P&S. Pay attention to the woman's right hand (because that's the only part in focus). Sure enough, that skin looks very plasticky to my eyes.

To each his own. But personally if I were buying into a system today, this is exactly what would make me stay away from Canon - I don't care how good is the high ISO performance if the camera can't take a decent portrait (to my taste. Obviously many don't seem to notice. Good for them!).
--
Thierry
 

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