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5D/7D from A2?

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Paxman

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Hey everyone,

I am a fairly long time member of dpreviews forums and have spent most of my time in the konica/minolta forum as I own an A2. I am finally looking at moving on to a dslr mainly because of performance issues. I shoot mostly raw, daylight and indoor (about 60/40), shoot about 70/30 of people and lanscape, always shoot at lowest iso possible (64 on my A2) yet find that indoors and evenings I need higher iso. The big thing is I like to shoot fairly wide and crop and will quite often print up to 13"x19" prints (at 240 dpi minimum... prefer 300 dpi)

The A2, at 8 mp (and it's quite good glass), does this very admirably and I am concerned about fewer pixels to start with berfore the cropping begins. I realize that the differnece of 6 or 8 mp is not really that big of deal when printing small pics but the difference really does show, with my A2 at least, with the larger prints.

So that brings me to my dilema...... I really am impressed with the value/features and feel for the $$$ a D5 or D7 now offers (if you can find one), but am having a hard time going with a smaller image size to begin, with so I keep looking at the much more expensive Canon 20D/30D's or the new (and unproven) Sony A100. I am not interested in the Canon 350D as it felt very awkward in my hands.

So I ask, is the cropping factor a valid concern, or am I making a mountain out of a mole hill? I would appreciate any feedback on this.

Thanks
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
The A2's width-height-ratio is 4:3, while the SLR's is 3:2.

An A2 image is 3264 pixels wide, while a 5D/7D image is 3008 pixels wide - not much of a difference. In fact, I often crop A2 images to 3:2 and then they are almost equal.

The A2 can produce quite remarkable images, especially in wide angle at ISO 64, but at longer focal lengths with less light, the 5D/7D with a good lens just blows the A2 away.
 
hey Pax,

If you want to see the difference then just resize on of the A2 photos from 8 Mpix to 6 Mpix and print to the size you like. You will have a direct comparison.

IMHO, the delta from 8 to 6 is not great and I also came from the A2 forum.

If you look close you will see a small difference, but at normal 13x19 viewing distance any delta is small.
Paxman said:
Hey everyone,

I am a fairly long time member of dpreviews forums and have spent
most of my time in the konica/minolta forum as I own an A2. I am
finally looking at moving on to a dslr mainly because of
performance issues. I shoot mostly raw, daylight and indoor (about
60/40), shoot about 70/30 of people and lanscape, always shoot at
lowest iso possible (64 on my A2) yet find that indoors and
evenings I need higher iso. The big thing is I like to shoot fairly
wide and crop and will quite often print up to 13"x19" prints (at
240 dpi minimum... prefer 300 dpi)

The A2, at 8 mp (and it's quite good glass), does this very
admirably and I am concerned about fewer pixels to start with
berfore the cropping begins. I realize that the differnece of 6 or
8 mp is not really that big of deal when printing small pics but
the difference really does show, with my A2 at least, with the
larger prints.

So that brings me to my dilema...... I really am impressed with the
value/features and feel for the $$$ a D5 or D7 now offers (if you
can find one), but am having a hard time going with a smaller image
size to begin, with so I keep looking at the much more expensive
Canon 20D/30D's or the new (and unproven) Sony A100. I am not
interested in the Canon 350D as it felt very awkward in my hands.

So I ask, is the cropping factor a valid concern, or am I making a
mountain out of a mole hill? I would appreciate any feedback on
this.

Thanks
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
Click to expand...
--
Rick
 
You should be able to crop as tight as you like because the image is so much cleaner thanks to the more 'spaced out' photosites.
This fly is from about 1/4 of the image area.



Much depends on the lens. This is from a 90mm f2.8 Tamron. Kit needs a bit of subtle sharpening - download the Focus Magic plugin if not happy with USM.
--
John.
http://www.pbase.com/johnfr
 
Theisan, Rick, & John,

thanks for your replies so quickly.

Thesien, I have already come to that conclusion that it really isn't that big of a difference, only about 1 inch of print at 300dpi. But every little bit helps, right? I have heard that in less light the 5d/7d do very well. And i know that the A2 really struggles with higher iso's

Rick, good to see/hear you again. I have already done exactly as you suggest in downzising and at the larger prints I do see a difference when I see folks trying to examine the "invisible" detail with their faces pressed to the print. lol. I'm hoping that the 5d/7d are more detailed because pixel size is actually bigger.

which brings me to

John, 1st of all very nice gallery! Incredible detail on the fly. I'm becoming a believer of the larger pixel theory. That is what I have been hoping for. Thanks for sharing

Thanks again to all of you for your input. It is a much valued.
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
Hello,

I too own an A2 and asked the same question.
Here are some other things to consider.

The CCD size
7D 23.5 x 15.7 mm
A2 8.80 x 6.60 mm

Thats much smaller as you can see.
The Canon Mark II 1Ds has an even bigger imaging plate (CMOS)
36 x 24 mm. Guess what else has that size? A standard sized 35mm negative.

The A2 is a bit noiser.
I can say the color gamut is different and Is diffinitely better on the 7D.

Images are natually clearer on the 7D. Although the A2 when setup in the right conditions does an EXCELLENT job.

There is a lot of argument into bigger CCD or CMOS for imaging and its effect on quality. I think its has pretty much been proven to be higher quality. The larger the CCD or CMOS the lower the more light collected (simply put).

Things I couldnt do on the A2

Zoom closer (you are stuck with that lens.. like or not it has limits)

Focus faster (This annoyed me to no end)

Auto focus in low light (with both the camera by itself or the 5600 flash you can focus in low light. Immensely useful!)

Stop switching out batteries. (I loved the EVF.. but it drained batteries)

Things I cant do on the 7D

Pack all my gear in a small bag (I have 3 lenses, scavenged batteries from my A2, two flshes and EP2 battery pack for the flash, flash cables, and a dust blower bulb. Makes my gear much heavier to tote around. With the A2 its rather compact.)

Shoot quietly (The mirror slap on the 7D is slightly louder and sorta stands out if you are shooting in a theater or other quiet venue . This is true for most DSLRs.)

I claim my A2 as a backup to my 7D.
I have never carried it on a shoot.

I regularly say that I'm going to carry the A2 to personal events because it is compact. I never do. Why would I sacrifice quality?
You will miss the EVF and in time forget it existed.
You will wonder why you didnt get a DSLR earlier.

Lastly...
The 7D is a steal right now...

Despite the possibility of problems and need of repair from currently .. no one, the camera is wonderful.
The next camera I would consider would be the Mark II 1Ds.

--
KM A2
KM 7Hi
KM 7D

28-70mm
70-300mm
300mm f4
5600 HS D
HVLF56AM (Sony)
 
Bedammit, thanks for you lengthy summary. That really does help me think things through. I too get so frustrated with focus issues. Not so much oof pics but terribly slow focus. And even with the new firmware I find I wait on my A2 at times to write my raw files to the card. this irritates me. When with family I would miss the movie mode. I have captured some great clips that wouldn't have been caught with a dslr. however I can't have it all it seems. I really need to move on. Thanks for your input.

Pax
bedammit said:
Hello,

I too own an A2 and asked the same question.
Here are some other things to consider.

The CCD size
7D 23.5 x 15.7 mm
A2 8.80 x 6.60 mm

Thats much smaller as you can see.
The Canon Mark II 1Ds has an even bigger imaging plate (CMOS)
36 x 24 mm. Guess what else has that size? A standard sized 35mm
negative.

The A2 is a bit noiser.
I can say the color gamut is different and Is diffinitely better
on the 7D.
Images are natually clearer on the 7D. Although the A2 when setup
in the right conditions does an EXCELLENT job.
There is a lot of argument into bigger CCD or CMOS for imaging and
its effect on quality. I think its has pretty much been proven to
be higher quality. The larger the CCD or CMOS the lower the more
light collected (simply put).

Things I couldnt do on the A2

Zoom closer (you are stuck with that lens.. like or not it has limits)

Focus faster (This annoyed me to no end)

Auto focus in low light (with both the camera by itself or the 5600
flash you can focus in low light. Immensely useful!)

Stop switching out batteries. (I loved the EVF.. but it drained
batteries)

Things I cant do on the 7D

Pack all my gear in a small bag (I have 3 lenses, scavenged
batteries from my A2, two flshes and EP2 battery pack for the
flash, flash cables, and a dust blower bulb. Makes my gear much
heavier to tote around. With the A2 its rather compact.)

Shoot quietly (The mirror slap on the 7D is slightly louder and
sorta stands out if you are shooting in a theater or other quiet
venue . This is true for most DSLRs.)

I claim my A2 as a backup to my 7D.
I have never carried it on a shoot.
I regularly say that I'm going to carry the A2 to personal events
because it is compact. I never do. Why would I sacrifice quality?
You will miss the EVF and in time forget it existed.
You will wonder why you didnt get a DSLR earlier.

Lastly...
The 7D is a steal right now...
Despite the possibility of problems and need of repair from
currently .. no one, the camera is wonderful.
The next camera I would consider would be the Mark II 1Ds.

--
KM A2
KM 7Hi
KM 7D

28-70mm
70-300mm
300mm f4
5600 HS D
HVLF56AM (Sony)
Click to expand...
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
Buy a video camera for video..

I have never been happy with any video from digital cameras and conversely never been happy with any still from a video camera.

--
KM A2
KM 7Hi
KM 7D

28-70mm
70-300mm
300mm f4
5600 HS D
HVLF56AM (Sony)
 
Having recently bought a 7d and having owned the A2 for the past year, I regularly print 13x19, and I can say I see no difference. I thought I would need 10mp in the dslr after the A2, but I now don't think it is at all necessary.

The 7d has been an incredible upgrade to the A2 in almost every way.
--
Steve W
 
Hey Jim,

Thanks for the link to walmart's deal!! I'll look into it for sure.

Pax
Jim Cockfield said:
Konica Minolta Maxxum 7D (a steal at only $724 from Wal-Mart while
supplies last).

See the listing here (but, don't expect them to last for much
longer). Grab the extended warranty and they'll reimburse you
fulll purchase price later if it breaks for reasons outside of your
control and can't be repaired).

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=4898002

--
JimC
------
http://www.pbase.com/jcockfield
Click to expand...
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
bedammit, I agree with you. I just seem to end up catching priceless video when I don't have a video camera present. I've been accused (for good reason) of having only grabbing my camera bag and not ever remembering to grab the video camera bag. But that's just me. A lot more pleasure in catching a good still!

Pax
bedammit said:
Buy a video camera for video..
I have never been happy with any video from digital cameras and
conversely never been happy with any still from a video camera.

--
KM A2
KM 7Hi
KM 7D

28-70mm
70-300mm
300mm f4
5600 HS D
HVLF56AM (Sony)
Click to expand...
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
Hey Steve, more stunning desert scenes with the 7d I'm almost certain. That's good to hear that you print 13x19 with great success. that is my worry. I'd love to see a great desert scene of yours with the 7d.

thanks for your input.
Pax
Steve West said:
Having recently bought a 7d and having owned the A2 for the past
year, I regularly print 13x19, and I can say I see no difference.
I thought I would need 10mp in the dslr after the A2, but I now
don't think it is at all necessary.

The 7d has been an incredible upgrade to the A2 in almost every way.
--
Steve W
Click to expand...
--
Pax

Minolta A2, Tcon 1.7, Minolta ACW-100, Sigma EF500 Super.
Oly C2100uz, 15' Powerbook 1.67ghz, G4 Tower



'If you can't be good....... Be good at it!!' - me
 
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