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Canon, 1.6x needs a good normal prime ...

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Samuel MV

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Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ... cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!! and 1.0?!?!

If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most Canon wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4, obviously my request is feasible ...

Best regards ...

--
SMV
 
Samuel MV said:
I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
Click to expand...
No. If you have the cash you can go for the 24 1.4L or 35 1.4L depending on whether you prefer slightly wide or slightly long.
Samuel MV said:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
Click to expand...
Not super fast, a good f/2.0 lens and a very good f/2.2-f/2.5 one. From what I've seen posted here the current classic Canon 50mm's are far from perfect wide open.
Samuel MV said:
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
Click to expand...
Why do you say this has bad borders? Check out FstopJojo's site- the borders are fine especially stopped down a little. How many times is the corners to be sharp at f/1.4 (unless you get kicks from shooting test charts). Yes there are AF issues (I had one) but if you must have a ~ 30mm lens being excellent at f/1.4 it is probably worth the return to sigma or multiple copy game.
Samuel MV said:
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ...
cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!!
Click to expand...
Yes I'd buy one if it did not cost as much as the already great 24 1.4L or 35 1.4L.
Samuel MV said:
and 1.0?!?!
Click to expand...
Hmmmmm, Canons only last effort, the 50 1.0L was a disaster in terms of value for money according to William Castleman's tests; why on earth would any mainstream photographer want that bulk and expense?
Samuel MV said:
If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most Canon > wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4, obviously my > request is feasible ...
Click to expand...
True. But is there really enough of a market for one out there? When did Canon last release a standard to wide prime lens (other than the recent upgrade of the 85L)?
 
Samuel MV said:
Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ...
cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!!
and
1.0?!?!

If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most
Canon wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4,
obviously my request is feasible ...
Click to expand...
Only question is if there is enough demand to warrant it. I suspect not. A fast normal prime is not a something that many consumer-level DSLR owners are clammering for. You and a few others will disagree, but your numbers are not great enough to justify the design/manufacturing costs. It's almost exclusively a zoom market.

Nikon lists an AF 28 f/1.4D in their lens lineup, but a quick check of popular retailers failed to turn up anyone carrying it (discontinued?). Pentax has nothing faster than f/1.8 in the 24mm-45mm focal lengths.
 
Samuel MV said:
Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
Click to expand...
My 30/1.4 has excellent AF, particularly in very low light, good borders and is perfectly compatible on an XT and a 30D. It's by far my most reliable (and sharp) prime. I don't know about the 28/1.8.

Sal
 
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
Click to expand...
No. If you have the cash you can go for the 24 1.4L or 35 1.4L
depending on whether you prefer slightly wide or slightly long.
Click to expand...
Both are too expensive, the 35 too long for my taste, and the 24 is not very good (at least in the reviews)
I have a 30D, maybe with a 5D I would consider the 35mm
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
Click to expand...
Not super fast, a good f/2.0 lens and a very good f/2.2-f/2.5 one.
From what I've seen posted here the current classic Canon 50mm's
are far from perfect wide open.
Click to expand...
I agree.
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
Click to expand...
Why do you say this has bad borders? Check out FstopJojo's site-
the borders are fine especially stopped down a little. How many
times is the corners to be sharp at f/1.4 (unless you get kicks
from shooting test charts). Yes there are AF issues (I had one) but
if you must have a ~ 30mm lens being excellent at f/1.4 it is
probably worth the return to sigma or multiple copy game.
Click to expand...
The borders are important if your subject is not in the center of the frame ... and I don't want to work as tester for Sigma ...
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ...
cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!!
Click to expand...
Yes I'd buy one if it did not cost as much as the already great 24
1.4L or 35 1.4L.
Click to expand...
An EF-S lens should be better because is closer to the sensor, and easier/cheaper to build.
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
and 1.0?!?!
Click to expand...
Hmmmmm, Canons only last effort, the 50 1.0L was a disaster in
terms of value for money according to William Castleman's tests;
why on earth would any mainstream photographer want that bulk and
expense?
Click to expand...
Yep, but the 50 1.0L was full frame, for a 1.6x should be better.
KRobA said:
KRobA said:
If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most Canon > wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4, obviously my > request is feasible ...
Click to expand...
True. But is there really enough of a market for one out there?
When did Canon last release a standard to wide prime lens (other
than the recent upgrade of the 85L)?
Click to expand...
Every light available photographer in the world would buy Canon: low noise for high ISO, fast prime, IS ...

--
SMV
 
The nikon 28 1.4D costs about $1400 ... not the same league ...
Lemming51 said:
Samuel MV said:
Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ...
cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!!
and
1.0?!?!

If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most
Canon wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4,
obviously my request is feasible ...
Click to expand...
Only question is if there is enough demand to warrant it. I
suspect not. A fast normal prime is not a something that many
consumer-level DSLR owners are clammering for. You and a few
others will disagree, but your numbers are not great enough to
justify the design/manufacturing costs. It's almost exclusively a
zoom market.

Nikon lists an AF 28 f/1.4D in their lens lineup, but a quick check
of popular retailers failed to turn up anyone carrying it
(discontinued?). Pentax has nothing faster than f/1.8 in the
24mm-45mm focal lengths.
Click to expand...
--
SMV
 
After reading several reviews seems that the Sigma has better IQ (but worse borders and QA), while the Canon has better/faster AF ... I would just like to have the best of both worlds ;-)
Sal Baker said:
Samuel MV said:
Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
Click to expand...
My 30/1.4 has excellent AF, particularly in very low light, good
borders and is perfectly compatible on an XT and a 30D. It's by
far my most reliable (and sharp) prime. I don't know about the
28/1.8.

Sal
Click to expand...
--
SMV
 
the 28/1.8?

i find it better than good in just about every respect. it's certainly better than my skill level and the skill levels of most that post here complaining about the lens as reported by photozone or f.m.

let's get real, ok.
Samuel MV said:
SMV
Click to expand...
 
Samuel MV said:
Samuel MV said:
Samuel MV said:
and 1.0?!?!
Click to expand...
Hmmmmm, Canons only last effort, the 50 1.0L was a disaster in
terms of value for money according to William Castleman's tests;
why on earth would any mainstream photographer want that bulk and
expense?
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Samuel MV said:
Yep, but the 50 1.0L was full frame, for a 1.6x should be better.
Click to expand...
Yes but 50mm lenses are much easier to design than 30mm ones. That will cancel out any EF-S advantage. The 50 1.0 was a challenge, but commercially a disaster from what I've read. And for the ££££££/$$$$$$$$ it was not overly sharp wide open.
 
I agree, Canon's excellent USM coupled with excellent optical performance is all that is needed. But no point having an F1.4 when you can't use it or the results are not quite worthwhile.

My specs for the new lens: 28mm, F1.4, USM, full time manual focussing. colour and contrast the same as EF-S 17-55 or the EF 70-200 F4. I would happily pay more than the EF 28 F1.8 or Ef 85 F1.8 for this normal prime.

I have the EF 28 f1.8 and it is OK/GOOD, best after f2.2.

But in low contrast situaitons e.g. inside at night, at home under soft light, there is not a lot of detail. Nor should there be, it is poor light. I find I have to be realistic in my expections of a low light lens.

I like the Sigma 30mm and will likely buy one soon, just to see the difference. In Melbourne, stock levels have been zero. No way I would buy this lens from anywhere but a shop where you can talk face to face with them, try different copies before you buy, and even return the lens for rebuilding/calibration/whatever.
 
It was the Manual Focus 28mm f/1.8 FD lens which is rated at 3.82 by Photozone (EF 28mm f/1.8 = 3.06). In fact, many of the older FD lenses were superior in optical quality to the present EF generation (FD 85mm f/2 = 3.95 / EF 35mm f/1.8 = 3.95).

If you demand optimum optical quality; the manual focus Carl Zeiss lenses are very good quality but need an adapter to be used with EOS cameras.

Suprisingly, the Sigma 28mm f/1.8 EX(HSM) provides significantly better optical quality than the Canon lens of the same type. (Sigma = 3.57 while Canon = 3.06). The Sigma is also quite a bit less expensive. B&H prices the Sigma at $269 while the Canon is $384. I use one and like it very much. It doesn't focus as instantaneously as a HSM lens but, it is no slouch either. I will give up a millisecond or two in focus speed for better optical quality.

A few points on the Photozone rating scale will hardly be noticed, however over 50 points is a significant quality difference).

Photozone ratings...
http://www.photozone.de/active/survey/querylenstxt.jsp?filter=%221=1%22
--

Retired Navy Master Chief Photographer's Mate - 30 years service. Combat Cameraman, Motion Picture Director and Naval Aircrewman. I have done considerable comercial photography including advertising, weddings and portraiture.
 
Here are some pics with the 30D:



















Cheers,

José
Samuel MV said:
Hi everybody,

I imagine that I'm not alone in this request. When you look for a
really fast and good normal prime for Canon 1.6x seems that you
only have two options:
  • Canon 28mm 1.8 (not so fast, nor really good)
  • Sigma 30mm 1.4 (AF issues, bad borders, compatibility)
I just need something like an EF-S 28mm 1.4 well designed ...
cheap, small, fast, ... and with IS would be wonderful!! and
1.0?!?!

If they can build the 17-55 2.8 IS with an IQ better than most
Canon wide angle primes, if Sigma can build some sharp 30mm 1.4,
obviously my request is feasible ...

Best regards ...

--
SMV
Click to expand...
--
Shooting with the famous Replacements (1DMarkIIN and 30D)
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/canon_1dmk2n
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/canon_30and20d
http://www.pbase.com/jmb_56/maxxum_7d
 
--
Artist Eye's

It's a good lens and I like mine a lot. Sharp, small good low light performance and not all that much money.

Once you start using a lens you forget all the bad reviews and just get on with making pictures. Thats what you want it for right?
 
I have the 35mm f2 and for the money it is excellent. In fact, it has pretty good reviews as well. I also like that it is compact and fits in my bag easily. Makes a great low light lens on the 20D.
 
I have mine since they just arrived to shops and can say that it's extremely sharp even wide open and better then 35/2.

Very good colours, focusing is fine (on Nikon, sorry). There is only one weakness - bokeh at the edges not perfectly circle:



But everything else is fine:

 
Amen brother.

I owned several 1.6 camera and have gone to all 5d bodies so I could have mid-range primes.

If there was a small EF-S 22mmf2 or 28mmf1.8 I would buy it and a Rebel XT body tomorrow, just for something small and light.

Tom
--
http://www.kachadurian.com
 
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