Jpeg vs Raw images

jonrobertp

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Does anyone know where there is an unbiased display of an image shot in both raw and in jpeg, and posted for comparison? I can't seem to find any in print nor screen. It would help if the time spent on processing was included with each version of the image. Thanks very much.
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Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
 
Does anyone know where there is an unbiased display of an image
shot in both raw and in jpeg, and posted for comparison? I can't
seem to find any in print nor screen. It would help if the time
spent on processing was included with each version of the image.
Thanks very much.
--
Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
I used to shoot all JPG; I now shoot only RAW; I do not know of any scientific comparison between RAW and JPG but, in comparison to what I do now, there is no real difference in the final product from RAW vs JPG files--provided you were good with your WB and exposure and don't open and compress the KPG very much.

There real advantage of RAW is the additional lattitude that it provides the photographer to make postprocessing modifications--not so much any differences in the final product

Whether to shoot RAW or JPG is a matter of personal preference; I think the RAW zealots overstate the case for RAW

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Vance Zachary
http://www.pbase.com/photoworkszach
http://www.photoworksbyzachary.com
 
Thanks Vance, that is close to what my view has been to date. I just wish I could SEE instead of hear/read the differences with my own eyes. When that seems so hard to come by, it adds to my suspicion somewhat. Thanks.
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Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
 
Once upon a time I shot the same giant tree, outdoors, in JPEG and RAW.

I put both imagines up on my monitor, saved them both as JPEG so that they would print at the lab, and made prints.

The only difference was the person in the RAW shot, who I had there so I could tell which frame was which.

But I too have been curious about the advantages of RAW, so I bought new software to prcess RAW images, and it wouldn't work with my camera.. Wasted a weekend.

Now I have other software.

SO FAR, the only difference is that you can be careless with RAW and perhaps reccover.

BUT MORE EXPERIMENTS ARE TO BE DONE; I've shot some buildings with the sun shining on the front, but inset doorways in shadow. I've been able to lighten the dark doorways using the RAW software (Canon's free stuff),

and I must say it's a lot easier than didging and burning a doorway in a darkroom.

But I think I could do the same doorway lightening with a JPEG files and Photoshop Elelments. Ijust have not got around to trying.

About white balance. It's handy to be able to click on the screen and see what the picture would look like with different white blanaces, but I've been able to click on"Variations" in Elements and see pretty much the same thing, or use the color cast eyedropper, or just change hue and saturation settings.

One big advantage of JPEG for sure is that I can pull the card from the camera, walk into the store, and come out in ten minutes with a print.

Whether this matters depends on whoyou are and what you shoot, of course.

With RAW you're back to a computer for a while, guaranteed.

I look forward to seeing the side by side shots you requested, too.

BAK
 
I used JPG in my work, but I has problem with exposure (With Canon Flash), an WB, Now I use 100% RAW more sorage, more time to process but best quality in final print.

Juan
 
I've paid particular attention to both Vance and BAK's opinions about the JPEG vs. RAW question for a while now, and have changed some of my practices accordingly.

What I shoot most is commercial and advertsing stuff, for which I shoot RAW. I really appreciate the additional controls it gives me before committing, although I'm very careful with exposure and ratios in the studio. Last week I did a catalog shoot on location for a national manufacturer. All items on white plexiglass. 60 items, some painted red, some blue, some yellow, some black and gray, all had chrome or stainless attachments, and some were all stainless or chrome. They needed skip lighting as well as good definition. I wanted as much post processing control as possible, so it was an all RAW shoot. I thought JPEGs would limit that post control more than I was willing to accept.

When I shoot weddings it's a faster pace than above. I've been shooting all JPEG, but will add RAW to the formal sessions this year for the first time. I've lost highlight detail in the occasional bridal gown in JPEG, and will be avoiding that (I think) by this change.

Ultimately, my lab wants JPEG for upload to their FTP site for printing, so they all end up as JPEGs, unless I'm providing TIFFs on a DVD/CD for commercial ad layouts. I just completed a 30x40 portrait from a JPEG. It's great. I did use Fred Miranda's newest step interpolation PS plug-in to up-size it is all.

So. For really critical highlight/shadow ratios, I'm more comfortable with RAW. That's about it - my comfort level.
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jrbehm
 
That experiment was interesting. I wonder if there are any others, more recent ones out there? thanks.
--
Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
 
Does anyone know where there is an unbiased display of an image
shot in both raw and in jpeg, and posted for comparison? I can't
seem to find any in print nor screen. It would help if the time
spent on processing was included with each version of the image.
Thanks very much.
There are a few reasons why you won't see side by side comparisons of JPEG's and RAW files online and also why doing so wouldn't provide a lot of useful information. Mainly because web browsers don't support direct viewing of RAW files. They're limited primarily to JPEG's, GIF's, and PNG's.

Also even viewing a raw file directly you can only see a small portion of the information contained within at any single time. The RAW file contains 12 bits of data per color channel allowing for 4096 shades of each primary color vs the 8 bits (256 shades of each primary color) that most monitors and printers are capable of displaying.

Every image the camera takes, no matter what kind of file is being output by that camera starts off as a RAW file, meaning that it contains nothing but the raw data captured by the sensor. When shooting JPEG's the cameras internal processing takes that data and attempts to convert it to an 8 bit JPEG in the most pleasing way possible. Quite often, especially if you've taken the time to set your camera up properly for the kind of scene being captured and have carefully set your exposure the camera can do a very good job of processing the raw data, leaving you with an 8 bit JPEG that requires very little post processing at most.

Sometimes you might have preferred a different approach to what the camera may decide on. Shooting RAW will take that processing out of the hands of your cameras electronics and place it back into your own hands. From there, it's mainly up to your own post processing skills to determine whether or not the end result will be any better than what the camera would have done on it's own. Either way, once you or your camera has finished up with the processing, the end result will be an 8 bit per channel image, suitable for display on an 8 bit monitor or by an 8 bit printer.

--
Tom Young
http://www.pbase.com/tyoung/
 
Some demosacing engines in some cameras use advanced algorithms some use simple ones, the simple ones generally give a softer look. In the latter case you can sometimes see a noticable difference if the shot was very sharp.

If you intend to alter very few images then jpg is great, if you intend to alter every one then RAW file can make for a better workflow, just one jpg that needs highlight repair or is poorly white balanced can take the same amount of time as tweaking a fair few RAW files.

Andrew
 
i stared out with RAW when i started photography ... and most of the times had to correct a lot of my exp/WB errors in RAW> but soon i got frustrated with the saving space requirements ... now a days I shoot JPG esp since my WB has imrpved a lot and exp are bang on.

IMHO RAW is good if you are willing to do a lot of PP, esp blends, HDR etc. otherwise no real value (I have printed 11x16s of both jpg/RAW and no diff in quality) Many pros shoot mostly tiff/jpg since it cuts the workflow a lot. but what a pity jpg is not 16 bit ....
--
http://www.photoshoot.in - Eats shoots and leaves...
or, Hitchhiker on the Info Super Highway!
 
OK, that is printing an image that was processed raw. Somehow I think you knew this....that's ok, humour is a good thing.
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Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
 
George !!! Your photos are simply great !! Lucky you! I wish I could afford to go to those places! Few of us can get where you went. Thanks for the views.
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Life is about choices...See Cuba: http://www.jonrp.smugmug.com
 
which is one of the major benefits, you get to chose, not the camera.

But the discussion should really be shoot raw or shoot tiff, as jpg is a compressed, destructive format and can't hold all the information from the sensor.

If chosing between raw and 16bit tiff, then the choise is harder to do.

Having the camera throw away first 40% of the data to make a bitmap, and then discard another 50% of the remaining data when compressing it is NOT an option for me=)
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Anders

http://www.teamexcalibur.se/excalibursida4.html
http://www.teamexcalibur.se/excalibursida4a.html

event photography and photo journalism
 
I never heard about printing RAW how did you do this?
You can print a RAW file (NEF anyways) using Nikon View . . .

I used to shoot JPG to save space on my card, and the ard drive. More recently I decided memory was cheaper than lost data. (A few of my early favorites are stuck in JPG land, and I wish it were not so.) Today I shoot RAW only.

--

'You have to have an idea of what you are going to do, but it should be a vague idea.' -P. Picasso
 
For the ocasional shot you can "save" in raw...and the additional depth available to you by working in raw....and the speed with which you can now batch and work with raw files.....it just makes sense to keep that flexibility....

As to the downsides of storage/processing times....they really aren't all that bad anymore....

Whenever I shoot in jpeg...I almost always later wish I had shot in raw...the only places I have to shoot in jpeg...are where camera throughput is important...like taking 4000 shots in two hours....buffer matters with raw ....and more is better.
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Richard Katris aka Chanan
 
You will need multiple images of differering scenes, brightnesses, etc. to make a useful comparison.

You can also rent gear that will make RAW and JPG images from a single shot automatically, and compare them.
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[email protected]
 

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