Anyone use Metz 54MZ4 in AUTO mode only with KM5D?

I think I got an older version 3302 'foot', so TTL does not seem to work at all (everything goes white, due to extrem overexposure, every time)

However, took a few shots around the house in AUTO mode, and it seems to give me pretty nice exposure. Straight ahead flash sometimes seem a bit overexposed, bounce seems very nice. Have not played with diffuser at all.

Since I plan on using it mostly for simple snapshots indoors, usually of my baby running around Do you think this is sufficient?

Is anyone sticking with AUTO only anyway? I understand it doesn't use preflash (unlike TTL?), so maybe this is reason good enough?

Thanks!

-Tom

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1035&message=17099301
Regards, Jim

tomes said:

I think I got an older version 3302 'foot', so TTL does not seem to
work at all (everything goes white, due to extrem overexposure,
every time)

However, took a few shots around the house in AUTO mode, and it
seems to give me pretty nice exposure. Straight ahead flash
sometimes seem a bit overexposed, bounce seems very nice. Have not
played with diffuser at all.

Since I plan on using it mostly for simple snapshots indoors,
usually of my baby running around Do you think this is
sufficient?

Is anyone sticking with AUTO only anyway? I understand it doesn't
use preflash (unlike TTL?), so maybe this is reason good enough?

Thanks!

-Tom

Click to expand...

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Thanks Jim, I noticed (and asked followup there As you can see there, it still doesn't work, so this thread would useful for some feedback as to how people use their metz, i.e. do they use Auto often anyways.

I'm glad to have such a knowledgeable and active person on the forum, much appreciated!

-Tom

I've gotten enough info&experimenting done to be sure I have an older M model of the 3302. While I'm considering returning, I would also be interested in if people really use TTL that much, since AUTO initially seems to give quite good exposure.

Hi,

Yep - I use my Metz 54 with auto mode quite often. And it operate just well. However you miss High speed TTL with older SCA foot firmware than version M5. My local Metz dealer updated my SCA's firmware from M4 to M5 for free.

Ari

tomes said:

I think I got an older version 3302 'foot', so TTL does not seem to
work at all (everything goes white, due to extrem overexposure,
every time)

However, took a few shots around the house in AUTO mode, and it
seems to give me pretty nice exposure. Straight ahead flash
sometimes seem a bit overexposed, bounce seems very nice. Have not
played with diffuser at all.

Since I plan on using it mostly for simple snapshots indoors,
usually of my baby running around Do you think this is
sufficient?

Is anyone sticking with AUTO only anyway? I understand it doesn't
use preflash (unlike TTL?), so maybe this is reason good enough?

Thanks!

-Tom

Click to expand...

Thanks Ari!

Can you perhaps explain what the different advantages are between Auto and HSS TTL? I know Auto eliminates Preflash. Is HSS TTL regarded to be more precise though?

I'm not sure about the version I have, and I understand that if it is M2 or older, it cannot be updated, but I will ask the distributor if there is a way I can determine the exact model.

Thanks again.

-Tom

tomes said:

I'm not sure about the version I have, and I understand that if it
is M2 or older, it cannot be updated, but I will ask the
distributor if there is a way I can determine the exact model.

Click to expand...

i called METZ with ths very question the other day. I bought the 54MZ-4 and the foot that came with it was marked M4 - although the manual in the box was for the M5. anyway, here's what to do:

while the flash unit is off, press and hold the MODE and SELECT buttons. with these pressed down, turn on the flash. keep holding the two buttons for a couple seconds and the display will show what firmware is operating. M4 is listed as 04, M5 as 05, etc. Turns out my foot had been upgraded to the M5.

Hope that helps. I have actually found the AUTO mode to work better on the METZ than TTL. I am considering returning the METZ (it was an impulse buy that i can't really afford) and getting the promaster 7500dx in stead. i can probably live without HSS, but i'm worried that i'll miss the AUTO mode of the METZ.

I was going to get the KM 5600 and send it to be calibrated if needed, but after using the METZ, i decided that i would miss the secondary front reflector when bouncing. (the promaster has this too.)

anyway, good luck checking the firmware. I'm looking forward to Jim's review of the METZ. Also, if anyone wants to share photos/experiences with the promaster, I'd be very interested. Thanks.

-josh
(my first post - hope i didn't ramble too much.)

Thanks for the tip! Unfortunately it is really old... M1... I guess I'll shoot for a few days, and decide whether it is worth the cost to return ship, pay restocking fee(?), and pay extra to get a new (M5 verified) foot.

-Tom

..Yes the secondary flash on the Metz is intriguing. I'll have to test it with Bounce, and perhaps a Sto-Fen diffuser on the bounce head.

I got the Metz so I could take pictures with no pre flash. Auto mode works very well in most circumstances. I have to think more about what I am doing, but I think I get significantly better pictures than with my 3600HSD in ADI mode. With the KM F2.8 28-75 and the camera in portrait or automatic mode I found a tendancy for overexposure at short ranges, particularly in dim background light. My camera (5D) was often selecting F2.8. I got good exposures by using aperature priority and manually stopping down to F6.3 or F8 (also gave me better depth of field for portraits). I think this works because these settings give the Metz' exposure system time to work properly. Down side is that it will limit the range of the flash - need to change modes or aperature if you move further from your subject or switch to bounce. Hope this helps.
--
RickD

This is the exact setup-Bounce with a Stofen
Right out of the 7D-no retouching. Useing 24-105D



--
Shoot first-ask questions later.

Very nice exposure!

Yes, that is really useful info, thanks!

-Tom

As other responders, I got a Stofen omnibounce and also really like the results with the Metz using this plus the secondary reflector. However, success depends on a relatively low white ceiling. To deal with situations with high ceilings/dark walls I go to direct flash, and am trying out a Lumiquest softbox (velcros on to the flash head) to soften the light. I really like not having the pre flash, and will stick with auto mode until someone comes up with a no preflash TTL solution for digital cameras. (I am hoping Sony solves this one, and provides it first in a Minolta mount camera, and that Metz provides us with a suitable adaptor).
--
RickD

For those that might be interested..

I'm using my Mezt 54MZ on both my Dynax 7D and my Canon 5D, with different adaptors. Until now I have mainly used in Auto mode with and without different difusers, and nearly 100% in partial daylight.

A week ago or so, I was experimenting with E-TTL II on my Canon (similar to ADI on KM) with a Micro Apollo softbox mounted in the evening, and I found the flash to overexpose by at least 2 stops. I then switched to My Stofens - same result ! - and then to my Lumiquest promax bouncer, which depending on the insert behaved a litte better, but still was yielded shots with significant over exposure (blown out whites)

I then switched back to to Auto mode which seem to handle all of the difusers and the softbox quite well..

I then sent a mail to Metz support, who unfortunately verified my findings - Due to the circuit design of the 54 MZ flash unit (not the adaptor) it cannot be used with bouncers, difusers etc..in E-TTL mode.. (they also stated that the pro models C45L and C76L should work with difusers etc..)

Well, this evening I made a number of tests vith my Dynax 7D - and found axactly the same when shooting in P-TTL and using any kind of bouncer etc...

Hence please be aware that if you want to use the Metz 54MZ for P or E-TTL, you CANNOT use, soft boxes, bouncers etc..without servere over exposure. Automode works fine however - and Manual mode as well - if you compensate for the light loss in these add-ons when you set the flashoutput ratio..

• Hans -

Hans, This is due to a second sensor that is located within the flash head itself. When placing any diffuser over that second sensor, the circuitry attempts to overcome the density and pumps up the output to do so. You would not normally see that sensor as it is small and blends in with the fresnel of the flash lens. Look closely in the lower right corner of the lens as it faces you and look for the small grayish circle that differs from the rest of the flash lens.

Being that the Metz is so comprehensive in what it does, it has all kinds of goodies, both inside and out that other units may not have. Three sensors to start with!
Regards, Jim

hpjfromdk said:

For those that might be interested..

I'm using my Mezt 54MZ on both my Dynax 7D and my Canon 5D, with
different adaptors. Until now I have mainly used in Auto mode with
and without different difusers, and nearly 100% in partial daylight.

A week ago or so, I was experimenting with E-TTL II on my Canon
(similar to ADI on KM) with a Micro Apollo softbox mounted in the
evening, and I found the flash to overexpose by at least 2 stops. I
then switched to My Stofens - same result ! - and then to my
Lumiquest promax bouncer, which depending on the insert behaved a
litte better, but still was yielded shots with significant over
exposure (blown out whites)

I then switched back to to Auto mode which seem to handle all of
the difusers and the softbox quite well..

I then sent a mail to Metz support, who unfortunately verified my
findings - Due to the circuit design of the 54 MZ flash unit (not
the adaptor) it cannot be used with bouncers, difusers etc..in
E-TTL mode.. (they also stated that the pro models C45L and C76L
should work with difusers etc..)

Well, this evening I made a number of tests vith my Dynax 7D - and
found axactly the same when shooting in P-TTL and using any kind of
bouncer etc...

Hence please be aware that if you want to use the Metz 54MZ for P
or E-TTL, you CANNOT use, soft boxes, bouncers etc..without servere
over exposure. Automode works fine however - and Manual mode as
well - if you compensate for the light loss in these add-ons when
you set the flashoutput ratio..

• Hans -

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You guys are truly a wealth of information! Thanks! I'll be testing some more myself with AUTO mode, and also will let a friend of mine (who is a much better photographer than me...) test run it and see what he thinks.

I may just stick with my old flash "foot" and use the Metz in AUTO mode..

Jim:

First of all, thanks for previous info re Metz. I am really happy with purchase, and the info helped me understand what my equipment was doing, which helps me get better pictures.

I incorrectly thought the only sensor on the Metz was on the front of the flash body. Does the following make sense, or am I still missing something:

• If there is also a sensor in the flash head, then presumably a diffuser will reduce the light coming back to the sensor and should cause over-exposure in Auto mode (using the Metz sensors), but not in TTL or ADI (using the camera's sensors). If so, then I would still expect over exposure if I use my soft box straight on - have not used this enough to know.

• Does the Metz disengage the sensor in the flash head when the flash head is angled to bounce? I have used the omnibounce quite a bit, and not noticed any tendancy to over exposure.

Cheers, thanks as always, and hope things are going well.
--
RickD

You are quite welcome and I hope any info I offered will be a plus for you and using your Metz!

I am chasing my tail a bit on this Metz business. There are so many avenues and if I get sidetracked in my comparison w/the 5600, I sometimes lose my way back to the right avenue...

For instance (and you can help me out here), I am finding TTL on the Metz is a bit of an anomoly for me. I find the only way I can get a proper exposure in TTL (on the Metz), is to implement HSS, otherwise, without it, gross over exposure. I have yet to find out why TTL (without HSS) is there if I have to turn on the HSS each time to make it work properly. This is without any modifiers on the flash as well. Does yours operate in this fashion? IOW, can you shoot (in any camera mode) and get good flash exposure using TTL w/o HSS turned on at the flash?

I have been pouring over the manuals for both the module and the flash (even tho I have been using the Metz for a couple of years) thinking that I have missed something since getting the proper module a little while ago, but I've found no answer yet. I am beginning to think I could have a bad module.

As to your question concerning the bounce angle disconnecting the sensor in the head, I find that perhaps just the opposite is true on mine. When in TTL (w/HSS) I can use a light modifier just fine straight ahead. When I go to bounce, the sensor (apparently) is bought on line and causes the flash to fire full power. I don't know that my logic is valid yet on the in-head sensor turning on or off with bounce, but there is a big change when in bounce mode and it is tied to that sensor being either on or off in bounce. Unfortunately, my HSS/TTL problem/need (on my Metz) has been taking up much of my time and so I can't say which way the head sensor is activated just yet, but I hope to get past the HSS deal and continue to work on the rest of this great flash!
Thanks and regards, Jim

RickD said:

Jim:
First of all, thanks for previous info re Metz. I am really happy
with purchase, and the info helped me understand what my equipment
was doing, which helps me get better pictures.

I incorrectly thought the only sensor on the Metz was on the front
of the flash body. Does the following make sense, or am I still
missing something:

• If there is also a sensor in the flash head, then presumably a

diffuser will reduce the light coming back to the sensor and should
cause over-exposure in Auto mode (using the Metz sensors), but not
in TTL or ADI (using the camera's sensors). If so, then I would
still expect over exposure if I use my soft box straight on - have
not used this enough to know.

• Does the Metz disengage the sensor in the flash head when the

flash head is angled to bounce? I have used the omnibounce quite a
bit, and not noticed any tendancy to over exposure.

Cheers, thanks as always, and hope things are going well.
--
RickD

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