Does the D50 stink that much?

My D70 (Firmware v. 2.0) has no such focussing issues, with either of those lenses (great glass, BTW), nor with any other Nikon glass of ours: everything from the 12-24 to the 28-70 2.8 to the 600/4 (and many in between)... one lens which we use a * lot * is the 180 2.8 AF-D; the D50 never focussed this particular lens as well or as consistently as either the D100 or the D70- I have no idea why. OTOH, the D70 never failed to do as well with focus accuracy, etc.(on any lens we've attached to it) as either the D50 or D100...

Your mileage obviously varied, but I have a feeling it may be issues with your particular example of the D70; I have a hunch my D70's performance is more typical of the model.

You also have to think about future ownership as well. Your bodies will come and go, as I'm already planning to upgrade to the D200..;-). The D70/D70s has features and benefits that will prepare you for the "next level" so to speak. All of the additional features on the D70/D70s are found on the more expensive semi-pro cameras and it would be a shame to spend a few years with a particular DSLR only to upgrade and have another learning curve to hurdle aside from just getting used to your new upgraded toy in terms of button placement, etc.

The D70/D70s also uses CF cards which all upper echelon Nikon's use as well. The D50 uses SD cards. This of course could change in the near future, but it is uncertain when that will happen. After you've accumulated a couple hundred dollars in storage cards, I doubt very highly that you'll want to sell them for a loss simply so you can upgrade your camera.

Image quality, well, you can you find outstanding images from either camera on this forum, so the point is mute. Your decision really will come down to how well you would like to prepare for your future hobby in terms of the body and its features and benefits that you can buy today.

As far as focusing or other issues that people are experiencing with both the D50 and D70s, ignore them. The highest percentage of these complaints comes from user error. Its funny how a purchase or preference suffers from end user ignorance. Sure, hardware issues arise from any mass produced electronic device, but the percentage is small.

Just my 2.
--
http://cmvsm.zoto.com/galleries

theishkid said:

theishkid said:

To be quite honest I'm only used to point and shoots with minimal manual controls. This would be my first slr, so I guess I wouldn't be missing out on features that I have never had before would I?

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Either camera will give you the opportunity for lots of growth. I don't have a chart with the differences in features handy, but I think that one of the differences is lack of depth of field preview in the D50. That's a feature I used to use years ago in film SLRs before I became so reliant on autofocus. These days I hardly use the feature so I wouldn't miss it. Another difference is that there's only one control dial on the D50 vs two on the D70/D70s. That's something I'd prefer to have, but is it a big deal? Is it worth $150? I don't know. The difference in flash capability is another thing to consider. I bought the SB800 instead of the SB600 so I'd have more flexibility when and if I wanted to get more heavily into sophisticated flash photography.

In general I opt for flexibility when I can. But there are always tradeoffs.

Either camea will do fine for fish photography and the other things you mention. You give up a little flexibility if you get the D50. You may never miss that added flexibility.

Either camera is a huge step up from a P&S camera, but either camera will have a learning curve as you learn to use it.
--
--Bob

slappomatt said:

I bought the D50 when i very first came out. it was cheeper than
the D70s and i was on a small budget. if i had to do it again. i
kinda think i would go for the D70s (not the D70.) for a few
reasons.

Click to expand...

slappomatt said:

1.the d70s has a lighted lcd on the top. which has bugged me about
the d50 now sereal time shooting in low light.

Click to expand...

So far this seems to be the one thing that bugs me about the camera. I plan to do a lot of lower light or even night shooting. This is a legitimate concern to me. Even though the LCD on top is not lit up, is there anyway to see those options on the backlite LCD screen? The top screen is nice but I'm so used to accessing all my options on the LCD screen of point and shoots so that wouldn't bug me too much as long as I could still see what I was changing, even if it was not the easiest way of doing so.

slappomatt said:

2. the D70s takes CF cards which will most likely be like the D200
which i plan to upgrade to someday. and their just plain cheeper
and larger in capacity.

Click to expand...

I could see how this may be a concern to some, but this is one of those things I just don't really care about. I'm not a power user (at least not yet). I won't be going out and shooting 400 shots. The only time I have ever needed a lot of photos for a brouchur I had my laptop setting right there so I was dumping them after ever 50 pictures or so.

slappomatt said:

3. the D70 has more options for acc. such as L brackets. i havent
found one for a D50 yet. although this will probably be remmidied
in the future.
4. the D70s (and D70) have flash comander mode. which i would use
on a fairly regular basis.

Click to expand...

So far the only accessory I want in my camera is the remote control. I think I saw it for about 20 bucks. That and a good tripod. Some of the accessories I have seen I just can't imagine needing. I'm having some of the same problems selecting my camera that I had when finding my laptop. "The new powerbook has FIREWIRE 800!!!" Well that's great and all, especially since I've had my laptop for a year and a half but don't have a need for 800. I'm only just now getting into video and need firewire 400. I think it's the same way with that flash commander mode. It seems like a cool feature but I doubt I would ever use it. With all my other shots I never used flash. I'm a BIG fan of natural light. Or I light my products or fish tank how I want them with my studio lights.

slappomatt said:

5. the D70s comes with a slightly larger capacity battery. 1500mh
instead of D50's (and D70's) 1400mh battery. although you can buy
the larger one for the d50 and it works fine. not that thats a big
one because i still managed to get 1800 photos in one shoot with a
single charge.
ok now having said that... there are a few things that are better
about the d50
1. the D50 is supposed to make more viberant photos straight out of
the camera with less PP (which is how 99% of my shots are left)

Click to expand...

I'm a pretty decent user of photoshop CS2 so that wouldn't be a big problem for me, however it is nice to know that you don't HAVE TO take them in for post editing. The battery isn't a big problem for me either, I wouldn't be going out for days on end without being able to charge my battery. Worst case scenario, I have an AC/DC converter in my truck that I could charge the battery with. It has saved me a couple of times on the way to school by charging my laptop.

slappomatt said:

2. if size is important than the d50 is a little smaller and
lighter (not much thought)

Click to expand...

I mainly got into wanting an slr after looking at the canon 300. I didn't feel a big enough difference to change my mind about it. Coming from the little rectangle sony compacts anything feels good in your hands.

slappomatt said:

3. assuming you arent going to be buying highend fast lenses then
the better high iso performance of the D50 will be in your favor!!
(although my experiance with iso 1600 on the D50 hasnt been very
good)

Click to expand...

It seems with a lot of these new cameras coming out that the high ISO isn't producing very good images. The good news for me though is that most images I take will be shot in RAW and then cropped and sized to fit on the web so that might help with a lot of the noise.

slappomatt said:

4. It is cheeper although when you look at it down the road with a
sb800 and a few lenses the ~$200 differance isnt much at all.
well i guess thats about all i got for now.

Click to expand...

I guess I should explain a little better where I am coming from. I am practically getting a camera for free. My father helped my brother get a video camera so he promised me he would help me out with something. He was only planning on giving me about 400 bucks and I first started looking at the slr-like cameras. However after holding that canon 300 and playing with it for 30 minutes, it really made me want an slr. I think I have talked my father into giving me a little more than he gave my brother (almost double), but there is no way I can go even another 200 dollars on top of that. And that's my main interest into the D50. If I had the money myself, I would easily go with the canon 20D right now, but i simply don't. But this is the reason behind all the fuss and the main reason I get a little ticked when I ask about the 50 and people start telling me why I need the 70 instead. I just can't afford the extra dough, and even if I could, I don't really know that I would be able to justify the extra dollars for it. I just doubt I would use some of those extra features like the commander flash mode.

there are a couple of reasons i wouldnt go for the older D70.

1. i want the biggest lcd i can get. my old fuji s5000 had a 1.8" lcd and the thought of a bigger one was great to me!

2. the BGLOD. (i know it is supposed to have been fixed by now) but why take the chance when you can get a better newer D70s for only 100 more? and not have to hastle with being camera-less for weeks while nikon fixes it?

3. Slightly better battery. I know its not much better and the regular D70 battery is already AWSOME!!! but why not?!?!?!

also another + for the D50 i missed, The D50 has true highspeed USB2.0 which neither D70's do (im pretty sure about that)

I think you are right also. Even though my d70 came back from servicing better, it was never as good as the d50 is with regard to focusing.

I do like my little d50 though. I the only thing I really don't like is the top lcd screen is not backlit. I use my info inside the viewfinder more now though
--
Jeffrey P. Kempster
Louisville, KY, U.S.A.
http://www.jeffkempster.com

hi,

the two cameras are pretty much the same, except for one VERY IMPORTANT difference (at least for me) the D50 has only one diam. in other words, you can set it to control teh aperture or shutter speed. The d70 has two dials...this makes life MUCH easier.

get the d70

haha... i'm coming from point and shoots where everything you change is buried deep in the menus and takes a few minutes to get to. One dial is going to be pleasure compared to what I'm used to. Again this is one of those features that just doesn't justify the extra cost to me.

http://www.bythom.com/D50REVIEW.htm

Regards,
Bernard

Having used both, I far prefer the image quality of the D50 as well as the lower noise at high ISO. In addition, while the fps is slower, the initial shutter delay is noticably less on the D50.

Just read the review on bythom.com. It's pretty obvious that he prefers the D50 to the D70. Which makes sense because the D50 incorporates the newest technology, while the D70 has been out for 1.5 years.

I finally switched over from film to digital w/ the D50. My reasoning for D50 over D70s? Pricing and the impending (hopefully) relase of a new midrange camera from Nikon (i.e. D200). I'm not a professional, since I don't earn my daily bread from photography, but I've been shooting Nikon film cameras for 15 years as an advanced hobbyist. I spent a day playing with a friend's new D70s recently, alongside my D50, and if I didn't have the EXIF data to tell me, I wouldn't know which shots came from which.

The ONLY caveats of the D50 when compared to the D70 (IMO) are the single command dial and lack of DOF preview. Neither is enough to sway me over to a more expensive, yet so similar piece of machinery. I'm experienced enough to know what aperature I'd prefer to shoot on any given shot. I've also gotten used to holding down a button while turning the command dial to change the function from shutter to aperature. Not a big deal at all to me.

My advice - get the D50 and put every dollar and dime you can scrape together into the best glass you can afford. That's where you notice the difference. Lenses will also hold their value better than a low-level body, so that, again, makes better sense as an investment in the long run.

theishkid said:

theishkid said:

So far this seems to be the one thing that bugs me about the camera. I plan to do a lot of lower light or even night shooting. This is a legitimate concern to me. Even though the LCD on top is not lit up, is there anyway to see those options on the backlite LCD screen? The top screen is nice but I'm so used to accessing all my options on the LCD screen of point and shoots so that wouldn't bug me too much as long as I could still see what I was changing, even if it was not the easiest way of doing so.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Remember that with an SLR you're looking through the viewfinder to shoot and the most important information is displayed at the bottom of the viewfinder and is illuminated so you can see it in the dark.
--
--Bob

theishkid said:

slappomatt said:

I bought the D50 when i very first came out. it was cheeper than
the D70s and i was on a small budget. if i had to do it again. i
kinda think i would go for the D70s (not the D70.) for a few
reasons.

Click to expand...

theishkid said:

1.the d70s has a lighted lcd on the top. which has bugged me about
the d50 now sereal time shooting in low light.

Click to expand...

So far this seems to be the one thing that bugs me about the
camera. I plan to do a lot of lower light or even night shooting.
This is a legitimate concern to me. Even though the LCD on top is
not lit up, is there anyway to see those options on the backlite
LCD screen? The top screen is nice but I'm so used to accessing all
my options on the LCD screen of point and shoots so that wouldn't
bug me too much as long as I could still see what I was changing,
even if it was not the easiest way of doing so.

Click to expand...

Yes, if you go into the menus you can see (and change) ISO, WB etc on the rear LCD. The rest can be seen in the viewfinder, afaik. A small flashlight is another option.

theishkid said:

theishkid said:

3. the D70 has more options for acc. such as L brackets. i havent
found one for a D50 yet. although this will probably be remmidied
in the future.
4. the D70s (and D70) have flash comander mode. which i would use
on a fairly regular basis.

Click to expand...

So far the only accessory I want in my camera is the remote
control. I think I saw it for about 20 bucks. That and a good
tripod. Some of the accessories I have seen I just can't imagine
needing. I'm having some of the same problems selecting my camera
that I had when finding my laptop. "The new powerbook has FIREWIRE
800!!!" Well that's great and all, especially since I've had my
laptop for a year and a half but don't have a need for 800. I'm
only just now getting into video and need firewire 400. I think
it's the same way with that flash commander mode. It seems like a
cool feature but I doubt I would ever use it. With all my other
shots I never used flash. I'm a BIG fan of natural light. Or I
light my products or fish tank how I want them with my studio
lights.

Click to expand...

It's hard to appreciate how good an external flash is until you've used one. I always hated flash photography until I got an external flash for macro work, and I was stunned at the difference, and the things it allowed me to do.

Off-camera flash is a very nice feature but if you're on a tight budget it can be done with $70 3rd-party flashes and cheap SU-4 slave triggers. You loose all the convenience of i-TTL, and you have to set the flash exposure manually, but it's still doable.

theishkid said:

theishkid said:

2. if size is important than the d50 is a little smaller and
lighter (not much thought)

Click to expand...

I mainly got into wanting an slr after looking at the canon 300. I
didn't feel a big enough difference to change my mind about it.
Coming from the little rectangle sony compacts anything feels good
in your hands.

theishkid said:

3. assuming you arent going to be buying highend fast lenses then
the better high iso performance of the D50 will be in your favor!!
(although my experiance with iso 1600 on the D50 hasnt been very
good)

Click to expand...

It seems with a lot of these new cameras coming out that the high
ISO isn't producing very good images. The good news for me though
is that most images I take will be shot in RAW and then cropped and
sized to fit on the web so that might help with a lot of the noise.

Click to expand...

Good is a very relative term here. If you're coming from a P&S you'll probably be blown away by the high ISO performance. Technique also comes into play... exposure and sharpening can have a huge impact on the results.

theishkid said:

theishkid said:

4. It is cheeper although when you look at it down the road with a
sb800 and a few lenses the ~$200 differance isnt much at all.
well i guess thats about all i got for now.

Click to expand...

I guess I should explain a little better where I am coming from. I
am practically getting a camera for free. My father helped my
brother get a video camera so he promised me he would help me out
with something. He was only planning on giving me about 400 bucks
and I first started looking at the slr-like cameras. However after
holding that canon 300 and playing with it for 30 minutes, it
really made me want an slr. I think I have talked my father into
giving me a little more than he gave my brother (almost double),
but there is no way I can go even another 200 dollars on top of
that. And that's my main interest into the D50. If I had the money
myself, I would easily go with the canon 20D right now, but i
simply don't. But this is the reason behind all the fuss and the
main reason I get a little ticked when I ask about the 50 and
people start telling me why I need the 70 instead. I just can't
afford the extra dough, and even if I could, I don't really know
that I would be able to justify the extra dollars for it. I just
doubt I would use some of those extra features like the commander
flash mode.

Click to expand...

Just get the D50 and have fun.

I just can't get over how the D50 high iso setting is so much better than the D70s.

D50 with higher iso without increasing noise is a very big plus to me as it will let me increase the shutter and take more sharp pictures.

Don't know why they didn't update on the D70s with the new technology on the D70s.. Shame on them!!..

Or Jennifer Love Hewitt, Julia Roberts, Jessica Simpson, Jessica Biel, take your pick.

(With Jennifer Garner--I am meaning PRIOR to her pregnancy, and/or how she'll almost for sure look afterwards.)

Sure the D50 gives up somethings vs the D70, it's a more "entry level" model. (The D70 was supposed to be, but really is more mid-range--almost as much as the D100 was, and a better camera than the D100 really.) You give up:

Depth-of-field preview Toughness (just a little of it)
LCD light 2 command dials
Wireless i-TTL built-in Compact Flash instead of Secure Digital
Direct control vs menu control of bracketing & meter-mode Viewfinder gridlines

But you get in return

Better noise across the range, esp. at high values Faster autofocusing (firmware would help D70 though)
AF-A autofocusing mode

More compact size but not TOO small like Canon Digital Rebel XT or Pentax *ist Ds More logical left-right image browse vs up-down
Better JPEGs out of camera (not night-day difference though I'd imagine)

And you keep everything else great about the D70

Fast speed in all aspects Great image quality overall (differences noted)

Full manual control as much as you could ask for (just less accessible with regards to bracketing, meter mode--and wireless i-TTL costing more to get) Same overall flash versatility (just costs extra to get wireless i-TTL)
Same access to excellent Nikon system

Same very-handy AE/AF lock button on back (for AF-lock to make it "shooting priority" in AF-A or AF-S, I LOVE that button)

A camera all the non D-SLRs owners envy--and owners of older D-SLRs may envy too

Yes, I own the D50. I almost got the D70 last year, went with Canon's Digital Rebel instead ("sold out", it was cheaper). But 6 weeks ago Wednesday I got the chance to move over to the D50, and I did so--and am glad I did.

---



LRH
http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz

--
---



LRH
http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz

You seem yo be getting your knickers in a twist for no reason. The D70 costs more than the D50, it's a better camera.

Get what you can afford combined with what you want. You make the choice, don't give us a hard time!

They are both good cameras. just looking at a test in front of me the D70 produces somewhat more deatiled images.

--
Black holes do not destroy information.

ByThom is far from the gold standard, IMO. He runs a website, does reviews, and that's great.

MY use I trust far more. YMMV. In my extensive experience, I've found the D50 has NO improvement over the D70; it merely prioritizes (for amateur, minimum PP snapshots that 'pop'), and simplifies (in some key ways, limits- see my first post) the imaging options available, compared to the D70.

It's a trade-off. But our D50 (actually, a cut-down, simplified and shrunken, via SD Card, D70), in no way exceeds, and in several key ways limits, the uses we require from our Nikon DSLRs.

Sure, it's a great camera. But it doesn't exceed the D70 imagewise, no matter its 10 mo. 'lead' in technolgy (debatable at best, since the 'D200' will probably be the major recipient in the future of advances from Nikon.

Pretending the D50 is 'superior' to the D70 is nonsense. It's different, yes. Cheaper, lighter, simpler. It is not capable of better images, out of the box or otherwise. From someone coming from a P&S, the images straight from a D70 must look less inviting than the default D50 images. Nothing wrong with that. But justifying the purchase of a D50 by claiming it makes superior images to the D70 is justifying a shopping choice, not proving that Nikon's newest DSLR is its best.

This from someone who owns both, along with a D2X and a D100.

The D70/D70s, set at 'no sharpening', gives equally 'noise free' (actually, the frequency and tone of each cam's ISO1600 images are equally acceptable), images when compared to the D50. The heavier anti-aliasing filter on the D50's CCD also elimintes some fine detail which cannot be retrieved.

This is coming from someone that is completely new to SLR cameras so don't take this the wrong way... but why in the world would you own all of those cameras? I mean if you have a 100 then why buy the 70, and if you have the 70 then why would you buy a 50? I understand having a backup camera, but what would be the reason for having every single edition a brand puts out?