Am I stupid?

John M. Poster · Sep 9, 2001

I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer), sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

Dunno, seems like a heck of alot more happy Canon users. hmmmm maybe its the picture quality hmmm

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

DavidP #28649 · Sep 9, 2001

People here would say you're very wise.

Those on the Nikon part of the forum might suggest otherwise.

I honestly don't think you could go wrong with EITHER choice -- Nikon or Canon.

I chose Canon for the same reason -- I think the lens selection is ahead of Nikon.

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Tom Maxwell · Sep 9, 2001

Let's be honest with everyone here please. The image quality of the D1 is far superior to the image qaulity of the D30. But then it should be, it is of a newer design and cost 2.5 times as much! If you asked 100 honest pro shooters who aren't tied to one manufacturer or the other a large majority of them will tell you the D1H/X is an overall superior camera to the D30.

The question should be, is the image quality and all of the other comparison items worth the difference in price? To most semipro (I hate the term prosumer) users, and some lowend professional users, I think not. However, to a hard hitting photojournalist or a travel/nature photographer, the sturdier D1 series of cameras are well worth the extra cost. The speed of the D1 series and lack of shutter lag will allow photojournalists and even wedding and portrait photographers to get images that they would otherwise miss with the D30. Yes I can say that for a fact because I have used both to photograph weddings. My preference for this type of work is the D1X but I can use the D30 with very few problems. If you want to make larger images, the D1X will definitly serve you better. I have beautiful 20x24s made with the D30, I have beautiful 30x40s made with the D1X. The D30 falls apart at these sizes. Again, though, ask yourself how many 30x40s are you going to make and is it worth the cost. There is no question that the D1X is a better camera, but again, it should be! When the new Cannon comes out, it will probably be comparable to or even better than the D1X. However, the D30 and the S1 (if we can throw it in here) may be the better value. We can buy 2 of them for the price of a D1X or the new Canon whatever. Just getting started, you may well be better off to get the D30 or S1. Since Jay doesn't have any glass yet, he has a harder decision than most but he seems to really be hooked on Canon glass. Based upon that, I think his decision is already made.

Let's all face reality guys!

Take care and enjoy!

Tom

Joseph Tan · Sep 9, 2001

You're reason is the same reason why most of us are Canon users. Their lenses as a whole are simply the best (with of course a few weaknesses/exceptions). Since lenses are the most important photographic tool, and since newer, better cameras/technology will always come along, investing in the best lenses is always a great idea. Canon will inevitably come out with an awesome pro digital camera. When, what features exactly, and how much are the questions that are driving all us Canonites absolutely insane. I think that the main reason some pros are switiching to Nikon is for immediate needs. They need certain features now and don't have the luxury to wait, and many will be coming back when the pro camera is released. This is my opinion, of course you are also on the Canon forum

Incedently, I have nothing against Nikon, they have great qualities, I just like Canon more.

JOE

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

ROFL .... The image speaks for itself.

ROFL interpolated 6meg lol hahaha

Tom Maxwell said:
Let's be honest with everyone here please. The image quality of
the D1 is far superior to the image qaulity of the D30. But then it
should be, it is of a newer design and cost 2.5 times as much! If
you asked 100 honest pro shooters who aren't tied to one
manufacturer or the other a large majority of them will tell you
the D1H/X is an overall superior camera to the D30.
The question should be, is the image quality and all of the other
comparison items worth the difference in price? To most semipro
(I hate the term prosumer) users, and some lowend professional
users, I think not. However, to a hard hitting photojournalist or
a travel/nature photographer, the sturdier D1 series of cameras are
well worth the extra cost. The speed of the D1 series and lack of
shutter lag will allow photojournalists and even wedding and
portrait photographers to get images that they would otherwise miss
with the D30. Yes I can say that for a fact because I have used
both to photograph weddings. My preference for this type of work
is the D1X but I can use the D30 with very few problems. If you
want to make larger images, the D1X will definitly serve you
better. I have beautiful 20x24s made with the D30, I have
beautiful 30x40s made with the D1X. The D30 falls apart at these
sizes. Again, though, ask yourself how many 30x40s are you going
to make and is it worth the cost. There is no question that the
D1X is a better camera, but again, it should be! When the new
Cannon comes out, it will probably be comparable to or even better
than the D1X. However, the D30 and the S1 (if we can throw it in
here) may be the better value. We can buy 2 of them for the price
of a D1X or the new Canon whatever. Just getting started, you may
well be better off to get the D30 or S1. Since Jay doesn't have
any glass yet, he has a harder decision than most but he seems to
really be hooked on Canon glass. Based upon that, I think his
decision is already made.

Let's all face reality guys!

Take care and enjoy!

Tom

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

I think I never said one word about how the D1x is sucky sucky. did I? hmmm amazing how you trash the D30 but I know better

So cool it tommy boy. Its funny how you guys have to defend your D1x. Oh by the way the D30 does quite well at 30x40 with no noise unlike the d1x

Tom Maxwell said:
Let's be honest with everyone here please. The image quality of
the D1 is far superior to the image qaulity of the D30. But then it
should be, it is of a newer design and cost 2.5 times as much! If
you asked 100 honest pro shooters who aren't tied to one
manufacturer or the other a large majority of them will tell you
the D1H/X is an overall superior camera to the D30.
The question should be, is the image quality and all of the other
comparison items worth the difference in price? To most semipro
(I hate the term prosumer) users, and some lowend professional
users, I think not. However, to a hard hitting photojournalist or
a travel/nature photographer, the sturdier D1 series of cameras are
well worth the extra cost. The speed of the D1 series and lack of
shutter lag will allow photojournalists and even wedding and
portrait photographers to get images that they would otherwise miss
with the D30. Yes I can say that for a fact because I have used
both to photograph weddings. My preference for this type of work
is the D1X but I can use the D30 with very few problems. If you
want to make larger images, the D1X will definitly serve you
better. I have beautiful 20x24s made with the D30, I have
beautiful 30x40s made with the D1X. The D30 falls apart at these
sizes. Again, though, ask yourself how many 30x40s are you going
to make and is it worth the cost. There is no question that the
D1X is a better camera, but again, it should be! When the new
Cannon comes out, it will probably be comparable to or even better
than the D1X. However, the D30 and the S1 (if we can throw it in
here) may be the better value. We can buy 2 of them for the price
of a D1X or the new Canon whatever. Just getting started, you may
well be better off to get the D30 or S1. Since Jay doesn't have
any glass yet, he has a harder decision than most but he seems to
really be hooked on Canon glass. Based upon that, I think his
decision is already made.

Let's all face reality guys!

Take care and enjoy!

Tom

Valliesto Bailey · Sep 9, 2001

I would say not. Unless you have to have the faster burst rate, or better AF, then the D30 should be just fine. The D1x has more pixels but they are not all true image pixels.

Is the D1x better? sure but for the price of just the body you can get a great D30 system started. That for me is the deal maker. Besides the real investment is in the glass not the body, The lenses you buy now will serve you well after the D30, EOS-1D (or whatever they end up calling it) or the camera after that.

The D30 is nice but no one can compete on lenses, so the D30 wins by default.

Valliesto.

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Peter Gregg · Sep 9, 2001

I have a reason not to go with the Nikon. Is my reason a show stopper?

YES, to me anyway.

The Canon has a glass 1/4 of an inch in FRONT of the sensor. It protects and seals the sensor from dust. Any dust that gets on the glass can be cleaned off the glass without touching the sensor. I discovered this by accident. Phil's response was a little pointed why he asked why doesn't the Nikon have a glass in front of it's sensor to protect it?

I like that question a lot. Tell me Nikon, why don't you have a glass to protect your sensor from the elements? The D30 was out long before the D1X. Didn't Nikon LOOK at the D30 at all? They should have picked that up.

My point isn't against the Nikon lovers, you guys deserve to love your camera and I wish you the best with whatever camera you have. My point is LOUD against the Nikon company. You build a big tough camera, seal everything in sight to make it to pro standards, and then you leave your underwear down! Shame on you. Why isn't there some sort of protection for your sensor. Don't your people who are so loyal to you deserve this? It does NOT seem to interfere with the picture or quality or anything at all. In fact, on the D30 it makes it better. Is this scalding enough for you Nikon? Put some sort of protection on your sensor. Practice safe sex - uhh, I mean safe sensor! Seriously, why is that protective glass missing on a $6000 camera when it does great things for a $3000 camera? I'd like an answer, and I am not willing to take anything but a GREAT answer. I think it is a slip up and should be fixed. I understand if dust gets behind the glass then it has to go to Canon, but maybe 90 percent or more can be taken care of the guys in the field, so why not put that weapon in their hands?????

I've been told I need to try and speak up sometimes

Pete

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

your right val, but IMO i think with the right lenses the Canon out shines the D1x go look at the samples here... boy they are so noisey even at iso 125 and not very sharp. Take a look at the night photo...lol

Valliesto Bailey said:
Is the D1x better? sure but for the price of just the body you can
get a great D30 system started. That for me is the deal maker.
Besides the real investment is in the glass not the body, The
lenses you buy now will serve you well after the D30, EOS-1D (or
whatever they end up calling it) or the camera after that.

The D30 is nice but no one can compete on lenses, so the D30 wins
by default.

Valliesto.

Jay Dougherty said:

I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Click to expand...

Mike Greer · Sep 9, 2001

Jay,

Nobody is answering your question. Most of the responses have turned out to be D30 vs. D1x threads. But you asked would Canon get there. While I don't have access to Canon's internal development plans, I think everybody would be shocked if they didn't. All you have to do is examine their history. Canon have been very deliberate in their digital camera product releases. They have never valued being first to market. But when they do release, they seem to get it right.

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Tom Maxwell · Sep 9, 2001

It sounds like I hit a nerve! Sorry! I don't think I bashed the D30 if I did I apologize. It was certainly not my intent. And I am not defending or bashing the D1X either, that was not my intent. Hell I own both and don't have stock in either company (although as much of my money as they have I think I should own stock in them both) so I don't have to defend or bash either one. They are both very fine cameras, I have used them both and I do indeed think the D30 is a great camera and a good value. Being in the electronics industry as my "real" job as they say, I believe Canon has an edge with their CMOS technology. You point out well that the camera has very low noise and it does. The CMOS technology is the reason why. And CMOS is much less expensive to produce also. So in the long run, I would think it should result in a less expensive camera overall. That is a good thing! Go Canon! Yeah Canon! Great Job Canon! Canon makes great equipment and I like it very much! On the other hand, noise levels in low light situtions is only one measurment of the cameras performance. I think Phil does a great job in his reviews of pointing out all of the features and shortcomings of both cameras. But I think if we objectively compare the two cameras feature for feature and side by side, a reality check has to say that today as everything is, the D1X is a superior camera to the D30. Once again, for the price it should be. Sorry to offend you L, it wasn't my intent. Take care!

Love ya man
Tommy Boy

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

dunno about superior but its ok

Tom Maxwell said:
It sounds like I hit a nerve! Sorry! I don't think I bashed the
D30 if I did I apologize. It was certainly not my intent. And I
am not defending or bashing the D1X either, that was not my intent.
Hell I own both and don't have stock in either company (although as
much of my money as they have I think I should own stock in them
both) so I don't have to defend or bash either one. They are both
very fine cameras, I have used them both and I do indeed think the
D30 is a great camera and a good value. Being in the electronics
industry as my "real" job as they say, I believe Canon has an edge
with their CMOS technology. You point out well that the camera has
very low noise and it does. The CMOS technology is the reason why.
And CMOS is much less expensive to produce also. So in the long
run, I would think it should result in a less expensive camera
overall. That is a good thing! Go Canon! Yeah Canon! Great Job
Canon! Canon makes great equipment and I like it very much! On
the other hand, noise levels in low light situtions is only one
measurment of the cameras performance. I think Phil does a great
job in his reviews of pointing out all of the features and
shortcomings of both cameras. But I think if we objectively
compare the two cameras feature for feature and side by side, a
reality check has to say that today as everything is, the D1X is a
superior camera to the D30. Once again, for the price it should
be. Sorry to offend you L, it wasn't my intent. Take care!

Love ya man
Tommy Boy

DavidP #28649 · Sep 9, 2001

Of course Canon will catch up. The question is, where will Nikon be at that time?

I still think, though, that a person can't go wrong with either a Canon or a Nikon system. It all depends on which features are more important to him.

Mike Greer said:
Nobody is answering your question. Most of the responses have
turned out to be D30 vs. D1x threads. But you asked would Canon get
there. While I don't have access to Canon's internal development
plans, I think everybody would be shocked if they didn't. All you
have to do is examine their history. Canon have been very
deliberate in their digital camera product releases. They have
never valued being first to market. But when they do release, they
seem to get it right.

LMC54 · Sep 9, 2001

Looking at Canon's history I think we all know

DavidP said:
I still think, though, that a person can't go wrong with either a
Canon or a Nikon system. It all depends on which features are more
important to him.

Mike Greer said:

Nobody is answering your question. Most of the responses have
turned out to be D30 vs. D1x threads. But you asked would Canon get
there. While I don't have access to Canon's internal development
plans, I think everybody would be shocked if they didn't. All you
have to do is examine their history. Canon have been very
deliberate in their digital camera product releases. They have
never valued being first to market. But when they do release, they
seem to get it right.

Click to expand...

Jim Leonard · Sep 9, 2001

Peter Gregg said:
I have a reason not to go with the Nikon. Is my reason a show stopper?

YES, to me anyway.

The Canon has a glass 1/4 of an inch in FRONT of the sensor. It
protects and seals the sensor from dust. Any dust that gets on the
glass can be cleaned off the glass without touching the sensor. I
discovered this by accident. Phil's response was a little pointed
why he asked why doesn't the Nikon have a glass in front of it's
sensor to protect it?

As a possible answer (This is really just a wild guess but it makes some sense to me):

That extra piece of glass adds two more surfaces (front and back) for light to reflect off of, adding to flare and reducing light levels. If your goal was to get the best pictures possible at any reasonable cost, could having one of your (several) bodies in the shop be worth the extra image quality you would normally get?

just playing advocate for the unholy one,
jim

Paul Pope · Sep 10, 2001

No your not stupid....however you might be a little surprised at the cost...

Jay Dougherty said:
I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Martyn38590 · Sep 10, 2001

I had n't looked at the full res picture, wow talk about noise, it looks like its snowing!

http://img.dpreview.com/gallery/nikond1x_samples1/originals/010627-2302-31.jpg

To be fair it's a 10 sec exposure, but that's pretty damn noisy! Interesting how the cameras vary under extreme conditions.

Looking at a 15 sec exposure on the D30, you end up with a much more usable frame:

http://img.dpreview.com/gallery/canond30_samples2/originals/001010-1932-04.jpg

Thanks for sparking the interest L

Have to agree that in other considerations the D1X is a meatier piece of kit (and I like the extra knobs and switches), but I hadn't seen such a good comparison on the noise.

Enjoying my D30...

Martyn

John M. Poster · Sep 10, 2001

Tom,

Thanks. Thoughtful reply. Actually, after lots of thought and after reading the posts from here and in the Nikon forum, I'm going with my gut and buying the D1x.

Tom Maxwell said:
Let's be honest with everyone here please. The image quality of
the D1 is far superior to the image qaulity of the D30. But then it
should be, it is of a newer design and cost 2.5 times as much! If
you asked 100 honest pro shooters who aren't tied to one
manufacturer or the other a large majority of them will tell you
the D1H/X is an overall superior camera to the D30.
The question should be, is the image quality and all of the other
comparison items worth the difference in price? To most semipro
(I hate the term prosumer) users, and some lowend professional
users, I think not. However, to a hard hitting photojournalist or
a travel/nature photographer, the sturdier D1 series of cameras are
well worth the extra cost. The speed of the D1 series and lack of
shutter lag will allow photojournalists and even wedding and
portrait photographers to get images that they would otherwise miss
with the D30. Yes I can say that for a fact because I have used
both to photograph weddings. My preference for this type of work
is the D1X but I can use the D30 with very few problems. If you
want to make larger images, the D1X will definitly serve you
better. I have beautiful 20x24s made with the D30, I have
beautiful 30x40s made with the D1X. The D30 falls apart at these
sizes. Again, though, ask yourself how many 30x40s are you going
to make and is it worth the cost. There is no question that the
D1X is a better camera, but again, it should be! When the new
Cannon comes out, it will probably be comparable to or even better
than the D1X. However, the D30 and the S1 (if we can throw it in
here) may be the better value. We can buy 2 of them for the price
of a D1X or the new Canon whatever. Just getting started, you may
well be better off to get the D30 or S1. Since Jay doesn't have
any glass yet, he has a harder decision than most but he seems to
really be hooked on Canon glass. Based upon that, I think his
decision is already made.

Let's all face reality guys!

Take care and enjoy!

Tom

John M. Poster · Sep 10, 2001

My experience has taught me never to bet that the second-best guy will catch up to the first.

Canon's lack of a pro-level digital camera - even after Nikon is on its second-generation pro digital model - is not a good sign. It shows that something is amiss at the company. It's like waiting for the Washington Redskins, a once great team, to return to their glory days.

Your time may be better spent rooting for the top dog now. The top dog is tops for a reason.

Joe Tan said:
Incedently, I have nothing against Nikon, they have great
qualities, I just like Canon more.

JOE

Jay Dougherty said:

I'm about to buy the D30 over the DX1 for the following reasons:

1. I like the Canon lens selection.

I'd rather have the DX1's rapid-shot capability (larger buffer),
sharper out-of-camera images, better AF, higher pixel level, faster
turn-on speed, and firewire connectivity, among other things.

I'm assuming Canon will get there. Am I stupid?

Click to expand...

Am I stupid?

Well-known member

Forum Pro

Forum Pro

Forum Enthusiast

Member

Forum Pro

Forum Pro

Senior Member

Senior Member

Forum Pro

Leading Member

Forum Enthusiast

Forum Pro

Forum Pro

Forum Pro

Well-known member

Paul Pope

Guest

Forum Enthusiast

Well-known member

Well-known member

Keyboard shortcuts