So, what is the problem with the 3600HS and 5600 HS flashes?

Everyone keeps saying they are not a perfect fit for the KM digital bodies. Can someone explain (in layman's terms), what is missing if you use those - or what you could gain with a new flash specifically designed for 5D/7D?

I'm planning on buying a 5D and a flash. Nothing super-fancy in terms of use, probably use it mostly as bounce flash indoor, and possibly as fill flash outdoor.

PS: Stupid question, but if you take a picture in portrait mode (on the side), would it work well to get the 5600, and rotate that "sideways" (so the flash points up to the ceiling). Seems to me that is why they probably made it swivel left/right on the 5600?

I don't think I will be doing much wireless flash, or use tripod much..

Thanks!

-Tom

Nothing wrong with my 3600HS, if I want to shoot portrait aspect I can always take it off camera (I keep a little tripod just for the flash), but I'd prefer the swivel of the 5600HS.

Andrew

Thanks.

Do you know what features 'they' are talking about are missing from these models, compared to 'designed for digital' flashes would have? presumable compared to Nikon or Canon?

tomes said:

Thanks.

Do you know what features 'they' are talking about are missing from
these models, compared to 'designed for digital' flashes would
have? presumable compared to Nikon or Canon?

Click to expand...

People are missing exactly that "designed for digital" label. If Minolta just put that label on new 5600HS stock, call it 56-DD, and add a couple hundred dollar to the price tag, people will jump up and down for it.

The 5600HS was 5 years ahead of Canon and Nikon's flashes and their new flashes now are just playing catch up. The 5600HS got everything that you could name it in a flash: HSS, stroke, modeling, multiple wireless, wireless HSS, diffuser, tilt, swiel, external power terminal, high GN, AF assist, manual control......

Will HSS work with the 7D and 5D? The 7D's native sync speed is so slow!
Thanks,
fsw

--
LH

Based on purely anecdotal evidence, the 3600HS may even be a better fit for the 7D than the 5600HS is because there have been fewer (it appears) reported metering problems with the 3600HS.

tomes said:

Everyone keeps saying they are not a perfect fit for the KM digital
bodies. Can someone explain (in layman's terms), what is missing if
you use those - or what you could gain with a new flash
specifically designed for 5D/7D?

I'm planning on buying a 5D and a flash. Nothing super-fancy in
terms of use, probably use it mostly as bounce flash indoor, and
possibly as fill flash outdoor.

PS: Stupid question, but if you take a picture in portrait mode (on
the side), would it work well to get the 5600, and rotate that
"sideways" (so the flash points up to the ceiling). Seems to me
that is why they probably made it swivel left/right on the 5600?

I don't think I will be doing much wireless flash, or use tripod
much..

Thanks!

-Tom

Click to expand...

--
David

'It must be the shoes!'

Hi Tom,

I discover that when shooting 3 continuous shoot with 3600HS on camera, direct flash, the result is that the 1st picture is under-exposed, then the 2nd is over-exposed and the 3rd might be over-exposed or under-exposed due to the weakness of the last burst. I tested it in a dim room with two of the Minolta 3600HS and both gave me the same result. Have not found a solution to this. Maybe there is no solution. I am happy to snap away with single exposure and add a 0.3 or 0.7 flash compensation and that usually make the exposure better.

Larry
--

40 years without a camera, caught up in an instant, thanks to the digital world. Now lost in the cyber color space and virtual reality...

I have a 5D and a 3600HS that was used with my Ax cameras. It seems to work fine; I have not checked the HSS but page 112 of the manual says it has full compatibility. I purchased the camera while traveling and wasn't able to test the flash until returning a few days and I certainly didn't do any exhaustive testing, only making sure that the exposure was okay and that I could actually enjoy less noise with flash at high ISOs. I also have not tested the wireless but other posters have said it is fine with the new camera. One of the reasons that I chose the 5D camera was that I was happy with the flash and wouldn't have to buy a new one as I would if I bought from Canon or someone else.

I have also read that the initial problems calibrating the 5600 with the 7D have been eliminated in the 5D and there was never any mention of a 3600 problem with the earlier camera.

I don't really understand the question about the flash not fitting. I am quite pleased with my 3600, except that it is quite large and the 5D does not have a grip available to give the unit better balance (like my Ax cameras did).

I should probably clarify my earlier post. I shouldn't have said that the 5D manual has "full compatibility" with the 3600HS. It seems to indicate so, but since I haven't personally tested the wireless feature I can't say it works the same as it did on my Ax cameras. I will probably test it within the next couple of hours.

I refuse to buy either of the 2 flashes. I am not spending anymore money on KM items that are new and you have to immeidately send in for adjustment. Poor QC!

But then again, this has all been hashed out before.

3600 wireless feature seems to be fine with 5D, indicated by exhaustive test of 10 shots before only handy AAs went dead (haven't recharged in over a month).

The ability of a flash to support continuous shooting depends on how much output is required and recycle time. your camera's iso setting, object distance and lens aperture setting greatly affect this.

Regarding 5600HS problems, don't forget that this is the internet, you will see exaggreated reports of problem and user experience is very different. There are far more people with no problems who didn't care to post.

Larry,

After reading your post, I conducted the same test with my 7D, but using the 5600. First, at 6 feet and f/3.5 and 200 iso. All three shots were spot on and repeatable for proper (flash) exposure. Next, I focused out to a measured 16 foot distance and moved to f/5.6 and kept 200 iso. Again, three rapid flash shots in continuous mode were spot on. One occasion I took it to 4 shots, but the flash had exhausted itself and didn't recycle in time to expose for a fourth shot.

I think that is admirable flash performance, especially since neither the camera nor flash have ever been sent to KM for any calibration. Now, having said all that, this very same flash (my 5600) simply wouldn't work (underexposed several stops) on a friends 7D a few months back, but is perfect on my 7D. BTW, my flash is nearly two years old.

It speaks to the nature of these forai in that users experiencing no problems (like me) are not likely to post that fact out of the clear blue sky. Only when an anomoly is noted by another user, will someone test their own unit for the same thing, and even then may not post that they do not experience the same problem. Nature of the beast, eh?

I am of the opinion that many more are having no problems, than those who are experiencing flash/camera issues.
Regards, Jim

LarryYan said:

Hi Tom,

I discover that when shooting 3 continuous shoot with 3600HS on
camera, direct flash, the result is that the 1st picture is
under-exposed, then the 2nd is over-exposed and the 3rd might be
over-exposed or under-exposed due to the weakness of the last
burst. I tested it in a dim room with two of the Minolta 3600HS and
both gave me the same result. Have not found a solution to this.
Maybe there is no solution. I am happy to snap away with single
exposure and add a 0.3 or 0.7 flash compensation and that usually
make the exposure better.

Larry
--
40 years without a camera, caught up in an instant, thanks to the
digital world. Now lost in the cyber color space and virtual
reality...

Click to expand...

--



Odds N' Ends album here:
http://www.pbase.com/jimh/inbox&page=all
Z album here: http://www.pbase.com/jimh/marilyn_the_car&page=all

The adjustment requirement is not due to poor QC, but due to no DSLR's available to tune the original 5600HS(D) design for. Remember the 5600 has been around for quite some time, and was heads and shoulders ahead of competitor offerings when it came - and it was designed for film only at the time. Competitor flashes were designed with the limitations of DSLR's in mind; it's a good thing the 5600HS(D) is capable of being adjusted to work perfectly with DSLR's despite not having been designed for them from the start.

I'll be testing my 5600HS(D) (unadjusted) with my KM 5D this week, I hope. Then I'll see just how bad it is, and if I need to do some sending in for adjustment.

There is another aspect to your answer: learn how to use the equipment and how to adjust if needed instead of blaming the camera and/or flash if auto--auto does not deliver technically perfect pictures. The camera and the flash do not think, that is why the photographer should ...

It put some of my worries to rest

So the 5600 lets you swivel for portrait (vertical) pictures and the 3600 needs removed from the camera?

Someone stated that the 3600 was giving inconsistant exposures with continuous shooting. Is this a problem with the 5D and 5600HS also?

So if I want to get an external flash for my 5D, is the 5600HS worth the extra dollars? I think the 3600HS has enough power and is considerably cheaper, but these other issues concern me.

I can get them shipped for:

3600HS - $168
5600HS - $309

Anything I should be aware of regarding these flashes or problems/concerns to keep in mind before purchasing or when using?

Videoguy said:

So the 5600 lets you swivel for portrait (vertical) pictures and
the 3600 needs removed from the camera?

Someone stated that the 3600 was giving inconsistant exposures with
continuous shooting. Is this a problem with the 5D and 5600HS also?

Click to expand...

Its not inconsistent. It just hasn't fully charged before the next shot. I use sprint 15minute charge batteries and the cycle very quickly. There have also been complaints of underexposure when the guide number required was more than the 3600's. There are also genuine problems with flash calibration but it seems to affect more 5600s than 3600 and the newer 3600HS would appear to be fine.

I won't recommend either, I like my 3600 and it gives great exposures but I would like a 5600 also

Andrew

Videoguy said:

So if I want to get an external flash for my 5D, is the 5600HS
worth the extra dollars? I think the 3600HS has enough power and
is considerably cheaper, but these other issues concern me.

Click to expand...

Videoguy said:

I can get them shipped for:

3600HS - $168
5600HS - $309

Anything I should be aware of regarding these flashes or
problems/concerns to keep in mind before purchasing or when using?

Click to expand...