Image Stabilization with tripod

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

'Tis true.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&page=1&message=1428041

If you search on tripod and IS or Image Stabilization in this forum you will find more information.

Mark

Dave Jordan said:

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in
Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read
that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a
tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a
tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some
experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

Click to expand...

So what they are saying is that the steadier you hold it the less effective the IS is? Or do they mean that only if the camera is held perfectly still (like on a tripod)does the IS become less effective?Or should you be careful not to hold it perfectly still by hand? Hard one to understand ! JD

Mark Devine said:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&page=1&message=1428041

If you search on tripod and IS or Image Stabilization in this forum
you will find more information.

Mark

Dave Jordan said:

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in
Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read
that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a
tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a
tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some
experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

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Hi, John and Dave

I have read other's opinions on this and some say as long as the shutter speed is less than a second, putting it on a tripod with the IS on is no problem.

I've taken quick shutter speed shots with the IS on and the UZI sitting on the railing of my deck and they were sharp. I took nearly identical shots (hand held) right after to see whether there was any differnce; There was none that I could see.

I haven't actually put it on a tripod because what I usually shoot moves around too much.

Daff

john demastrie said:

So what they are saying is that the steadier you hold it the less
effective the IS is? Or do they mean that only if the camera is
held perfectly still (like on a tripod)does the IS become less
effective?Or should you be careful not to hold it perfectly still
by hand? Hard one to understand ! JD

Click to expand...

Well, if you make an effort to hold it unsteady, you're almost guarenteed a bad picture. The IS can only handle five or ten milimeters in any direction... I always do my best to hold perfectly still, as if I didn't have IS, and rely on it to do the rest ... which it does. I don't think it's possible to hold the camera as steady as a tripod, if you have a heartbeat.

Hi,

I discovered the following response to a similar question in another forum. This is from Canon, which I think our IS lens comes from. It seem that the answer depends which type of IS lens our UZI is based on. Anyone knows which type our Uzi is based on ?

Cheers
Wee Yeow

Response from Canon:

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

The instruction sheets with my IS lenses say to turn the IS function OFF when using a tripod. I have heard other photographers argue the opposite.

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Would you discuss the pros/cons of this?

The answer depends on which type of IS lens you're talking about. With the IS super-telephotos (300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS and 600/4L IS), it's OK to leave IS turned on when the lens is mounted on a tripod. For all other current IS lenses (28-135/3.5-5.6 IS, 75-300/4-5.6 IS,100-400/4.5-5.6L IS, and 300/4L IS), it is much better to shut off the IS function when the lens is mounted on a tripod.

Here's the explanation for the 28-135 IS, 75-300 IS, 100-400L IS, and 300/4L IS lenses:

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

The instruction manual warns that the IS stays on after pressing the shutter button half way, and that use of IS on a tripod may damage the lens.

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Here's what the instruction book says (page E-8): "Do not set the image stabilizer switch to 'I' when using the camera on a tripod. Doing so may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically. Turn the image stabilizer off '0' before using the camera on a tripod."

There is no language here or anywhere else in the instructions

concerning damage to the 28-135 IS caused by using the camera on a tripod. All they're saying is that using IS while the camera is on a tripod "may cause the image stabilizer to act erratically."

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

Why does tripod use cause a problem?

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Short explanation: The IS mechanism operates by correcting shake. When there is no shake, or when the level of shake is below the threshold of the system's detection capability, use of the IS feature may actually add unwanted blur to the photograph, therefore you should shut it off in this situation.

Longer explanation: Remember that the IS lens group is normally locked into place. When the IS function is active, the IS lens group is unlocked so it can be moved by the electromagnetic coil surrounding the elements. When there's not enough motion for the IS system to detect, the result can sometimes be a sort of electronic "feedback loop," somewhat analogous to the ringing noise of an audio feedback loop we're all familiar with. As a result, the IS lens group might move while the lens is on a tripod,

unless the IS function is switched off and the IS lens group is locked into place.

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

Is IS best kept off, then turned on for each shot as needed, then turned off again, much as one would use the exposure compensation dial?

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For most hand-held work, leave the switch on; for tripod work, shut it off, as noted in the instruction book.

The recommendations above do not apply for the 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS, and 600/4L IS. Here is some information for them:

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

[with 300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS and 600/4L IS] Does IS operate when the lens is on a tripod or not??

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I can positively confirm that it does, and quite well as a matter of
proven fact.

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

The Owner's Manual (page 12) says it does not.

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We know. But our testing indicates otherwise.

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

Canon Inc.'s EF Lens Tech Report (Vol. 13) implies that it disengages but then says it stabilizes when using a tripod.

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I see no such implication. My copy of this report says: "With previous IS lenses, it was necessary to turn off the Image Stabilizer when using a tripod because it might operate incorrectly. But the Image Stabilizer installed on these IS lenses has an additional function that prevents improper operation when using a tripod. It also corrects camera vibration caused by slow shutter photography when using a tripod: a common problem with Super Telephoto lenses. About one second after the shutter is pressed halfway, the unit automatically determines that a tripod is being used from the output of a vibration gyro." These statements are 100% accurate based on my testing. There are no other references to the use of IS on a tripod anywhere in this report, as far as I can tell.

Dave Jordan said:

Dave Jordan said:

My own guess is this. When the tripod/head is rigid and there is little or no vibration, IS does disengage. When you loosen the head -- as for following birds in flight -- the gyros sense some vibration and the IS begins to operate again.

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This is not quite right. Based on my own personal testing and observation, as well as a personal consultation with one of Canon Inc.'s chief executives in the Lens Division, these lenses effectively have 2 IS modes within Mode 1. The decision on which mode will be used is made by the equipment, not the photographer, based on an evaluation of the degree of detected
movement, as follows:

A. When the lens is mounted on a steady tripod and the shutter button is pressed halfway, the IS begins to operate immediately and the image in the viewfinder goes through a very slow vertical shift for about 1 second. After that, if the shutter button continues to be pressed halfway, the IS mechanism automatically goes into a special mode which is designed to detect and correct for mirror slap and shutter movement at slow shutter speeds. Based on my personal testing, it does this job spectacularly well. Close examination of results from shooting tests definitively proves that there is no advantage to be gained by shutting off IS, or even by locking the mirror prior to exposure.

B. When the lens is mounted on a monopod or hand-held and the gyro sensors detect movement exceeding a certain rate, the IS mechanism switches into its conventional correction mode which is designed to compensate for relatively gross and/or erratic lens movement.

So, what you're seeing when you loosen the ball head and start moving the lens is essentially an automatic switchover from "tripod IS" to "conventional IS."

Best Regards,

Chuck Westfall
Assistant Director/Technical Information Dept.
Camera Division/Canon U.S.A., Inc.

Those are all 35mm camera lenses.

weeyeow said:

Cheers
Wee Yeow

Response from Canon:

weeyeow said:

weeyeow said:

The instruction sheets with my IS lenses say to turn the IS function OFF when using a tripod. I have heard other photographers argue the opposite.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Would you discuss the pros/cons of this?

The answer depends on which type of IS lens you're talking about.
With the IS super-telephotos (300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS
and 600/4L IS), it's OK to leave IS turned on when the lens is
mounted on a tripod. For all other current IS lenses
(28-135/3.5-5.6 IS, 75-300/4-5.6 IS,100-400/4.5-5.6L IS, and 300/4L
IS), it is much better to shut off the IS function when the lens is
mounted on a tripod.

Click to expand...

Yes, but I expect the technology based will be the same, since they leverage from previous work. The question is: whether our Uzi lens is the later hardware technology or earlier.

Wee Yeow

John P said:

weeyeow said:

Cheers
Wee Yeow

Response from Canon:

jperilloux said:

jperilloux said:

The instruction sheets with my IS lenses say to turn the IS function OFF when using a tripod. I have heard other photographers argue the opposite.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Would you discuss the pros/cons of this?

The answer depends on which type of IS lens you're talking about.
With the IS super-telephotos (300/2.8L IS, 400/2.8L IS, 500/4L IS
and 600/4L IS), it's OK to leave IS turned on when the lens is
mounted on a tripod. For all other current IS lenses
(28-135/3.5-5.6 IS, 75-300/4-5.6 IS,100-400/4.5-5.6L IS, and 300/4L
IS), it is much better to shut off the IS function when the lens is
mounted on a tripod.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Daff said:

I have read other's opinions on this and some say as long as the
shutter speed is less than a second, putting it on a tripod with
the IS on is no problem.

Click to expand...

I recently photographed some fireworks in the 1-8 second exposure range. I forgot to turn IS off and about 95% of the photographs have noticeable "squiggle" in them. The tripod was definitely not moving, so my hunch is that the IS is to blame. Ah, well, live and learn.

• CraigF

weeyeow said:

Yes, but I expect the technology based will be the same, since they
leverage from previous work. The question is: whether our Uzi lens
is the later hardware technology or earlier.

Click to expand...

Well, given that our entire camera costs about half what a Canon IS tele lens costs by itself, I'm guessing the older technology.

• CraigF

CraigF said:

Daff said:

I have read other's opinions on this and some say as long as the
shutter speed is less than a second, putting it on a tripod with
the IS on is no problem.

Click to expand...

I recently photographed some fireworks in the 1-8 second exposure
range. I forgot to turn IS off and about 95% of the photographs
have noticeable "squiggle" in them. The tripod was definitely not
moving, so my hunch is that the IS is to blame. Ah, well, live and
learn.

Click to expand...

Craig, I think your tripod WAS moving, enough to cause squiggles
at least, especially if you had the zoom full up. I got lots of squiggly
fireworks with my 2020 on a tripod. I blamed it on the wind and
on the light weight of my aluminum tripod.

Roy F.

Roy F. said:

Craig, I think your tripod WAS moving, enough to cause squiggles
at least, especially if you had the zoom full up. I got lots of
squiggly
fireworks with my 2020 on a tripod. I blamed it on the wind and
on the light weight of my aluminum tripod.

Click to expand...

Roy,

If my tripod was a light-weight one, I surely would believe this. While I was at a substantial zoom, this tripod is very stable. It weighs about 20 lbs., has a cast-iron central fixture with triple-wall legs and neck (about 2 mm thick aluminum). Granted, it's unlikely it held the cam perfectly motionless, but the magnitude of some of the squiggles makes me think it was something other than random tripod tremors (I was using the remote as well so nothing was even touching the camera).

• CraigF

yesterday evening I tried a long exposure shot inside the house on a tripod by using the self-timer. After I pressed the button i stood back and noticed on the LCD the picture slowly moved around a little bit. It kept on doing so up to and including the time the shutter was open, resulting in a blurred picture. I repeated that and the same happend. Then I disabled IS and all the movements were gone.

So for longer tripod exposures you should definitely turn it off.

marcel

Dave Jordan said:

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in
Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read
that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a
tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a
tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some
experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

Click to expand...

Thank eveyone for all the responses. I still have not done my own testing but it sounds like its something to consider when using a tripod (turning IS off). I guess tripods in stable conditions should be at least as good as IS. For curiosity I'll test it myself so I can pass findings on to others.

Dave Jordan

Marcel Kreeft said:

So for longer tripod exposures you should definitely turn it off.

marcel

Dave Jordan said:

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in
Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read
that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a
tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a
tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some
experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

The problem is at longer exposures. I did a whole series of night time shots at various locations while on vacation recently - they should have turned out beautiful. I was going for 2-8 second exposures. Used my Bogen tripod - rock steady.

Got home and checked the images - most were blurred. I had left the IS on. I normally know better than that. The firmware that controls the IS is designed for shorter exposures. Not sure exactly HOW it works. I would say that anything under 1 second may work well. But then if you are on a tripod, you do not need it anyway.

Mark

john demastrie said:

Mark Devine said:

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1008&page=1&message=1428041

If you search on tripod and IS or Image Stabilization in this forum
you will find more information.

Mark

Dave Jordan said:

I recently purchased an after market manual (A short course in
Olympus c-2100 Ultra Zoom Photography) and was surprised to read
that they suggest turning off Image Stabilization when using a
tripod. It says the IS can introduce blur when taken from a
tripod. Has anyone experimented with that? I will do some
experimenting myself but wondered what others have found.

Dave Jordan

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Could also be noise from the fireworks causing a vibration?

Roy F. said:

CraigF said:

Daff said:

I have read other's opinions on this and some say as long as the
shutter speed is less than a second, putting it on a tripod with
the IS on is no problem.

Click to expand...

I recently photographed some fireworks in the 1-8 second exposure
range. I forgot to turn IS off and about 95% of the photographs
have noticeable "squiggle" in them. The tripod was definitely not
moving, so my hunch is that the IS is to blame. Ah, well, live and
learn.

Click to expand...

Craig, I think your tripod WAS moving, enough to cause squiggles
at least, especially if you had the zoom full up. I got lots of
squiggly
fireworks with my 2020 on a tripod. I blamed it on the wind and
on the light weight of my aluminum tripod.

Roy F.

Click to expand...

weeyeow said:

Hi,
I discovered the following response to a similar question in
another forum. This is from Canon, which I think our IS lens comes
from. It seem that the answer depends which type of IS lens our UZI
is based on. Anyone knows which type our Uzi is based on ?

Click to expand...

Here are the notes from the Canon Pro-90 manual. It uses the same lens as the UZI. They say nothing about turning it off on a tripod. The only conclusion I can draw from this is that Olympus has more complete manuals than Canon does.

Fritz

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

• The camera may not be able to completely eliminate the effects of camera shake when shooting at slow shutter speeds, such as for night shots. In these cases, affix the camera to a tripod to shoot.

• The camera may not be able to completely eliminate the effects of excessive camera shake.

• You are also recommended to turn the image stabilizer off when you are purposely moving the camera to achieve a blurred effect.

Roy F. said:

CraigF said:

I recently photographed some fireworks in the 1-8 second exposure
range. I forgot to turn IS off and about 95% of the photographs
have noticeable "squiggle" in them. The tripod was definitely not
moving, so my hunch is that the IS is to blame. Ah, well, live and
learn.

Click to expand...

Craig, I think your tripod WAS moving, enough to cause squiggles
at least, especially if you had the zoom full up. I got lots of
squiggly
fireworks with my 2020 on a tripod. I blamed it on the wind and
on the light weight of my aluminum tripod.

Roy F.

Click to expand...

Have either of you considered the fact that the fireworks were moving, and that the squiggles could be due to the travel of the fireworks while using a long exposure? A rock steady mount with absoultely no vibration would show squiggles, if the subject were moving during a long exposure!
MDiamond