ats
Forum Enthusiast
May be a film camera to replace my F80, F90 or something..
ArAvInD
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Nikon announces new products on Sep. 1
- Thread starter gisle
- Start date
GaySatyr
Senior Member
Prediction & Wish List:
--- N/F85 update/replacement for N/F80 & last Nikon film camera
--- D85 high-end "DX" amateur DSLR, 10+MP ($1300, body only)
--- both have built-in flash
--- MB85 vertical release grip & battery holder for both models
--- these share components with the current D50/D70S series
--- D200 "DX" format, 12+MP, F6 chassis (D2X-lite)
--- does NOT have built-in flash
--- MB200 vertical release grip & battery holder
--- SB "Command Module" (non-flash controller for off-camera iTTL strobes)
--- 2 "DX" primes: an ultra-wide rectilinear & a super-fast wide
--- maybe a 10- or 12-mm f/2.8G AF DX
--- and an 18- or 21-mm f/1.4G AF DX
--- the full-frame 35mm f/1.4 AIS updated to "G" and AF
--- "G" and AF-S updates to the 80-400 f/3.5-5.6 VR
--- "G" and "VR" updates to the 400 f/2.8 AF-S and the 500 f/4 AF-S
--- several new CoolPix models
--- N/F85 update/replacement for N/F80 & last Nikon film camera
--- D85 high-end "DX" amateur DSLR, 10+MP ($1300, body only)
--- both have built-in flash
--- MB85 vertical release grip & battery holder for both models
--- these share components with the current D50/D70S series
--- D200 "DX" format, 12+MP, F6 chassis (D2X-lite)
--- does NOT have built-in flash
--- MB200 vertical release grip & battery holder
--- SB "Command Module" (non-flash controller for off-camera iTTL strobes)
--- 2 "DX" primes: an ultra-wide rectilinear & a super-fast wide
--- maybe a 10- or 12-mm f/2.8G AF DX
--- and an 18- or 21-mm f/1.4G AF DX
--- the full-frame 35mm f/1.4 AIS updated to "G" and AF
--- "G" and AF-S updates to the 80-400 f/3.5-5.6 VR
--- "G" and "VR" updates to the 400 f/2.8 AF-S and the 500 f/4 AF-S
--- several new CoolPix models
Digital UW
Forum Enthusiast
?? Online?
GaySatyr
Senior Member
Probably not.
It is usually sent to members of the local & professional camera press, a handful of local dealers, and a few well-known photographers.
It is usually sent to members of the local & professional camera press, a handful of local dealers, and a few well-known photographers.
Give me a medium format at the price point, zoom lens size, weight of a 35mm and I'll jump on it in a second. I stayed with 35mm not because it’s better than medium format but because it’s lighter, more lens collection and much cheaper.
Give me a DX sensor on something small (similar to the R-D1) with a good DX lens collection and I’ll jump all over it. Price it at $3K and I’ll still buy it.
Give me a small sensor on the 35mm body and calling it the “standard” is BS. The best possible sensor for a 35mm body is the full-size sensor. Anything smaller is not taking the full advantage of the 35mm body. At the minimum, the viewfinder is compromised.
The DX sensor will run into limitations before the FF sensor does.
I’ve been driving around with a V8 vehicle. Now if you take the same body and drop in a V6, I’ll call that a compromise. Now, if you drop in a turbo V6 and it’s better than the original V8, it’s a very good change but still a compromised. Why? Because the body can take a turbo V8 and be that much better.
I am willing to bet that Nikon will come out with a larger sensor. Maybe in 3 years but they will.
fishcatcher
Senior Member
You mean one that holds detail at any ISO? Can't see the logic in an s model quite yet, too much like advertising that you didn't get it quite right the first time around. s models are a marketing strategy that doesn't work too well on anyone but loyalists, and it serves to anger the non s model owners, especially if it comes out too soon.
Nikon knows where th real bread gets buttered! Canon has been blowing them out of the water with P&S for several years already.
That would frustrate so many shooters dying for a real upgrade in MP and improvement in Noise with higher ISOs in the next body. If Nikon did that Canon would be laughing all the way to the bank. Nikon has done some dumb marketing moves, but this one would likely earn them an award for lack of market perception. Hey, maybe you are right after all.
Now that is classic Nikon when it comes to software!
An astute marketing move. Soccer Moms prefer silver to black two to one.
BobMcCarthy
Forum Enthusiast
I don't see a FF being an issue. A FF (or near FF) Nikon, with (piooma) 25mpxls, with a list of (hmmm) $7k would coexist with the current Dx line just fine. Marketed as a med/large format killer, with a few tuned/upgraded wide ff primes, makes perfect sense to me.
Bob
Please forgive me in advance - My Spelling and Grammar often fall far behind my typing and posting
Bob
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Please forgive me in advance - My Spelling and Grammar often fall far behind my typing and posting
Charles Bandes
Senior Member
sergey1968
Senior Member
can not. I wonder why?
--
Sergey
http://www.photo.net/photodb/member-photos?include=all&user_id=1471237
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Sergey
http://www.photo.net/photodb/member-photos?include=all&user_id=1471237
Seth111629
Member
One thing that I have not seen speculated here (maybe I missed it) is the probability of Nikon coming out with a FF dslr with HSC that makes it compatible with DX. It seems to me that the HSC on the D2X is a sign that they will have a FF option sometime. Maybe not right now, but the D3?
RiverSide Photography
Senior Member
no text
ruut
Leading Member
Interesting. This evening a saw an international news-item on TV (Don't recall the name) and one of the pj's used a small F6 look a like camera with a small flash-unit on it. The name Nikon was taped with black tape.
It wasn't a F6 because there was a white dot in the middlke of the viewfinder...
Don't think that was a piece of white tape ;-)
thomas1973
Veteran Member
Well, not quite, but the Norwegian publication "Fotografi", a well respected photomagazine, has an online article at http://www.fotografi.no about the new releases from Canon. The article is dated 25th of August. In the same article, they mention that Nikon will probably answer Canon next week (fits with September 1st):
"Samtidig har Interfoto varslet en verdensnyhet i neste uke. Vil Nikon utfordre Canons nye modell allerede før den er i salg?"
English:
"At the same time, Interfoto [The official Scandinvian Nikon importer] are announcing they will reveal something extraordinary next week. Will Nikon step up to the plate and challenge Canon's products even before they're released?"
So there is something to be announced next week, and from the wording, I'd be very dissappointed if it was only a couple of Coolpix model upgrades ;-)
Thomas.
"Samtidig har Interfoto varslet en verdensnyhet i neste uke. Vil Nikon utfordre Canons nye modell allerede før den er i salg?"
English:
"At the same time, Interfoto [The official Scandinvian Nikon importer] are announcing they will reveal something extraordinary next week. Will Nikon step up to the plate and challenge Canon's products even before they're released?"
So there is something to be announced next week, and from the wording, I'd be very dissappointed if it was only a couple of Coolpix model upgrades ;-)
Thomas.
Derrick Siu
Senior Member
I hope all your prediction will come ture next week plus a 55-200 constant f4.0 AFS VR.
Derrick
Derrick
Yamil R. Sued50621
Senior Member
Bob, I know what you mean, but...
My question is:
Will it Make me more money?? or just cost me more money??
What can it do that I'm not acomplising right now??
Will it make me do better work??
Did I ask if is going to make me more money??
I'm a working pro, I don't need toys, I need working tools!!
DX works just fine.
Great edge to Edge, no fall off, now fuzzy edges!!
What's wrong with that??
Y
My question is:
Will it Make me more money?? or just cost me more money??
What can it do that I'm not acomplising right now??
Will it make me do better work??
Did I ask if is going to make me more money??
I'm a working pro, I don't need toys, I need working tools!!
DX works just fine.
Great edge to Edge, no fall off, now fuzzy edges!!
What's wrong with that??
Y
Yamil R. Sued50621
Senior Member
HMMMM, you mean like the Canon??
I shoot both, but I rather have a 1DMKII that a 1DSMKII!!
They don't have it quite yet!!
Yes, when they have optics good enough for FF!!
But!!!!! At what cost??
My simple questions
From another Post)Will it Make me more money?? or just cost me more money??
What can it do that I'm not acomplising right now??
Will it make me do better work??
Did I ask if is going to make me more money??
I'm a working pro, I don't need toys, I need working tools!!
DX works just fine.
Great edge to Edge, no fall off, now fuzzy edges!!
What's wrong with that??
thomas1973
Veteran Member
Thanks for the laugh! :-D
shutzman1
Forum Enthusiast
There was an interview with Nikon's CEO about 2 years ago, in which he said that for at least the next five years Nikon did not see the need to come out with an FF camera.
Knowing a little about how traditional Japanese people are, I am pretty certain we have at least another 3 years before Nikon produces a camera with FF sensor, if at all.
It is very possible that the new and future lenses would render FF obsolete. Afterall FF is only there to keep it compatible with everything we've had in the past and not a universal standard of nature (like PI or PHI)
Also the 4/3rds system of Olympus and the other guys, indicates that the smaller sensor has long life (perhaps longer than the existing lenses).
If the DX lenses out-number the old lenses, FF is out the window. It seems that with technology advancement and miniaturization, bigger is not always better, so people's obssession with the past and FF, could be sort of like a reminiscence of horse and carriage when the car became a novelty.
Perhaps the saying that you can't teach old dog new tricks is how we should approach the issue of FF. The surprising factor here is that people who are computer savvy (and are therefore on this forum) still have hard time adjusting to new standards.
Knowing a little about how traditional Japanese people are, I am pretty certain we have at least another 3 years before Nikon produces a camera with FF sensor, if at all.
It is very possible that the new and future lenses would render FF obsolete. Afterall FF is only there to keep it compatible with everything we've had in the past and not a universal standard of nature (like PI or PHI)
Also the 4/3rds system of Olympus and the other guys, indicates that the smaller sensor has long life (perhaps longer than the existing lenses).
If the DX lenses out-number the old lenses, FF is out the window. It seems that with technology advancement and miniaturization, bigger is not always better, so people's obssession with the past and FF, could be sort of like a reminiscence of horse and carriage when the car became a novelty.
Perhaps the saying that you can't teach old dog new tricks is how we should approach the issue of FF. The surprising factor here is that people who are computer savvy (and are therefore on this forum) still have hard time adjusting to new standards.
Thomas Sapiano
Senior Member
That depends on your style of photography and which way the various advantages/disadvantages of the two formats effect it. From the tone of your message it seems not, and there is no problem with that, however there are different people out there with different requirements.
It won't cost you any money if you choose to stay away from it, and it could easilly make other people more money if the advantages line up with their desired photographic style.
Depth of field isolation for one - if you're style doesn't push you to shoot with wide apperatures, then it isn't an issue for you, but for those of us who do then it is a very significant one. Nikon can certainly remedy this by making lenses with larger apperatures (ie f2.8-> f1.8, f1.8-> f1.2, f1.4-> f0.9, etc.), however given the choice it would be a lot less expensive for me to get full frame bodies than replace my lens line. Naturally, I'll take what I can get but that won't stop me from pushing for my desired solution
Either way, at this stage the vast majority of those lenses do not exist so we are currently in the lurch until one of these paths are taken For you purhaps, but for others it does not. Naturally, we work around the limitations that it presents to us and get the job done - however our results would certainly be improved if we didn't have to resort to work arounds. I'm certainly happy that the limitations of the format do not effect you, but that doesn't mean they aren't significant for others.
Of course it has to be said that there are certainly limitations of the full-frame format that HF resolves - however for some of us they are much less significant than the advantages. They are legitimate issues, it's just that given my style they don't come up as often as they do for you. I have no interest in belittling those issues, just saying that my interests do not necessarilly mesh with yours
The key here is that most people who want FF recognise that HF has it's place and will continue to for the forseeable future. We aren't asking Nikon to switch exclusively to the larger format, we are simply asking for a suitable model to give us the choice. Either that or get to work in producing more lenses that resolve those problems with the smaller format - the 200f2.0 is certainly a good first step, but we need a lot more before we pipe down about it
With that said, I will certainly agree that this is not the time for such an announcement. The professional cameras have recently been refreshed, and the D100 has been without a refresh for a while - a HF D200 makes perfect sense at this stage. Any move toward full-frame will most certainly be made at the high-end first, and given the recent releases it doesn't make a whole lot of sense at this time.
fishcatcher
Senior Member
There was also a statement at the launch of the D2x where it was acknowledged that Nikon would be making an FF camera because the market wanted them. We can oly speculate on when, but they will. Bet on it.
That is not the compelling reason for anyone making FF cameras. The limitations with DX are not lens dependent. If anything DX gets more of the goodie out of FF lenses because it uses only the central part of the lens. FF would reduce the images out of a lot of the less expensive lower to mid quality glass that was used on 35mm to unacceptable. FF demands very high quality lenses. Your reasoning doesn't hold up. FF offers the possibility of high resolutions with less noise and higher ISO among other things. Those are the reasons that both Canon and Nikon--and others--have or are developing them.
In what sense. I don't see a headlong rush to the E1, quite the contrary, and the lenses it uses that are designed for it are heavy and expensive. It may catch on as a format, but I rather doubt it. Canon's emphasis on FF clearly sets the competition at this time. Unless you think they are suicidal or suddenly have lost their marketing savvy that has done so well for them over the last 15 years. They could, of course, be making a market blunder, but the benefit of the doubt based on history has to go to them until it is shown.
Again, a little deeper thought on this would help. Nikon's really great lenses, the mainstay of their market, are largely FF compatible lenses. Your notion that lens compatibility is what is behind the demand for FF cameras needs some rethinking. It is a minor part.
There are a lot of standards in the world of pjotography. Dx has both plusses and minuses as a format. FF also has them. You seem to want to make this into something easily explained by superficial explanations and platitudes. I'll leave it to you to do a bit of reading on the genuine photographic differences between the two formats. Some will choose DX because it fits their needs, others will go with FF for the same reason. Choice is what is important.
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