Sony V3 images perhaps at their limit

Streusel · Jun 8, 2005

I thought, I'd share some pictures with you taken with the Sony V3 of different people and things during a 4 day music festival. During this time I stressed the camera a good deal.

Most functions of the camera were set manually at some point. Short and long exposures by day and night, in the dry and the wet, at low and high ISOs (including Night Shot) were taken. Almost all were hand held. For a few shots the camera was rested for example on a ledge or stick.

The pictures have been processed with Photoshop where necessary.

What would I like improved: a larger sensor, MORE DYNAMIC RANGE, higher non Night Shot ISO, image stabilization, faster start up and focusing, that the raw mode was not just implemented as a useless feature.

What I like a lot: the form factor of the camera body, the ergonomics, the hologram auto focus assist beam, Compact Flash cards.

Have fun.

http://www.nagabyte.com/dpr/

Maple Leaf · Jun 8, 2005

Although I find body piercing and nose rings distasteful, I do like your series. If I can do half as well with my V3 as you have done in your series I will be satisfied.

Very interesting series. Your indoor shots are well done and without a tripod as well.
--
Bob

Cpt Galant · Jun 8, 2005

Streusel said:
What would I like improved: a larger sensor, MORE DYNAMIC RANGE,
higher non Night Shot ISO, image stabilization, faster start up and
focusing, that the raw mode was not just implemented as a useless
feature.

I'd like to see a better implemented optical viewfinder. Currently, it seems as though it's just an afterthought. I'd like one with superimposed focus points and exposure/shooting data on the side or bottom. It also wouldn't hurt to relocate it to the other side of the flash if possible.

I'm actually okay with the image chip size, despite the comprimises it entails. A 4/3 sensor might be interesting, but I believe it would increase the camera size, which is perfect at the moment. At very least it would require lenses that stick out farther making it closer to the 828 in form factor. Maybe Sony could develop a chip with a 3x crop factor (in DSLR terms) that would be a good comprimise between pixel pitch and lens size.

Faster startup would be a great help. I'm actually quite impressed with the current focusing speed, but hey, faster is always better.

Finally, I'd like to see the buffer implimented in such a way that the next shot can be taken before the previous image is completely flushed. DSLRs use a system like this, but because they don't use the LCD for framing, I'm not sure if it can really be implimented on the V4(?).

Finally, I'd be interested in seeing a tilt-up LCD screen. This is a hard one because the large screen (which is a great benifit) would be hard to hinge without major design changes to the body. If Sony could keep the classic rangefinder look and feel and make a tilting screen for waist-level shots, I'd be happy to sacrifice a little bit in size. Maybe a 2" to 2.25" screen?

Streusel said:
What I like a lot: the form factor of the camera body, the
ergonomics, the hologram auto focus assist beam, Compact Flash
cards.

I have to agree. I also feel the build quality is quite good, other than the flash cover. I love how compact and portable it is, which is why I bought it in the first place.

No camera is perfect, but overall I really like the V3. A few tweaks and it just might be ready to replace one of my bulky DSLRs.

--
A camera is just a tool - no matter how much one loves it.

ianz28 · Jun 8, 2005

You definitely are giving that V3 a workout. Nice!

Ian

p.s. welcome to the forum

--
http://www.ianz28.smugmug.com
Positive or Negative - Critique's are always welcome and appreciated.

Mark Oakland · Jun 8, 2005

Hi Streusel, I'm sort of wondering what those extras you want would have done for your photographs. The quality seems to match your aspirations and photo style just perfectly as is. Great workout. I took my V3 to Venice a month ago and almost without exception it coped very well with deep shadows and still held the highlights to give a certain V3 'look'. I guess what I'm trying to say, is that all cameras have a character, a style which determines the result you get and the V3 hasn't let you down IMO.

I would like some of the handling/button placement issues to be sorted, before an upgrade in quality.
great stuff - lets see some more
cheers
mark

--
Pixels proliferate but film is more precious.

Streusel · Jun 9, 2005

Thanks for the warm welcome.

@mark

I too find that the V3 suits my way of taking pictures and it's the main reason, why I haven't bought a dslr yet.

Streusel · Jun 9, 2005

Hi Ian

I had a look at the images on your site. They are very well done. I particularly noticed how well you've managed to sharpen them. Would you let me in on your V3 workflow there? Please?

)

bigtruckguy · Jun 9, 2005

My biggest beef with the V3 is that it doesn't have image stabilization. That would be the one thing I would have liked the most since I'm an outdoors person and do a lot of running around and biking and stuff. But this camera will have to last me at least through college. I kinda feel I rushed this purchase and should have waited for the Canon S2 IS... with that 12x zoom [drools]. Oh well. Those are nice pictures, I need to learn how to take pics as good as you.

ianz28 · Jun 9, 2005

Thanks for the possitive feedback. I guess that means I'm not oversharpening.

My process for sharpening using Photoshop.

First I usually run a noise filter (lightly.....a little noise is un-noticeable after printing).

Then I run USM 2 times in Photoshop CS.

1st pass - 10, 30-40, 0 (A.D. Haney calls this a contrast adjustment)

After the first pass I usually do all the color and level adjustments, cropping and anything else that's needed.

2nd pass totally depends on the type of picture.
As a baseline I use: 75, .8, 1 and usually end up at 60, .8, 1 or 2.

Typically night photography requires more and daylight high detail images require less.

I didnt notice any panoramas in your collection - but, if you ever get into taking panorama's I have found that they need almost double the fine edge sharpening (2nd pass at anywhere from 100-150, .8 or so, 0).

I havent noticed much image degredation when reducing for the web by 50%. - so that's pretty much it for my technique.

Ian
--
http://www.ianz28.smugmug.com
Positive or Negative - Critique's are always welcome and appreciated.

Skunkabilly · Jun 9, 2005

--
How can you shoot women and children?
Easy...ya don't stop down so much. Ain't photography Hell!

Streusel · Jun 11, 2005

Thanks for the insight in your V3 workflow. I tried out all the things you mentioned. It was very helpful.

Streusel · Jun 11, 2005

Oh, I live in the south of Germany.

Evil Eggplant · Jun 11, 2005

Here it comes

Streusel said:
Streusel wrote:

What would I like improved: a larger sensor,

DSLR

Streusel said:
MORE DYNAMIC RANGE,

DSLR

Streusel said:
higher non Night Shot ISO

You got me there

Streusel said:
image stabilization

DSLR

Streusel said:
faster start up

DSLR

Streusel said:
focusing

DSLR

Streusel said:
that the raw mode was not just implemented as a useless
feature.

DSLR

It sounds like you're ready.

--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com
'How many hands have I shaked?'
-George W. Bush

wolfie · Jun 11, 2005

Havent owned one, but have handled one and loved the overall form and features of the V3, one major addition for me would be to weather-proof the design - then you would have something serious indeed. Keep the RF styling for sure.
Oh and extend the zoom to 28mm-135mm.

I thought the V3 start up & focusing were as fast as any digicam on the market, although faster is never to be sneezed at...
--
Cameras are NOT computers!
Olympus E1 with 14-45, Nikon Coolpix 5400, Fuji Finepix A201

Streusel · Jun 12, 2005

Why I do not own a digital SLR camera:
1. I'm not a high volume shooter, so dSLRs still are a bit too expensive for me

2. I would have to stay outside of many concert and event halls (What's the point of a camera that gets me banned from places?)
3. No live view in the LCD with instant exposure feedback

4. No built in auto focus assist beam (the pattern type). (Why do I need an external flash for that feature on all dSLRs?)
5. Too big for my coat pocket.

I guess I could say that for me:

Digital SLRs have the image quality but would be too much of a compromise in other areas.
Digicams lack the image quality I want, but have the advantage of being small and non intrusive and suiting my style of shooting.
Maybe in a few years from now, there will be good snapshot cameras built into mobile phones. Then I'll get one of those plus a digital SLR that only gets taken along for serious stuff.

kski · Jun 12, 2005

Woe! Those are really nice pictures! Sony keeps me very impressed!!! They really know how to make cameras!!

smok3 · Jun 13, 2005

very nice,

have some q if you dont mind:
1 do you take all portraits in A mode?

2 do you add a lil grain in photoshop? (actually is there a good filter which will mimic the film grain and will work fine with portraits?)
3 did you shoot all this to jpges or raw?

4 do you have that perfect zoom setting for portraits or..?ž

(i would like to see all this in some bigger res actually

)

tia

--

ianz28 · Jun 13, 2005

Here is a nice plug-in to play with your photo's.

http://www.optikvervelabs.com/

I need to work a few of mine through this software. It's pretty good......but, isn't exactly fast to use. You have to take some time playing with it to get the output you want.

Ian
--
http://www.ianz28.smugmug.com
Positive or Negative - Critique's are always welcome and appreciated.

Larry Lynch · Jun 13, 2005

Cpt Galant said:
Streusel said:

What would I like improved: a larger sensor, MORE DYNAMIC RANGE,
higher non Night Shot ISO, image stabilization, faster start up and
focusing, that the raw mode was not just implemented as a useless
feature.

Click to expand...

I'd like to see a better implemented optical viewfinder.
Currently, it seems as though it's just an afterthought. I'd like
one with superimposed focus points and exposure/shooting data on
the side or bottom. It also wouldn't hurt to relocate it to the
other side of the flash if possible.

I'm actually okay with the image chip size, despite the comprimises
it entails. A 4/3 sensor might be interesting, but I believe it
would increase the camera size, which is perfect at the moment. At
very least it would require lenses that stick out farther making it
closer to the 828 in form factor. Maybe Sony could develop a chip
with a 3x crop factor (in DSLR terms) that would be a good
comprimise between pixel pitch and lens size.

Faster startup would be a great help. I'm actually quite impressed
with the current focusing speed, but hey, faster is always better.

Finally, I'd like to see the buffer implimented in such a way that
the next shot can be taken before the previous image is completely
flushed. DSLRs use a system like this, but because they don't use
the LCD for framing, I'm not sure if it can really be implimented
on the V4(?).

Finally, I'd be interested in seeing a tilt-up LCD screen. This is
a hard one because the large screen (which is a great benifit)
would be hard to hinge without major design changes to the body.
If Sony could keep the classic rangefinder look and feel and make a
tilting screen for waist-level shots, I'd be happy to sacrifice a
little bit in size. Maybe a 2" to 2.25" screen?

Cpt Galant said:

What I like a lot: the form factor of the camera body, the
ergonomics, the hologram auto focus assist beam, Compact Flash
cards.

Click to expand...

I have to agree. I also feel the build quality is quite good,
other than the flash cover. I love how compact and portable it
is, which is why I bought it in the first place.

No camera is perfect, but overall I really like the V3. A few
tweaks and it just might be ready to replace one of my bulky DSLRs.

--
A camera is just a tool - no matter how much one loves it.

The 828 has a 2/3 sensor, a 4/3 sensor would raise the size of the camera to the size of an Olympus E-300 (which is as bigger than a digital rebel).

FACT: if you want the camera to stay the same size and not compromize MORE than it already has, it need to maintain the sensor size it has.

--
L.L.
Mystic, Ct.

RPease · Jun 13, 2005

Just wondering what is wrong with the V3's raw mode.

Thanks

Streusel said:
the raw mode was not just implemented as a useless
feature.

--
Ron
-V1

Sony V3 images perhaps at their limit

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