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REAL Serial Number problems....check your EXIF info!!!

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Gourdfather

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In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus. It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130 upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was "repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras, and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!! It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
 
Just my 2 cents, but I think it is more likely that they swapped some electronic innards than replacing the SN on your body....
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
 
If so, it was a really sloppy swap if they didn't match S/N in the "innards" and put in the latest firmware!! What's to say now that I didn't swap S/N plates?? Pretty reckless if that's the case.

John
Adam said:
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
I do have all the paperwork, "before" and "after" so there shouldn't be a problem, but it's pretty sloppy on their part to have the "electronic S/N" inside the camera not match the physical S/N on the body.

John
Gourdfather said:
John
Adam said:
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
John,
I agree, that doesn't make much sense to me either.

Adam
Gourdfather said:
If so, it was a really sloppy swap if they didn't match S/N in the
"innards" and put in the latest firmware!! What's to say now that
I didn't swap S/N plates?? Pretty reckless if that's the case.

John
Click to expand...
 
John,

I completely agree with you. I don't think it makes an ounce of sense. However, judging by some of the stories I've heard of the tech people there, I wouldn't be surprised if they even know that the SN shows up on the EXIF data.

Adam
Gourdfather said:
John
Adam said:
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Maybe we're seeing what they do with the "returns" that they can't sell as "new"; just piece them out on repairs. The Oly "chop shop".

Putting old "innards" in my camera to "fix" it is almost worse that swapping cameras....Arrrgggh!!!

John
Adam said:
Adam
Gourdfather said:
If so, it was a really sloppy swap if they didn't match S/N in the
"innards" and put in the latest firmware!! What's to say now that
I didn't swap S/N plates?? Pretty reckless if that's the case.

John
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
LOL sadly, or if they even know there IS exif data!!!

John
Adam said:
Adam
Gourdfather said:
John
Adam said:
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Gourdfather,

Good guess, huh? I had some suspicions regarding the way they didn't seem to want to discuss whether manual focus problems could be adjusted or even admit they existed, but had no clue that they'd do such a thing rather than replace what I assumed might just be a part manufactured to poor tolerances... Frankly, I later figured they did have an adjustment since they were apparently fixing a number of them.

I'm not sure how unethical it is to make the swap, as I think they have the right according to most warrantees(I haven't closely examined Oly's warrantee) to repair or replace defective equipment at their discretion. BUT(3 foot high letters with bright neon), it does strike me as INCREDIBLY UNDERHANDED to pull that and try to pass it off as your camera... Rather sloppily at that, as you'd think they could probably flash the serial number too... Then again, maybe they can't flash the serial number, they may be hard coded in ROM. That'd be good actually.

Perhaps, a call to the marketing department would net you a new model serial number camera with new firmware... in lieu of your spending more time writing emails to the editorial pages of the top camera mags and online reviewers detailing the intriguing repair methods employed... I really do think they have some obligation to tell you that they're replacing your camera with something that may be a refurb... on the other hand, it could be argued that your camera, "lived in" and repaired would also be a refurb, so no harm done... except to your confidence in them. These companies need to start waking up and realizing the modern consumer is not necessarily an idiot willing to accept whatever is tossed their way. Especially concerning expensive items.

Me, I say, "Better to live with the devil you know..."

I'm probably going to be known as a real "Payne-in-the-Ass" when I return mine for a firmware upgrade and to get my manual focusing problem fixed...

By the way, did it take 'em two weeks to change the serial number sticker? That's just SAD.

Let us know how you make out.
 
I'm living this same nightmare. I returned mine to fix the short focus problem and it also came back with the firmware downgraded (119 -> 116). In fact, even before I discovered that oddity, the moment I picked it up and turned it on after I got it back, I told the store clerk (who handled the return for me) that it felt like a different camera. The feel of the on/off switch was different.

After further inspection a variety of other things proved in my mind that this was indeed a different camera than the one I sent. If you look closely at the construction of the case, you'll see that it would be relatively easy to take the back/bottom plate (that has the serial number) from one camera an put it onto another.

What's interesting about this thread is that I already suspected the serial number might be included in the EXIF data. However, when I checked, I didn't see it. Given the other comments, I can only assume that it's because my software (ACDSee) doesn't know how to parse or interpret that bit of meta data. I also have PhotoShop 5.0 Lite that came with the camera, but it doesn't seem to provide the EXIF data at all. What other, readily available software can I use that will show me the serial number?

Thanks,
David
 
John,

Your concerns are well justified, I would be giving Oly some right grief over that. This is certainly something that deserves an airing because it highlights a problem with the Olympus service centre, I would get the email address of the CEO and post him directly.

I think Kick Butt is appropriate.

Rgds Nick>
 
David, Try this it's great and free. Rich

http://www.takenet.or.jp/~ryuuji/minisoft/exifread/english/
David Turner said:
I'm living this same nightmare. I returned mine to fix the short
focus problem and it also came back with the firmware downgraded
(119 -> 116). In fact, even before I discovered that oddity, the
moment I picked it up and turned it on after I got it back, I told
the store clerk (who handled the return for me) that it felt like a
different camera. The feel of the on/off switch was different.

After further inspection a variety of other things proved in my
mind that this was indeed a different camera than the one I sent.
If you look closely at the construction of the case, you'll see
that it would be relatively easy to take the back/bottom plate
(that has the serial number) from one camera an put it onto another.

What's interesting about this thread is that I already suspected
the serial number might be included in the EXIF data. However, when
I checked, I didn't see it. Given the other comments, I can only
assume that it's because my software (ACDSee) doesn't know how to
parse or interpret that bit of meta data. I also have PhotoShop 5.0
Lite that came with the camera, but it doesn't seem to provide the
EXIF data at all. What other, readily available software can I use
that will show me the serial number?

Thanks,
David
Click to expand...
 
Swapping reconditioned hardware is a standard operating technique in electronics when repair volume would otherwise call for abnormally long return times.

My only concern is that the firmware wasn't updated to that you bought... not that the camera was different. The reason why I view the degraded firmware version as a serious breach of trust is that people wait to buy later models in hopes that the initial kinks have been ironed out... AND the fact that there WERE version upgrades means that there were, in fact, kinks that had to be ironed out.

My other concern is that a camera is NOT like other electronic devices like video games. You KNOW how your original camera was treated. There is no way to know how the replacement camera was treated. It might have been DOA and brand new... or, it might have been used by someone that lived in a highly salty atmosphere that might end up prematurely reducing the life of the camera.

If it were me, I'd be talking to my state consumer affairs office... or that of the repair facility... to see how they view this situation. Not being a lawyer, I don't know if swapping serial numbers is an act of fraud; but, from a layman's point of view it sure smells.

I'd have felt a WHOLE lot better had they simply told you they had to send you another camera becuase the original could not be fixed, etc. This way was pretty shabby.
Gourdfather said:
In another thread Nick Lukey said:
My point was that certain people seem to be paranoid over serial
numbers and firmware updates, and as I said in my post, it is
getting rather boring.

Rgds Nick
Click to expand...
Gerald kidded in another post about Oly being handy with an Exacto
blade in switching serial numbers, but what if they DID??? What if
you sent in your camera for warranty repair and they substituted an
OLDER model, with OLDER firmware??? AND put the newer S/N back on
the older camera???

Oly rec'd my camera on June 15th for repair to the manual focus.
It was S/N 1053xxx, firmware 42-0120. They repaired it ("general
check, clean and adjust") on the 19th and shipped it back.

The manual focus works fine now and after hearing about the 130
upgrade, I again checked my firmware; it was now 42-0116!!! (I
may have said 42-0119 in an earlier post) So not only did I not
get the upgrade, they put OLD firmware back in my camera, or so I
thought.

Someone posted that you could find your camera serial number in the
EXIF info (5ive lines down from "White Balance"). I checked the
first pic I took after buying the camera in April:

Software 42-0120

S/N 1053xxx

Then I checked the EXIF on pictures I took AFTER the camera was
"repaired":

Software 42-0116

S/N 1011xxx

It was a diffrent camera!!! (that explains why it had the caps on
it that I had left off!!) Now I'm not paranoid about having the
latest and greatest, but I DO want at least what I bought. I now
have an OLD 101 when I BOUGHT a 105!!!

If the EXIF info is correct, then Oly apparently swapped cameras,
and put the newer S/N plate on the OLD one. THIS disturbs me!!!
It would have been bad enough for them to swap and TELL me, but to
swap bodies and SWITCH serial numbers.......

I'm not sure who to call/write just yet, but I will follow up.

Just check your S/N on the EXIF info.

John
Click to expand...
 
Gourdfather

I dont think that Oly would intentionally swap SN tags as it doesnt really make sense. They have the right to swap your parts or complete camera anyway.

I see 2 possible reasons.

1) Electronic was swapped and nobody took care of synching the SN's if that is possible at all.

2) By accident your and somebody elses cameras insides have been swapped and put back together with the wrong outside pieces.

I would definately contact Oly to clear it up for warranty and legal reasons. What if they where swapped and the other guys camera gets stolen. Your images may now be stamped with a stolen serial number. Nothing to get paranoid about but i would make sure to get something in writing from Oly.

Mike
 
Gerald,

Thanks for the info (and Rich too). I just downloaded it and compared "before" and "after" images. I don't think the answer will surprise anyone. They sent me an different, older camera.

BTW, "Software" gives you the firmware info, which I was already able to see in ACDSee.

Before: Software : 42-0119
After: Software : 42-0116

The serial number is listed as "Unknown (101A)2,32"

Before: Unknown (101A)2,32 : 1029547
After: Unknown (101A)2,32 : 1011181

The number listed as "Before" matches the serial number label on the bottom of my camera.

Although I was fairly certain they had switched cameras, thanks to everyone here, I now have the "smoking gun".

I'll let you know what happens.

David
Gerald M. Payne said:
It has been mentioned that you can open jpegs in word processors,
but I think Dave Weikel has a link to a better solution on his site:

http://davidweikel.com/E10_samples/exif_reader/reader1.shtml

It's a 400K free download of a thumbnail Exif viewer.

The info you want appears in the fourth item labeled: Software...
Click to expand...
 
Mike,

That they have the right to swap parts is entirely correct. That they didn't tell me the extent of changes is not. The notes that came back from Oly simply said they made the focus adjustment and cleaned the camera. Leaving out the fact that they completely replaced the rest of the camera (except for the plate that has the serial number on it) is a serious crime of omission.

As for you suggestion that this was done by accident. I simply can't accept that. That the identical problem happend to a number of different people, and in at least two of the cases our firmware had "reverted" back to 116, indicates this is a systemic problem in the Oly service organization.

Gourdfather and I both had 1011xxx cameras returned to us after our repairs. This is no acident.

David
Mike Salzlechner said:
Gourdfather

I dont think that Oly would intentionally swap SN tags as it doesnt
really make sense. They have the right to swap your parts or
complete camera anyway.

I see 2 possible reasons.

1) Electronic was swapped and nobody took care of synching the SN's
if that is possible at all.

2) By accident your and somebody elses cameras insides have been
swapped and put back together with the wrong outside pieces.

I would definately contact Oly to clear it up for warranty and
legal reasons. What if they where swapped and the other guys camera
gets stolen. Your images may now be stamped with a stolen serial
number. Nothing to get paranoid about but i would make sure to get
something in writing from Oly.

Mike
Click to expand...
 
Amazing, absolutely amazing!!! I now wonder how many of these "chopped" E-10's there are out there now........

John
David Turner said:
Thanks for the info (and Rich too). I just downloaded it and
compared "before" and "after" images. I don't think the answer will
surprise anyone. They sent me an different, older camera.

BTW, "Software" gives you the firmware info, which I was already
able to see in ACDSee.

Before: Software : 42-0119
After: Software : 42-0116

The serial number is listed as "Unknown (101A)2,32"

Before: Unknown (101A)2,32 : 1029547
After: Unknown (101A)2,32 : 1011181

The number listed as "Before" matches the serial number label on
the bottom of my camera.

Although I was fairly certain they had switched cameras, thanks to
everyone here, I now have the "smoking gun".

I'll let you know what happens.

David
Gerald M. Payne said:
It has been mentioned that you can open jpegs in word processors,
but I think Dave Weikel has a link to a better solution on his site:

http://davidweikel.com/E10_samples/exif_reader/reader1.shtml

It's a 400K free download of a thumbnail Exif viewer.

The info you want appears in the fourth item labeled: Software...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
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