PC users switching to Mac for Security

Well, I must day that I am biased. I do love my Mac. We started our p/t wedding photographer & videography on a PC and switched to Mac about 3 years back now (3 words: Final Cut Pro) and have never looked back. I honestly do not know of trouble free maintenance on a PC. I help friends & family with their PCs as much as I can. The latest was some sort of pop-up on IE that a friend had. Long story short, it had infected her registry and the only way to delete it was through the registry. Instructions had been posted on-line for how to do this (indicating it was at least a known & somewhat common threat) but she didn't feel comfortable doing it and since it was a company machine (she worked from home) she just the company IT guy come take care of it. My point is always the same: maybe you can set up a PC to be as secure (and I certainly don't know how) but why on earth do you want to live that way. I want my computer to work for me, no the other way around.

Good Luck,
Mike

http://www.securityfocus.com/news/11256?ref=rss

Paul Samoluk said:

I happen to agree with Sean on this one....i use a Mac @ home but
PC's exclusivelly at work and school, my IBM ThinkPad has been
virus free ever since i got it...The users and their lack of
computer knowledge is to blame for allowing security to become such
a problem. On the side note, if the CEO of Intel did say to switch
to macs he should be fired by the board right away. How can he say
something like that when probably 90% of the chips they make are
used in PC's....Intel is currently in fearse competition with AMD
and to make such dumb statemtents is borderline criminal!!!

cheers,

--
'Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses
simply have their
bright ideas closer together. '

Click to expand...

--
Jon
http://cybermice.smugmug.com

Limited in what way Bob? Photoshop alon e could keep keep one busy for the rest of ones life.

Limited? Have you even taken a look at Spotlight, Automator, smart folders and the like? No, not limited by a looooooong shot! The same could be said for flexability. The new inovations in Tiger makes the Mac MUCH more flexable than a PC running say XP.

Take alook here and then realize that you can use Aotmomator for EXTERNAL PS actions.

Photoshop Online Resource Guide:

http://porg.4t.com/Nav.html

One more of over 80 entry pages:

http://porg.4t.com/Recent.html

Ken

BobHaverford said:

My objection to MAC's: Limited software, more expensive, less
flexible, and from what I can tell slower dollar for dollar. I do
love MAC's G5 case design - its truly elegant.

Click to expand...

Paul Samoluk said:

In my own experience, the Windows box can be just as safe as any
other platform. 99% of the time, users are to blame for security
problems and not the technology. Why most home users of Windows are
logged in as administrators is beyond me, that is where lot of
these problems start! I think it is wrong to think that Mac or
Linux will protect you any better than Windows box will.

Click to expand...

Most users are logged in as admin because Windows boxes are used for games, and a lot of games require admin to exert the most power from the computer. Or other programs don't work really well either without admin - at work I have to have an admin account for two or three programs I use every day.

But really I have trouble saying that Windows would be a fine OS if it weren't for those damn users. If more than 50% of the people that are buying Windows cannot use it safley, then frankly it is not fit for use or sale should be regulated to people that can proove they can handle the "power" of Windows. The rest of us suffer every day from spam or overladen networks being used to DDOS sites all because so many people can't seem to handle the burden Windows places upon them.

So by all means blame the user, and let's get the ball rolling on PC User certification requirements with jail time for people illegally running Windows without a licence.

--
---> Kendall
http://www.pbase.com/kgelner
http://www.pbase.com/sigmasd9/user_home
http://www.kigiphoto.com/Gallery

William Carson said:

Mike, above I asked a question that no one answered. I figgered it
was just a boring question. But from what you are saying the answer
to my question is that there IS no way to set up a person who is
not willing to do high maintance on their computer (PC) to keep it
virus free.

Click to expand...

It's not just maintenance. Unless the user is aware enough not to click on and open popups, dodgy email attachments, etc, then that Windows PC will quickly become reinfected, it's inevitable.

[snip]

William Carson said:

Truely amazing that folks are defending pc s over macs. If i'm
wrong correct me and tell me HOW to set the system up. For
instance, what is the best (if any) virus protection application
that is low or no maintaince.

Click to expand...

The problem is that antivirus software is, by nature, curative, rather than preventive. Most good av proggies will do heuristic analysis but there's no getting away from the fact that, until a particular virus/worm/trojan is identified the av vendors can't provide a fix.

The only sure prevention there is is to boot using a system disk and at the DOS prompt, type format c:

IOW, get a Mac. A lot easier than trying to make sys admins out of people who regard their computers an extension of their TV and phone/fax.

Kendall Helmstetter Gelner said:

Most users are logged in as admin because Windows boxes are used
for games, and a lot of games require admin to exert the most power
from the computer. Or other programs don't work really well either
without admin - at work I have to have an admin account for two or
three programs I use every day.

Click to expand...

Yes. And the last time I looked, Yahoo messenger wouldn't work unless one was logged as admin. Useless. And I bet there are loads others.

[snip]

Kendall Helmstetter Gelner said:

So by all means blame the user, and let's get the ball rolling on
PC User certification requirements with jail time for people
illegally running Windows without a licence.

Click to expand...

Nah, just get the antitrust case goin' again.

Much thanks for reply. Reason I got into this is a $30 garage sale pc for a friend so I'm just going to recommend to him that he talks to a pc power user and follow all rules and have an Virus program that updates everytime he turns the thing on. Over the years, I've seen nothing but folks with terminally infected pcs and crashes requiring the machine to be taken to a repair shop. I lucked out when I started out by buying a little square mac classic. Never a virus. Only one crash I couldn't fix. (Applications such as photoshop7 required more ram than the classic could deal with so I upgraded) I'm not dissing pcs but I'm just perplexed as to never yet successfully delt with virus thing and pcs.
Will

"IOW, get a Mac. A lot easier than trying to make sys admins out of people who regard their computers an extension of their TV and phone/fax."

The evils of PC maintance is greatly exaggerated big huge time by the Mac cult. Maintenance is automatic. Virus software auto update and auto scan and it can be set to do this daily. Firewall is one time setup and perhaps a click of the unblock button when a new program is installed. Spyware is installed most the time with the users permission. Just most people are too stupid to read. You simply don't install stuff unless you research it. It is no different then Mac users researching a program first to see if it fits their needs. Most spyware removal programs are free, brainless to setup and run automatically which makes them hands free.

I use my PC I don't do maintenance. It is all done automatic while I sleep even defragment of the hard drive. All I did is 2.5 years ago when I built my computer I spent 15 minutes setting up the maintenance software which is all free and about it. All I do on my is use it. I click on the happy game icon to play game, I click on happy PhotoShop icon to edit photos and develop web graphics, I click on the happy Dreamweaver icon to make websites, I click on the happy winamp icon to listen to music, I click on the happy Firefox icon to surf the net, I click on the happy Skytools icon to see what cool stuff I can see in the night sky, I click on the happy outlook icon to check my email and other PIM tools. I simply use my computer not maintenance it.

Maintenance of a PC is greatly exagerated by the Mac cult in a vain effert to justify their over the top purchase. Fact is PC maintenance is automatic. It is very easy to have a trouble free PC.

2 years ago I built myself an AMD 2500 with 1 gig of ram, 160 gig hard drive ATI 9600 graphics card dvd player and CD burner (later upgraded to DVD burner) all for $900. Can you get that kind of value with a Mac? A huge no!!!

--
Shawn Grant

I think my mom, who again I labeled as your average PC user (read: she isn't going to custom build her box), would disagree with everything you just said.

Mike

Go Vols said:

The evils of PC maintance is greatly exaggerated big huge time by
the Mac cult

Click to expand...

[snip]

You haven't been paying attention:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1004&message=13665884

Shawn:

Apple's June quarter strong as consumers switch to Mac for security

“The most recent study comes research and investment firm PiperJaffray, which earlier this week spoke with 20 of Apple's specialist resellers regarding business in the June quarter and trends with various products. On average, Apple specialists said that over 16% of customers who buy a Mac from their stores are PC switchers. In Apple's own retail stores, this figure is closer to 50%.”
Full article here:

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1098

(My take)

Contrary to popular belief, 80% of all PC users experience spyware. The typical PC / Mac users are not knowledgeable about precautions other than perhaps to use virus blockers (which are swiftly outdated). THe fact remains that PC style spyware/malware/viruses do not affect macs. That being said Apple closes security holes on a regular basis. The fact remains however that in the 4+ years of OS X not a single Mac virus has been successful. Even the CEO of Intel is recommending switching to Mac to get away from viruses.
Avoid risks, buy a Mac (Intel CEO Paul Otellini)

http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=11698

and here:

http://www.securityfocus.com/news/11256?ref=rss

Mad as hell, switching to Mac

Article here:

http://news.yahoo.com/ ... ... mc/20050526/tc_mc/madashellswitchingtomac

“Over 80% of PC users have been infected by spyware, and, dozens of spyware applications are typically found on their computers. Even the fastest Pentium-based workstations can slow to a crawl under this abuse. If you want to get a small picture of the damage Windows users face, read attorney Eric J. Sinrod's article in USA Today on the subject. No wonder Congress is struggling over bills to protect us against the malware scourge.”
Full article here

http://www.macnightowl.com/index.htm#overconfident

More and more, long time PC users are getting fed up with the Security risks of Wintel machines. 2 quite interesting articles up today:
Mad as hell, switching to Mac
By Winn Schwartau, Network World, 05/23/05

http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2005/052305schwartau.html

Intel CEO Otellini: If you want security now, buy a Macintosh instead of a Wintel PC -

MDN on Main article

http://macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/5861/

Main article here:
By Jason Fry of the WSJ

http://online.wsj.com/ ... ...a0sjw8dJXY_20060524,00.html?mod=tff_main_tff_top

Mac Security: Don't Get Overconfident!
http://macnightowl.com/news/2005/05/week4#overconfident

10 minutes of education and all users can keep their PC virus and spyware free without sacrificing productivity period. Mac isn't the answer simple education is you sith spawn

--
Shawn Grant

And she would be wrong to do so. Fact it is simple to keep a computer virus and spyware free period.
--
Shawn Grant

Apple's June quarter strong as consumers switch to Mac for security

“The most recent study comes research and investment firm PiperJaffray, which earlier this week spoke with 20 of Apple's specialist resellers regarding business in the June quarter and trends with various products. On average, Apple specialists said that over 16% of customers who buy a Mac from their stores are PC switchers. In Apple's own retail stores, this figure is closer to 50%.”
Full article here:

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1098

(My take)

Contrary to popular belief, 80% of all PC users experience spyware. The typical PC / Mac users are not knowledgeable about precautions other than perhaps to use virus blockers (which are swiftly outdated). THe fact remains that PC style spyware/malware/viruses do not affect macs. That being said Apple closes security holes on a regular basis. The fact remains however that in the 4+ years of OS X not a single Mac virus has been successful. Even the CEO of Intel is recommending switching to Mac to get away from viruses.
Avoid risks, buy a Mac (Intel CEO Paul Otellini)

http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=11698

and here:

http://www.securityfocus.com/news/11256?ref=rss

..after SP2, "Windows remains too difficult for the average person to administer, and therefore profoundly unsafe on the internet."

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/09/17/xphome_sp2/

Mad as hell, switching to Mac

Article here:

http://news.yahoo.com/ ... ... mc/20050526/tc_mc/madashellswitchingtomac

“Over 80% of PC users have been infected by spyware, and, dozens of spyware applications are typically found on their computers. Even the fastest Pentium-based workstations can slow to a crawl under this abuse. If you want to get a small picture of the damage Windows users face, read attorney Eric J. Sinrod's article in USA Today on the subject. No wonder Congress is struggling over bills to protect us against the malware scourge.”
Full article here

http://www.macnightowl.com/index.htm#overconfident

More and more, long time PC users are getting fed up with the Security risks of Wintel machines. 2 quite interesting articles up today:
Mad as hell, switching to Mac
By Winn Schwartau, Network World, 05/23/05

http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2005/052305schwartau.html

Intel CEO Otellini: If you want security now, buy a Macintosh instead of a Wintel PC -

MDN on Main article

http://macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/5861/

Main article here:
By Jason Fry of the WSJ

http://online.wsj.com/ ... ...a0sjw8dJXY_20060524,00.html?mod=tff_main_tff_top

Like a give a sh*t about a bunch of Mac bias articles stating that some note the word some PC users are switching to Mac because they have the brains of a knat and can't learn the simple easy steps to keep their PC clean.
--
Shawn Grant

You're right Shawn. All my stupid PC friends whose computers break on a regular basis should listen to you. It's not the gaping security holes in Windows that's at fault. It's those millions of stupid PC users who don't know how to plug the holes. Dummies, one and all. I wish they'd get a clue & listen to you so I wouldn't have to try to fix their busted Windows. Geez, what a bummer to have to put up with so many stupid PC-using friends.

By that logic, I guess, all my Mac OS X friends are brilliant 'cause NONE of them EVER go down due to security holes. Never thought of that before: 80% of PC users are stupid but no OS X users are stupid.

Hey, I just thought of a kool idea! Next time one of my PC friends needs help can I give him your phone number so you can tell him how to solve all his Windows problems forever with only 15 minutes of trivial effort?

Go Vols said:

The evils of PC maintance is greatly exaggerated big huge time by the Mac cult.

Click to expand...

[snip]

Go Vols said:

Just most people are too stupid to read.

Click to expand...

Taking a couple of examples and generalizing to an entire universe of possibilities. A couple extremists said this, therefore all lefties think that.

However, I absolutely agree that a threshold needs to be reached to see clear effects in populations (though a lucky molecule or two can theoretically kick off a tumor). OS X's requirement that people enter their passwords when installing software is a good deterrent, but it's hardly an ironclad defense. A lot of PC spyware is actually corporate-sponsored and comes as a result of phishing schemes or piggybacking onto more-or-less legitimate software installations. If you're a spyware company looking to infect users, you're going to spend your resources going after what is by far the largest share. If you go the piggyback route, you're also going to need some minor commercial software to piggyback onto, which is far more likely to exist in the Windows universe.

OS X does have a couple inherent security advantages over Windows, but you'll start to see viruses and spyware at some point if they increase in popularity. Apple engineers aren't so terribly much smarter than Microsoft ones that they can create, on a sixteenth of the R&D budget, an OS that is completely invulnerable while MS remains clueless.

BobHaverford said:

Always assuming a linear rather than sigmoid relationship between
cause and effect.

The numeber of Macs would have to reach a certain threshold before
michief makers felt it was worth their while to act. So your
argument is flawed from the beginning.

FYI, the effects of radiation, smoking, exposure to any carcinogen
is always a sigmoid relationship. IOW, you have to reach a
threshold before effects become evident.

The Left ALWAYS disingenuously assumes a linear relationship. Just
another example of their intractable dishonesty.

Click to expand...

Care to counter with some PC biased articles Shawn? I for one would love to see them! Post your links below.

Ken

Go Vols said:

Like a give a sh*t about a bunch of Mac bias articles stating that
some note the word some PC users are switching to Mac because they
have the brains of a knat and can't learn the simple easy steps to
keep their PC clean.
--
Shawn Grant

Click to expand...

To prove what? Anything I post you will disagree. But anyway here is a link that list a few simple step to keep a computer virus free you dumb f*ck sith spawn http://blink-prod.ucsd.edu/Blink/External/Topics/How_To/0,1260,2469,00.html
--
Shawn Grant

Nice try Shawn but on a Mac you don't have to do any of that. If you can't stand disagreement Shawn then perhaps you should not trol here on the Mac forum. You also need to wash your mouth out, you know, get rid of the viruses.

Ken

Go Vols said:

To prove what? Anything I post you will disagree. But anyway here
is a link that list a few simple step to keep a computer virus free
you dumb f*ck sith spawn
http://blink-prod.ucsd.edu/Blink/External/Topics/How_To/0,1260,2469,00.html
--
Shawn Grant

Click to expand...