Photoshop

Um...

does that mean you were able to make prints from film, without a darkroom? I needed a darkroom, even when i shot chrome film. guess i wasn't any good then either.

Michael D Robinson wrote:
If your photos are so bad that you need photoshop all the
time, I would REALLY question your abilities, because we know that
there are many that came before you using slide film for commercial
purposes who did'nt photosh_T! and were better photogs than you !!!
 
Good points. I just installed CS today. Wow. It's a shame this guy will never know the pleasure of using the huighlights/shadow tool instead of laboring with layer masks.

Whats a layer mask?
Bill_Turner wrote:
If you spent a little time, or a lot of time in your case, learning
the techniques that are available to you in Photoshop rather than
making idiotic posts on the DPReview Fora perhaps you'd understand
the power of this software.
Photoshop is the industry standard. Not because it was developed
by monkeys on LSD but because it is well though out and becomes
very intuitive with continued use. As one begins to understand the
tools, and yes, the learning curve is very, very steep, Photoshop
becomes irreplaceable as a tool for photography; not only digital,
but for all photography.
There are many editors out there in cyberspace that you can try.
If you'd really like a challenge, which seems to be unlikely, try
GIMP. GIMP has many of the features of Photoshop, is free but has
the worst UI (User Interface) that I've ever seen.
I'd suggest that, after reading your posts, you stick with your
Rebel 2000, Kodak Royal Gold 200 and have your local drug store
process your prints.

--
Regards,
(afka Wile E. Coyote)
Bill
PSAA
Equipment in profile.
http://www.wmdturner.com
If you can visualize it, then create it in the camera, finish it
off with the print that matches your mind's eye then you are, most
likely, a master...
--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com

'I'm not such a bad guy
once you get to know me'
-Agent Smith
 
Michael D Robinson wrote:
Yea, I know you guys are right ! Thats why many experts in the
field of technology state that the MAJOR problem holding back the
wide adoption of computers and softwear is user unfriendlyness of
everything digital.
You're joking, right? Computers used to be in cool glass rooms with raised floors, maintained by people in white coats. Your computer is now an appliance. Juat like your toaster.

Lets move on, OK...

I don't give a rats if you can do it or
you daughter or grandpa ! If photoshop is all you can come up with
since man walked on the moon in 1969 !
How can you critisize something you openly admit you don't understand? I'll stop with that, although there is more to be said.

The joke is on you, The big
problem is that most reasonable men or women don't want to deal
with it. If your photos are so bad that you need photoshop all the
time, I would REALLY question your abilities, because we know that
there are many that came before you using slide film for commercial
purposes who did'nt photosh_T! and were better photogs than you !!!
I burned and dodged in a wet darkroom. Got headaches looking througfh a grain magnifier.

Welcome to the 21st century, pops.
....Design a photo edit platform that you don't need 2 lifetimes to master.
Perhaps this would be more suitable....

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00002S9P7
--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com

'I'm not such a bad guy
once you get to know me'
-Agent Smith
 
True, all of it. Except they understand what their goal is, they appreciate PS and what it can do, and they are learning.

This guy doesn't want to learn, he wants to whine.
Who designed this thing, a blind monkey on LSD, and they have the
nerve to charge almost 800 U.S. for it ! I vote it as the "worlds
most user unfriendly softwear" Elements 3 is better because it
promts you to certain functions. Want to become the next Bill
Gates ? Design a photo edit platform that you don't need 2
lifetimes to master.
--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com

'I'm not such a bad guy
once you get to know me'
-Agent Smith
 
Would you blame the car because you don't know how to drive a stick?

Photoshop is the industry standard for good reason. It takes time
to learn how to unleash the power of this amazing application.

Sorry, photoshop is not an appliance. It is a powerful application
that requires time spent learning how to use it.

If instant gratification is what you desire there are gads of
programs with "auto-fix" options. Photoshop is not for you, that's
for sure.

I can't believe you would come out here on the pro forum and whine
about photoshop because you're unwilling to invest some time
learning how to use it.

Most pros have spent years learning what they know, and continue
working on perfecting their craft. They have little patience for
appliance operators who insist on instant gratification.
i can't believe i'm saying this...but i agree with you...god forbid you actually have to read a book....stick to wasting film...
 
This guy doesn't want to learn, he wants to whine.
Who designed this thing, a blind monkey on LSD, and they have the
nerve to charge almost 800 U.S. for it ! I vote it as the "worlds
most user unfriendly softwear" Elements 3 is better because it
promts you to certain functions. Want to become the next Bill
Gates ? Design a photo edit platform that you don't need 2
lifetimes to master.
--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com

'I'm not such a bad guy
once you get to know me'
-Agent Smith
I geuss thats why people pay people like us to do their graphics and photos I,m glad there are people like you as its keeps are job security pretty high, sorry about about your head.
--
Good Luck, Enjoy
 
Is that his assetion that Photoshop is user unfriendly is incorrect on the face of it. I teach photography and for my students Photoshop is not only easy to grasp, it is absolutely fun for them to use. This does not mean that it is not a challlenge to them also, but they enjoy the depth of the program.

Robinson is obviously just seeking attention by making these silly comments and we are being sucked into responding to his inane statements. I remember one of my psychology professors once talking about how children who cannot get attention by doing good will get attention any way they can. I think this is exactly what Robinson is doing. Not having anything positive, constructive, or even funny to say, he just snorts out drivel for us to respond to.

Don
 
Yes, Dunces here are so smart...How come it never states that I don't know how to use it ! LOL I'v played with it for years, but still have the honesty and guts to admit its a failed experiment, hard to use and needs a complete makeover..come on you genius you, design a better product if you are so wise !
Michael D Robinson wrote:
Yea, I know you guys are right ! Thats why many experts in the
field of technology state that the MAJOR problem holding back the
wide adoption of computers and softwear is user unfriendlyness of
everything digital.
You're joking, right? Computers used to be in cool glass rooms with
raised floors, maintained by people in white coats. Your computer
is now an appliance. Juat like your toaster.

Lets move on, OK...

I don't give a rats if you can do it or
you daughter or grandpa ! If photoshop is all you can come up with
since man walked on the moon in 1969 !
How can you critisize something you openly admit you don't
understand? I'll stop with that, although there is more to be said.

The joke is on you, The big
problem is that most reasonable men or women don't want to deal
with it. If your photos are so bad that you need photoshop all the
time, I would REALLY question your abilities, because we know that
there are many that came before you using slide film for commercial
purposes who did'nt photosh_T! and were better photogs than you !!!
I burned and dodged in a wet darkroom. Got headaches looking
througfh a grain magnifier.

Welcome to the 21st century, pops.
....Design a photo edit platform that you don't need 2 lifetimes to master.
Perhaps this would be more suitable....

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00002S9P7
--
rich
http://www.photoallure.com

'I'm not such a bad guy
once you get to know me'
-Agent Smith
 
a stright print in his life of any merit ! Thats why he is the great photosh_t techer...All you need is an eye prof, ingrained talent and a little thing called exposure ! A real victim of psychological and technological FALACY !
Is that his assetion that Photoshop is user unfriendly is incorrect
on the face of it. I teach photography and for my students
Photoshop is not only easy to grasp, it is absolutely fun for them
to use. This does not mean that it is not a challlenge to them
also, but they enjoy the depth of the program.

Robinson is obviously just seeking attention by making these silly
comments and we are being sucked into responding to his inane
statements. I remember one of my psychology professors once
talking about how children who cannot get attention by doing good
will get attention any way they can. I think this is exactly what
Robinson is doing. Not having anything positive, constructive, or
even funny to say, he just snorts out drivel for us to respond to.

Don
 
If your photos are so bad that you need photoshop all the
time, I would REALLY question your abilities, because we know that
there are many that came before you using slide film for commercial
purposes who did'nt photosh_T! and were better photogs than you !!!
Your right. They had retouchers do it by hand. Now those same artist use, well, Photoshop.

And those of us who shot chrome bracketed, pushed/pulled film, cross processed, etc. And what we could not do in camera, the ad agency had a retoucher touch up the image to make it better.

PS has just made it possible for the photographer to take control over his images rather than a retoucher or lab. Sorry to tell you but it's been going on for years.

You have no idea what this craft is all about. Even Ansel Adams manipulated his images. They weren't perfect right out of the camera and the first print in the darkroom.

Mike

--
'Change the way you look at things, and the things you look at change.'
 
they would want a new superior product to change all their twiddly little inane exposures and third grade photo scrawlings into a real photography, because they themselves sure cannot do it ! LOL
Is that his assetion that Photoshop is user unfriendly is incorrect
on the face of it. I teach photography and for my students
Photoshop is not only easy to grasp, it is absolutely fun for them
to use. This does not mean that it is not a challlenge to them
also, but they enjoy the depth of the program.

Robinson is obviously just seeking attention by making these silly
comments and we are being sucked into responding to his inane
statements. I remember one of my psychology professors once
talking about how children who cannot get attention by doing good
will get attention any way they can. I think this is exactly what
Robinson is doing. Not having anything positive, constructive, or
even funny to say, he just snorts out drivel for us to respond to.

Don
 
You might be surprised to know that some of the very best photographers in the world use Photoshop.

Mike

--
'Change the way you look at things, and the things you look at change.'
 
a stright print in his life of any merit ! Thats why he is the
great photosh_t techer...All you need is an eye prof, ingrained
talent and a little thing called exposure ! A real victim of
psychological and technological FALACY !
Some find PS relaxing..... you need something stronger! Gimp and
you might have something in common after all. It is easy and sure
fits your style in name.

And, best of all, it is free.

Gimp: A software program akin to Photoshop

Or...... well, you decide which fits your personality.

gimp [n.]
1. lameness, limping, gimpiness, gameness, claudication
 
Michael,

I have read all of the posts in this ridiculous thread, and its easy to see that you are a troll whose sole purpose is to rile people up. Most of your other posts reflect the same.

You can't possibly be serious. There is not one photographer at a professional level who doesn't see the value of Photoshop.

It may not be for you, but don't insult the intelligence of those who know better.

You say that you have used it in the past, but it evidently is too much for you to handle. I would suggest that you delete it from your computer immediately, and continue without it. You will have one less thing in life to whine about.
 
Yea, I know you guys are right ! Thats why many experts in the
field of technology state that the MAJOR problem holding back the
wide adoption of computers and softwear
That's SOFTWARE. W-A-R-E

If you're going to start another moronic rant about something, at least learn how to spell it so you don't look like a total imbecile...
 
It's not McSoftware for tourists who want easy things handed to them in the drive-through window.

It's a serious professional tool, and among the most remarkable pieces of software ever written IMHO.
 
I hereby commit you to the Threader's Hospital for the Socially Inept.

I've read exactly 2 threads in this forum & you sir are an arrogant, set in his ways, old man that is willingly ignorant to useful technology.

GROW UP, you're already in your 60s, ACT LIKE IT! Sheesh.
Who designed this thing, a blind monkey on LSD, and they have the
nerve to charge almost 800 U.S. for it ! I vote it as the "worlds
most user unfriendly softwear" Elements 3 is better because it
promts you to certain functions. Want to become the next Bill
Gates ? Design a photo edit platform that you don't need 2
lifetimes to master.
 
I love PS but there is some truth in Mchaels comments and I suspect deep down most agree but would not admit it. I doubt if there's anyone out there who fully understands PS.
Carl
 
Always. Take a formula 1 race car..if you don't know the specifics about how to race it, you will crash and die. Heck...ever notice that a manual transmission car is slightly harder to drive than an automatic, but it's always faster given the same other specs. Power=complexity.

There is always a constant trade off between power and convenience. The thing is: people who use photoshop want to be able to control every aspect of the image. Given the unbelievable power that Photoshop contains, it is incredibly easy to use. You do have to learn what you're doing, though, like anything. The Curves tool alone takes weeks to really, really get used to tweaking everything, but I made a determined effort because I've seen what it can do. Now, I can go into Curves, because of the easy to understand interface, make the tweaks I need to in usually less than a minute and drastically improve / correct the contrast, color balance and such.

One thing to realize is that nearly every photograph relies on some sort of processing. In film, it's the darkroom. I shoot straight digital, which, due to the anti-aliasing filter on the camera, requires a bit of sharpening in nearly every image. Also, tweaking the contrast and color can let you create your vision of the image. Now, definitely, the better the original photo (proper exposure, tack sharp, etc) the better it will be to work with in Photoshop. It's not a cure all, but it can make great photos truly stunning.

I've been using Photoshop since v4, about 8 years total, and I'm still learning things on a regular basis. I'd actually only say I know about 75% of the tools well, and probably less than half of what can really be done with them, and I know a LOT. There's just that much power. Even so, when I first started, I was able to use the levels tool and basic layers very easily. As I grew more experienced, I started to unlock the more powerful features of the program...I'm still learning. Lots of times I will find easier and better ways to do things I was really a slave to, but I learn and get that much better. But I can do things now that I never would have been able to do 3 years ago. In another 5 years, I'll be that much better.

Personally, the dumbed-down interface on something like Elements is exceedingly frustrating. I don't want the stuff completely automated, since every image is different, and I know a lot better than the program what I want the final image to look like. Sure, there are some things that could be a little better, but that's every program. I'm also not saying that you can't have easy to use things that do powerful things...just that if you want the control over the details, it means more complexity, more options, and more ways to do things.

Photoshop also has many different levels of the complexity. Curves can do everything that Levels can do...but levels is easier to understand. It also doesn't do the rest of what curves can do. Curves can effectively replace levels, hue/saturation, color balance, and contrast/brightness. However, you really need to know what you're doing in some respects on that. If you just want to increase contrast without delving into curves, you can just use the easier contrast adjustment. Usually the results won't be as good, but you can use it.

Also, there are about 15 different methods to sharpen an image, and they all have strengths and weaknesses. You can use the simple "sharpen" or "sharpen more" if you want, or you can take more control and use Unsharp Mask. You can also use the sharpen tool, layers with unsharp mask to create selective sharpening, high pass sharpening, luminance channel sharpening, etc, etc, all with slightly different results. You don't HAVE to know those things to sharpen an image, but they're there if you need them to get the effect you can't get with just the 'sharpen' command. Power = complexity.

--
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http://www.jordansteele.com
 

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