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S3, the final judgemet !

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Cyrus kamak

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Hi guys,

What I have experienced during last four months looking for a new Digital camera is not to basse my judgemet on reviews and the openion of so many so called proffessional. It has demonstrated to me how biassed we all can be and for the most part we don't even want to admit to it.

What I did was bought a D70, kept it for 10 days, return it with a 10% penalty. I wanted to give 20D a try. Bought that, kept it for two weeks, returned it with a penalty; I was was convinced that considering everythig and the sharpness of D70 over 20D, D70 was a better buy. Whwn i saw my dealer had the S3 in stock, I took a few pictures with it, came home and went through the pixcels. The next day i was at the dealer with my D70 all packed up and ready to trade, he gave me full value on it. I can't explain it well but I started respecting this camera like I had not the other two.

I have numerous shots taken with 20D and S3, from the same subjects and same camera settings. There is absolutely no way anyone CANNOT see the difference in Dr and resolution between the two. At this point I would not even pay a $1000.00 for 20D and I do not need it's speed advantage over S3. If you need proof, let me know I post some comparrison shots for you but for now check this out. This pic was taken a couple of days ago fully automatic mode and absolutely no manipulation, straight from the camera. it was late in the evening and it was getting dark. 20D could never capture the details in the shadow and specially in the tree barks.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2989048

Whaat i think you guys do is to go to your local dealer with your CF card and take some pictures with the cameras you're interested in, go home and compare them ad decide.

Good luck.
 
Cyrus kamak said:
Hi guys,
What I have experienced during last four months looking for a new
Digital camera is not to basse my judgemet on reviews and the
openion of so many so called proffessional. It has demonstrated to
me how biassed we all can be and for the most part we don't even
want to admit to it.
What I did was bought a D70, kept it for 10 days, return it with a
10% penalty. I wanted to give 20D a try. Bought that, kept it for
two weeks, returned it with a penalty; I was was convinced that
considering everythig and the sharpness of D70 over 20D, D70 was a
better buy. Whwn i saw my dealer had the S3 in stock, I took a few
pictures with it, came home and went through the pixcels. The next
day i was at the dealer with my D70 all packed up and ready to
trade, he gave me full value on it. I can't explain it well but I
started respecting this camera like I had not the other two.
I have numerous shots taken with 20D and S3, from the same subjects
and same camera settings. There is absolutely no way anyone CANNOT
see the difference in Dr and resolution between the two. At this
point I would not even pay a $1000.00 for 20D and I do not need
it's speed advantage over S3. If you need proof, let me know I post
some comparrison shots for you but for now check this out. This pic
was taken a couple of days ago fully automatic mode and absolutely
no manipulation, straight from the camera. it was late in the
evening and it was getting dark. 20D could never capture the
details in the shadow and specially in the tree barks.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2989048

Whaat i think you guys do is to go to your local dealer with your
CF card and take some pictures with the cameras you're interested
in, go home and compare them ad decide.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
Cyrus,

I appreciated your post. I loved my S1, and based on how well it has served I ordered an S3.It arrived the week before Christmas and I have not been able to do much beyond a few inside photos. Last night I took some photos during a large meeting and I was pleasantly surprised with the results. Hopefully I shall give it a real workout next week. Several of the shots were taken at 1600 ISO and there was no noise.
 
Thanks for your imput and the photo. I would definently be interested in any comparison shots you have between the 20d and the S3, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Thanks
Cyrus kamak said:
Hi guys,
What I have experienced during last four months looking for a new
Digital camera is not to basse my judgemet on reviews and the
openion of so many so called proffessional. It has demonstrated to
me how biassed we all can be and for the most part we don't even
want to admit to it.
What I did was bought a D70, kept it for 10 days, return it with a
10% penalty. I wanted to give 20D a try. Bought that, kept it for
two weeks, returned it with a penalty; I was was convinced that
considering everythig and the sharpness of D70 over 20D, D70 was a
better buy. Whwn i saw my dealer had the S3 in stock, I took a few
pictures with it, came home and went through the pixcels. The next
day i was at the dealer with my D70 all packed up and ready to
trade, he gave me full value on it. I can't explain it well but I
started respecting this camera like I had not the other two.
I have numerous shots taken with 20D and S3, from the same subjects
and same camera settings. There is absolutely no way anyone CANNOT
see the difference in Dr and resolution between the two. At this
point I would not even pay a $1000.00 for 20D and I do not need
it's speed advantage over S3. If you need proof, let me know I post
some comparrison shots for you but for now check this out. This pic
was taken a couple of days ago fully automatic mode and absolutely
no manipulation, straight from the camera. it was late in the
evening and it was getting dark. 20D could never capture the
details in the shadow and specially in the tree barks.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2989048

Whaat i think you guys do is to go to your local dealer with your
CF card and take some pictures with the cameras you're interested
in, go home and compare them ad decide.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
 
The D70 seemed like a nice camera when I tried it out, but the colors were a bit funky. I have not used the 20D, but my 10D had the worst DR of any camera I have ever used. It seemed like it had maybe 4 or 5 on a good day. Really the worst and I sold it.

Just out of curiosity what is the DR of the S3 ???

Anybody have a guess ??

It looks like it might be around 8-10 ++ stops.

Very nice and a big improvement over the S2.
Cyrus kamak said:
Hi guys,
What I have experienced during last four months looking for a new
Digital camera is not to basse my judgemet on reviews and the
openion of so many so called proffessional. It has demonstrated to
me how biassed we all can be and for the most part we don't even
want to admit to it.
What I did was bought a D70, kept it for 10 days, return it with a
10% penalty. I wanted to give 20D a try. Bought that, kept it for
two weeks, returned it with a penalty; I was was convinced that
considering everythig and the sharpness of D70 over 20D, D70 was a
better buy. Whwn i saw my dealer had the S3 in stock, I took a few
pictures with it, came home and went through the pixcels. The next
day i was at the dealer with my D70 all packed up and ready to
trade, he gave me full value on it. I can't explain it well but I
started respecting this camera like I had not the other two.
I have numerous shots taken with 20D and S3, from the same subjects
and same camera settings. There is absolutely no way anyone CANNOT
see the difference in Dr and resolution between the two. At this
point I would not even pay a $1000.00 for 20D and I do not need
it's speed advantage over S3. If you need proof, let me know I post
some comparrison shots for you but for now check this out. This pic
was taken a couple of days ago fully automatic mode and absolutely
no manipulation, straight from the camera. it was late in the
evening and it was getting dark. 20D could never capture the
details in the shadow and specially in the tree barks.

http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=2989048

Whaat i think you guys do is to go to your local dealer with your
CF card and take some pictures with the cameras you're interested
in, go home and compare them ad decide.

Good luck.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.troyammons.com
http://www.pbase.com/tammons
http://www.troyammons.deviantart.com
 
I owned an S1 and really liked it.

I now own an S2 and love it.

I went into Glazer's this week and played with an S3. What a great feel. Way superior to a D70....no comparison. I realize that we make a putrchase decision based on image and features but the feel is great.
 
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!

You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D has some info on it which should be on the photo used for comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens as the other pic.

Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO 800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)

If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer. Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
 
oopps, the link!
http://www.photo.net/photodb/folder?folder_id=459908
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
 
Cyrus,
Thanks for sharing your experiences and the pictures.

I appreciate that the pictures were not made in the same circumstances, but the differences are too obvious to be associated only to other circumstances.
A question, why did you not make or post the 12 mp image versions of the S3?
Thanks again,
Jos
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.jos-echelpoels.smugmug.com
http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=269430
 
Thanks Cyrus,

These are interesting. It's nice to see a mixed lighting interior photo from the S3. I appreciate you taking the time to do this.

I took the liberty of checking out your gallery. Nice stuff. I really like the cityscapes. Have fun with the new camera.

Ben
Cyrus kamak said:
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Yes Jos. The difference, isn't it quite clear? I really don't care who gets my money, Fuji, Canon, Nikon or whoever as long as I get the right camera for me and my needs. I was going crazy over what to get and the more I was reading the more confused I got.

Why did I not use 12 MP S3? because I wated to be fair to 20D. I did not have a raw image from 20D(software problem, not canon fault, long story).

S3's 12Mp pictures taken at original colors and natural tones are awsom and i have plenty, I will post more. Any particular environment or lighting condition you're looking for?
Igoforit said:
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.jos-echelpoels.smugmug.com
http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=269430
Click to expand...
 
Thanks Ben. S3 hasn't been to downtown Boston yet! those pics were taken a few years ago with my old Jufi 4900. This new years Eve in Boston it's going to be with me. The funny thig is that when I was fooling around with D70 and 20D I wasn't even thinking about S2 or S3 at all, maybe mainly because of the battery problem. A guy at the local store who works in their lab suggested that I should try it. I have been happy with the batteries as well. on Chrismas day I took about 180 photos, and many of them with fill flash, no problem. i was kinda apprehensive though. towards the end, every pic I took I checked the batteries, no problem and i think I still had juice available.

!

Good luck.
Cyrus
Ben North said:
I took the liberty of checking out your gallery. Nice stuff. I
really like the cityscapes. Have fun with the new camera.

Ben
Cyrus kamak said:
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
Cyrus,

I must have been unclear in my statement. Yes the differences are clear and can not be explained only by the difference in circumstances. This is probably a better and simpler way of putting it.

The main thing bothering me a bit at this moment with the S3 are a kind of jaggies at the border where dark meets highlight, visible also in vertical lines. I wonder if these are still visible with in-camera sharpening off or in RAW. I don't mind for most of my pictures, but it would be good to know that if you want to get even better, that it will be possible.

Thanks!
Jos
Cyrus kamak said:
Igoforit said:
Cyrus kamak said:
Please read before download
Ok guys,

The pictures are uploaded. There are many more where these came from!
You have to help me out here. The only reason I,m doing this is
because you've asked me to. I have no other objectives other than
being able to present a guide. You may want to critique my
photography, I can certainly learn from alot of you guys but please
don't question my motives. There are alot of room for discussion
here. The pictures might not taken at exactly the same angles and
settings but you be the judge and give and take. All the
comparrison, side by side picture re at 100 percent. You have the
full res pictures there too and youmay want to do the comparrison
yourselves too. The information on the "bonus picture" taken by 20D
has some info on it which should be on the photo used for
comparriso. But the "bonus" pic was also taken with the same lens
as the other pic.
Although I presently own S3 but have only one pic of the location
used for comparrison, I will take more but I have plenty of pics
taken with S20. I tried to use a picture by S20 which was taken
closer to the focal length as the pic with S3 (the two full res
pics on the top of folder). I also included a picture by 20D taken
at 17mm. It's a nice picture by 20d and the overal colors are VERY
close to the original colors. I used Kelvin adjustment for this pic
I think around 4800 or so. it's a mixed lighting environment and
when I took the pic with 20D it was bright and sunny out and when
taken with S3, it was overcast and as much natural light. I think I
took the picture using daylight WB inadvertantly. As a result 20D
image has a much better overal color fedality for these rooms. The
part of the comparrison photo taken by S3 the is dominated by
natural light however has colors that are closer to the actual
colors than the other pictures. Both these pics were taken at ISO
800 (I have pics by s3 of the the sae rooms at low light at night
using Auto WB and they look SUPERB.)
If I have missed anythig please ask me and I'll try to answer.
Please forgive the appearace of the room, the dust on the floor and
the furniture as there is a construction going on in the house.
Thank you and good luck.
Click to expand...
--
http://www.jos-echelpoels.smugmug.com
http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=269430
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
--
http://www.jos-echelpoels.smugmug.com
http://www.photo.net/photodb/user?user_id=269430
 
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