Formatting SD Cards

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for something else this morning, I came across that section and it states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

No, and I have never formatted a card.

There was a thread going a couple weeks ago , Split about 50/50 over whether to or not.

--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

I have always formatted (with the camera) rather than delete after all images have been downloaded thru a card reader into my PC. Have done this with Oly's & now with FZ20 - never a problem.

genece said:

No, and I have never formatted a card.
There was a thread going a couple weeks ago , Split about 50/50
over whether to or not.

--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

Click to expand...

See this thread. Lots of information (and opinions)

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1033&message=10565584

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Hi Maureen,

I think you may have made a mistake with this information you have posted.

Some people may be misled by it which is why I am offering some opposing viewpoints.

First, Panasonic say DO format your card (page 105 FZ10 manual)

"If the card has been formatted by a pc or other equipment, format the card on the camera again".

That means when you buy a new card it needs to be formatted on the camera because it was formatted in other equipment.

Also related and I think very important information can be seen at this link.

http://www.nyip.com/tips/flashcards0604.php

Pixy.

Pixy said:

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Hi Maureen,

I think you may have made a mistake with this information you have
posted.

Some people may be misled by it which is why I am offering some
opposing viewpoints.

First, Panasonic say DO format your card (page 105 FZ10 manual)

"If the card has been formatted by a pc or other equipment, format
the card on the camera again".

That means when you buy a new card it needs to be formatted on the
camera because it was formatted in other equipment.

Also related and I think very important information can be seen at
this link.

http://www.nyip.com/tips/flashcards0604.php

Pixy.

Click to expand...

I don't interpret it that way at all. If they meant that, they would instruct the user to format all new cards, and they say just the opposite. As I posted earlier, they start out by saying you don't need to do that in most cases. Then they go on to site the cases where it would be needed - which is IF the card has been formatted by a pc or other equipment or IF there is an error message.

Maureen

Hi there Maureen,

As I understand it, formatting does not actually delete the files on the card, but rather it deletes the card's file directory. although this doesn't make much sense to me - where do the files go (?), that's apparently the case.

I've also never had to format a new card in a camera, but I do know that Minolta recommends formatting IN-CAMERA whenever the files have been transferred to the computer. They claim that you should never format a card in the computer as it could damage it. Actually I've heard this before with other makes, and recall that it was recommended by Panasonic as well in the FZ10.
Barry

Mareda said:

Pixy said:

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Hi Maureen,

I think you may have made a mistake with this information you have
posted.

Some people may be misled by it which is why I am offering some
opposing viewpoints.

First, Panasonic say DO format your card (page 105 FZ10 manual)

"If the card has been formatted by a pc or other equipment, format
the card on the camera again".

That means when you buy a new card it needs to be formatted on the
camera because it was formatted in other equipment.

Also related and I think very important information can be seen at
this link.

http://www.nyip.com/tips/flashcards0604.php

Pixy.

Click to expand...

I don't interpret it that way at all. If they meant that, they
would instruct the user to format all new cards, and they say just
the opposite. As I posted earlier, they start out by saying you
don't need to do that in most cases. Then they go on to site the
cases where it would be needed - which is IF the card has been
formatted by a pc or other equipment or IF there is an error
message.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Barry Kernerman said:

Actually I've heard this before with other makes, and recall that it was recommended by Panasonic as well in the FZ10.

Click to expand...

Hi Barry,

So how do you interpret this from the FZ10 manual?

Usually, it is not necessary to format the card (initializing). Format the card when the message [MEMORY CARD ERROR] appears.

If the card has been formatted by a PC or other equipment, format the card on the camera again.

Maureen

Maureen. Trying to trip me up there huh? Well, as you know I don't have the FZ10 anymore, but I seem to remember that it was in there somewhere. Look at your Minolta User Manual - maybe that's where I saw it, I just can't remember where.

I'm looking at the D7D Manual that I've downloaded and it says the following and contradicting what I wrote earlier (nerve of those guys!):

"When a memory card is formatted, all data on the card is erased. ..... Always format the memory card using the camera; never use a computer to format a card."

So even though it does not mention formatting everytime you download a card's contents, I'm positive I've read it in one user manual or another cameras format their cards after each. I think most people that have owned or own any of the Minolta D7/A1/2 do make it a practise to format after downloding files.
Barry

Mareda said:

Barry Kernerman said:

Actually I've heard this before with other makes, and recall that it was recommended by Panasonic as well in the FZ10.

Click to expand...

Hi Barry,

So how do you interpret this from the FZ10 manual?

Usually, it is not necessary to format the card (initializing). Format the card when the message [MEMORY CARD ERROR] appears.

If the card has been formatted by a PC or other equipment, format the card on the camera again.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Mareda said:

I don't interpret it that way at all. If they meant that, they
would instruct the user to format all new cards, and they say just
the opposite. As I posted earlier, they start out by saying you
don't need to do that in most cases. Then they go on to site the
cases where it would be needed - which is IF the card has been
formatted by a pc or other equipment or IF there is an error
message.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Maureen,

Here is the point,

In the link that I posted earlier in this thread is said that many of the problems that folk experience with their flash cards are created by not knowing how to treat or handle them.

Bad information is a dangerous thing.

It cost nothing to format the card in the camera,

It does not hurt the card to format it in the camera,

It helps the card if you format it in the camera,

it takes 2 seconds to format the card in the camera,

So why not format the card in the camera?

and why recommend to others that they need not do it when experts suggest that we do?

Beginners need good information.

As far as the FZ10 manual giving contradictory information ,

Is it possible that the FZ10 manual has lost something in the translation
from Japanese?

Bottom line,

Format your new card as soon as you insert it in your camera.

Only ever format your card in the camera in which it will be used

NEVER delete pics other than by the camera

Follow the rules for safe handling of your cards with particular regard to static.

Pixy.

Barry Kernerman said:

Maureen. Trying to trip me up there huh? Well, as you know I
don't have the FZ10 anymore, but I seem to remember that it was in
there somewhere. Look at your Minolta User Manual - maybe that's
where I saw it, I just can't remember where.
I'm looking at the D7D Manual that I've downloaded and it says the
following and contradicting what I wrote earlier (nerve of those
guys!):
"When a memory card is formatted, all data on the card is erased.
..... Always format the memory card using the camera; never use a
computer to format a card."
So even though it does not mention formatting everytime you
download a card's contents, I'm positive I've read it in one user
manual or another cameras format their cards after each. I think
most people that have owned or own any of the Minolta D7/A1/2 do
make it a practise to format after downloding files.
Barry

Click to expand...

Barry, trust me. It's not in the FZ10 manual. Whether or not it's in my Minolta manual isn't the issue. The issue is, it's not stated in the FZ10 manual. Also not at issue is the fact that you should always format the memory card using the camera and not the computer. I already know that and that wasn't the question. Where you've read it is here, because that's been posted more than once and people believed it was actually in the manual.

File it away as an urban legend....lol.

Maureen

I have not formatted a card in 6 yrs and am not going to start now.

I read on the Simpletech site and Lexar site that they format the cards, after mfg.... with a program.
I just do not understand, I think this might be a Myth.
--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

I thought it was in the FZ10 manual. In any case I've have seen it in one or more of the manuals from the dozen or so cameras I've owned in the past.

In any case, over on the Minolta forum, and I'll bet on some of the others as well, I believe most of those people format their cards on a regular basis - just as I've always done - without damaging the cards in any way. In any case, there will always be arguments about whether to format or not. It's sort of like discussing noise. Everyone talks about it and has an opinion. My opinion is to format regularly and not to delete instead.
Barry

Mareda said:

Barry Kernerman said:

Maureen. Trying to trip me up there huh? Well, as you know I
don't have the FZ10 anymore, but I seem to remember that it was in
there somewhere. Look at your Minolta User Manual - maybe that's
where I saw it, I just can't remember where.
I'm looking at the D7D Manual that I've downloaded and it says the
following and contradicting what I wrote earlier (nerve of those
guys!):
"When a memory card is formatted, all data on the card is erased.
..... Always format the memory card using the camera; never use a
computer to format a card."
So even though it does not mention formatting everytime you
download a card's contents, I'm positive I've read it in one user
manual or another cameras format their cards after each. I think
most people that have owned or own any of the Minolta D7/A1/2 do
make it a practise to format after downloding files.
Barry

Click to expand...

Barry, trust me. It's not in the FZ10 manual. Whether or not it's
in my Minolta manual isn't the issue. The issue is, it's not
stated in the FZ10 manual. Also not at issue is the fact that you
should always format the memory card using the camera and not the
computer. I already know that and that wasn't the question.
Where you've read it is here, because that's been posted more than
once and people believed it was actually in the manual.

File it away as an urban legend....lol.

Maureen

Click to expand...

genece said:

I have not formatted a card in 6 yrs and am not going to start now.
I read on the Simpletech site and Lexar site that they format the
cards, after mfg.... with a program.
I just do not understand, I think this might be a Myth.
--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

Click to expand...

Hi Gene,

I am somewhat surprised by your comment that you are "not going to start now"

How do you reconcile that statement with your bottom line slogan?

"Just trying to learn and it is slow going"

All cards when bought have been formatted with a generic procedure.

That is the point and the reason why a new card should be formatted in the actual camera in which it will be used.

To eliminate any chance for incompatibility between the two.

and in fact to optimize the functionality between the two.

If formatting will offer any benefit and potentialy remove any chance for trouble, why not do it?

Pixy.

genece said:

I have not formatted a card in 6 yrs and am not going to start now.
I read on the Simpletech site and Lexar site that they format the
cards, after mfg.... with a program.
I just do not understand, I think this might be a Myth.
--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

Click to expand...

LOL - I'm with you, Gene. I haven't reformatted and have had no problems, and will stick with what the manual suggests. I'll reformat if I get the error message.

Maureen

Mareda said:

LOL - I'm with you, Gene. I haven't reformatted and have had no
problems, and will stick with what the manual suggests. I'll
reformat if I get the error message.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Hi all,

It reminds me an old joke. A man was born with the bolt on the stomach and was curious what this bolt there for. One day he unscrew the bolt and his a$$ dropped off.
So, if you have no problems, why look for them?

I have 5 cards from different manufacturers and don't format them. Also, never formatted then for the 1st time before use. So far no problems.
Regards,
George

I can't take this anymore. Formatting is NOT some "special-to-the-camera" procedure. It doesn't "marry" the card to the camera, or any other device. There are no optimizations, it's just a file system. If it were special, it wouldn't work in other devices such as card readers plugged into a USB port.

Formats come in many different types (FAT12, FAT16, FAT32, NTFS, etc). Most cameras use FAT16 and so, max out at 2GB.

As long as the device (camera, computer, Portable Storage Device or Toaster Oven) uses the same format TYPE as your camera, you're fine. The main reason they say do it in the camera is that they KNOW it will use the right format type. A computer (or un-aware user) might use NTFS (for example) and the camera obviously won't recognize that. The same holds true for the less-than-likely FAT16 with 64K clusters. That gives a maximum of 4GB, but I'd bet there isn't a camera out there that would recognise that one either.

One "good" reason to format the card is that using a Quick format is typically quicker than deleting all the individual files (even if you select them all and say "delete").

If you don't have a problem, you don't have to (re-)format.

Pixy said:

genece said:

I have not formatted a card in 6 yrs and am not going to start now.
I read on the Simpletech site and Lexar site that they format the
cards, after mfg.... with a program.
I just do not understand, I think this might be a Myth.
--
Kodak DC-4800
Panasonic FZ-10 and FZ 20
T Con 17 -- Raynox 2020 pro -- Tcon 14 --DCR 720



Just trying to learn and it's slow going!
Gene

Click to expand...

Hi Gene,

I am somewhat surprised by your comment that you are "not going to
start now"

How do you reconcile that statement with your bottom line slogan?

"Just trying to learn and it is slow going"

All cards when bought have been formatted with a generic procedure.

That is the point and the reason why a new card should be formatted
in the actual camera in which it will be used.

To eliminate any chance for incompatibility between the two.

and in fact to optimize the functionality between the two.

If formatting will offer any benefit and potentialy remove any
chance for trouble, why not do it?

Pixy.

Click to expand...

I don't really care what the manual says or what other people say.

Normal practice for many years in dealing with computer filesystems is that you should always format
a new drive volume once before using it, to preclude any possible problems.

Formatting the SD card takes all of 5 seconds and can't hurt anything if you're formatting a new card. It certainly can't hurt to do it once before you start storing your data onto it.

Godfrey

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Just to clear the air here, I actually agree with everything you just wrote.

I was just making the point that if the card is already formatted and works fine, you don't HAVE to, and there's nothing magical in doing it inside the camera. I know some specific cards had problems, but it's not rampant.

As with most things, we all tend to "do what works", so if you like formatting often (or never), in the camera (or out), every Tuedsay (or whatever), by all means do it.

And good luck to you.

Godfrey said:

Normal practice for many years in dealing with computer filesystems
is that you should always format
a new drive volume once before using it, to preclude any possible
problems.

Formatting the SD card takes all of 5 seconds and can't hurt
anything if you're formatting a new card. It certainly can't hurt
to do it once before you start storing your data onto it.

Godfrey

Mareda said:

Am I dreaming, or have we seen it posted here many times that the
manual for the FZ10 states we must format the SD Card before using
it? (which I've never done...lol) In looking at the manual for
something else this morning, I came across that section and it
states that formatting is usually not necessary initially, and that
cards should be formatted if and when you get an error message
stating Memory Card Error.

I'm posting this because others may be confused and also think you
have to format the card before using it.

Maureen

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Format any time you have problems.

Test new cards first, to make sure they work. If you have problems then format. New cards being shipped may be randomly subjected to electromagnetic forces that can corrupt the file directory. This is a rare occurance and most of the time it is not necessary, but if you want to play it safe then format. (user choice)

Formatting does not erase images, neither does manual deletion. It only writes over the directory (index) that keeps track of where files or file fragments are located. To completely erase, you need to write over the old file with something else.

If you do experience problems, reformatting is a good first step to see if it fixes the problems. If you find that when deleting via computer software after downloading, you have frequent problems, there may be something about the computer or reader that corrupts the directory. Format. (again, not usually necessary, but no harm done if you do it).

If everything works, there is no need to format. Formatting however causes no harm. The end user can choose, there is no absolute right or wrong.

To say that you never need to format is ignorance.
To say that you must format is paranoia
Between the two is balance.

--
David - One camera, one lens
http://www.pbase.com/brdavid/
http://brdavid.smugmug.com/
http://homepage.mac.com/brdavid