On my new 828... if I set the camera to teh S mode, and set the value with the selection wheel to 30 the image starts getting dark. When I get down to 100 it's very dark, and eventually it just goes black. According to the manual when I adjust this number I'm adjusting the shutter speed, correct? So what should adjusting the shutter speed have to do with the brightness of my pictures? I want to be able to take pictures while holding the camera without having them blurry. At the 30 setting it does ok, but I'd like to be able to take faster pictures so they don't blur if someone's moving (for example). Is there another setting that I have to change when setting this value above 30 to brighten the image? Thanks guys.
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Alright I'm an idiot... (828 question)
- Thread starter i64X
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mdebrieder
Senior Member
Your problem is probably in darker areas right?
You just didn't realise yet that the camera has to do something to get a fast shutter speed
it has to open up the lens more, that means a smaller f-number. If it's at 2.0 already, it can't go lower, so the pics get darker instead.
I hope this helped, feel free and not stupid to ask more!!!!
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
You just didn't realise yet that the camera has to do something to get a fast shutter speed
it has to open up the lens more, that means a smaller f-number. If it's at 2.0 already, it can't go lower, so the pics get darker instead. I hope this helped, feel free and not stupid to ask more!!!!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
The shutter speed is how long the shutter stays open, and directly impacts the amount of light getting to the senosr. A shutter speed of 1/30 is half the speed of 1/60. That means that 1/30 lets in TWICE the amount of light as 1/60. This is why things get dark when you choose faster shutter speeds.
You need to compensate for it by either opeining up the aperture (lower "f" number), or choosing a higher ISO value.
I would strongly recommned reading this tutorial:
http://www.setzler.net/documents/exposure111.pdf
You need to compensate for it by either opeining up the aperture (lower "f" number), or choosing a higher ISO value.
I would strongly recommned reading this tutorial:
http://www.setzler.net/documents/exposure111.pdf
Sparky_ca
Senior Member
think of it this way
30 seconds is the slowest shutter speed good for dark conditions of course at this speed you will need a tripod or you will get horrible camera shake
Actually all the way till about 1/80 of a second its good to use a tripod
When you start using a faster shutter speed you will need lighter and brighter conditions 1/100 to 1/250 of a second is good for normal pictures in normal lighting with minimal movement
When getting to the highest shutter speeds awesome for stopping high speed action 1/1000 or 1/2000 of a second you will need a very bright day or lots of light
the slower the number the more light thats let it for a longer time the faster the speed the less light is let in
of course this is just for shutter speeds you can change the F stops to adjust how much light comes in too but for now play with the shutter speeds
Sparky_ca
I have a photographic memory, but I always seem to have the lens cap on.
30 seconds is the slowest shutter speed good for dark conditions of course at this speed you will need a tripod or you will get horrible camera shake
Actually all the way till about 1/80 of a second its good to use a tripod
When you start using a faster shutter speed you will need lighter and brighter conditions 1/100 to 1/250 of a second is good for normal pictures in normal lighting with minimal movement
When getting to the highest shutter speeds awesome for stopping high speed action 1/1000 or 1/2000 of a second you will need a very bright day or lots of light
the slower the number the more light thats let it for a longer time the faster the speed the less light is let in
of course this is just for shutter speeds you can change the F stops to adjust how much light comes in too but for now play with the shutter speeds
--
Sparky_ca
I have a photographic memory, but I always seem to have the lens cap on.
mdebrieder
Senior Member
it was probably too dark so it was already wide open
Nice reading though! It will help the OP! No-one should think of himself as an idiot!
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
Nice reading though! It will help the OP! No-one should think of himself as an idiot!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
Thanks for all the help guys. I'll read that tutorial. I'm heavy into digital art (half-way through a degree right now for graphics design) and I've been looking more and more at the photography on here and on Deviantart.com and am amazed by what you can do with these digital cameras. I had a Sony DSC-P52 before (which will probably be going on eBay now that I got this one) and it worked well for point and shoot because it was rather easy to carry, but I've been messing with this 828 taking macro shots and stuff and it's amazing.
I was heavily weighted between this and the Canon Digital Rebel... I know a lot of people think I'm crazy for not going with the Rebel, but the Sony was more comfortable to me coming from two previous Sony cameras, and having a crazy amount of zoom or wide angle lens isn't that important to me. More important was not having to constantly have to pay to get the camera cleaned, and using the LCD as a viewfinder, which the Rebel can't do. I ordered some lenses for the 828 on eBay (a UV filter, polarizer, star lens, etc.) today, all of which were decently priced (ended up spending $50 plus shipping for 4 lenses) so hopefully those'll be fun to play with. I'm really wanting a soft lens and a fish-eye lens too, although I haven't found a fish-eye one yet (don't know if I can get it in a screw-on like the others or not).
Anyway, I'll read that article and see what sense I can make of it. I'm TOTALLY new to all of this stuff, so it might take a couple weeks for me totally understand the terminology and stuff behind it. I've been reading a lot on photography theory and techniques lately and have started to develop a taste for good pictures. It's crazy now - I'm constantly looking for stuff that'd make a good photo op everywhere I go. On my drive to work this morning I saw 10 or 12 things that I really want to go back and take pictures of on an early Saturday morning when there's not a lot of people out.
I was heavily weighted between this and the Canon Digital Rebel... I know a lot of people think I'm crazy for not going with the Rebel, but the Sony was more comfortable to me coming from two previous Sony cameras, and having a crazy amount of zoom or wide angle lens isn't that important to me. More important was not having to constantly have to pay to get the camera cleaned, and using the LCD as a viewfinder, which the Rebel can't do. I ordered some lenses for the 828 on eBay (a UV filter, polarizer, star lens, etc.) today, all of which were decently priced (ended up spending $50 plus shipping for 4 lenses) so hopefully those'll be fun to play with. I'm really wanting a soft lens and a fish-eye lens too, although I haven't found a fish-eye one yet (don't know if I can get it in a screw-on like the others or not).
Anyway, I'll read that article and see what sense I can make of it. I'm TOTALLY new to all of this stuff, so it might take a couple weeks for me totally understand the terminology and stuff behind it. I've been reading a lot on photography theory and techniques lately and have started to develop a taste for good pictures. It's crazy now - I'm constantly looking for stuff that'd make a good photo op everywhere I go.
On my drive to work this morning I saw 10 or 12 things that I really want to go back and take pictures of on an early Saturday morning when there's not a lot of people out. Mel Lammers
Senior Member
but you should be aware that even $50 for a true lens won't get you anything you want to keep. You may make it with your filters and polarizer but even that is cutting it close.
A decent lens of any stripe (talking lens here, not filters) will cost upwards from $100. In the case of the 828, there are really only 2 kinds, Wide angle and Telephoto.
CAUTION: One of the reasons that Sony doesn't advertise any add on lenses for the 828 is they are concerned that the manual zoom rack that moves the lens element may be damaged if you hang any weight on it. They would like to make the money on the lenses but not at the expense of lots of returns from extension lens damage to the main camera.
If you put anything on the camera other than the very light filters, provide lots of hand support for the extension lens. If you are at all careless, you can have a very expensive repair.
Welcome to the 828 owners enclave (unofficial group of 828 owners), I just made that up. LOL
Mel--Digital Fan--
http://mslammers.smugmug.com/gallery/204084/1
'Thought allied fearlessly to purpose becomes creative
force.' (James Allen)
A decent lens of any stripe (talking lens here, not filters) will cost upwards from $100. In the case of the 828, there are really only 2 kinds, Wide angle and Telephoto.
CAUTION: One of the reasons that Sony doesn't advertise any add on lenses for the 828 is they are concerned that the manual zoom rack that moves the lens element may be damaged if you hang any weight on it. They would like to make the money on the lenses but not at the expense of lots of returns from extension lens damage to the main camera.
If you put anything on the camera other than the very light filters, provide lots of hand support for the extension lens. If you are at all careless, you can have a very expensive repair.
Welcome to the 828 owners enclave (unofficial group of 828 owners), I just made that up. LOL
--Thanks for all the help guys. I'll read that tutorial. I'm heavy
into digital art (half-way through a degree right now for graphics
design) and I've been looking more and more at the photography on
here and on Deviantart.com and am amazed by what you can do with
these digital cameras. I had a Sony DSC-P52 before (which will
probably be going on eBay now that I got this one) and it worked
well for point and shoot because it was rather easy to carry, but
I've been messing with this 828 taking macro shots and stuff and
it's amazing.
I was heavily weighted between this and the Canon Digital Rebel...
I know a lot of people think I'm crazy for not going with the
Rebel, but the Sony was more comfortable to me coming from two
previous Sony cameras, and having a crazy amount of zoom or wide
angle lens isn't that important to me. More important was not
having to constantly have to pay to get the camera cleaned, and
using the LCD as a viewfinder, which the Rebel can't do. I ordered
some lenses for the 828 on eBay (a UV filter, polarizer, star lens,
etc.) today, all of which were decently priced (ended up spending
$50 plus shipping for 4 lenses) so hopefully those'll be fun to
play with. I'm really wanting a soft lens and a fish-eye lens too,
although I haven't found a fish-eye one yet (don't know if I can
get it in a screw-on like the others or not).
Anyway, I'll read that article and see what sense I can make of it.
I'm TOTALLY new to all of this stuff, so it might take a couple
weeks for me totally understand the terminology and stuff behind
it. I've been reading a lot on photography theory and techniques
lately and have started to develop a taste for good pictures. It's
crazy now - I'm constantly looking for stuff that'd make a good
photo op everywhere I go.
10 or 12 things that I really want to go back and take pictures of
on an early Saturday morning when there's not a lot of people out.
Mel--Digital Fan--
http://mslammers.smugmug.com/gallery/204084/1
'Thought allied fearlessly to purpose becomes creative
force.' (James Allen)
mdebrieder
Senior Member
See, I can appreciate a guy having a F828 and I confess I wouldn't want a 300D either, but you are defenitely not wanting it for the wrong reasons here!
Cleaning, it's a fact, but relax, you can do it yourself, easy as can be, and it doesn't have to be done often!
LCD?! Now hold the phone! A view through the lens with an optical viewfinder is, as of yet, much better than a LCD!
My EOS 5, just arrived today, has eye controlled focus, try that on your LCD
sorry, just had to get that off my chest! I love my little V1 package, but it sure ain't no DSLR, and I didn't realise that until I got one in my hands!
Ahhh I hope you have lots of fun with the F828, I'm just jealous I don't have one
Cheers Mate, and post some of your results!
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
and I confess I wouldn't want a 300D either, but you are defenitely not wanting it for the wrong reasons here!Cleaning, it's a fact, but relax, you can do it yourself, easy as can be, and it doesn't have to be done often!
LCD?! Now hold the phone! A view through the lens with an optical viewfinder is, as of yet, much better than a LCD!
My EOS 5, just arrived today, has eye controlled focus, try that on your LCD
sorry, just had to get that off my chest! I love my little V1 package, but it sure ain't no DSLR, and I didn't realise that until I got one in my hands!
Ahhh I hope you have lots of fun with the F828, I'm just jealous I don't have one
Cheers Mate, and post some of your results!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
brokenz
Veteran Member
You are not an idiot. That was actually a pretty good question. An idiot wouldn't have asked and just never have known the reason why.
Your comment about the LCD, that is the only reason I would never have a DSLR as my primary camera. I still can't fathom why people would want to look thru that tiny viewfinder on a DSLR and never be able to compose with the LCD. Yes I know, fine focus. Frankly I would never keep a camera that wouldn't auto focus reliably.
I've gotten a few shots that would have been either inconvenient or impossible (without spraying and praying) because of the tilt LCD. My back has also been bothering me recently but I've still been able to do some low angle work because of the swivel feature. I wouldn't have been able to do this with a DSLR.
--
Trust that little voice in your head that says, 'Wouldn't it be interesting if....' And then do it. -Duane Michals
Your comment about the LCD, that is the only reason I would never have a DSLR as my primary camera. I still can't fathom why people would want to look thru that tiny viewfinder on a DSLR and never be able to compose with the LCD. Yes I know, fine focus. Frankly I would never keep a camera that wouldn't auto focus reliably.
I've gotten a few shots that would have been either inconvenient or impossible (without spraying and praying) because of the tilt LCD. My back has also been bothering me recently but I've still been able to do some low angle work because of the swivel feature. I wouldn't have been able to do this with a DSLR.
--
Trust that little voice in your head that says, 'Wouldn't it be interesting if....' And then do it. -Duane Michals
mdebrieder
Senior Member
hello brokenz,
I believe the swivel body is a great feature for many people, but I've seen the difference between optical and LCD.... LCD is cool, especially with live histogram, but after I got used to the optical.... It is better for me...
To each his own, someday I WILL own a F-series camera, they are COOL!
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
I believe the swivel body is a great feature for many people, but I've seen the difference between optical and LCD.... LCD is cool, especially with live histogram, but after I got used to the optical.... It is better for me...
To each his own, someday I WILL own a F-series camera, they are COOL!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
brokenz
Veteran Member
I've had quite a few SLR's over the years (still do). I don't own a DSLR. Yet! Actually I'm more of view camera fanatic. Sort of makes sense that I'd love the tilt feature. Don't get me wrong, I know that alot of people would trade the best LCD in the world for a good optical viewfinder. Just one look at what the marketplace is proof of that. I'll admit that I'm probably the exception to that rule though. I still must have a DSLR so I can use some of the lenses I already own and some others that have come to market that interest me. A DSLR does give you options that are impossible with a fixed lens cam. I guess I'm just a fanatic when it comes to the 828. I'm really happier with it than I imagined would be possible.hello brokenz,
I believe the swivel body is a great feature for many people, but
I've seen the difference between optical and LCD.... LCD is cool,
especially with live histogram, but after I got used to the
optical.... It is better for me...
To each his own, someday I WILL own a F-series camera, they are COOL!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
--
Trust that little voice in your head that says, 'Wouldn't it be interesting if....' And then do it. -Duane Michals
mdebrieder
Senior Member
gimme better res EVF, interchangable lenses and the F828 body, drool
a word of warning to you about DSLR's though, the reduced viewfinder and FOV crop is a bit to work with (I just found out recently when receiving an EOS 5) so take care
Enjoy photography!
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
a word of warning to you about DSLR's though, the reduced viewfinder and FOV crop is a bit to work with (I just found out recently when receiving an EOS 5) so take care
Enjoy photography!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
brokenz
Veteran Member
need to start posting more pictures here again. You are one of the reasons I started hanging out on this forum.gimme better res EVF, interchangable lenses and the F828 body,
drool
a word of warning to you about DSLR's though, the reduced
viewfinder and FOV crop is a bit to work with (I just found out
recently when receiving an EOS 5) so take care
Enjoy photography!
--
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
--
Trust that little voice in your head that says, 'Wouldn't it be interesting if....' And then do it. -Duane Michals
mdebrieder
Senior Member
I'm preparing a sweet-light post gimme a couple of minutes
--
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
gimme a couple of minutes --
- Michiel de Brieder -
Enjoying V 1, Exploring D 3 0
http://www.pbase.com/giel
Be aware of the optics of life!
1000Words
Senior Member
Alright I went out and tried to take a couple macro pics with the camera in MANUAL mode adjusting everything myself to get the hang of all of the settings, and 4 out of the 10 I took turned out pretty decent. This is with the camera on a tripod. I adjusted all of the settings to where they looked good to me - nothing really scientific about this guys.
If you look at the links you'll see it starts with 03. 01 and 02 are there - I took them last night after dark when I got the camera home (in auto mode) and they didn't turn out too well. What do you guys think about the macro shots?
If you look at the links you'll see it starts with 03.
01 and 02 are there - I took them last night after dark when I got the camera home (in auto mode) and they didn't turn out too well. What do you guys think about the macro shots?jsonic
Senior Member
Hi,
well EVF, i almost never use it. It is not usable for fine focus unless they put a sort of matglass in there just as on a (d)slr. On the otherside I love working on the LCD, excactly the reason I didn't bought a Dslr. I love the amount of info and to see what the camera is seeing, on an (d) slr you have to wait till after the shot.
I have used many many slr's in the past and found them especially with zoomlenses often quite dark, yes a 400 mm f2.8 was clear but i could buy two f828 for that.
I also love the swivel body, I shoot a lot of macro and my kids. It's qquite easy to get at their eyelevel without crawling through the mud (I live in Holland, lot's of rain). I couldn't do that with an Slr.
I would consider an DSLR if I had the need for changing lenses, but after carrying more than 15K of equipment in the past (two Canon bodies, a 1.8 28mm, a 50mm F2.8 macro, a 28-105 zoom for everyday use, a 70 210 F.2.8 Apo and a 400mm F2.8 + a normal flash and a ringflash) I am very glad with my 828 it serves me well in 98 percent of the shooting situations and that all in a small neat package.
So in the end it is like with all things just a matter of taste. I personally find that a good thing, it gives us al that nice things we can drool about.
Quality wise there is no difference between an Dslr or a 828 kind of camera (in fact these are a kind of SLR's). The difference is in the details, larger sensor = lower noise put a larger sensor in the 828 and you have lower noise (a bit simply said maybe) but in that case the lens will be much havier and larger, ever hold an 28-200mm F2.0-F2.8 zoom lens for an SLR?
I suppose it would give you a backache as well as a little pain in the wallet.
In ten years time we will look back at these days and laugh about ourselves, mark my words. But it are exciing times we live in and I am sure that after the pixelmania (7m pixel on an 1/8 chip, is that a good idea?) things will mature and we will even more have the choise out of the pack of cams to find one that will meet once's demands.
My first digi was an Olympus 1400XL (in fact an dslr) and it was a wonder, my second was a F505, and that was a wonder again, my third was a Casio 4m whow that was something, then came the 717 whow again, then I got very ill and sold it for a P100 for my wife and after seeing the pictures it can make I thought whow, so small and so fast an good colours (after her Canon A series it's an delight) Oh and I forget about the pentax and The olympus C150, all had there strong and weakpoints but sure with most of them I had a lot of fun. And that's exactly what being this ill, I won't live that ten years I mentioned earlier, made me very clear : enjoy what you have, enjoy the moment and try to capture them with whatever tool you have and don't spent to much valuable time thinking that there are better things out there, there are now and there will be tomorrow.
Sorry for this long story but I had to get it of my chest, there are no stupid questions asked by idiots just a lot (no one personnaly by the way) stupid answers from idiots
Have fun and keep asking your questions.
Jeroen
well EVF, i almost never use it. It is not usable for fine focus unless they put a sort of matglass in there just as on a (d)slr. On the otherside I love working on the LCD, excactly the reason I didn't bought a Dslr. I love the amount of info and to see what the camera is seeing, on an (d) slr you have to wait till after the shot.
I have used many many slr's in the past and found them especially with zoomlenses often quite dark, yes a 400 mm f2.8 was clear but i could buy two f828 for that.
I also love the swivel body, I shoot a lot of macro and my kids. It's qquite easy to get at their eyelevel without crawling through the mud (I live in Holland, lot's of rain). I couldn't do that with an Slr.
I would consider an DSLR if I had the need for changing lenses, but after carrying more than 15K of equipment in the past (two Canon bodies, a 1.8 28mm, a 50mm F2.8 macro, a 28-105 zoom for everyday use, a 70 210 F.2.8 Apo and a 400mm F2.8 + a normal flash and a ringflash) I am very glad with my 828 it serves me well in 98 percent of the shooting situations and that all in a small neat package.
So in the end it is like with all things just a matter of taste. I personally find that a good thing, it gives us al that nice things we can drool about.
Quality wise there is no difference between an Dslr or a 828 kind of camera (in fact these are a kind of SLR's). The difference is in the details, larger sensor = lower noise put a larger sensor in the 828 and you have lower noise (a bit simply said maybe) but in that case the lens will be much havier and larger, ever hold an 28-200mm F2.0-F2.8 zoom lens for an SLR?
I suppose it would give you a backache as well as a little pain in the wallet.
In ten years time we will look back at these days and laugh about ourselves, mark my words. But it are exciing times we live in and I am sure that after the pixelmania (7m pixel on an 1/8 chip, is that a good idea?) things will mature and we will even more have the choise out of the pack of cams to find one that will meet once's demands.
My first digi was an Olympus 1400XL (in fact an dslr) and it was a wonder, my second was a F505, and that was a wonder again, my third was a Casio 4m whow that was something, then came the 717 whow again, then I got very ill and sold it for a P100 for my wife and after seeing the pictures it can make I thought whow, so small and so fast an good colours (after her Canon A series it's an delight) Oh and I forget about the pentax and The olympus C150, all had there strong and weakpoints but sure with most of them I had a lot of fun. And that's exactly what being this ill, I won't live that ten years I mentioned earlier, made me very clear : enjoy what you have, enjoy the moment and try to capture them with whatever tool you have and don't spent to much valuable time thinking that there are better things out there, there are now and there will be tomorrow.
Sorry for this long story but I had to get it of my chest, there are no stupid questions asked by idiots just a lot (no one personnaly by the way) stupid answers from idiots
Have fun and keep asking your questions.
Jeroen
You are not an idiot. That was actually a pretty good question. An
idiot wouldn't have asked and just never have known the reason why.
Your comment about the LCD, that is the only reason I would never
have a DSLR as my primary camera. I still can't fathom why people
would want to look thru that tiny viewfinder on a DSLR and never be
able to compose with the LCD. Yes I know, fine focus. Frankly I
would never keep a camera that wouldn't auto focus reliably.
I've gotten a few shots that would have been either inconvenient or
impossible (without spraying and praying) because of the tilt LCD.
My back has also been bothering me recently but I've still been
able to do some low angle work because of the swivel feature. I
wouldn't have been able to do this with a DSLR.
--
Trust that little voice in your head that says, 'Wouldn't it be
interesting if....' And then do it. -Duane Michals
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