I'm liking the F828 less and less... :-(

[HelenPB]

Hi Brooks!

So nice to hear from you -- how are you??

I guess I haven't been posting much here -- I do check in to see what's interesting, but as I went back to my old job at the Turkish Daily News and am trying to help get the paper back into good form, six days a week, I don't seem to have much time for anything else! I also haven't been doing too much photography since I'm finding Ankara pretty uninspiring this time around (oh, how I miss the light and colors of Okinawa!). Plus I don't have an 828, so can't contribute a whole lot to many of the discussions.

Yes, it's the same with me and PS. I always do minor things (cropping, sharpening, straightening, some levels, some cloning) but I've never taken the time to really learn how to use it to it very well (or maybe I just don't have the talent to, I don't know). I don't mind fixing things I do wrong as best I can, but as a matter of principle, I don't feel that I should have to try to remedy a camera's weaknesses as well in PS -- my own are more than I can handle!

Anyway, I'll try to allocate a bit more time for the forum but good to see you all the same.

Helen

I don't know if it's the time difference or..., but I don't seem to
see as many posts from you as I use to see. For that, I'm sorry.
I couldn't agree more with what you just said. While I do have a
copy of PS, I never seem able to figure out how to do what I want
to do. While Andy and some other's are taking great pictures, many
other are struggling.
I really can’t afford another camera this year anyway, and I think
the coming year is going to witness huge changes in digital
cameras. So for now, I feel I am better off saving my money and
seeing what is coming down the road.
Bye for now, and I do hope to see more of you here on the STF.

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[HelenPB]

Why thank you, Tigadee! Just wish I had more time to spend here. When I saw your thread earlier today, I just had to respond, if only to just say hi.

Helen

Brooks P wrote:
I hope you don't think I hijacked your thread; it's just that I
don't see many postings from Helen, and I wanted to say hi to her.

Not at all, Helen is not just one of my STf friends, she is a good
friend tomany here!

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[Tigadee]

Arigato, Helen-chan!

HelenPB wrote:
When I saw your thread earlier today, I just had to respond, if
only to just say hi.

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[Tigadee]

kenny wrote:
I really feel for ya buddy. You and I were among the ones eagerly
awaiting for this camera to arrive. I am saddened to hear about
all the additional issues you had besides PF and Noise with your
unit.

Yeah, but the PF and noise can be ignored espeically if you don't crop a lot or print at mostly small sizes... The blooming colors and funny lines, however,...

I am even more hesitant now to get it after hearing of your
dilemma. I have been waiting for a local store with a liberal
return policy to stock them so I can try it out for myself...but I
really don't know now...so many bad experiences...so many severe PF
posted...I am really at a lost. I may just have to hold on to my
717 a bit longer. I prefer high end pro-sumer digicam over DSLR for
the same reasons you stated. Therefore, like you have mentioned, it
really narrow down the available choices.

Well, let me keep on testing with another flash and will update you on whether it is a flash issue or really a camera defect. Also, maybe Sony will have received a new batch of 828s soon and I can get a proper replacement camera, not just one from the same batch...

One positive thing you have going for you is that Sonny Malaysia
seems to be pretty understanding and willing to work with you and
resolve the issue to your liking.

True, I am relieved and even happy they consider a refund, which is rare in this part of the world!

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[Rick Niles]

If your problem only happens with a particular flash than it really isn't a camera problem right? It is a flash problem. I would not blame the $1000 camera for the problems of a $100 flash. Its like if I but a new video card for my computer and it makes the computer run unstable crashing all the time, I don't take the computer back to the manufacture, I get a different video card that will work with the computer.

If you like the camera you will get a new flash. Most digital cameras can only handle newer flashes with out risking the internal electronics, I believe the flash you are using is to old.

But the main thing is get a new flash if you like the camera not a new camera to go with your flash.

Rick

They couldn't fix that weird 'interlace effect'...
http://tigadee.fotopic.net/c104081.html

Even the replacement cam had it, worst in fact, as I snapped 25
pics and 7 came out with that problem! :-O

I have also gotten 100 prints back and all those with either
green-blue or red in them have blown out colors! Even the blacks
have lost details in them!

I am very unhappy with Sony this time and I am going to ask for a
refund! And plase don't label me a whiner or as being negative - I
am a long-time Sony user, as well as using my F707 for more than 2
years and know the F-series inside-out. PF and noise I can live
with, but this defect with either the CCD or firmware chip or
whatever it is, is just too much! > :-(

I took to the F828 quick and well enough, I knew it had new tech in
it that may need some time to be worked with, yet I did not expect
it to let me down so badly! :-(

Sorry guys, I think I'll be going with something else. Maybe the
D70 or an S2 Pro if I can find one...

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[hip2]

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[Luís Martins]

Hello Natty,

So, are you enjoying your camera ?? I was supposed to receive mine last week too, but Fedex lost it, and im waiting for a substitute... Geee, im stressed about this. Just cant wait to get my hands on it !!

Luís Martins
Portugal.

I have mine since thursday and so far so good....it´s a shame what
happened to you Tigadee...

Photographic Regards.

Natty Brito (Portugal)

 

[hip2]

it's a shame you have such problems with your 828. i'm really sorry about it.

though i was thinking the exact same thing as Rick Niles (just above). if it occurs only with the Achiever 828, you might want to try to shoot with another flash, or maybe get the Achiever replaced because it may be getting old by now ?

i was also curious as to how the blown out reds, emeralds and blacks appeared, do you have a few samples to share ?

looking forward to your next "painting with light" experimentations

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[mdebrieder]

If a camera doesn't work for you, then you're right in choosing another! I hope you will find what you are looking for real soon!!
Good luck!!
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[dementate]

Hmm... that banding is definitely not user-causable. (ask the head tech support dude to put down his reefer for a minute and show you how he thinks you made your 828 do that...) And your sample shots were taken in the Sony office! Yeesh, bad Customer Service. Keep complaining, seems to work with Sony Singapore

The head of the technical support dept. I spoke to and whom I
convinced of the problem (you know how they'd rather it was the
user with the problem and not the unit!) said that a refund is
definitely an option if I so wished.

 

[Lin Evans]

A last note from me: I really don't understand why SONY didn't put
more work and bugfixes into the 828. The 828 could have been a very
nice piece of camera but like it is now, I really can't imagine
that somebody is satisfied with it. Maybe current 828 owners should
have a look at the picture quality of other digital cameras. But I
guess it is always the same story: one spends a lot of money for an
item and it is pretty difficult (maybe that stupid male pride
thing? ;-) ) to acknowledge that one spent a lot of money for a
piece of junk. Sorry to say that but the 828 doesn't stand to it's
specs, no wonder Phil wrote that disastrous review. When I read it,
I didn't believe him but now I know he's right. It is a shame that
SONY doesn't put more effort in their new products. I own two SONY
VAIO laptops and I'm very satisfied. Same applies to their video
cameras. Even my former 707 (I had one of the first) sucked. :-(

I think either you had a bad F828 or you didn't learn to use it. Several things here don't make sense. There are many very satisfied owners of the F828 who have more than adequate experience with other digital cameras. Personally, I have over 24 fixed lens digital cameras representing all major manufacturers. I also have the Canon 1DS, Canon 1D, Canon 10D, Canon D30, Kodak DCS-760 and Kodak MF back, and I absolutely love my F828 and get incredibly good images from it.

Lin

 

[Tigadee]

Lin Evans wrote:
I think either you had a bad F828 or you didn't learn to use it.
Several things here don't make sense. There are many very satisfied
owners of the F828 who have more than adequate experience with
other digital cameras. Personally, I have over 24 fixed lens
digital cameras representing all major manufacturers. I also have
the Canon 1DS, Canon 1D, Canon 10D, Canon D30, Kodak DCS-760 and
Kodak MF back, and I absolutely love my F828 and get incredibly
good images from it.

I'm glad and can believe you're getting great images from your F828. Like I told Andy, either he (& you) got a gem or I got a lemon!

Anyway, from the feedback and suggestions of the helpful and sympathetic STFers here, I am beginning to think that the major problem with the interlaced-lines effect stems from the flash and not the camera, although one other user says he gets it with his internal camera flash, not an ext. flash...

The blooming colors, are still an annoyance, however, and I think Ferrari wouldn't be happy if their new red hot model turned out as a very shapely red, black or emerald blob in prints...

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[Tigadee]

Could be either way, although someone also complained of the same problem - using the internal flash!

The head tech support guy was convinced, and seemed sincere about getting either a replacement cam for me from a future batch and even suggested a refund if a solution/fix could not be found.

dementate wrote:
Hmm... that banding is definitely not user-causable. (ask the head
tech support dude to put down his reefer for a minute and show you
how he thinks you made your 828 do that...) And your sample shots
were taken in the Sony office! Yeesh, bad Customer Service. Keep
complaining, seems to work with Sony Singapore

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[Tigadee]

You're right, of course. But what about the blooming colors in prints? Any colored object other than emerald, red or black does not get blown out. Not only has the blooming reds been passed down to the F828, now blacks and emeralds have been added to the list.

Rick Niles wrote:
If your problem only happens with a particular flash than it really
isn't a camera problem right? It is a flash problem. I would not
blame the $1000 camera for the problems of a $100 flash. Its like
if I but a new video card for my computer and it makes the computer
run unstable crashing all the time, I don't take the computer back
to the manufacture, I get a different video card that will work
with the computer.

If you like the camera you will get a new flash. Most digital
cameras can only handle newer flashes with out risking the internal
electronics, I believe the flash you are using is to old.

But the main thing is get a new flash if you like the camera not a
new camera to go with your flash.

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[hip2]

i'm no expert, but i would bet my right hand that the flash has something to do with it

you might want to try with another flash, that may cost less to replace (if sony is reluctant to refund, that is).

do you have any friend that could lend you a different flash than yours to make a few experimentations ?

i think your issue might be interesting to a lot of 828 owners that are thinking about not getting the F32x sony flash as their external flash

Matthew Cromer wrote:
That's weird.
Maybe it is a compatibility issue with your flash then.

Let's hope so, I am reluctant to give up on the F828... :-(

Good luck with your new camera, whatever it is!

Thanks...

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[Tigadee]

hip2 wrote:
i'm no expert, but i would bet my right hand that the flash has
something to do with it

It's looking that way...

you might want to try with another flash, that may cost less to
replace (if sony is reluctant to refund, that is).

Have already, with the Metz 28C. No probs but very slow recharge...

i think your issue might be interesting to a lot of 828 owners that
are thinking about not getting the F32x sony flash as their
external flash

FX32 is a lot more expensive and slow to recharge than my old F1000!

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[hip2]

hi tigadee
at least we got one problem down
now on to the other

could you show us some examples of blown out color shots ? with, if possible, settings ? and if it's not too much to ask, brand and model of your printer and photo paper maybe ? or maybe i'm just too curious

Rick Niles wrote:
If your problem only happens with a particular flash than it really
isn't a camera problem right? It is a flash problem. I would not
blame the $1000 camera for the problems of a $100 flash. Its like
if I but a new video card for my computer and it makes the computer
run unstable crashing all the time, I don't take the computer back
to the manufacture, I get a different video card that will work
with the computer.

If you like the camera you will get a new flash. Most digital
cameras can only handle newer flashes with out risking the internal
electronics, I believe the flash you are using is to old.

But the main thing is get a new flash if you like the camera not a
new camera to go with your flash.

--



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[Tigadee]

hip2 wrote:
it's a shame you have such problems with your 828. i'm really sorry
about it.

Merci, mon ami!

i was also curious as to how the blown out reds, emeralds and
blacks appeared, do you have a few samples to share ?

Will post some soon: From the original digital photo and scanned print of the same photo.

looking forward to your next "painting with light" experimentations

Heh! Thanks!

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[hip2]

at least we now know part of the source of the problem, even though i would be curious as to why that kind of effect can happen with just a blast of light

anyway, i heard good things about sunpacks and nikon flashes on the 828 ? maybe you would want to give them a try ?

hip2 wrote:
i'm no expert, but i would bet my right hand that the flash has
something to do with it

It's looking that way...

you might want to try with another flash, that may cost less to
replace (if sony is reluctant to refund, that is).

Have already, with the Metz 28C. No probs but very slow recharge...

i think your issue might be interesting to a lot of 828 owners that
are thinking about not getting the F32x sony flash as their
external flash

FX32 is a lot more expensive and slow to recharge than my old F1000!

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[Tigadee]

hip2 wrote:
hi tigadee
at least we got one problem down
now on to the other

Well, let's hope with another flash it doesn't occur anymore... I wouldn;t want to be so sure until I've shot another 1,000 pics!

could you show us some examples of blown out color shots ? with, if
possible, settings ? and if it's not too much to ask, brand and
model of your printer and photo paper maybe ? or maybe i'm just
too curious

I sent the photos out to print: Fuji FDi Station and Fujifilm paper. Will scan in the print and post the original photo as well soon...

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