If the R was not selling then I would I agree with your comment. But since it's still in stock and selling then an appealing logo trumps value. End of story.

Yep, sorry, you are correct that it used the mkIV sensor.

I got confused with the Rp.

I feel a bit protective about the R. Everyone was so nasty about it! I traded a 5Div for it. After the firmware updates it really wasn’t that bad, although that Touch Bar deserves a special place in hell. My first mirrorless camera, and my first experience of using my adapted EF-mount lenses (Canon and Sigma) with no front/back focusing issues. My current R5 does, however, feel like the real deal.

mike
The 5DIV sensor was not cutting edge when the R was released. Please note that "not as good as bleeding edge" does not equal "bad." Reviewers tend to gush about new and better things, so by those standards they couldn't help but be less than amazed. Fortunately cameras like the R are build to use, not to be reviewed and then laid on a shelf.....as I indicated by "getting used to." You seem to have entirely missed the point of what I was saying.

Welsh, the touch bar was fine. I seriously do not understand what all the hate was about from the beginning. No, it wasn't a joystick. It is simply two buttons with very basic scrolling functionality. If one treats it as such, it functions perfectly well. Mine is left for Auto ISO, right for ISO 100, and slide to change ISO. Easy.

"don't even understand the specs as you've demonstrated elsewhere."

Enlighten me.

My experience has been if you are doing simple hand-held videos, Good IBIS can make a "night and day" difference. No rigs, just simple handheld videos with a camera.

The R is a perfectly serviceable camera that was improved greatly by firmware updates. It is somewhat second rate for video, but, the image quality is great, its simply the annoying rolling shutter that makes it a static shot only kind of machine.

I still have my 5Dii. THAT is a classic.

> I still have my 5Dii. THAT is a classic.

I agree. The Canon 5D mk II released in 2008 was the camera that started the whole full-frame sensor video revolution. In contrast, the mediocre "R" model with its non-BSI non-stabilized sensor recycled from the older 5D line was already obsolete when it was released in late 2018. In the ten year period between these two cameras, Canon went from being arguably the leader of the industry to a company struggling to keep up against more innovative companies such as Sony and Panasonic.

I still have my 7D. THAT is a classic.

Mikegt, how can Canon struggle from being #1? Sony fortunately woke up Canon to what cheap labor can offer with high tech and competitive pricing. Canon has been in the camera industry since 1933 hence they know exactly what PRO's photographers need and suppose to what ameture eye-catching specs no one needs. Big difference.

Anyone into classic cameras knows exactly what this camera is. It will be that historic model that introduced a line. But at the same time is that model that everyone will tell you to stay away if you really want to use it.

That's exactly it. It will be both historic and classic but that no one would recommend to use, like a Kodak Brownie.

" It was an extremely compact version of the 5DIV."

You lost me there. Tbh this all seems to be written as if Canon had made the first (FF) mirrorless camera. Tiny? tiny is Panasonic GM1. Or even EOS M200.

To me it really depends where you're coming from. I've been using mirrorless cameras since 2013 and bought that EOS R only recently. It's a very nice camera, and coming back to Canon always puts a smile of my face, but it is not a camera that I will remember, not the way I'd remember the Canon 6D for instance.
As someone who's more into (actual) tiny cameras I was more surprised by the Panasonic S1R which is huge but very nice in hand and with a modern user interface that makes you want to use the camera.

While also lacking a lot of those "5DIV" features usual 5D customers are after like weathersealing and dual SD card slots.

Kazanuda, the R is weather sealed as well as or better than the 5DIV. It is also better in some other regards than the 5DIV, so.....

strat, there are so many outstanding cameras these days that I don't think that definition is of any use. A camera also needs to break ground in some way. The R was Canon's first new FF mount in decades AND of great quality. Yeah, the M mount was good and so was the EF-S, did they shake up the camera world? Nah. The RF mount brought the thousand pound gorilla called Canon into the FF ILC market.

And PA...keep moving those goal posts and pretending like you made a point.

sir_c...what are you even talking about? Of course they took "mirrorless" seriously: the RF mount is proof of that. And the first RF camera doesn't have to be the flagship model for the entire line, it just has to be a good mid-range segment from which to build. They HAD to get a feel for the market, and a low end camera or a high end camera wouldn't have utterly failed to accomplish that. But, put the wildly successful 5DIV into a smaller body and have some really impressive RF lenses to go with it, then you'll be able to get some idea of where Canon can fit into the existing FF segment.
It was an excellent first attempt in every way. The prices was right, the sensor was solid and established with a lower cost for entry than a newly developed, very expensive sensor. So the R came out for a mid-range segment, RP for the lower end, and then they could finish IBIS and their BSI sensors that would cost a premium.

@Dave Oddie:
"both companies first efforts were worse than their DSLR offering"

How is that? Maybe the Z7 was worse in some regards than the D850 but also offered new features like IBIS, and not the Sony 3 stops in good wind kind, it works well. And the Z6 has a better sensor than all DSLRs Nikon had.

@justmeMN yes, DPR already reviewed the EOS-R, but my understanding is that the TV review is a different review with not the same content. Unless I'm mistaken?

That's not true Txoni, TV shows and movies are often referred to as 'instant classics' due to the nature of the story etc... in this case if DPreview feel its one of their best ever videos, it doesnt matter if its a week of a decade old, it can still be referred to as a classic in this context.

I agree on the camera though, its shocking.

But anything before covid feels like a decade ago..

TRY: Not really true, because the video is newer than the camera, so how could be something becoming "classic" into just 3-4 years either way?

Small hint: A Pentax K1000 is, a Nikon FM(2), a Canon 5D, etc... ;-)

Good Light.

yeah its great. EOS R + RF 35mm f1.8 is a killer walk around combo. super light and compact with wonderful IQ

Talking about IQ outside of academic circles only makes sense in terms of end use. IQ of scanned 35mm slides did and still makes sense when selling 20x30 in. prints.
Likewise, the price of anything only makes sense relative to the market it is being sold in: Economics 101.
Canon can still sell the R, like the M50, because there is still demand for them at their prices.

@profhankD: The A7 II didn't beat my Fuji X-T20 by a big margin back then, I don't see myself recommending the A7 II based on IQ. Did you forget a 'R' or 'I' when writing this? ;)

I agree about the crazy price (though I bought the EOS R for 900€ a few months ago, sold it a bit later on). I wish Sony had really killed off the A7 II and made the A7 III the affordable one. We would have avoided anyone recommending the A7 II in 2022...

larkhon: The A7, A7II, and 5DIV are all comparable in IQ... although the A7II's IBIS gives it a practical win. I really think the A7II and its FSI sensor should have disappeared by now, but the Nikon Z5 basically is a more modern wrapper on an A7II sensor, so perhaps Sony justifies keeping the A7II in production that way? I still don't get how the A7II can sell for $100 MORE than a Z5; one would think Sony could at least have made an updated A7IIA...? The A7III uses a better BSI sensor than the A7II (or Z5).

The A7RII 42MP BSI sensor is still comparable in IQ even to the A1 -- way better than the 5DIV. Yet, the A7RII has been discontinued. My guess is that's because it's the same sensor in the A7RIII, so why waste the good sensor chips in a lower-profit-margin A7RII body? The A7RII also was the last model to support PlayMemories camera apps, so it's a different software infrastructure that Sony depricates.

In sum, now is not a great time to buy a camera body. :-(