Pocket 4K doesn't have a viewfinder. The 6K pro cam have one added. I've considered doing so, but actually the screen is good enough to negate its usefulness for me.

There is a whole paragraph about raw. The camera will output raw video through its HDMI socket. I assume they do not offer raw capture to the internal card because they do not want to be sued by RED like Nikon did recently.

yes, "run and gun" only for static shots because this "cinema" camera is useless for moving subjects and paning with its terrible rolling shutter. Just this issue excludes it for true video. It's overhyped "cinema" camera.

@ Mateus1: From your answer, my guess is that you don't do much video work.

Rolling shutter is better than the S1H, which is Netflix certified.

This is absolutely BS, there blockbusters who used cameras with way more rolling shutter in the past. Also there certified cameras with way more then this, seriously if you find the rolling shutter problematic on this you really need to see what is and has been used in the past for fast action, for example the certified XH2 has twice the amount of rolling shutter and so dos lots of others. It has some sure but it’s performance is still above average

*Mateus1 has left the chat*

You just found them their dream camera!

@4sofnature - "Shame on Sony for recycling a 4-year-old sensor found on X-T3"

no, this fx30 apparently has a new sensor, it's not recycled and it's not 4 years old.

@ozy82 - there wasn't as big of a market for this aps-c camera 4 years ago, and aps-c lenses were lacking... for instance, look at the 3 crop lenses sony released just last june, including a powered pz lens for video.

They could have released pz lenses also 4 years ago. Thanks to Fuji x-t5 they finally had to give internal 10bit video recording.

oh please.

sony has at least six pz powered zooms on the market right now, as opposed to fuji having what, zero powered zooms for x-mount?

x-mount is not a good choice for shooting video.

That would be an interesting lineup. I don't personally think we'll see Sony, Nikon or Canon produce a high-end APS-C camera but I can see arguments for using either this chip or the 40MP chip in an a6600 replacement.

BackToNature1 - The X-Trans colour filter pattern in front of the sensor is Fujifilm's patented technology but there's no difference in the semiconductor itself. When people talk about 'having the same sensor as the X-H2' I suspect they mean 'but with a Bayer CFA.'

This doesn't have the sensor for 8K.

For many types of professional production the norm still is HD, and 4K is judged as something brand new. My guess is that there will be a noticeable marked for 4K kameras for a long time.

For sure, the move is towards higher resolution. By now I can't quite imagine a full 8K workflow, due to the amount of data this takes, weighted to what you get extra.

The workfllow witth 8k is a nightmare

The 8K workflow is really not a nightmare. Proxies make it a piece of cake. Proxies are a thing for 4K why aren’t they a thing for 8K? You can make HD proxies with 8K sources just the same as you can with 4K sources.

The only issue is making sure you have enough RAM to do the final render. Oh and I’m assuming you’re not using some obscene RAW 8K format at many gigabits per second.

@ MikeRan: Proxies or not, the total amount of 8K data is huge when producing stuff that is rendered as HD, or maybe sometimes up to 4K. But as said, the marked is pushing higher resolution video.

The use of the video material directs what is needed, or sufficient. My guess is that it will take many years until 4K is seen as outdated.

400MBit h265 isn’t crazy storage. It’s absolutely manageable. As I said edit with HD proxies. They’re the same size regardless of the resolution of the source footage.

This sounds like the “wahhhh my computer can’t handle 45MP. I want my 20MP camera for sports because I have to deliver quickly” BS.

When you have a reliable camera that shoots good quality 8K with no worries of overheating like an A1, Z9 or R5C with reasonable H265 file sizes you find little reason to shoot anything less. (Assuming you’re shooting 24/30p)

@ MikeRan: Well, for real world reportage style work, the amount of video data matters troughout the workflow. Not so much for the hobbyist, or for the slower working team. Comparing 45 vs 20 Mp stills with video is BS, I would say, if this is what should be discussed here. ;-)

You may think it’s BS but it’s the same old thinking mentality.
It’s almost 2023….

@ Mike Ran: Well, for commersial work there is a balance between what the marked asks for, what people pay for you work, and what resources you need. This is buisness thinking and right-scaling.

Why not 16K? The you could feel hip and cool and future proof.

That said, seems like we are discussing different perspectives for video production - what is needed versus what is possible.

When 40% of households have 8K TV’s then yeah, 16K cameras will be relevant.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1247334/4k-ultra-hdtv-us-household-penetration/

@ Mike Ran: Your link also says that time spent in front of the telly decreases at a faster rate than households get 4K tv's ... maybe waiting for 16K mobile phone screens is more future proof. ;-)

Feel free to keep shooting and producing in HD. Not gonna stop you.
I am shooting everything in 8K and producing 4K because it’s easy and I can and then final result is much better. You do you.

@MikeRan 8K is too much for a lot of folks, even with HEVC that’s currently offered with the A1.

Those numbers are bigger budget productions and the vast majority don’t use those bitrates.

The truth is that the final product between highest bitrates and medium and low, is not that dramatic. The thought of multicam workflow on an 8K timeline, scares me. M1 has a hard time with 4K multicam projects……

I guess if nature videos is your thing, then good, I just don’t see it as a format that I is worth the trouble. Sometimes I wonder if 4K is even necessary…. It certainly helps when you use it for a large crop, but for enormous 8K crops, the scenarios when that is needed is even less common that 4K crops.

Fast turnaround, get paid, start another job.

IMO, 4K is not exactly easy to deal with, can become a monster with complex editing.

Johans, filmed in 8K, edited in a 4K timeline. Rendered in 4K. With full resolution. Pan and zoom.

On a laptop. No problem.

Totally agree with MikeRan. I used to see similar comments to what others are posting 5 years ago with 4K. People feel the need to insist what they don't have is the wrong thing for some reason. "Buyers bias" perhaps?

That was an interesting statistic that less than half of people have a 4K TV, I expected it to be at least two thirds by now.

I put a video out yesterday in Full HD (filmed in 4K), as I am well aware it is perfectly sufficient for most TVs and certainly PC monitors. Although the idea was to entice 4K TV owners to buy more expensive 4K videos.

8K is obviously not needed right now, but TVs are being made and in 5 years we might also see the ~40+% statistic for 8K TVs.

I have a 4K camera. If were to invest in another I would want an upgrade to make it future-proof. Like Mike, I would downscale for now. 8K is coming and there will be a demand, just like there is now a demand for 4K.

Dismissing 8K to the random public is pointless as we all have different situations.

To me even 4K is a nightmare and useless, as someone abive mentioned videos are watched typically at 720p or 1080p even today in 2022

Sony wants to sell you a stacked FF camera for $6500, not a stacked APSC sensor for $2500. Fuji just backed themselves into a corner with an APSC mount for their flagship.

@MILC man
What does a stacked sensor have to do with the stills versus video divide?. A stacked sensor would address the roiling shutter issues compared to their non-stacked brethren, for one. If Fuji sells their stacked sensor H2S at a $500 dollar premium over the H2, then Sony could manage the same cost by introducing a stacked sensor to the FX30 for the same premium which would bring it to a very attractive $2200,

I think it's easier to justify the additional (development and customer) cost if you offer a product that's a high-speed sports camera as well as a capable video camera.

Would this camera be (at least) $500 more valuable if it had less rolling shutter, given its shutter rates are already pretty good?

Cameras like the A7IV offer an excellent swith between stills and video settings. Since the settings are so well separated, just leave the camera for stills when working with photography, leave it for video when doing movie production, or switch between the settings without worries if you do both.

I am sure hybrid cameras are lower priced than if there should be separated models for stills and video photographers. Why? Cameras are mass produced electronic consumer products. Smaller series mean higher prices.

There's the Hasselblad X2D-100c that has no video functions. But I can guarantee you that cutting the video features has not saved any customer money.

You would pay more for a video free camera, because it would be a very niche model that creates additional costs to the manufacturer.

Nothing against video enthusiasts, but I get the feeling that 70% of R&D goes into video functionality these days. What's important for me is a good sensor/processor combination and a good EVF in a small camera body. IBIS, pixel shift, and a fast AF won't hurt. But it's next to impossible to find a small camera body with a very good EVF.
One of the driving factors today in marketing photographic equipment today, is the blogger crowd, but these guys are all video freaks. I think market research gets a bit to baized by these channels.

But again, really nothing against Video fans.

I get the feeling that a lot of people think shallow depth of field is appealing to video which it generally isn't. They think, "hey my camera has an f1.8 lens, lets shoot my kid's birthday party at f1.8".

FF cameras can capture good video up to ISO 25600, allowing the use of small apertures, creating large DOF.

Why not smaller? 2/3" has some nice lenses.

If you are upset about a standard from the 50s, why do you want to have a standard from the 20s? 24 fps was introduced with sound in film.

So your assertion is that an absurd, non-integer frame rate is better… and better because it’s NEWER?

Wow. Can’t wait to hear your defense of interlacing (hint: That’s “newer” than acquiring a whole frame at a time).

I've looked @ cine gear and pretty much settled on a used Canon C300 Mark I ... they're going for around a grand now. But this Sony isn't bad. I'm rather fond of Canon, however ... Sony not so much.

Without a mechanical shutter the camera's flash sync speed will be defined by the sensor readout speed. Let's assume the 15.7ms video readout equates to a full sensor readout of something like 35ms, which would mean you couldn't use flash at shutter speeds faster that around 1/25 sec.

The multi-interface shoe is used for attaching accessories such as the XLR adapter, even if it looks like where you'd attach a flash, if you're a photographer.

Not just af
R7 can do 30 fps, while fx30 only single shooting mode, no drive mode of any kind
R7 got mechanical shutter. While fx30 wil be useless in artificial light (no mech shutter or stacked sensor)
R7 got evf, while fx 30 got none

Seriously tho, if they remove mech shutter at least put stacked sensor, otherwise don't bother

They better off slapping 12mpix sensor so they will have better lowlights quality

Seriously. I'm looking at the spec chart, and there's no histogram? Seriously? No waveforms?

And let us guess: There's STILL no shutter angle. That one is just embarrassing.

R7 and FX30 are for two different markets. If you care at all about stills photography, then the R7 would be the far superior choice. The FX30 is in no way viable for stills on any regular basis.

I also agree that any camera marketed heavily at the video market should have the pro video controls like waveforms and shutter angle. No reason to not offer this; it's just software. And that applies to any camera company, not just Sony.

@Thoughts R Us
How many consumer buying Canon R7 for wildlife photography instead of OM System?

If hybrid/paid job, Sony a7IV may be better choice.
Who is target audience of FX30? May be Vlogging.

Canon R7 main issue is rolling shutter & buffer too little, not suitable for serious wildlife photography.

No one uses mech shutter for video 🤣

@Alam12
Sony FX30 tried cut cost and sell as cheaper vlogging gears, pair with newer Sony E 15mm F1.4 G, Sony E 11mm F1.8 & Sony PZ 10-20mm F4 G.

Only issue is FX30 still too expensive as APS-C.

@ Glenn Barber: Yes, if you think about it, Active Stab is an electronic stabilization on top of the IBIS. If you try to use gyro stabilization on top of that, they end up fighting each other and the footage comes out dreadful. Earlier, Catalyst Browse would not let you stabilize clips that already had IBIS and/or Active stab already applied. That made a lot of sense. For some reason, now they let you do it, but the results are mixed, to say the least.

For me, the discovery of being able to export 10-bit out of Catalyst Browse, without plumping for the paid Catalyst Prepare, was a huge Eureka moment - otherwise what was the point of shooting S-log 3?!

"this Sony category of cameras"... with huge 4K/120p crop, very bad rolling shutter, no noise reduction and few more serious drawbacks

Mateus1: The readout speed for this sensor is improved. What are the other "serious drawbacks" for real world video production?

How often is rolling shutter a problem for video capture when using proper exposure/180 degrees shutter? When panning so fast that you get unpleasant visual artifacts anyway?

Rolling shutter appears not only in fast panning of the camera, but also in fast moving subjects. Maybe RolliPoli wants to take his camera on the Nascar track :)

What competing camera has a viewfinder? I agree viewfinders are essential, but at least this thing has a full-sized HDMI port so you can hook one up somewhat reliably. You can't do that with Canon's pathetic R5 "Cine" camera at more than twice the price!

The rolling shutter is the biggest disappointment here, though. Put your camera on a car mount one time if you want to see how important sensor readout time is. I did this with an A7S II and the results are unusable trash; this camera's readout takes more than half the time of the A7S II's.

Half as bad as trash still stinks.

You know what else have horrible rolling shutters? BMPCC cameras. Get a better vehicle mount.

Better vehicle mount? Hahaha!

I’ll just get a competent camera instead and not worry about mollycoddling it with an array of hydraulic mounts or whatever you’re imagining for every dashboard, door sill, airplane wing, hood, trunk, train car….

Unreal.

The XLR/handle that comes with the FX3 and FX30 is an integrated unit: you can't separate the control box / XLR input from the handle because all the connectors are in the foot of the handle where it connects into the hotshoe/MI port.

I'd expect you to be able to fit the XLR-K3M accessory to the FX-30B though.

It's the IBIS being unlocked when the camera is off. Looks weird but I doubt it has anything to do with quality control issues.

the FX30 not being xtrans makes it already a better choice over the fuji XH2S for 85% of the buyers.

it's a moot argument because dpr apparently isn't awarding points for card slots(??)

but for the record, cfx-b is not more widely adopted with sony owners... dual card slots is a huge plus for sony owners because it allows them to keep using the sd cards that they already have, and there is little point in anything faster because the only place it's needed on sony is with a couple of obscure video formats that most people don't shoot.

sony understands that, and they also understand that sony owners overall value small bodies that don't easily fit dual cfx-b slots.

beyond that, if you factored in everything that actually mattered with shooting video sony would be on top just about every time, due in part to the lens choices... it's the only brand with at least six motorized pz zooms, linear voice coil af in much of the lens lineup, digital hotshoe in many bodies, etc.