Compact and feature-packed: Our Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark III review

E-M5iii - the camera that made 100 middle aged men cry in public.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Nice camera. All the camera most people will ever need.

Mind you it seems this site is for people who absolutely believe they NEED a full frame sensor even though they end up viewing the images on a 10 inch iPad.

Amazing how gullible people are.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Hey if you are happy with a quarter frame sensor camera good for you. But please don't pretend there isn't a difference a m43 sensor and a 35mm sensor.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

I am not pretending there is not a difference.

But it remains a demonstrable fact that for many people , the differences are irrelevant.

Ironically, it tends to be some of the most talented photographers who care less about the differences. Most of the pixel peeping over the differences comes from gear heads rather than people focused on the creative art.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Raoul Duke

I buy these nice lenses and hate throwing half the image away. Even if I crop the sides, a FF sensor allows you to crop how you like, you buy a 20mm and it's a 20mm.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

That does not make much sense. Have a smaller lens optimised for the sensor.

An EM5 rig and focal lengths equiv from 20-400mm in two lenses can fit in a tiny bag. FF is great but decent lenses can be huge.

Besides, what is so special about "FF"? It is just a throwback to an ancient film format. It means nothing.

Lets also remember that 35mm was originally regarded as " Small Format".

The sensor size debate is pretty daft in my opinion. Different cameras and different sensors suit different things.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Err what? If sensor size is so unimportant forget about m43 and just get yourself an iPhone.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

brendon1000
Err what? If sensor size is so unimportant forget about FF and just get yourself an MF camera

Oct 20, 2019permalink

Sensor size IS important which is why most professionals use 35mm or bigger sensors. However MF sensors are expensive and the system is not as developed as 35mm sensor systems. I had taken a trial of the Fuji MF system for my work but the AF was not up to snuff so I dropped the idea.

That's not to say small sensor cameras are not good. I myself used to use APS-C sensors before and two of my friends used m43 systems before when we were amateurs. However we have all since moved on from small sensor systems after trying out 35mm cameras even though we all 3 shoot different systems. The m43 cameras are now being used by my friends dad who is old and was finding his 5d mk 2 heavy to use. M43 format systems are great for soccer mom's and older folks who don't need the best IQ and prefer smaller cameras.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

Usual cliche response. Not everyone is the same

There are situations where small sensor is better just as there are situations where large format is better.

This includes professional work. My old agency still buys 43 images from travel and foreign journalists and happily uses it for print and web.

Some of this stuff is 43 simply because because the gear was light and small enough for the journalist to have carried it with them in the first place.

I’m looking now at files taken with a G9 and 55-200 panaleica 2.8 which are just lovely. It would make zero difference to their value if they were FF Sony, for example. Indeed 400mm reach on a Sony FF would be so huge a lens the photographer would not have carried it in the first place.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

LazyBear

Do you drive 500 hp M4 so you can dash for diapers at 2 am just in case or something more mundane but good enough. It baffles me why people hauling full frame with 2.8 premium glass to kids birthdays dont buy Porsches. They clearly superior to their subarus, no?

I have several 20x24 printed from Velvia slides years ago. Guess what - they were scanned 6000x4000. And please check how actually much grain Velvia had. It would look like unacceptable noise today. I also have images taken with first gen 5D - and they look noisier than EM1. So sure, sensor size matter. And so does horsepower and braking distance. Are you in line for Mercedes AMG?

Oct 21, 2019permalink

scotjack

Brendon 1000, a friend of mine (professional photographer) printed 12 photographs of the same scene taken with various cameras he owns - he has dozens! A few of the photographs were essentially full frame - just cropped to best fit a 10x12 print. But most of them, were a significant enlargement of part of the scene.
No one viewing them, no one, did any better than random at detecting which photographs were on a FF, ABS-C or FourThirds. I doubt you would do better.
Perhaps if you are shooting for billboards, it might make a difference, but for the other 99.5% of us, iut doesn't.

Oct 21, 2019permalink

Slouch Hooligan

Brendan1000
That’s what a LOT of people are doing.
Phone sales: up
Camera sales: down
Things change continuously but often follow trend lines.

Oct 23, 2019permalink

Slouch Hooligan

scotjack
Billboards are viewed at a distance where images from a 6MP camera are, and have been, more than adequate.

Oct 23, 2019permalink

It depends on your needs. If I was an amateur who needed a vacation camera I might have considered a cheap m43 camera with a good zoom lens. However if I am a more seasoned amateur or a pro with a much bigger budget why would I really want a small sensor camera when for the same price of a little more you can a larger format which will give you better IQ.

If you are trekking or shooting in an environment where size and weight is paramount then fine m43 has a lot of advantages.

But those sort of genres are very small and for most people they want a bigger sensor. That's why you see most professionals use larger sensor format cameras even in fields where m43 should hold sway like wildlife or sports. At the end of the day you can get a larger format camera to do almost everything a small format camera can do by stopping down. But the reverse is not true unless you use some f0.95 lenses on m43 to try and match f1.4 lenses on FF.

Oct 23, 2019*permalink

Slouch Hooligan

Choice of sensor size is based on a photograper’s needs. The need to compensate for perceived inadequacies for instance. The need to feel superior is best met with a medium format 100MP sensor. The need to been seen as having a big tool may be satisfied with a full frame sensor, of any resolution, combined with a very long, thick, lens.
The need to produce photos to sell or show may be met with any ILC camera made in the last 15 years.

Oct 23, 2019permalink

True you can get good photos with any camera. But as I said only m43 guys feel their tiny sensors are equal to bigger sensors which I know isn't true. I have seen the difference and I don't wish to be happy with lower IQ from the quarter frame format.

Any car can get you to point A to B. But I will be happier to go in a BMW than in a Ford. Fiesta.

Oct 24, 2019permalink

"Quarter frame" format is a BS term.

FF is small format. It is a fake throwback to a film size which at the time was created as a "small format". 35mm was in many ways like a 1" sensor is seen as today.

If someone needs "FF small format" to vindicate their photos, they are better off getting a course to learn to take better pictures IMO.

Oct 24, 2019*permalink

35mm sensors are a standard format. Of course bigger formats exist with even better IQ but we use the 35mm format as a standard now which makes the m43 format a quarter frame format. Its the naming convention which I choose to use. You may not like it but its plain facts considering the common naming conventions used today.

I already agreed you can take good photos today with almost every camera. But as I said bigger sensors give you better IQ. 35mm sensors give better IQ than quarter frame sensors. And medium format sensors give better IQ than 35mm sensors. The biggest difference is that 35mm sensor systems cost just a little bit more than micro 43rd sensors which are 75% smaller than 35mm sensors.

Oct 24, 2019permalink

Illogical. You can call it what you want. 35mm is still old "small format".

Plate cameras became obsolete because of better film. Just so with Digital cameras. Most cameras are obsolete because phones are convenient and have acceptable image quality for 99.9% of users.

With digital cameras it is the same. Technology means sensor size is largely irrelevant unless you shoot low light. 20mp is enough to resolve the limits of a 4k monitor, regardless of sensor size.

A small sensor can give better IQ than large sensor sometimes- for example 200m 4/3 lens will put 20mp on a 400mm field of view. Some larger sensors cannot do that without considerably more size and weight, so you end up cropping a "FF" image and end up worse off.

"Bigger sensors give you better IQ" you said. The answer to this is, "well, maybe, some of the time" - IF you can see the difference.

I have Sony /Nikon FF, Fuji APSC and 4/3. I've got Foveon and even a Pentax 6x7 film rig around as well to compare with..

Oct 24, 2019permalink

Which comes back to my original point. If you are happy with small sensor cameras good for you. But if you think 'most' people who care for IQ are going to choose smaller quarter frame sensors over larger 35mm sensors. That's was the whole point I was making. I had 4 friends who used to shoot m43. All have moved on to bigger sensors except one who has hence shifted to phone photography.

Oct 24, 2019permalink

Digitalharry

As a M5-ll user this new body has a better AF system but you can hardly call it R&D. Olympus just put the parts of a em1-2 in this body. Quite dissapointed and sad to see that there is no real development anymore on M43. No better sensor or AF, which is crap on a m5-2.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

So, you complain about the crappy AF on your E-M5 II and you also complain that Mark III gets the same great AF as the more expensive flagship model?

What's the logic behind that?

You are basically disappointment that you get 90% of E-M II for less money.

Since when is "I can have that for less money" is a bad thing?

You also get some perks not available on E-M1 II:
- 120 fps slo-mo video
- USB battery charging (but not running the camera off USB)
- More comfortable EVF
- OLED panel instead of LCD - as all the MFT haters will tell you, that's a huge upgrade, but I guess now that Olympus has it, it's probably not anymore
- New sensor dust removal mechanism

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Profondeur de champ

I was just reading the specs vs. the overprice "flagship" A6600 (its $200 more)
Here a few things the Sony lacks.
50MP high-res shot mode
30 FPS
Cinema (DCI) and UHD 4K video @237 Mbps
Up 6.5EV of image stabilization (anyone who has compared know the Oly is better)
Extensive direct controls and articulating touchscreen (sony's touchscreen is mostly useless and does not articulate)
Weather-sealed body (Sony failed getting theirs rated)
1/8000 sec mechanical shutter speed

Those are just a few. And when I compared sensors, DxO said the noise was near identical, but the Sony sensor readout was 3-4 times slower. That means massive rolling shutter and mostly useless electronic shutter on the Sony.

Oh, and that live bulb mode that there is a great article about too! :D

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

Reilly Diefenbach

$1799 with kit lens? Sheesh!

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Profondeur de champ

Depends on kit lens.
You are quoting the compact 28-300 EFL lens. Most will get the body and a pancake kit lens for about $500 less.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

There's actually not many weather sealed kits at that price.

Most of the others are also Micro 4/3, BTW.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

JakeJY

Actually it's $1499 if you click the Amazon link.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

Sirandar

EM5 II owner ....... hard to surpass this when I already own

If it had a robust handheld 50mp mode it might be tempting, but even light breezes ruin many of these types of images in a way no processing can fix.

I would recommend it for new users look for a single light bag almost full options solution

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Einride

Looks great! I really like Olympus image quality. Would really like to buy and EM5 someday. I think its still the best OMD camera. Super compact and they've managed to make it even smaller while improving things like weather sealing. The thing that sells the EM5 is the lenses. The Olympus lens system is really wonderful and no APSC can match it for compact size, low weight and low cost.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

IDoLikeCameras

I know there's aot of negativity on this camera but I like it. I has great IS mainly which i miss dearly in most camera bodies. It also checks all the boxes.

Sure AF could be better. Sure sensor could be newer. Sure body could be better. Burst could be faster. But it's pretty good imo, unlike many m43 releases this one is one I'd be interested in buying.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

jimkahnw

I'm seeing a lot of smearing that I don't get with my EM1 Mk2, which supposedly has the same sensor and processor. We're looking at jpg in-camera processing, or minimal post, which to my eye is unpleasing. I downloaded a RAW file, but ACR/LR can't read it, so I can't really apply my workflow to these images. See Robin Wong's review and sample images; they are what we can expect. https://robinwong.blogspot.com/2019/10/olympus-om-d-e-m5-mark-iii-review.html. Robin probably has a pre-release version of Olympus Viewer which can read the Mk3 files. My OMD files can easily go 36x24 inkjet or 12" high in offset printing, but these samples are misleading.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

joelakeland

I'd like to see a follow up model to the GX8 or 9 by Panasonic right about now.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

joelakeland

The market is lot different than when the Mark II was introduced and if the most important metric is image quality the XT3 would own that for the same price, more or less. Longtime Olympus fan but this model doesn't quite have me at "Hello".

Oct 18, 2019permalink

X-T3 would be a killer if it had IBIS.

But it does not, and is still more expensive.

So, pick your poison. Newest APS-C sensor or IBIS?

Oct 18, 2019permalink

joelakeland

Excellent point on the X-T3. In the past year I've shot with the Pen-F and X-T2 and as good as the Pen-F was...even with the stabilization, it's image quality didn't quite match the Fuji X-T2. I would imagine it falls further behind now, despite the EM 5 III.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Haider

If IQ is the most impotant metric then I'll grab the PhaseOne...

Oct 19, 2019permalink

He is talking about similar price points.

Oct 22, 2019permalink

bewie0411

There has been a lot of critical comments, but I think there might be target group for whom this camera is quite interesting: YouTubers, that want a) more flexibility than their smartphone offers (in terms of focal length), but b) want to concentrate on their content and are not interested in a lot of post production work (i.e. color correction). Seen from that point of view this camera offers 4k full sensor readout, IBIS and a lot of lenses by not having the weight of e.g. the G9.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

marc petzold

Looks like a nice, little DSLM, this 3rd Incarnation of the M5. 1199 EUR is something too much.

But for the asking price, i'd slap just 200 EUR more, if i *would* be into the need of buying new Gear, and get the X-T3 instead. And already being into the Fuji X-System.

And the X-T30 is just 1189 EUR, with the excellent XF 18-55/2.8-4 Kitlens, so one get an APS-C Sensor, and a great Zoom, for less than the new M5 Mark III asking price, Body alone.

Last, but not least. Olympus is saving at the wrong end, i'd never buy <any sensor> DSLM, with a price tag >1k, and being made out of a plastics, composite, even if quality plastics Body, it does need to be alu-magnesium alloy, i am not asking for a Titanium Shell...into this price class. ;-)

A full plastic Body DSLM for "just" 1199 EUR...wait...no way. Sorry. Even the "el cheapo" entry Level Fujifilm A-Series inherit some kind of alu-mag alloy, top plates, Dials. Not all.

Good LIght.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

@marc petzold - I share your sentiments entirely, except about the Fuji XF 18-55/2.8-4, which has strong field curvature at 18mm.

As well as my Nikon D610, I have an Olympus E-PL3 which I bought for a song as it became obsolete. The m.Zuiko 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R with it is not bad at all but I rely upon the superb m.Zuiko 12mm f/2 for most of my work anyway, as I mostly take landscapes. The E-PL3 is a fine metal bodied low end MFT but I would have liked to have something better, maybe even to replace the heavy weight and bulky Nikon equipment, for which I have three lenses, with MFT or APSC as my main camera.

However, I am not prepared to pay these stupid prices or get a plastic bodied OMD or have heavy lenses on them to get the quality, especially when I get very good quality from the 12mp E-PL3. I have the VF-2 but do not like EVF.

Continued in parts 2 and 3

Oct 18, 2019permalink

For most brands, there are some rather good lenses, IMO almost all ruined by high barrel distortion, which is an issue with RAW, as I do not wish to use only the software that can correct it. I use Machinery HDR Effects (MHE), which is excellent and very easy to use, also very cheap to buy.

I did a test this afternoon from the DP Review of the D600 where I could download RAW test images of the D600 and E-PL3. I converted them with MHE then downscaled the larger to the size of the smaller and adjusted so the contrast, brightness and colours were a little closer. I can hardly tell the difference between the two even though one has an original twice the image size and pixels than the other. As I have found in practice, 12 mp actually is enough if you are careful and your technique is good.

Continued in part 3

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

I do not take many pictures, putting the effort into knowing what I am doing, expecting and mostly getting good results and a high success rate. So the only practical difference between the D610 and E-PL3 is that the former is refined and a pleasure to use, much more flexible, the Olympus small and light but surprisingly good. With the E-PL3, once you have the settings right and if you do not wish to keep changing them, I am not sure I need better, so much as the Nikon is much nicer and more certain to use, apart from the considerable bulk and weight.

I will have to stick to my E-PL3, retaining the Nikon D610 as my main camera when it causes no grief to carry it and some or all of the lenses around. As I am getting old and am not very mobile, I tend often not to venture too far from my car and then the D610 is not a problem.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

MEDISN

@marc petzold
How much does it cost to add weather sealing and IBIS to that XT30? Does all that metal in the XT30 give at an IPX1 rating?

Oct 22, 2019permalink

xeppelin

lol. Camera still too big, sensor still too small, price still too high.
Will prefer a Canon EOS M50 for 500 € every single day.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Really ?? I mean, really ?

The EOS M sensor is 1.6 crop and not so different to the 20mp Oly sensor - indeed the IQ is no better. And the rest of the Canon sucks.

Until the new M6 mk2 came along, M cameras have been nasty little things IMO

Oct 20, 2019permalink

intercopter

So disappointed...
I had great expectations on the 5mk3 with better sensor, stabilisation, auto merging...
While as I read the reviews it looks like an excellent tool to take great photos, I do not see myself owning a plastic body camera. I have been proudly using different Nikon cameras and lenses in the past. They provided that great feeling having serious durable material in the hands and I chose to go with Olympus OM-D cameras because they provided that same sensation, even better. Today I own a 10mk2 which is great. I feel good handling it but I need more up to date sensor (30MPix?), ios(usb-c, mic and headphone) and more integrated processing (focus stack merging, more HDR modes...) and I am ready to step up.
BUT NO WAY I buy a plastic body camera. Feels like toy in my hands. The gain in weight is absolutely not worth it. Plastic is good for disposable cameras (and toys).

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Aberaeron

I have not seen a non-plastic Nikon in years. They are mostly metal chassis with a plastic cladding that is indistinguishable from a fully plastic body, certainly on the parts in direct contact with your hands. You certainly do not grip bare metal.

The exception may be the top and bottom plate which is not usually plastic coated. I have a range of cameras with both metal and plastic ends and I can't say, with all honesty and by looking alone, which is which. Engineering hard plastic looks indistinguishable from metal unless it is contoured into shapes that are not practical for pressing or moulding metal.

Oct 22, 2019permalink

Stan Powers

I think $1199USD (Body Only) is going to be a hard sell. Fuji X-T20 with the excellent 18-55 kit lens is $899. X-T30 body only $799. Maybe there is a groundswell of FF users going small and so Olympus will grab market share. But I think if one were not already in the Olympus Universe this camera is barely going to blip on the radar.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

well you are stressing too much on price mate, imho this gonna be the best camera of the year. probably not on selling (not sure either) but atleast on dpreview end of year poll. As it got so much potential, more than any other small form factor camera. it obviously doesn't got any ground breaking changes as we were always expect from olympus but compare to em5-ii its a huge leap forward, as very correctly stated by dpReview a mini em-1 ii

Oct 18, 2019permalink

jw48165

I was hoping they would use this release to update the menus. While they've done a fantastic job of optimizing the underlying AF system w/ the latest release of the E-M1 series bodies and now the M5iii, the menu system is still terrible. I can't see paying this much for a camera with broken menus. I say that as an E-M5ii owner of 4+ years, and I own the pro trinity as well. I'm going back to Canon. For the last couple of days I've been renting an EOS RP w/ the 35RF and 24-240RF. The RP is the same weight as my M5ii. The 24-240 is heavy but excellent - I was worried about AF speed, but it's been great. The biggest thing though? The menus! Within the first 2 hrs of working with it, I had fully customized menus for video, action, and etc., without even watching a youtube video. After shooting Olympus for 4+ years, 60+k photos, I *still* hated/struggled with the menu system. I was really hoping I wouldn't have to switch.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

dhiltonp

It may have an updated menu relative to the E-M5 II, right? I know the E-M1 II or x have updated menus...

Oct 24, 2019permalink

jw48165

I rented an E-M1ii shortly after the release of the v3 firmware. Nope, the menu is not better. I would have bought one if it was. The touchscreen was still weak at best.

Oct 29, 2019permalink

It has some great up sides such as the resolution bump and USB charging but I personally don’t understand how downgrading the viewfinder for shaving off a few mms and grams from a camera that was already almost too small can have come across as a good idea to the designers. Ok, is an OLED, but 0.6 it’s almost as small as the viewfinder on the Pen F (the reason why I didn’t buy it) whist the Mark II has a very spacious one. These are definitely not cameras that will be bought as smartphone upgrades, and ergonomically the finder is a vital point in a good camera.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

Jeffjeab

Damn it just buy it.... lol

Oct 18, 2019permalink

technotic

Where's my wallet already?

Oct 18, 2019permalink

muppix

As an existing E-M5 mk II user (and mk I before that) I’m considering upgrading to the mk III for one feature alone: USB charging. Because when you add the bulk of an external battery charger, mains lead, and international mains adapter you’ve nearly doubled the size of your travelling camera, which is a real consideration if you spend weeks on the road with just a carry-on bag. I don’t care that it’s micro USB and not USB-C - so’s my Kindle. I don’t care it’s only rated for 310 shots - I’ll appreciate the lightness afforded by the small battery more often than I’ll grumble about having to to charge it during the day using any ubiquitous USB charger or power bank. Speaking of lightness, I am slightly worried about where weight has been shaved off. Is this an all-plastic body now?

Oct 18, 2019permalink

It is all plastic .. yes
In general I hate plastic (for environmental effects) but these are the places where I do prefer them on any metal. Olympus actually made it such a high quality that you will love it, nevertheless!
Thanks for sharing your point on USB-C charging and small battries. It does makes sense!

Oct 18, 2019permalink

The description says that the body is made of a magnesium alloy...

Oct 18, 2019permalink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UedJfu25lgM&feature=youtu.be&t=150

@whawha here is the review of Robin Wong where he clearly saying its fully made of plastic. Its a good review, worth watching anyways, if you interested in this camera

Oct 18, 2019permalink

That’s quite a turn off, one of the things I love about the Mk II is the beautiful solid metal feel in the hands.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Haider

I have quite a lot of car parts in plastic reinforced carbon fibre...

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Good for you! :)

Oct 20, 2019permalink

muppix

I've seen a number of reports / reviews that state the mk III is metal & plastic construction, and an equal number that state it's made of 'synthetic' materials.

Not that it matters much now, given the price of this thing I've decided to start with yet another system by ordering a Fujifilm X-T3.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

fuji x is no doubt a great system to get into.
I only wish if they could match ibis specially on videos side with m4/3.

Oct 20, 2019permalink

muppix

Can a stabilised lens not go some way towards making up for lack of IBIS? I know very little about video but when I shoot stills nothing I point the camera at is actually, er, still. People move, foliage moves, IBIS encourages you to shot slower and you end up with blurry photos. I guess you can always plan ahead and turn it off, but that’s kind of missing the point I guess.

Oct 21, 2019permalink

Yes lens based IS are pretty good, but not a match for Oly's IBIS or Pany's Dual IS.
For stills if you know whatever 3 to 4 stops better hand held you can take, those optical only systems works just fine ..
But in videos all other systems are not dependable at all. For any serious filming you have have to use a gimbal.
If you are still photography focused, am sure you gonna love X-T3. I would happily chose it on any other APSC camera, sony A6**, nikon Z50 and lets not even mention Canons M* :))

Oct 21, 2019permalink

rgs_45

For $1799.00 for the EM-5iii + 14-150 kit is a bit too much for me.

If Olympus would have bundle this, EM-5iii + 12-200/3.5-6.3 for $1799.00 I would seriously consider it. Body only? $1099.00 would have been a fair price.

Now, either this or EM1-ii for my next upgrade. I currently shoot the EM-1i + 40-150/2.8 PRO and the EM5-ii + 12-100/2.8 PRO...I'm leaning on the EM1-ii because I don't have to buy another type of battery even though it's a bit larger

Oct 18, 2019permalink

aliasfox

E-M1ii uses a different battery from the E-M1i and E-M5ii.

That's the biggest reason stopping me from considering either E-M1ii or E-M5iii (own previous iterations of both). Not that I can't afford extra batteries, I just don't want to carry multiple chargers on a trip. That's why my E-PM2 stays at home, despite the fact that it + the Panasonic 20 make for a perfect casual evening photo kit.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Mateus1

What? They downgraded EVF by dropping it from 0.74x magnification to 0.6x ?! This is big dissapointment! and they ask $1200 for plastic body with such tiny EVF... for me good EVF is more improtant then IBIS, one of the most important camera part... what a mistake. Then used E-M1 mk2 is a better choice.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

Your comment sounds belittling to us people who wear glasses. Remember, that not every camera must be made for 7ft tall Rambos. Us who suffer from pain in hands, backs and have poor eyesight, finally a camera tailor made for us !!, .. and so many posters around moan?
One day will come when most of you will wear glasses and shiver too, I'm tellin' ya.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Mateus1

Especially wearing glasses I woud buy the camera with such tiny EVF.
But that's my point and different needs then yours which I understand.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

I wear glasses and I wouldn’t trade down to a smaller finder. I use the diopter correction, that’s what it’s there for. And as the belittling thing, then maybe cameras that can’t be operated single handedly are an insult with people with only one arm...

Oct 18, 2019permalink

kolyy

The magnification is 0.68x, not 0.6x. That's not a tiny EVF by any stretch.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Well, how small is a small evf is a horses for courses sort of thing.
I like the one on the E-M5 Mkii and find it disappointing that on its upgraded model the evf is quite considerably smaller. The same magnification but with an OLED screen would have been a very appealing step forward.

Oct 19, 2019*permalink

kolyy

It's 9% smaller in both directions, that's hardly noticable. And 0.68 is not exactly small, you might argue it is not huge or that it is average, but it is most certainly not "tiny".

Oct 19, 2019permalink

For the last two decades cameras and lenses have increased in price way beyond general inflation and now DPR talks of entry level costing a great deal, that not long before would have got you anything but. This M5 III is a grade up from that but nevertheless my comment holds up. Thus it is no wonder that sales are way lower than they used to be, though there are also other reasons of course.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

prices increased and so does the technology and cost of r&d and production!

Oct 18, 2019permalink

@Naveed Akhtar Costs have not increased to anything remotely approaching the price increases.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Let's see some numbers.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Reading a lot of comments from people upset by the price. However It costs less at launch than the original version, roughly the same as mkii. This camera does seem to be a stark reminder that high performance digital photography has never been a cheap pursuit.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

I'd be interested to see the fine detail of that analysis. Over the past ten years, direct replacement models tend to be priced similarly or lower than the outgoing versions.

The original E-M5 cost $1299 at launch, which would be $1452 in today's money. The E-M5 II cost $1099 at launch, which would be $1190 in 2019 dollars.

So, in the sense this is priced $9 above its immediate predecessor once you've taken inflation into account, then yes. (Which involves ignoring the $250 drop, in real terms, compared with the original model).

The average price of cameras has rocketed in the past few years, because the inexpensive compacts that used to account for most of the market have vanished. If you compare like-for-like models (or, rather, compare better featured models to their predecessors), prices have been pretty static or gone slightly down, from what I've seen.

This may depend on where you live, to a degree. US cameras tend to sell at/near MSRP for much longer than in Europe.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

@Richard Butler - Fair comment except that the average price of quality interchangeable lens cameras with a quality viewfinder at the point of entry, without all the copious bells and whistles has also rocketed, except there are not any such cameras.

There needs to be a metal bodied E-M20 with the same sensor, same EVF as the E-M10 but much the digital equivalent of an OM1, only what is necessary with digital to function at all. But consumers do not have that choice, therefore are forced to spend more and that is my grouse.

My ideal camera would be metal bodied, have interchangeable lenses, single point auto-focus at the centre, likewise metering including spot AF-ON, AE lock, exposure adjustment and exposure bracketing, choice of ISO, no more I can think of. I would prefer an OM1 sized full frame DSLR or failing that mirrorless with as near as good an EVF that looks like OVF even if it isn't or the nearest to that possible.

Name me one example close to £600.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

@Richard Butler--The original EM-5, according the DPReview cost $999--body only--see April 2012 review under specs. The EM-5 original with the 12-50mm lens was $1299.

Comparing the price of the bodies at launch there is a $200 differential. Using the CPI calculator the inflation adjusted body only would be $1114 in August 2019 dollars. This about 1 percent above inflation each year.

An introductory camera comparison--E-620 (2009) with lens was $799 compared to E-M10 iii (2017) which was also $799. I think body only were both priced at $699. The E-620 in 2017 dollar prices out at $831. So introductory prices for entry-level cameras have fallen in real terms in this example.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Craig from Nevada: Ah, good catch. Our database only has the UK and Euro prices in it, so I looked at Imaging Resource, which listed $1299. I'd forgotten that the E-M5 dated back to a time when we had to manually write-out the specs page as well as putting the same information in our database.

And, given I wrote that review, it would have been me who made that table.

In which case, yes, $200 cheaper in money terms and $82 cheaper in real terms (according to the inflation calculator I used).

keepreal: I think the problem is that, especially for a mirrorless camera, it doesn't save the manufacturer any money to omit focus points or any other features, once they've developed the technology. So the question is: how cheap would the be able (and willing to) sell a metal-bodied camera?

That's a separate question from whether this, fairly well featured camera should cost less. After all, pricing is based on what you will pay, not what you want to pay.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

@Richard Butler--Now that we have the prices sorted out, the next question is whether the mark iii is $82-$84 better than the mark i?

We frequently discuss apples-to-apples comparisons. After a couple of iterations of models (over an 8-year period) we have an apples-to-oranges comparison. Oranges sometimes cost more than apples. In this case a little more than 7 percent in 2019 dollars.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

I'm actually hoping to write a comparison of the E-M5 (the first genuinely great mirrorless camera, in my opinion) and the E-M5 III.

I want to see how far we've come in those seven years, but also discuss whether we're in a period where of subtle refinements rather than radical breakthroughs (at least, in spec terms).

Oct 18, 2019permalink

@Richard Butler - Regrettably I have to capitulate. As you said "After all, pricing is based on what you will pay, not what you want to pay". That is true. After all I bought a Nikon D300 and then a D610, the Nikkor 20mm f/1.8, feeling that all was extortion. Nevertheless, I went ahead, enjoying the equipment but moaning about it ever since.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

GreatOceanSoftware

I bought my first camera, an Olympus OM-10 in 1978. I seem to recall paying $235 for the body and 50mm 1.8 prime. This was an entry level kit, purchased at a military base exchange, presumably at a 20% discount over civilian retailers. According to US Inflation Calculator (.com) it would be $1154 today. Seems about right to me.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

wootpile

Battery life of 310 for 1200 dollars in 2019? no thanks

Oct 18, 2019permalink

thx1138

I'm not defending it, but look at the battery life of the competitors, also woeful other than the new Sony A6600 which now uses the A9 battery. I agree for essentially a 2020 camera to still be offering such tripe is pathetic. The worst thing is they made the battery smaller even though they say it has the same number of shots. I had the original E-M5 and it could barely get 200 shots not much improvement in 6 years.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

GreatOceanSoftware

I love ya Olympus, but X-T30.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

DrewRick

Looks like a really nice small package, very proportional to the sensor size. Providing a swiveling mini flash is great, hope other brands follow suit. Given that, IBIS, and the many well-known computational functions Olympus has pioneered I guess the value adds up, though I'm not sure how easy it will be to keep the price this high given that most of it is software. One thing - I hoped micro USB would die already, where's the USB type C connector? Incidentally, the one on the X-T30 doubles as headphone jack (with adapter), so the comparison table might need another asterisk.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

I would love a version with real brown leather trim instead of black imitation, and brass plated top instead of silver. I mean, by now, Olympus should have learned what is the most common saxophone colour in jazz bands …

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

BIF on an E-M5!

Oct 18, 2019permalink

mpb002

Im sure this model will be great for those looking to get into the M4/3 system, but as a FF user, a Canon RP is $1,299, which is not much more than this camera. Also, before too long the RP body will likley drop in price soon. I know that the Olympus is an attractive camera with the really great IBIS, but a FF sensor is a better alternative for image quality. Just my opinion.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Jefftan

A7 II may be even cheaper, talking about sensor IQ even A6100 is much ahead
but how important is IS and lens lineup which is MFT real strength is hard to say
still this should $1000 new and not $1200

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

I know your pains; I walked into a car dealership wanting to buy a smaller car, and then, lo and behold, there was a used van priced similarly!
Then I thought, the price of this small car makes no sense: for the same money, why not pick up a van!?

Oct 18, 2019permalink

A small car is much easier to park in a city and offers 90% of the day-to-day functionality of a van.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Why not buy a van and never to drive it out in the streets? It's so difficult to find parking space.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Why would you buy any vehicle if you aren't going to drive it somewhere? You kind of sound like someone who would buy a 3 row SUV just to commute to work.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

A lot of van drivers out today.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

"Why not buy a van and never to drive it out in the streets? It's so difficult to find parking space."

Yes those who buy vans do not drive them.

Similarly those who buy FF cameras don't use them. Anyone who does not use m43 is just fool who does not know what to do with tools.

What nasty attitude is this.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

buratino

mpb002,
image quality does not exist without specific circumstances including lenses one can comfortably take to a destination. I like to be able to fit, say, 2 bodies, a pro zoom and several primes (besides camcorder with an external mic) into my personal item on a plane. You mentioned "really great IBIS"... does it contribute to real image quality or not in real conditions? will MFT with this IBIS outperform FF at certain conditions or Canon RP 'always' win? You decide what's most important for you and make your choice, it's ok if for somebody it is Canon RP. By the way, even at testing conditions here at DPR, Canon RP seems to be only 1 stop better than EM 1.2 with respect to noise despite its 4x size sensor. Have you heard that the newest superzoom Canon made specifically for RP does not cover the whole sensor area at its widest setting, leaving the corners black? Do you wonder why? Canon had literally "to cut corners" to make this superzoom reasonably manageable.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

magnesus3

The IBIS is amazing in newer m43 cameras though. I've just been on a longer trip and even with lenses that don't have OIS the Pen F IBIS was doing miracles. Unimaginably long shutter speed and not a sign of movement at pixel level (allowed me to use ISO 200 in dark churches, mosques and caverns). I would need to sacrifice DoF or noise to get that on a camera without such good IBIS. For photographing of static objects (monuments, insides, caverns and for landscapes) it is irreplaceable. Unless you want to bring a tripod along and fight with guards to allow you to set it up.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

@DarnGoodPhotos I think you missing the point @Zvonimir Tosic is making :))

Oct 18, 2019permalink

I understand his point he is trying to make, but do you understand mine?

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

yes mate, totally :))

Oct 18, 2019permalink

btw just wanted to express here, he was not serious imo
about his analogy of tiny car and big van!
obviously if you are going for a tiny car, you wont buy a big van just because its big and you are getting more material for your money. I guess, he was laughing on people who do such silly mistakes!!!
we in technology world dont care big sizes and more material, but we pay for more potential and usability.
he further got very clear on this when he laughably said .. so what, if it will be too crowded i won't use my big van .. thats even better .. it will probably save him fuel and traffic on roads .. means he is just trying to be so obviously clear, that he is just joking .. of course there is no point in buying such a big car, or camera if you are not gonna use it :)

Oct 18, 2019permalink

i guess, you are very very sensible person, and maybe somehow missed the point that he was exaggerating to make his point clear!

Oct 18, 2019permalink

In the end the exaggeration made his point less clear.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

"In the end the exaggeration made his point less clear."

his point is pointless, a RX10 covers more than 90 % of use of m43 in much compact package. Why doesn't he buy Rx10 and call it a day.

The reason is that he himself does not truely want to solve that issue. Size does not matter to him if a smaller option is available.

If all these people were serious about size pentax Q was a hit system.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

LazyBear

Can you please check size, weight and cost of full frame 100-400, 600mm and then come back to check same on 100-400 Panaleica which is 200-800?

Oct 21, 2019permalink

Kopi-O

As an occasional shooter who's done most shots during trips I personally find this model quite appealing. I have recently upgraded my old EM10 to EM1 ii and although i really liked the handling and the power it offers, I've found it substantially heavier than what i would prefer. A friend of mine owns a A7iii with 24-70 and i've tried to carry it on my neck, definitely not a good idea.
I totally agree that from almost every aspect the old EM1 ii seems superior to this new model. However i think Oly gave their answer earlier this year when Pana jumped to FF. They said they will keep going m43 and the company is devoted to build the portable camera system everybody get's to use easily. This EM5 seems consistent with that. Those great merits we love and asked for from the high end OMD line: weather sealing, great IBIS, PDAF, pro Cap, high res, are now packed in a body as small and as light as the entry level EM10. I don't know what u guys thought but I would say great job Olympus.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Kopi-O

However I do understand it's overpriced especially if u focus on the specs. The whole environment also made it much less competitive. The target customer "Casual shooters" are much eaten up by those cutting edge smartphones these days. It seems clear that it's a mater of time when the whole digital camera market vanish as cellphones advance. I guess i will still miss the days when we had great fun with these beautiful machines.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

arjunmehta

Olympus is a funny company. With every iteration they seem to make their cameras more unsightly with more complicated form, and much more complicated to use. This trend seems to go back to their original OM film days.

The OM-1 (35mm film camera) was a marvel of design. Simple, elegant and classic. Then the OM-2, a few more dials and buttons. OM-3 more dials and buttons. OM-4... more dials and buttons, seemingly slapped on. Not to mention their consumer OM-*0 line...

The OM-D line is the same. The original EM-5 was simple and actually quite sophisticated. It let me take a photo without getting in the way. The EM-5 MII got a little more complicated with more switches, dials and buttons. The Mark III now looks like a Frankenstein.

Look at this: https://camerasize.com/compact/#289,594,835,wa,t

It's become Homer's Car.

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

gLOWx

When Olympus tried to simplify EM10 III, Olympus users complained about it (me included).
EM10 is going to disappear.
And EM5 may be just after.

You want simpler camera ?
Buy a PEN or a second hand OMD gen 1 😁

Because when you add features, you add complexity and buttons. And when you remove features... ppl don't buy.

Compare Sony and Olympus ergonomics.
And tell us back 😉
PS i own Sony AND Olympus cameras. And owned Fuji too.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Photoman

As a previous owner of a few Olympus M43 camera (and love them), it is had to part money, when all Olympus does it put a new body on an old sensor. At least when you buy a new model Sony A7 series camera, you get a new body and a new sens or.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

1. The sensor isn't even 3 years old yet.
2. It's a big upgrade over the mkII sensor. A bigger upgrade than from A7ii to iii.
3. The new features in the mkII are as or more significant than the leap from the A7ii to iii. Ie: autofocus in A7ii was poor, and was mostly fixed in the A7iii, just as afc was a weak point for E-M5ii, and will now be a big strength of mkIII.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Flow Friday

"At least when you buy a new model Sony A7 series camera, you get a new body and a new sens or."

Sony A7 II has the same sensor as the a7 (and that's the one from the A99).

Oct 18, 2019permalink

"Sony A7 II has the same sensor as the a7 (and that's the one from the A99)."

different versions of bionz x no

Oct 18, 2019*permalink

Vigi

bionz is processor not a sensor

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Jon Schick

But adding phase detection AF is a big deal and major upgrade. Even more so for people who held on to their Four Thirds E system lenses... Now they don't have to buy the E-M1 to use them.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

"bionz is processor not a sensor"

sorry was in hurry in morning so.

What can be asserted without evidence , can be denied without evidence so the claim

"Sony A7 II has the same sensor as the a7 (and that's the one from the A99)."

is not true, until a proof is presented.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Flow Friday

"is not true, until a proof is presented."

Dude, you have a lot to learn!
As Indiana Jones tought us: Truth can't be proven.
"If it's truth, you are interested in ...".

Oct 18, 2019permalink

LazyBear

Exactly. I got rid of first gen A7 bc AF was plain horrible in low light.

Oct 21, 2019permalink

Lone Tree

This camera seems great! STOKED to upgrade when the time comes. I’m currently using the e-m5 mark ii and love it, love the lenses, great system, so light and compact and excellent image quality. This will have better focusing, a bit more resolution/better sensor, better ibis, a bit lighter, pro capture, focus stacking... def a worthy upgrade!
All the hater are gonna hate, nothing new there. Those of us who love m43 have our reasons.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

mpix345

I'm an m4/3s shooter, not a hater, but I don't think the "upgrade" is nearly worth the money. That sensor just doesn't move the needle for me.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Lone Tree

Fair enough mpix345 , maybe you want more mp or high ISO performance? I think sony announced a new 38 or 48 mp m43 sensor maybe...? But this sensor makes sense for this model, the mark ii was 16, now this one is 20... I’m finding even with the 16 I can print 2x3 and it’s all good. I don’t know, not worth upgrading unless it’s the right time for you, but I am happy to see such a small, light capable body come out in m43... seemed like they were getting bigger and bigger and that’s not why I use this system.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

BennoFG

I'm so excited for this.
I can have the 40-150 f2.8 and this body for incredibly compact, high quality reach with great dof and now with great resolution (I rarely crop shots from a long zoom).
AND I can keep the A7riii with the 24 f1.4 attached with it's amazing dof as well.

If i need to swap a lens, then I can choose either the Sony 55 1.8 or the brilliant Oly 50 f1.2. to have a flexible 2 body wide to medium to long setup.

For the price, size and weight I think I'll have the most versatile and compact professional-quality kit ever made. Could not be happier.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

gLOWx

I use Sony A7 and Olympus too.
Olympus is for the system (amazing lenses,IBis..) and reach.

Sony is for adapting shorter/fast lenses, like Canon 58mm f1.2.
Use Apsc crop : 85mm f1.8 equivalent 😁

Oct 18, 2019permalink

kolyy

The Olympus 40-150mm/2.8 is "incredibly compact"? Are you kidding? Why not just buy the similarly sized Sony FE 70-300mm for the A7R III and get more background blur at shorter focal lengths and way more reach (450mm eq. @ 18Mpx)?

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Marcelobtp

This price seems complete madness.
I clearly understand the path of very high aggregated value, this is a trend Sony is leading the pack, we've seen RX100VI for 1200 dollars if i'm not mistaken, completely insane, still i think it appeals more to me than this one, because it's basically the best pocket-able camera.
This one? Is it the best on anything?

Oct 18, 2019permalink

beavertown

There is nothing so special about this camera, we all wants Olympus to do well but... this is the best they can come up with.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Landscapephoto99

Not bad, but it's just disappointing, especially given how Olympus always used to throw in something creative / new and fun with their EM5 introductions. Now, it's just meh. Like many here, I was hoping for Hand held high resolution in a smaller body, but I guess they are saving it to slowly milk it for as much money as possible, introducing it without change first in the EM1iii and maybe 3 years later finally in the EM5iv.

Sadly, Peter Pan has grown up and become a pirate. Olympus has grown up and become Canon.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Doug Janis

Overpriced.

Other than that, it's OK.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

andrew bentley

My accountant used to call it the 5 5 5 rule. Reduce costs by 5% saved you X amount, increase sales by 5% gave you Y amount, Increase prices by 5% gave you Z amount. Z amount was always significantly higher than the other two options. Interestingly, in the scenario he outlined you needed a 15% drop in volume before profits decreased to the pre price increase level.

It's no surprise then that the camera companies are pitching their pricing at the highest level they think the market will support at point of initial offer, before they inevitably discount or otherwise incentivise you to buy.

I bought my EM-1X at launch at the notional full price but got £200 off on trade in from Olympus. As time has passed those discounts are now a lot higher (Think it's £600 uk now).

Oct 18, 2019permalink

kristof93

Too little, way too late, for too much money. This isn't going to cut it, olympus.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Timbo101

My thoughts exactly.

I bought the original E-M5 when it first came out and didn't upgrade to the mark 2 as there was no noticeable difference in image quality. My E-M5 died a few months ago and I was considering waiting for the mark 3 but assumed it would be around $1,700 AUD (actually will be closer to $2k) with the same 20mp sensor that's been out for a while so I bought the Panasonic GX9 for $950 AUD instead.

The only reason I prefer Olympus over Panasonic is I think the colours are nicer but the price difference is just too much - it isn't worth twice the money. I can adjust the colours to my liking with Lightroom or Alien Skin Exposure...

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Ivan Guoh

I bought the original E-M5 when it came out too and I still have it. Just like you, I could not justify the mark 2 and skipped it. I also bought the GX-9 when it came out as the price was right but somehow it just does not connect with me so I sold it and am now back using my old E-M5. Sadly, I don't think I will buy the mark 3 at this price. I would have had this been the mark 2 so I agree with those who say that this is too little and too late. I love m43 for the size and weight. However, my new iPhone 11 Pro Max is so good I can use it for my family and holiday photos. As such, it may make more sense for me to sell away all my m43 gear and just get a simple FF camera with maybe one or two prime lenses.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Price in Toronto right now for the E-M1II is $1320 U.S./$1799.00 Can. Or, $121.00 more than the E-M5III's new price. You will have to be concerned mainly with the smaller dimensions and lighter weight in order to justify bying this new body, IMO.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Isn't that always going to be the case, when you compare a three-year old model with the launch price of a new one?

Yes, if you're shopping today, you could get an older, bigger model at a discount. A new model is always going to be launched at the top price it'll ever sell for, because it's all downhill from there.

If the depressed price of an older model ends up defining the launch price of the new one then your asking prices just get lower and lower. Soon enough you end up under pressure to sell for less than they cost to develop and make. That's not exactly a sustainable business model.

The E-M5 III's price will drop. The question is: does this model offer a compelling set of features, relative to its peers (and compared with the E-M1 II). It's $100 more than the E-M5 Mark II and $100 less than the Mark I were at launch. Compare it with the Fujifilm X-T3 or Sony a6600 and it looks alright, perhaps a touch steep compared with the Nikon Z50. I don't think it looks outrageous.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Why are you comparing camera bodies from different generationa? This should be compared to the E-M1III. Do you have the RRP on that?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Richard Murdey

Normally though the older, larger camera will have an older sensor and slower electronics. Here, since both cameras share the same internal platform, the comparison is very much valid I think.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

It's not uncommon for the same sensor and electronics to make their way down a lineup, and it's quite usual for the price gap at launch to be quite small, because the 'higher-end' camera has been on the market for longer.

The question is: are they distinct enough models that they both need to exist (maybe bearing in mind that the price gap may widen a little, once the camera hits the shelves)?

I'm not saying it's not a valid comparison, but I am saying it's hardly unprecedented, and that it isn't proof that the new model is overpriced.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Doug Janis

What this illustrates is the EM1.2 needs a new, much improved, flagship-level m43 sensor....yesterday.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

@Richard Murdey What are you talking about? The EM-5 III and E-M5 II are not the same.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Richard Murdey

We are talking about the EM1ii.

In any event price comparisons of this nature are pointless since the at-release price of the new model is always unrealistically high to allow discounts later and to help flush old stock out of the channel. Just wait 3 months.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

In a few months the price of this E-M5iii should settle at $999.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Does anyone seriously think this new E-M1II is somehow "less" than the E-M5III I compared it to, either in general specification or processing power? Regardless of the fact it's a "whole" year or so older?

Oct 17, 2019*permalink

j_dogg

@LoneTree1 Naw dude, it was only Critical Thinker that was reading things all wrong. That's a fair comparison. After seeing the E-M5 III, I'm now wondering whether I should just get a used E-M1 II for less.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

@Richard Murdey This EM-5 III replaces the EM-5 II, not the EM-1 II. RRP Price wise it should be compared to the RRP of the EM-1 III, and theres no way its just $100 or so cheaper.

Why do people compare different products from different product lines and different generations? Older stuff will always be cheaper. Lower end models will always have less features 🤦🤦🤦

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Difference being, I bought the E-M5 and E-M5II because there was nothing comparable when they were released. The E-M1 wasn't notably better (all things taken into account) than the E-M5II so I paid the $1199.00 it (the E-M5II) cost, happily. But given the circumstances now, I don't feel compelled to pay that for the E-M5III. Others will feel differently, and Olympus needs buyers so I hope it succeeds.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

junk1

I think it’s the smallest camera with sensor shift high res mode. GX9 lacks that feature. I hope panny comes out with competitor (I mostly have panny lenses).

Oct 18, 2019permalink

mpix345

The issue is that Olympus seems to think that a new camera deserves a big price even if it doesn't offer features and performance that justify it. I bought an original E-M5 a few months ago for $100. I doubt the MK3 will be much better for general use.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Richard Murdey

@Critical Thinker

"Why do people compare different products from different product lines and different generations?"

Because there's no law against it. If you are buying a camera, it's an open field.

The M1ii happens to have the same sensor and a similar generational feature set as the M5iii, the "trickle down" followup. Normally, the new model would be sufficiently cheaper, or failing that have sufficiently newer technology, to make it attractive. In the present instance, and at the current prices, the older camera may be the better value.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Doug Janis

Anytime camera models use the same sensor a 1:1 comparison on the rest of the features and specs is inevitable.

Either the EM5.3 is overpriced...or the EM1.2 is under-spec.

Probably a bit of both, especially the dated EM1.2 sensor.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

>Normally, the new model would be sufficiently cheaper, or failing that have sufficiently newer technology, to make it attractive. In the present instance, and at the current prices, the older camera may be the better value.

Again, this is not the E-M1 III. Stop getting confused. This is a lower end model that has better specs than its predecessor. Its not supposed to be a "replacement of the EM-1 II with the exact same specs". Just have a look at the form factor 🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦🤦

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Dantist

Really wanted to like em5 series, but always bought something else upon direct comparison (nex6 vs mk1, a7 vs mk2) because of the price/iq Ratio. Now it’s even worse for Oly with xt-30, xt2, a6300/6500, A7ii, Nikon d750 at the same or cheaper price. You can choose what you like, and all will give better IQ. The lens choices are also there: I just checked that even with Fuji you get set of 24,35,50, and 80 primes for the same money as m43 equivalents! All comparable size/weight and WR to boot! Sony Aps Glass is even cheaper, and even FF can be cheaper if you opt for Samyang for 35mm(great lens btw). Nikon is also a mature system with lots of older glass sufficient for 24mp available for peanuts. You really have to like oly to buy one now...

Oct 17, 2019permalink

It's interesting that you list lower end models (the X-T30 isn't weather-sealed, so the X-T3 is a more like-for-like comparison), or older models that have mostly been replaced (X-T2, a6300, a6500, a7ii).

All new cameras look expensive if you compare them to more basic or older and outgoing models.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

kristof93

Except that olympus built this "new" camera from old, "outgoing" components, so any such comparisons are valid. If an older model has better specs and performance then this thing is pointless.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

There are at least six models listed in the post, so I'm not going to try to discuss every single pro and con. I agree that many of the components here are familiar, but not that they're 'outgoing.'

I think you can make a case for the E-M5 III offering a combination of features: small size, really good IBIS, well-sorted ergonomics and good weather sealing, that other cameras don't offer. I've not used it yet, but so long as the AF is competitive, I think it looks pretty solid against the current competition.

But all new cameras look overpriced if you compare them to ones being sold off cheap. That's not a particularly useful analysis.

Oct 17, 2019*permalink

Vignes

its a m43 camera. the m43 users will see value. the sensor is physically smaller, it's a known point and m43 users knows the value of this i.e. smaller lens etc.
i used to own m43 system but now i use FF since the ownership cost has come down but ever since playing with the Em1X in the stores, i'm thinking about getting back to the m43 system. i still have some of the lens and flash.
i would rather have a FF system and a m43 system for compactness then having APSC with FF. apart from Fuji, all the other APSC makers invest less on lens development and rely on their FF lens line up. the m43 system has dedicated m43 lens design. Fuji is similar but their lens are larger and almost all their bodies don't have IBIS.
the m43 now has 3 AF lens makers i.e. Oly, Pana, Sigma.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

junk1

Gotta look at MSRP or price of prior versions when introduced.
If you buy at full price, you’ll have 3-12 months of use before prices fall....

Oct 18, 2019permalink

BazzzH

How can you go on about IQ and then throw Fuji into the equation? You must be joking.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

Dantist

@Richard Butler Oly is not bad camera, it's actually great camera! But it does not matter if camera is new or "old" if it's still up to snuff. I specifically did not want to enter pros/cons debate for the same reason as you, but I'd argue that my point on IQ was correct, so it has to come to other things like weather-sealing, lenses, etc. And my point was just that there's enough options to choose from depending on ones needs, and to have m5 needs need to be quite specific :)

Oct 18, 2019permalink

kristof93

It's not really a unique combination. The em1ii and couple of panasonic cameras offer the same thing for pretty much the same price. There are also cameras with way better iq and cheaper lenses around, for even less money, if you make some other compromises. It's a very disappointing, overpriced, recycled release.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

junk1

Well, it is a tad smaller than EM1ii (which does require engineering) but I wish it was a tad smaller.

Oct 19, 2019permalink

Kiwisnap

Shame that they used a different battery. Kills sales to anyone who was thinking of it as a second body.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

UllerellU

If this cost € 700 it would be the best camera enthusiast in the market. If I have to spend € 2,000 for it and the Oly 12-40 f2.8 I almost go to FF, I can get a Sony A7RII with Zeiss 24-70 f4 for the same price, it really seems like a great camera and I like it better than its APSC competition, but the same thing happens with the XT-30/6400 etc, if you join them at 16-55 f2.8, they are as expensive and designed as a good FF system, not an entry level one like A7 / A7II, one with BSI sensor, with very good AF and a DR and low Ligth ISO performance first (A7RII).

Oct 17, 2019permalink

tkbslc

If we are just making up our own prices, why not 300?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Dantist

I guess he meant used prices, but new body can be also had for 1300 eur in eu (I.e. gray from Ireland or via cashbacks). Couple that with 28-70 tamron (700 new) and you get a combo for 2k... 42mp FF combo with 2.8 standard zoom!

Oct 17, 2019permalink

UllerellU

It is not even necessary to resort to the gray market, at Amazon.es the A7RII has been at € 1,500, and € 550 on 24-70 f4 Zeiss, at stores in the Canary Islands or Andorra it is still at € 1,500, physical stores, authorized sellers of Sony I have 7 APSC lenses that have made me upgrade to A6500, but the A7II was € 150 cheaper, if I know that the A6500 surpasses the A7II in everything except ISO performance, but you already enter a system that is going to be converted In the standard. But the A7RII is something else, it already has a great AF, ISO and DR performance of "authentic" FF, nor would I buy an A6600 or an XT-3 ahead of this, also the lenses are very economical, FE 28 f2 , Samyang 45 f1.8, Sony FE 85 f1.8, 50 f2.8 macro, Tamrom 28-75 f2.8, even FE 24-105 seems like a bargain, they are cheaper than their APSC / M43 equivalents.

Oct 18, 2019permalink

ShatteredSky

What's with all those below moaning about the small grip or the bad ergonomics. For Pete's sake get the E-M1 line then. Finally most of the E-M1 II stuff in the right body form. The thing that bugs me is the price. Around 900 would have been alright.

Oct 17, 2019*permalink

BostonC

It's Panasonic's pettiness by giving G95, GX9 heavily cropped 4k and underwhelming AF-tracking that gives EM5 iii a good fighting chance to win market share. G9 is simply too heavy and big for most of the M43 core users.
Panny needs to address the big hole.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

onlyfreeman

100% agree with this.

In usual Panasonic style they can offer something similar to Olympus for a lot less money, e.g. G9 vs E-M1.2. So I would love to see a true competitor to the E-M5 III from Panasonic.

Oct 22, 2019permalink

Platinumkid

I recently bought a brand new EM1 II for $1250 on British Amazon. Why on Earth I would buy the same camera minus 1 card slot, for the same amount?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

StevoPhilo

Cause it's smaller and lighter?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

ShatteredSky

Because I do not like large grips.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Because its not the same camera?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

Rob-in-Alberta

because you collect cameras?

Oct 17, 2019permalink

onlyfreeman

Because you don't want Olympus to disappear?

Oct 22, 2019permalink

zyko

Finally it has 4K. This is what I missed most when I had the MK2. 4K paired with the frankly incredible Olympus IBIS will be fantastic for "hybrid" shooters.

Oct 17, 2019permalink

As long as the focusing AND IBIS both work with video.

Oct 17, 2019permalink