Nikon D780 Review

Preferably at night while using a crosstrainer.

2 days agopermalink

Macromind

From your comparison with the Z6 and evaluation I do not see how you can find the Z6 only 2 overall points higher or the D780 2 points less. After 3.0 firmware addition to the Z6/7 your evaluation of overall score needs to reflect the much needed improvements. After all the D780 is just a mirrored Z6 without the use of the fantastic Z series lenses. The Z's can adapt to the f lenses, but the D780 is stuck with the f lenses. Smaller, quieter, adaptable, and the future of DSLR, the Z6/7.

1 week agopermalink

Macromind:

There are big limitations on F lens use on a Z body.

The Z line isn't a DSLR line.

1 week agopermalink

LiOm Photography

@howboutraw what limitations are those??

1 week agopermalink

LiOm:

So lenses with AF won't AF.

There are aperture control limits for some lenses. You'll be setting your own aperture from the lens.

The F to Z adapter is not perfect and universal.

1 week agopermalink

Unfortunately none of the futuristic mirrorless cameras have an optical viewfinder. For some people this might be a reason why they prefer a DSLR.

2 days agopermalink

Ixoye

Nice camera, but there are more important things to spend money on in times of crisis.

1 week agopermalink

Snapper2013

Like what?

1 week agopermalink

jackspra

A flash.

1 week agopermalink

Ixoye

Hookers...

1 week agopermalink

Petka

Bourbon...

1 week agopermalink

srados

Toilet paper.

1 week agopermalink

Ramon767

I spend my money on drugs and hookers. I waste the rest.

1 week agopermalink

Jos12

Can anybody explain what is een rolling shutter?

1 week agopermalink

srados

Google is your friend.

1 week agopermalink

It happens when you drop your camera I guess.

2 days agopermalink

Amitava Ghoshal

Hi Rishi,
Its not clear what is meant by "and no risk of shutter-induced shake". Mirrorless cameras do not have mechanical shutter? Or you meant to say shake due to mirror movement. Please clarify.

Regards

1 week agopermalink

preferredfault

To be honest, my 5DMK1 puts out better IQ than what I'm seeing in these JPG's.

1 week agopermalink

Even my old 6D does a decent enough job.

2 days agopermalink

Mariano Pacifico

Should I spend Trump CARE stimulus check on D780?

1 week agopermalink

Unless you need it (or a replacement camera), no. Otherwise I would save your stimulus check.

1 week ago*permalink

Ramon767

Is a stimulus check socialism?

1 week agopermalink

Those who didn't file a return in 2018 or 2019 won't get one so you have to pay into the system to get one as long as you qualify (ie. don't make too much money to a point where it disqualifies you), so yeah probably. HOwever, I think they should have added a few more tiers ($50,000 would get $600, and under $25,000 would get only $300). While it does pro-rate after $75,000 I think it's only fair that those who paid in less, get less back in return--maybe that was in there, and maybe I missed it--but from my quick reading of the draft, it appears everyone who had an AGI of $75,000 or less gets $1200 (plus some other additional bonus if you have dependents/chidren, etc).

1 week ago*permalink

Dré de Man

How can you know you saw shutter shock and not simply mirror vibration? Did you also test with the mirror flipped up? I tested the camera next to a D800E at 180mm and also 1/30s handheld and my experience is exactly the opposite: the D800E reaches about 50% of the lp/mm the D780 reaches handheld in this extreme situation.

I personally think you're just spoiled after having used so many mirrorless cameras. 1/30 s at 200mm handheld is a little on the risky side for a DSLR, even with optical stabilization in my experience.

Of course, it's possible that your 70-200 /4 (I used a different lens) - in combination with VR and the D780 somehow causes vibration to be not optimally compensated. We'll probably never know why you did, but I didn't experience a shutter vibration problem with the D780. It's a DSLR, with a well-damped mirror, but with a mirror nonetheless, so vibration is slightly higher than with a mirrorless camera. That's all in my opinion.

1 week agopermalink

Tysk

DSLRs are dead?
So thinking about getting this. I love people photography but also want to take ice hockey and dog action pics. Thinking D500 (750 at bargain) or D780 / 750, as I have some great Nikkors and my D300 has finally given up. What’s my mirrorless option? (Or computational option, whatever that is?

2 weeks agopermalink

Spectro

z6, but d780 liveview is the same as the z6.

1 week agopermalink

Platinumkid

I had three of the new S-line lenses for my Z6. All three were better than their F-mount equivalents. The fact I cannot mount the new lenses on this camera makes it a poor buy for me. Without even mentioning the weird experience of having 2 different AF systems in the OVF and on the back screen. Plus, it has no IBIS, which I find useful. All in all - I wouldn't buy it. Which doesn't mean it's not capable of great stills and video and will not have happy owners, ofc.

2 weeks agopermalink

Doesn't seem like you are the target audience for this camera as you are a happy Z shooter. Obviously if you own and like s lenses you should keep using a z camera. Not sure ibis on the D780 would make a difference. Every Nikon DSLR with video has two different af systems. Nothing different except the incredible bump in quality of the live view performance.

1 week agopermalink

Exactly. This camera is more for people who have existing Nikon DSLRs and want to upgrade to another DSLR, and maybe at the same time dip their toe in the mirrorless waters and enjoy some of those advantages.

1 week agopermalink

opeom

Great camera! But I am a happy Canon 6d mark ii owner.

2 weeks agopermalink

Petka

Both companies make great cameras, switching between them costs a lot and should be done only for a good reason. Quality of photographs is 98% in the operator anyway.

1 week agopermalink

LenRivers

From a former D750 user what i was doing with said D750 I would buy another D750 over the D780 or just go to the D850 if you want to stay put with a DSLR

2 weeks agopermalink

LensRivers:

Okay, but that just says you don't shoot higher ISOs, above 12800, and that you don't need really good liveview+video AF. The D750 is an excellent stills camera. The D850 is also an excellent stills camera, but no it is not the high ISO body that the D780 is.

2 weeks agopermalink

There is still a decent price difference between the D850 and D780 (about $500 last I checked). The D780 is probably still better in low light than the D850, and the D750 (IMO) between the three, remains the king (if the D780's ISO performance is truely similar to that of the Z6). On my D750 I could shoot up to 3200 without the need for NR in post for most images, and could even get away with ISO 4000 as well. The D850 is realy good for people who need high res images (to print large or whatever) but there's a trade-off.

Obviously, all three are great stills cameras, but when you start talking about high ISO performance (and other minor things) that where the differences start to show with each model.

1 week ago*permalink

fz750

why on earth haven't they increased the number and spread of the focus points?! It looked good in 2014 but in 2020 it doesn't . A real mixed bag isn't it..?!

The D750 here is $1100, the D780 $2200 and the D850 around $2400 which is certainly food for thought..

1 week agopermalink

https://www.the-digital-picture.com/Photography-Tips/Canon-EOS-DSLR-Autofocus-Explained.aspx

I think some of it has to do with the limits of how certain AF is implemented in DSLRs (specifically, how AF is implemented for the OVF). I think that some DSLRs have up to around 150 points, but that's probably around the limit for a standard DSLR unless you start looking into special techniques of some sort. To get a high number of AF points (like 300 or more), I've only seen this on ML cameras because they use on-sensor technology for AF (same concept as using LiveView on a DSLR).

(This article is the about Canon's DSLRs but I would assume the reasoning is similar for Nikon and other DSLRs):

1 week ago*permalink

fz750

yes, but the D850 has 153, and they are more widely distributed, I am sure I am not the only one who expected an improvement in this area (I'm not interested in live view..)

1 week agopermalink

fz750:

As long as you weren't expecting the whole OVF.

I bet it's a different AF module than that in the D850.

1 week agopermalink

fz750

Actually, was just looking at the difference and there's not the hugest difference in the distribution between the d780 and the D850.. The D500 on the other hand has, by far, the best coverage!

1 week ago*permalink

fz750:

And the ratio of AF sensor size to OVF size is lower in the D500 than in the D780, D850, etc.

The D500 also has better OVF AF than either the D850 or the D780.

1 week agopermalink

Funny Valentine

Why would anyone buy this D780 over a Pentax K1-II ??

2 weeks agopermalink

FV:

Much better AF, much better at higher ISOs. That was easy.

Also one can mount vastly more lenses on it, including Zeiss Otus and Milvus lenses.

2 weeks agopermalink

Tibor1

Because of a much better AF maybe?

I own a Pentax K1 and like it very much. But the AF-C performance is currently far behind the competition. All else is superb, excellent ergonomics and UI.

2 weeks agopermalink

Um... if they are already invested in existing F-mount glass maybe, or they want to upgrade their D750 and not switch systems, among other reasons.

1 week agopermalink

Joed700

As a former user of the D750, the shutter shock issue was a deal breaker for me then. I'm surprised that they didn't address this issue with the D780.

2 weeks agopermalink

Tysk

It was and is the same with the D700. It has been fantastic. What is your chief concern with it - what does it prevent / make more cumbersome? I ask in peace.

2 weeks agopermalink

primeshooter

How come no low light AF section like the D750 review and most of the other recent reviews?

2 weeks agopermalink

Low light is covered a bit in the Image Quality section, and you can use the comparison tool to make your own assessments.

1 week agopermalink

primeshooter

The point I was making is the review isn't consistent with other reviews, why not keep the low light section and other's more similar for easier comparison? It's missing the -EV low light eye tests which were great in the D750 review...

1 week agopermalink

The D780 is another really high quality, solid release from Nikon, that unfortunately doesn't get its due, at least in online commentary. Over time this model will grow on consumers as people realize its inherent value, but that's been true of most of Nikon's recent releases, including it's Z series.

In today's world, when you release a new product, if you want attention and positive buzz it has to be perceived as offering something groundbreaking and cutting edge.

Sony did that for years with their alpha series FF MILCs. They were not necessarily the best overall, but they did offer new features that attracted attention. Now they are kind of getting beaten by those same rules, as their most recent releases haven't had much new stuff.

Canon seems to have that figured out now. With their 1DXIII they debuted all sorts of new and cutting edge features that got attention. Their R5 is the same way.

So cameras like the D780 unfortunately don't get the positive attention it should.

2 weeks agopermalink

Tibor1

In my opinion, majority of people perfectly understand the obvious quality of the camera.
The problem is with the fairly similarly priced d850 at the moment.
We can argue that there is a huge difference in these two cameras' life cycles, but in real life, the ACTUAL purchase price of the product is an important factor in the final equation.

2 weeks agopermalink

Chris J Newman

I have a D800, which I almost invariably use with a GPS sensor, that also functions as a wireless shutter release, connected to it. The D800, like Nikon’s other pro-spec DSLRs, has a 10-pin accessory terminal on the front. The D780 has its accessory terminal on the side. If you try to use a conventional “L” bracket to mount a camera on a tripod in portrait mode, anything plugged in to an accessory terminal on the side is likely to foul the tripod clamp. Positioning the terminal on the front avoids this problem. (I find the screw collar securing the 10-pin terminal fiddly to use, but that’s got little to do with its location). I came on this issue when looking at the possibility of switching to a Z7, which shares this issue, along with most of Nikon’s entry and mid-level cameras.

Chris

3 weeks agopermalink

agukha

"Image quality from its full-frame 24MP sensor is class-leading"

Well, not really, the image quality of the Pentax K1-ii is clearly better.

3 weeks agopermalink

agukha:

Um, image quality, whether it be from a Nikon or a Pentax is largely based on the lens used.

Now, for higher ISOs the body matters too, and the Nikon is a much better higher ISO body than the Pentax K1-II. (The D780 is a much better higher ISO body than pretty much any camera save the S1, Z6, and 1DXIII--likely the D6 too.)

2 weeks agopermalink

torogeephoto

The Pentax k1-ii has 36 mp lol.

2 weeks agopermalink

Tysk

Um, image quality is largely determined by who is holding the camera. That’s a good thing.

2 weeks ago*permalink

forest dream

Image quality is largely determined RAW post-processing software algorithm e.g. Lightroom. How many percentage image manipulated during RAW post-processing?

1 week agopermalink

forest:

"Image quality is largely determined RAW post-processing software algorithm e.g. Lightroom. "

Nope. You've confused good or bad raw file processing with IQ.

Also you neglected the massively important fact that IQ, at low ISOs--below 1000 for large sensored 2019 ILCs, is nearly entirely determined by the lens used.

1 week agopermalink

agukha

well, when I say that the image quality of the Pentax K1-ii is clearly better, it is based on the image quality comparator of dpreview. But if you say it is useless and biased, and that maybe a 645Z is worst than a D780 because of the lens or the user or else... well, you should never look at tests. But for most of us it is a good way to compare ;)

1 week agopermalink

agukha:'

And my claim is based on having tried both the K1II, and the Nikon D750+D780, and the A7RIV, A7RIII, D850, 5DSR.

Again, bodies have little to do with better IQ.

You can download raws real world raws from most of these cameras. But pay attention to the lens used and only look at raws shot below ISO 1000.

1 week agopermalink

Arastoo Vaziri

The what we don't list makes me wonder whether the reviewers think this is a camera for toddlers.
- Default JPEG noise reduction can be a tad aggressive: who shoots JPEG with a camera like this?
- No built-in flash: really?

3 weeks ago*permalink

NZ Scott

News photographers routinely shoot jpeg.

5 days agopermalink

The latest CIPA numbers are in.

Compared to January 2019 sales numbers, the DSLR category is down 30%.

New buyers of digital cameras are not buyers of DSLRs.

1 month agopermalink

pro photo 2011:

How many new models of DSLRs have come out since Jan 2019?

4 weeks agopermalink

The camera business is down >20% world wide. There are no new buyers more or less.

2 weeks agopermalink

@HowaboutRAW

Last hurrah for the DSLR category.

2 weeks agopermalink

pro photo 2011:

Not an answer to my question.

Anyhow, there'll be Nikon D7, a Nikon D870, a Canon 1DXIV, and several more some with APSC sensors.

2 weeks agopermalink

ed rader

goodbye nikon

1 month agopermalink

Rolleix

I like to try it with the 200 f2 VR to see how it does compare to my D750.

1 month agopermalink

SLOOPB

I customized a button the D780 for HDR but it doesn't work because if you have HDR off in the menu it does not turn on using the button. And if you have HDR on in the menu as single shot it works once only. And if you have HDR on in the menu for series it shoots HDR whether one uses the button or not.

2 months agopermalink

25 shot RAW + JPG buffer? Really? That's it? I was seriously thinking about trying one out but that buffer is smaller than the one in my Z6.

2 months ago*permalink

Thematic

Whoa! you are right.

4 weeks agopermalink

Nice Job Nikon. The DSLR is far from dead.

2 months agopermalink

Let's see what the sales numbers show us. They've already started offers, so that doesn't seem like a good sign.

2 months ago*permalink

Interesting response. Do you want DSLRs to die?

2 months agopermalink

I dont :)

2 months agopermalink

The latest CIPA numbers are in.

Compared to January 2019 sales numbers, the DSLR category is down 30%.

New buyers of digital cameras are not buyers of DSLRs.

1 month agopermalink

The majority may not be. So what

1 month agopermalink

@CaPi

"The majority may not be."? You are not willing to face the facts. A decline of 30% year-over-year and you said "The majority may not be". Ha ha.

So the DSLR will vanish in the not-too-distant future, like the Twin Lens Reflex (TLR) that was popular from the 1930s to the 1960s.

The diminishing sales number signal death of the DSLR category - like it or not.

1 month ago*permalink

Those are not facts - only your interpretation. Of it were? Mirroless would follow - the overall numbers are declining as well.
Just removing the mirror isn’t going to save cameras if computational photography options aren’t included way beyond what is on the market today. Ironically Olympus seems to be the first mover on that.
That said:
I am considering buying a dslr again.It will be available and it will be excellent.

1 month agopermalink

@CaPi

What interpretation? They are just cold and hard numbers.

Nikon and Canon became scared and started making non-reflex cameras two years ago.

All the best that you buy a DSLR again.

They won't be flying off the shelf for sure.

1 month ago*permalink

@pro photo

The devil is in the details. I mean, Mark Twain said, there are three kind of lies, lies, damn lies and statistics.

So, you are talking about the death of dslrs, and yes maybe you are right. But Mirrorles lost ~ 15% value. Thats not a good sign.
And if you look.by competitors in the mirrorless segment, Sony is dropping the most in the mirrorless segment. Why? Well because CaNikon entered the mirrorless segment.

So even that you are a pro Sony fan, you have to realize the facts that, the only reason why DSLR is dropping and mirrorless not dropping so much is all about CaNikon.

2 weeks agopermalink

@Bumblebees

The DSLR market is an already small niche that is dying.

These "new" DSLRs are the last hurrah.

Canon and Nikon smelled the trend two or three years ago. That's why there are also non-reflex cameras from them.

There will always be a dedicated camera market, even if it shrinks as the smartphone cameras gain capability.

As to the DSLR market, well, you can always find them in the used market on eBay and elsewhere.

2 weeks agopermalink

@pro photo

Its not that. What I pointed out is that mirrorless is not really making the market bigger. The ONLY reasons why mirrorless doesnt shrink as fast as DSLR’s is because CaNikon after many years of testing jumped on the ship. They put their eggs in another basket.

When they did they made a giant step in terms of bayonett size and flange. So, even though the market is shrinking CaNikon has put themselves in a nice position from a lens technology view.

But then by looking at D780 it really combines the advantages with DSLR’s with the advantages for mirrorless.

Fantastic battery capacity, nice grip, nice balance, sturdy built, very good af (i.e high hitrate), ovf and mirrorless af for liveview an movie, n-logg 10 bit, 12 step dynamic range in movie.

So, if I had a bunch of f-bayonett lenses I would defenetely take the D780 as a camera that could be interesting.

2 weeks agopermalink

@Bumblebees

Those who have a bunch of F-mount lenses most likely have dumped them in the used market.

A person having 3 lenses, for example, will not buy the EXPENSIVE D780 just so he can continue to use those lenses.

How many people out there have 5 or more F-mount lenses?

If Nikon is aiming at these people, there are not too many of them.

And they have to overcome D780's high price hurdle.

2 weeks ago*permalink

I do. More than 5

2 weeks agopermalink

I have several F-mount lenses but I wouldn’t hesitate to sell them on eBay to jump to a new system or another brand. For now, I have no issue using them on my Z6 via the FTZ adapter. I’m also enjoying the awesome performance of the 24-70 F2.8S. If all the new lenses are that much better, I’ll have all Z lenses soon.

2 weeks agopermalink

@pro photo 2011

I guess you are not a pro. Pro = professional = some one who works professionally = earns money on what he/she does.

One of the most stupid decisions you can do as a pro is to get rid of older and nice stuff that you know works and dont let you down when the work HAS to be done. Meaning no matter what weather or situation it is - cause the buyer still need his pictures.

So, if were a pro I could choose between using the old f lenses on the new Z as well.
But if I were going on a football game, shooting for a news agency and had three cameras in front of me to choose from, eg. A7III, Z6 and D780,
I would most probably pick the D780 of several reasons, like af/hitrate, batterycapacity, grip/balance with bigger lenses, menues.

Btw, if you like to visit a pro page. Google on eg ”D850 + nps” there are a lot of settings tips how you as a pro could/should use eg the af in various situations.

1 week agopermalink

You can go on criticizing and complaining but the DSLR sales will continue to diminish.

1 week agopermalink

So will the mirroless sales.

1 week agopermalink

That's not the point.

It is that the non-reflex camera is REPLACING the DSLR.

1 week ago*permalink

@pro photo 2011

Well, maybe you didn’t read my text so good.
Yes DSLR will in sometime vanish, still many of them are good enough or for some users like sportsfotographers, still better.

And the original thing was about the D780. And the D780 will be a joy for many of the users with a big chunk of f-bayonett lenses. And when they change to mirrorless, they can still use their old lenses. I.e. There is no reason to sell the old f-bayonet lenses, except if you change system.

1 week agopermalink

And no one mentions the lack of the grip option.

2 months agopermalink

Not again

2 months agopermalink

Not again what? I did not mean to blame Nikon for removing the grip option because even DPR doesn't care about it.

2 months agopermalink

EDWARD ARTISTE

Look, no grip is pathetic no matter who does it. It's lame, dumb, pathetic, sad, foolish, ridiculous, nonsensical, etc etc etc

Feelings wont change facts. Even rebels can get a grip (pun!)

1 month agopermalink

Are you 13?

1 month agopermalink

EDWARD ARTISTE

No, but your ridiculous question doesn't hide the fact that Nikon doesn't want this to be a cheaper D5. Even 13 year olds can see that. It might have gone over your're head.

Whatever you meant by your assertion that even dpreview doesn't care, doesn't mean anything. It seems like desperation or just convenient stupidity that a few of the camera makers have been creating grips that either have no functionality or like this sad example of no grip at all.

Make a great camera and then limit the options. Good job Nikon, whatever helps the bottom line.

1 month agopermalink

Ok, so you are temperamental 14. How does D780 with would be grip compare to D5? D5 is top of the class camera while D780 even with the grip no one bought is the bottom of the line camera.

1 month agopermalink

The no grip controversy was way overblown. Most never bought it for the D750. Why should Nikon invest money in making an accessory that most will not want and end up giving them away? Most don't realize that it would cost Nikon to make a grip for this camera, in terms of development, manufacture, inventory, etc.

And no way would adding a grip to a D780 make it a sort of D5/D6. Anyone who says that has never used a D5. Nikon is not trying to protect that market.

They know the sales figures and they know the grip was not used by the majority of users in this market.

2 weeks agopermalink

In respect of dpreview's comment on electronic viewfinders, I put my eye to the Sony 6400's viewfinder and was shocked at how poor an experience it was in respect of my experience of the Xpro-1 electronic viewfinder. That's right, a camera from 2012.

I haven't tried any other Sonys but on that basis I would be wary of not trying out modern electronic viewfinders before purchase.

You have been warned.

2 months agopermalink

I love the viewfinder in my Z6.

2 months agopermalink

I'll hopefully try one out soon.

2 months agopermalink

rbach44

Some are much better than others. The Nikon Zs and the Panasonic SL's are rather nice.

A bad EVF, however, feels like a crappy tv pressed to your eye. Totally unpleasant and does account for much f the EVFs out there. I'll take a crappy OVF over an EVF any day.

2 months agopermalink

https://petapixel.com/2019/11/12/nikon-says-its-cameras-need-to-justify-their-existence-as-a-business/

Good point. Not all EVFs are created equal. The best ones I've tried out are the ones for the Panasonic S1R and the Fuji GFX100...which makes sense since they are the same component. The EVFs for the Nikon Z and the Canon R are also quite nice.

Most of the Sony's have average EVFs...kind of ironic since with Sony's background in TV and smartphone displays you think they would have this figured out better. I also tried the A7R4, which has the same EVF panel made by Sony as the Panasonic and Fuji...but it didn't perform as well in the Sony. It just didn't look quite as nice. Again, ironic.

But as mirrorless cameras grow in use, most reviewers should review the EVF more rigorously as it does matter a lot to the whole user experience of the camera.

2 weeks agopermalink

StoneJack

Just to give some information about those *Sony Northrop* who think is that Nikon is dying or sort of.

In 2016, Nikon operating profit was 35 billion yen, operating margin 4.2%, return on equity (ROE, profitability) 5.5%.

In 2019, Nikon's operating profit is 82.6 billion yen *up by 67.6 billion.
Operating margin: 11.7% or up by 9.5%
return on equity (ROE) 11.2% or up by 9.4%.

Operating profit of 82.6 billion yen is HIGHEST since 2010.
R&D expenditures in the fiscal year ended March 31, 2019, totaled ¥63.9 billion, an increase of ¥3.2 billion year on year.
It paid dividends per share in the fiscal year ended March 31, 2019, amounted to ¥60, which is increased by ¥24 from the previ- ous fiscal year and, indeed, highest since 2010.

In incoming years with intensified investment, company targets ROE no less than 8%,12% by 2023, focuses 40% of its resources on strategic investment.

2 months ago*permalink

StoneJack

In 2020, Nikon is planning to increase its investment and establish foundations for growth. It targets areas of 3D Printers, Laser processing systems, Integrated optical processing machining solutions, 3D measurement systems in digital manufacturing, sports imaging, robot vision, healthcare with cell culture applications, AI diagnosis.

In Imaging division (cameras) Nikon declared focus in incoming years on full frame cameras, video, completion of Z line, high mid end DSLR, swift product launches and frequent improvement cycles.

2 months agopermalink

MILC man

nikon overall financials are not very relevant to nikon camera owners, who are justifiably concerned about the future of nikon imaging:

"Nikon Says Its Cameras Need to Justify Their Existence as a Business

...In its 2nd quarter results for fiscal year 2020, Nikon revised its financial forecasts for the year, dropping its predicted revenue from the imaging business from ¥260 billion to ¥235 billion (a drop of nearly 10%) and lowering the operating profit from ¥12 billion (~$110 million) in profit to a loss of ¥10 billion (~$92 million).

Nikon blames the forecast change on an “overestimation of market size/share” and the fact that the shift toward full-frame mirrorless cameras away from full-frame DSLRs “has not accelerated as expected.”

...In other words, Nikon cameras and lenses need to start contributing to Nikon’s bottom line again instead of weighing it down."

2 months ago*permalink

MILC man

This is relevant to nikon camera owners, and it is a disaster:

"Performance by the [Nikon] Imaging Products Business:

...However, overall unit sales of both digital camera-interchangeable lens type and compact digital cameras fell amidst the shrinking market. As a result, revenue for the Imaging Products Business decreased by 21.1% year on year to 119,054 million yen, and operating profit fell by 84.7% year on year to 2,026 million yen."
https://nikonrumors.com/2019/11/07/nikons-q2-financial-results-are-out-2.aspx/

2 months ago*permalink

ed rader

maybe Nikon will make more noct lenses

1 month agopermalink

EDWARD ARTISTE

Facts will always good

1 month agopermalink

rbach44

Even as a Nikon fan, who will love just about anything they do, I don’t quite see how how this is a mirrorless/SLR crossover. It seems likes an SLR with well executed live view and video features.

If they had only figured out how to cram an at least somewhat capable IBIS unit in here, it would be real winer. Right now its just another iteration of a very good camera.

Though knowing Nikon, there are portably a ton of little refinements that don’t make the spec sheet that make it a lovely camera in actual use. And the current generation of Nikon color is worth the price of admission alone. My D600 will need a replacement one day...

2 months ago*permalink

It is called a crossover because it doesn't just have improved live view. It has the Z6 live view. People seem to forget about the flip screen. When using the flip screen, one has access to Z6 functionality while shooting stills. Why else was the flip screen introduced before great live view was introduced? I don't care about ibis. And, I do appreciate all of the upgrades to the D750. I haven't pulled the trigger yet. Maybe after my tax refund or during the end of year sales.

2 months agopermalink

D850, D500 also have flip screens. Does it make them mirrorless crossovers?

2 months agopermalink

C'mon Sushi, that is no response to what I just said. I brought up the Z6's live view in the D780 which the D500 and D850 clearly don't have. Shooting video or stills with that fantastic live view, and shooting stills with the great ovf af is what makes this a crossover. But, you know that.

2 months agopermalink

But what does it have to do with the flip screen? Id D780 did not have a flip screen wouldn't it still be a crossover?

2 months agopermalink

If if's and buts were candy and nuts.

2 months agopermalink

Sushieater, if you have used liveview on older DSLRs then you know they are not equivalent to mirrorless performance and a pro photographer wouldn't often use them.

However here it is equivalent, and you get both worlds (other than for the no viewfinder in mirrorless mode).

2 months agopermalink

Do you normally read what person says or just trying to push your agenda?

2 months agopermalink

Huh? Who's pushing an agenda? Seems like you might have an agenda.

2 months agopermalink

You posted an answer that is not related at all to what I said. What do you call it?

2 months agopermalink

SushiEater, whatever.

2 months agopermalink

gameshoes3003

I too don't see it as a "cross-over". Nikon simply caught up to Canon for having a nice live view experience.

1 month agopermalink

paolo robaudi

I still use d800, I don't understand all this rush about new camera, all I need I still do with d800. Again, I don't understand Sony camera, it's like use a mobile for take pictures.

2 months agopermalink

muljao

To be fair the d800 is probably all the camera most would ever need.
Sony menus would probably become second nature to you if you needed to use them

2 months agopermalink

IdM photography

I had the D800E... very good image quality, better than any currently sold Canon,, but the AF is very poor in low light... I then bought a Pentax 645Z, the AF in low light was so much better (Single shot AF, not continuous AF.)...

2 months ago*permalink

RubenS89

Better than any currently sold Canon? Right....

2 months agopermalink

IdM photography

Yes... Maybe the R7 will change that... or maybe not...

2 months ago*permalink

Until you run low on light. ISO 102,400 on the D780 looks better than 25,600 on the D800. https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/image-comparison/fullscreen?attr18=lowlight&attr13_0=nikon_z6&attr13_1=nikon_d800&attr13_2=nikon_d810&attr13_3=nikon_d780&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=25600&attr16_1=25600&attr16_2=25600&attr16_3=25600&normalization=print&widget=629&x=-0.03133269365502396&y=-0.9689982728842834

2 months ago*permalink

muljao

@DAN I don't take pics of black cats in coal mines without flash so it doesn't matter too much to me :)

2 months agopermalink

You can realize the difference in plain old everyday indoor shots. With new technology, you can increase the shutter speed to reduce blur, or you can close the aperture to increase depth-of-field. It's funny how I thought this exact same thing when the Fujifilm S1 Pro came out. Hey but back then I was limited by film. One thing's for sure though. With my Z6, my flash use has gone down dramatically and with that, my images look so much more natural.

2 months ago*permalink

muljao

@Dan I agree, it was an attempt at a bit of humour. Enjoy the Z6, looks the business

2 months agopermalink

oh :)

2 months agopermalink

gameshoes3003

I enjoyed my D800 until last December when I sold it off it modernize my equipment. If you don't see any benefits with the newer cameras then cool, you've saved some money.

1 month agopermalink

vytautasengineer

As can be seen from the gallery, AF-S Nikkor 35mm F1.8G ED is not good, because it is soft in the corners.

2 months agopermalink

chambeshi

Following on the D750 the D780 could – indeed should – be ideal for sport and wildlife photographers. And Nikon marketing ranks these genres highly eg sports. The D780 is relatively affordable with excellent low-light capabilities, 51-point AF using the D5 algorithm running on Expeed6.

Download pdf of the Manual, here one reads Good and Very Bad in Custom Options. Excellent menu expansion by adding the customizable Z i-Menu: respective Setups in Stills, Movie and Playback. Great features cloned across from the Z6/Z7 (which cannot customize the i-Menu in Playback by the way?)

Nikon have now thrown out the ability that’s standard in current DSLRs (eg D500, D850) to map key Features to Fn/Pv etc: notably you cannot use AF-On+AF-Area Mode on a Fn button. Seriously?! Users shooting action don't buy a crippled DSLR that's otherwise a very decent camera. Crass stupidity yet again by Nikon. Free Advice - Get a Used D850 or D500. At least until Nikon upgrades the D870 Firmware.

2 months ago*permalink

dpierredp

" Default JPEG noise reduction can be a tad aggressive " Hmmm AA filter!

2 months agopermalink

threw the lens

I'm not interested in "convergence" of DSLR with mirrorless lines, though I understand why Nikon is tempted to do it. If you want to shoot video you really would be better served with an electronic viewfinder and sensor stabilisation. Decide what you want. Because here you get a DSLR with no facility for adding a grip, no flash and no flash commander. I'd rather have a DSLR which excells at stills instead of trying to behave like a mirrorless video camera which it can't match.
Different types excell at different things. Mirrorless is not going to supplant DSLR for certain applications anytime soon.
If Nikon had presented the D780 to me as a mature camera which would have accepted a battery grip then I would have been kinder about it. Not having this screams "consumer toy" to me. Sorry, but using pro cameras it's the way I feel.

2 months ago*permalink

But why the 'instead of'? It does excel at stills. The D750 also had live view but was barely useful. If one wants better still photography all by itself get the next D8xx. The D780 offers the best stills photography at this price point (not counting years old cameras or used) as well as having live view. I don't know about you, but I like the idea of having top notch live view for my macro work. I use live view when on a tripod shooting macro. Of course, it's not for everyone and is not going to sell anything like the D750 did. That is of no concern to me.

2 months agopermalink

G Master

DSLR camera reviews are reading more of a copy and paste review from yesteryears.

2 months agopermalink

Richard Butler

Or is it that DSLR cameras are being built by raiding the parts bin?

2 months ago*permalink

StoneJack

@ G master
Yea, not every article praises Sony... i feel your pain

2 months agopermalink

rbach44

"Or is it that DSLR cameras are being built by raiding the parts bin?"

If this is true then mirrorless camera updates are nothing but big ol' firmware updates.

2 months agopermalink

GV65

This comment is spot on ! DSLR reviews always discuss pixels and focus and colors and light over and over again.... truly boring and far too repetitive stuff for people who have been around for a while. I believe DPReview urgently needs innovative forums on gardening, pets and knitwear for a change ...

2 months agopermalink

Good to see Nikon is back with SD card, lot of Nikon users (including me) couldn't buy z6/7 due to the XQD slot... that too a single one!

2 months agopermalink

ROFL, what a joke of an excuse !

2 months agopermalink

Joke or not, Nikon lost quite a few faithful customers for that...

2 months agopermalink

saiko
Can you name any?

2 months agopermalink

salko, if you drop your Nikon system because Z cameras are only sporting one XQD/CFE card slot, frankly, you should stop photography and just goto unboxing youtuber business.

Sorry, but you can bark as loudly as you want, that "only one slot is a utterly bad failure" is just a lame argument for SONY fanboys that were p1ssEd of after years of bashing from Canikon dSLR owners with dual slot memory cards bodies. I never understood why that lame argument was used, as it was lame and insignifiant, period.
There are still many point MILC that are critcable, but frankly the single slot pseudo fiasco was not one.

Oh, by the way, even if memory cards don't look to worn out, actually silicom does worn out.
Just get new memory card on regular basis, especially the one of the worst design aka SDcard (smartCard were even more a pity, of course, with sturdy but epic "confidential" SONY memory stick)

2 months ago*permalink

Mared

Gon0S You're so in the minority to think a single card slot wasn't a gigantic failure in the Z series cameras. The amount of negative press it generated was incredible. This mis-step has and does clearly negatively affect the sales of these cameras and correspondingly the health of Nikon as a camera manufacturer.

4 weeks agopermalink

@Mared
ROFL
For scared guys using 10 years old SDcard because they can shell out thousand of USD for a new system, but unable to sustain 100USD card budget/year...

Seriously, get a life. Do you really worry your smartphone does only sport onto a single mass storage unit ? your car ? Frankly, this noise was so a pity coming from guys with lame and poor knowledge what they are talking about. But of course, it was as failure, as every body were touting it HAS TO BE A FAILURE.

Worst part, most of the whiners do not even use both slot as a backup but just overflow... really an epic failure... for the brain of whiners and all the army of rich unboxer selfcalled geniuses of videography

3 weeks agopermalink

@Gon0S Because of XQD I won't buy Z6 or Z7 for half the price, I won't even buy it second hand! But that's me, you don't have to agree!

SD Card is not 10 but more than 20 years old but it keep getting updated in terms of speed, capacity and reliability (the latest being SD-UC).

Not everyone interested throwing away more than 10 times (~20USD for 128GB SD Card vs 200USD for 120GB XQD) money one memory card for not any significant benefit in day to day use. Even Sony doesn't put it in their top of the line FF cameras even though they are a leading manufacturer of XQD cards. Most probably Nikon realized its blunder and will avoid in its next FF mirrorless iteration.

If you want to spend your money one such expensive and obscure cards that's doomed to fail, good for you! But no need to get so worked up that others are not doing the same...

2 weeks agopermalink

The best way to take advantage of XQD speed is to use it as a hard drive. In cameras it's advantage is debatable.

2 weeks agopermalink

@saiko
Hey, do you know you are playing with expensive devices and expensive lenses but cannot sustain a 80USD payload for a memory card ?

Seriously, you are acting like a child. But do whatever you want, touting how wonderfull your SONY camera is when it struggle to empty its buffer to the über wonderfull SDcards...

I don't own any XDQ/CFE cards, but your claims are just poor. Just tell us you are absolutly not intersted in any Nikon device because you are so much in blind love with what you barely managed to buy because of the hype or needs, but please, stop with that ridiculous argument.

2 weeks agopermalink

@tbcass
D850 and D5 nor Z6/Z7 seems to be suffering from running XQD cards, or are you trying to convince us there is no benefits ?
Did you ever tried to transfert 64GB of a SDcard vs 128GB from a XQD to your SSD ? Will you try to tell us there is no difference either there ?

Oh, yeah, the new hope is to only have onboard storage and transfert files through wifi, it is really that your best wish for the storage future ?

2 weeks agopermalink

Gon0S
I said "In cameras it's advantage is debatable." I stand by that. I can dump 64GB of files in a couple minutes with a standard SD card. If the XQD card cuts a minute off that time it's not something that I consider a big deal. I'm not that impatient.

2 weeks agopermalink

@Gon0S If Leica, Sigma (or even Canon) had used XQD card I won't give two hoots about it because I don't own any of their gears... the very fact I am talking about it is because I care about Nikon. I have been using Nikon system since the film era. I have quite a few Nikon bodies (film, dx, fx) and tens of lenses. I was eagerly waiting to get the Nikon FF mirrorless but they brought that fugly design with an obscure and expensive memory card... had I not been invested in Nikon I would have moved to another platform long ago.

Also, you can't seem to comprehend that there are fast SD Cards that are way faster than cheap slow and trash you seem to be using.

If you don't even use XQD card (or Nikon Z6 or 7) then why are you going around whinnying about it?!

2 weeks agopermalink

Mared

saiko - Thank you for proving/being an example of my point - my earlier post a couple of comments earlier :). The fact that it upset Gon0S so much that he had to make a long rambling reply to me makes it even better.

2 weeks agopermalink

Some people give the impression that a camera could be the best at everything possible but if it didn't use an XQD card it would be unacceptable.

2 weeks agopermalink

@tbcass I guess Nikon was expecting their XQD would to be a great hit!! How many 'best' cameras are using XQD by the way, I don't see many...

2 weeks agopermalink

saiko
My statement was hypothetical. There is no "best" camera. You could insert any other feature in place of XQD card and somebody would reply that it's absence was a massive mistake or even made the camera unacceptable. Examples I've seen are 2 card slots and articulating LCD, I'm sure you can think of others.

2 weeks ago*permalink

tbr63

It might sound strange, but having used Nikon digital cameras for more than 10 years, the "i" menu function in the D780, taken from the Z6/Z7, is a fantastic improvement in usability, even compared to many other cameras it is a no brainer. As example setting exposure delay is now very simple compared to a function button on front in combination with a selector wheel or digging deeply in menues. And changing focusing mode was earlier only possible with dedicated oddly placed button and selector wheel...It is a pitty that DPreview won't spent more time and attention on this camera. They write that the D780 has the Z6 functions, but people needs to know then the Z6....so who is the review for then?
The Fujifilm X-T200 get a lot of attention and understandable, still the D780 is not an upgrade to D750, it is a brand new camera that maybe deserve a bit more attention. And DSLR lives on, Canon get a lot of attention with the new 1 DX MKIII.

2 months agopermalink

Leonp

Looking at the studio test scene samples I think moire is quite bad. It seems to me that using modern, very sharp, lenses is not the greatest idea on a camera with 24,5 MP on a full frame sensor.

2 months agopermalink

Jhaakas

Why would they not put in IBIS when they had it in Z6!!
Probably due to the existing lenses being OIS... not sure if it would interfere

2 months agopermalink

Jurgen M Lobert

Because that is their DSLR paradigm, and because it would require a complete redesign of the camera, IBIS needs space in the back, while maintaining the distance from the sensor to the lens.

2 months agopermalink

Jhaakas

They were able to put it in Z6 so space is not an issue. It is already designed so will be just an adaptation in dslr.
Strangely, they dropped ibis from z50 as well...

2 months agopermalink

The Z6 is a newly designed camera.

2 months agopermalink

Stanchung

Don't think the joystick omission is a deal breaker. The opposite is true because I'm left eye viewer. My nose would be in it.

2 months agopermalink

Matsu

Can't wait to see what the D6 AF module does in the D880.

2 months agopermalink

chambeshi

Yes! a D880 could be tempting. Hope Nikon chase this up pronto, as it should sell steadily with key Z features but it will be stillborn if they kill off the best in the D850. Vital to keep broad Custom options especially in the flexibility to shoot with complementary AF controls.

It will be equally terrible if the D880 does NOT get its Vertical grip using the ENEL18. Simplest to maintain compatibility with the MB-D18

2 months ago*permalink

primeshooter

Why are these reviews not consistently keeping the low light AF testing part? Like in the D750 and 850 reviews? I don't see one here, is this review finished?

2 months ago*permalink

ElDiablo73

i disagree with the title.

Unless the camera operator is going to use the D780 on a 3-axis gimbal, there's nothing great about shooting a DSLR using the rear screen, especially when using a heavier lens.

For sure, having better 4K on a stills camera like the D780 is great but I would definitely choose the Z6 if video was my priority (actually I have already chosen the Z6 to complement my D750).

2 months agopermalink

Kind of why the flip screen was invented.

2 months agopermalink

Peter Hayward

"....should significantly improve the D780's AF performance..." as this is a review I would have thought the word 'should' wouldn't be valid?

2 months agopermalink

They didn't seem to do a significant amount of testing of the af system. Most of the statements were pretty general about the image quality as well. Read like a spec comparison.

2 months agopermalink

bdbender4

As a Z6 user, this strikes me as a blast from the past. Fine if that's what you want, I guess. I notice that the 12fps rapid shutter on the 780 has significant rolling shutter, so I wonder a little about the conclusion that this is a better sports shooter than the Z6.

(I also notice that this review perpetuates the silly DP Review "banding in the deep shadows" thing for the Z cameras, which is not real-world-significant. Really, you purposely underexpose by 6 or 7 stops all the time? Can we see the comparative results of this from the 780? Never mind, rhetorical question, waste of time.)

2 months agopermalink

Check out this review:
https://youtu.be/IB_q2M1qOys

The D780 is significantly better than the Z6 when a file is pushed. The color shift in the Z6 file is so glaring. I think it best to look at thorough comparison studies from people with excellent testing skills before just trampolining on the Z6. This is the best review I have seen so far and by a Z6 user.

2 months agopermalink

ElDiablo73

@ brevoo if you plan to underexpose by 6 stops your images often, then yes, the D780 seems to have 1 stop advantage over the Z6. HOWEVER, the Z mount is future proof and so far, the S lenses represent the best glass Nikon can make. IMO, unless someone has lots of D screwdriver glass, there's absolutely no reason to get a D780 in 2020. This camera would have been great 2 years ago, today, it is just a marginal improvement over the D750. FYI, I do own a D750 & a Z6.

Of course, if someone is convinced that the D780 is "the" camera for his needs, then obviously he cannot go wrong as it is a solid offer / body.

2 months ago*permalink

The positive of the new lenses is mentioned as one pro for the Z6.. I don't know if you watched the video, but he pretty thoroughly explained why one would want a D780 in 2020. Chief among them for me is that I do not like using a Z camera. Sure, the z lenses are fantastic, what there are of them. No short or long macro planned. I have a 70 and a 180. No 100-400 or 150-600. No 24 1.4. The lenses I do own may not be the ultimate expression of a lens, but they are more than sufficient for my needs. Maybe I will get a Z60000 one day. The future takes care of itself.

2 months agopermalink

One thing I have learned from owning other DSLRs, if a camera functions much worse than another camera at a very challenging setting, it probably still functions worse at less challenging settings. The awful performance of the Z6 pushed 6 stops suggests it is better but still below the D780's performance at 3 or fewer stops. I will continue watching out for thorough reviews but won't know for sure until I give the D780 a try. The lack of an ovf knocks several points off the Z6 to begin with for me. Poor battery life, worse handling, lag, incompatibility with pre af-s lenses, limited lens selection, looking at a screen instead of the world. Many reasons to get a D780 over a Z6 for me. I am not saying that others should make the same choice. For some reason Z6 users insist their choice is right for me

2 months agopermalink

Jurgen M Lobert

You are dead wrong about the banding not showing up in the real world. I see it very often in night photos, when you need to accommodate highlights and push the shadows by 3-4 stops (not 5-6). It is quite visible. Even more so, if you convert it to full spectrum / IR.

2 months agopermalink

Per Inge Oestmoen

The Nikon D780 has no electronic contacts for a vertical grip.

Why, Nikon? Why does Nikon force us to twist our hand and joint, instead of letting us have a much more comfortable vertical grip?

For those who frequently shoot with the camera in the vertical position, a vertical grip with vertical controls including a shutter release button is nearly indispensable.

2 months agopermalink

https://youtu.be/IB_q2M1qOys

Elsewhere in this comment section I have discussed my opinion that this review is limited. There are no images from the D750 taken concurrently with the D780 and few details to back up certain staments.

This review linked below is excellent. Balanced and thorough with the examples from the cameras taken concurrently. Surprisingly enough, the reviewer found the image quality of the D780 noticeably better than that of the D750 and better in some ways than that of the Z6 in specific areas in both raw files and jpegs.

He uses the Z6 and recommends it highly for newcomers and those who want raw video or the best lenses. But the D780 is a better choice than the D750 even with the price difference. Check it out.

2 months agopermalink

ElDiablo73

I follow Richard Wong and although he is saying good things about the D780, he is still going for the Z6.

Regarding "noticeably better" than the D750, he is referring to extreme cases when the photographer must have really screwed up. The sensor is practically the same in all of the cameras. in normal use, there will be absolutely no difference unless pushing ISO to the limit. If you're shooting weddings in low light, perhaps it is the better choice BUT you will have to deal with the lack of a battery grip (advantage D750).

Regarding IQ at normal ISO levels, I can guarantee that there's little to no difference between my 24mpx D5200, D750 and Z6.

i salute you.

2 months ago*permalink

I dont think this dslr needs an additional battery in a grip.

2 months agopermalink

Probably. But I bought a 150-600 recently and it is rare when I can shoot at f 8, 1/2000 at iso 100. Having a wider range of shutter speeds available is a good thing. On the other hand, there are times I need to stop a fast prime down to avoid overexpose at 1/4000. Also, Wong only tested the cameras at 6 stops where the performance of the Z6 was horrible. But, at what point does the better performance of the D780 become noticeable? 5, 4, 3 stops? There are advantages to getting this particular camera.

2 months agopermalink

Son Of Waldo

I don't know about this camera in 2020. If I can't get some wall-hangers while doing my daily jumping jacks, I'm definitely NOT interested.

2 months agopermalink

Joed700

The D780 would have received a golden award had it been introduced somewhere in the past. However, we are not living in a vacuum. The conclusion says it all: "Not Good For Anyone requiring in-body image stabilization or folks seeking a small/light package."

With the popularity of smartphones, even MILS are considered big by many, let alone DSLRs.

2 months agopermalink