Apple acquires Spectral Edge to boost iPhone camera performance

So what? The roads are filled with very bad drivers with nice cars. One has nothing to do with the other. This forum is filled with old people that have very expensive gear, and we get awful cat pictures out of it posted here. When you get your pics in a museum, you let us know.

Jan 8, 2020permalink

steviewa

Apple needs to do a lot on their night mode as the colours, softness and noise is by far the worst when comparing them to the pixel an p30pro

Dec 16, 2019permalink

wasTF

to be fair, the difference is minimal

Dec 17, 2019permalink

SmilerGrogan

Cellphone cams are getting better but I’m curious what percentage of social media photography for athletes, celebrities, influencers, and businesses is shot by professional photographers with serious equipment vs shot by non-pros with cell phones.
I suspect the photos posted to Kim Kardashian’s account are always done by pros as are 80 to 90 percent of the other socials where reputation or money are at stake.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

well, yes, but the reason is because those hire real photographers to take the images, and they tend to use more professional gear. As well as in some areas (like portraits) certain focal lengths and DOF are needed, where smartphones are still not doing a great job.
But for others, such as a food-blog for example, a 2 gen old phone is simply just as good as any Leica

Dec 16, 2019permalink

SmilerGrogan

Excellent points. The difference I imagine is that the closer you are to your subject the less the equipment matters and with food you're shooting at 12 inches or less in relatively predictable lighting.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

Its ridiculous that the Big Camera Manufacturers aren't LEADING this way. Once again, they are handing the camera market to cellphones. Do they have any Brains in their Leadership Heads?? Or are they all sitting on their a$ ses?

AI and Computational doesn't change any part of your artistic or manual photography. Not even a bit of it.

But it is basically just the same thing you do in Lightroom, anyway, but with a stronger "suggestions". Frankly, every Big camera maker should add this to their JPEG shooting option immediately for SOOC shooting. And, ABSOLUTELY, Lightroom (etc RAW processing engines) must get on board with these time-saving features, but with sliders that let us reduce or increase from 0 to 100% the effects; and integrate the full-spectrum of abilities that AI and Computational offers, right now. They are behind.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Established old timers may not care -- but this is a serious competitive problem for new photographers competitively to survive the next 5 years vs. consumers just using their iPhone. The photography industry has a Duty to stay AHEAD of this curve, not behind.

The camera manufacturers and software companies who don't integrate AI and Computational are the ones that will DIE OUT in the next 10 years; just look at how hard sales are on Nikon (not a Software company), compared to Sony (a software company), using very similar parts. Software is now KING. Absolutely your art depends on your vision and your and manual abilities in setting up and choosing settings -- but you will lose advantageous business, you will waste your time vs. your competitors in processing, and you will miss shots your eyes can barely even see, if the industry doesn't immediately jump on this.

Simply, things are going to get a LOT easier for photographers & artists. And that's absolutely a great thing.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

fusoexplorer

Do you know what is happening behind the scenes? I don’t.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

bayindirh

> It's ridiculous that the Big Camera Manufacturers aren't LEADING this way.

That's expected because, the constraints on phone cameras and proper cameras are different. Phone cameras are trying to close the physics and quality gap with computation.

Things will get interesting when phone cameras reduce the gap considerably.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Nikonese

Camera companies are trying to protect themselves and their territory. They are so hard/stubborn in making changes.

Photography and social media have taken a huge chuck, and camera companies can't compete with giants like Apple.

I actually think cameras should provide less tech and better quality. Just my opinion of course.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

"We should not expect the technology to be integrated in the next iPhone generation" -- how the hell would they know that?

My guess is APPLE will be applying whatever can, immediately. This is software, not hardware. And APPLE isn't the best phone camera right now.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

"The Spectral Edge technology can be applied via software or baked into hardware which would allow Apple to integrate it into a custom image signal processor." - so it can be either way.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

falconeyes

That‘s an interesting approach.
Spectral edge uses e.g. 0.25W IR illumination to significantly improve IQ at very low light, esp. video. It still produces monochrome where it is pitch black. You can find sample videos via google.
It will open up new creative options, not even possible with a 6000$ ILC.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Mariano Pacifico

Smartcameras are into AI and computational photography. Personally, I still prefer my artistic intelligence and manual photography

Dec 14, 2019permalink

AI and Computational doesn't change any part of your artistic or manual photography. Not even a bit of it.

Its basically just the same thing you do in Lightroom, anyway, but with a stronger "suggestion" in JPEG shooting. Frankly, every camera maker should add this to their JPEG shooting option. And, ABSOLUTELY, Lightroom (etc RAW processing engines) must get on board with these time-saving features, but with sliders that let us reduce or increase from 0 to 100% the effects.

The camera manufacturers and software companies who don't integrate AI and Computational are the ones that will DIE OUT in the next 10 years. But absolutely your art depends on your vision and your and manual abilities in setting up and choosing settings.

Simply, things are going to get a LOT easier for photographers & artists. And that's absolutely a great thing. If this is what they can do with small sensor tiny cams. Imagine what will be possible with large sensors & bigger analog parts.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Max Iso

"AI and Computational doesn't change any part of your artistic or manual photography. Not even a bit of it."

Most of it does for me, unless i can use it in raw. The closest form of CP that allows raw is super rez and my G9 already has it.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

I'll alert the media

Jan 8, 2020permalink

gaul

What everybody wants is a good Full-Frame or even APSC or M4/3 but with the power and onboard AI of an iPhone 📱

Can CanikonSon deliver that?

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Soon. More likely on smaller sensors due to read out speed - so 1", M4/3 most likely.

However, Apple uses a custom arm instruction set, so is much faster than comparable Android chips. Even then phones have incredible economies of scale and buying power. Not sure camera makers could incorporate let alone develop phone computing power without a significant cost increase.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

troppe

No, they don't have such resources and engineers. Also, Sony never shipped adequate camera software for their smartphones. That's why Sony smartphones with "best" Sony camera modules had one of the worst image quality results and sometimes even were excluded from image tests on Android resources.

Classic cameras shipment are seriously declining and you rarely see someone in Europe in tourists places with heavy and bulky cameras. M4/3 and APSC cameras don't provide any benefits against mobile sensors for regular user. I've sold all my Fuji gear because photos just looked a bit better in pixel-peeping quality, but flat as sin in comparison to Full Frame even on XF 56mm f1.2.

So basically there i no point to buy any camera except Full Frame for "Full Frame look" if you don't make money with camera.

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

NetMage

Apple used a stock ARM instruction set, in fact that is part of their licensing with ARM. They use a custom processor that implements the stock instruction set faster and more efficiently than others.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Tom_A

Actually the Zeiss camera, should it be released, could be a step towards that ideal. It uses Android OS so conceivably you could have nifty apps on it.
This being said, to really shine it would need a top mobile processor such as in the latest iphones and a dedicated chip that can be used to speed up machine learning based apps (also such as the iPhone and top Android phones).

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Max Iso

"So basically there i no point to buy any camera except Full Frame for "Full Frame look".

How silly, as if IQ was the only thing that matters. Lens selection, IBIS, an actual VF. Battery life. Tons of reasons that are not pure IQ.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

LoneTree1

A.I. to fake I.Q.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Well look at the big brain on Brad. How did you ever figure that out?

Jan 8, 2020permalink

Discombobulate

apple has all the money to buy everything and destroy them/competitions.

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

falconeyes

They usually buy technology to actually make it usable, rather than destroy it. E.g., capacitive touch, multi touch, finger print sensor etc. It all all was done via aquisitions. You must confuse Apple with other big tech giants.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Gary Goodenough

Maybe someday Apple will buy a help system and put it on its iOS devices.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

Why do you think a company like Spectral Edge exists? Did you think they would be coming out with a competing cell phone until evil Apple bought them? There purpose is to invent tech that could go in a cell phone so they could be bought out by companies like Apple.

I know that doesn't fit your evil corporation narrative, but hopefully you will find other areas to apply your ideology.

Jan 8, 2020*permalink

TN Args

Headline: DPR admits iPhone camera needs boosted IQ.

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

Tom_A

Sub headline - TN needs to follow a reading comprehension course.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

TN Args

"It looks like Apple might have just made another move to improve image quality on its iPhone camera." -- says DPR, quote-unquote.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

sub headline - TN proves Tom's point

Dec 14, 2019permalink

TN Args

LOL, I'd better leave, didn't realize this was a children's comment space

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

haha - surely you must have realised that when you first joined. Just messing with you - no malice :-)

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Tom_A

No matter the sensor/camera, everyone tries to improve IQ. Reading comprehension shows that this is not the same as implying that DPR admits that the iphone needs boosted OQ...

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Lotsa people here who don't don't know Jack about using the iPhone's camera. Ask any ten year old, they all know that the volume buttons also work as a shutter button.
BTW An Apple watch works as a remote shutter for the iPhone—standard equipment, no additional apps needed.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

MySimplePhotosToday

Isn't this the same on nearly every camera phone? I'm sure Samsung has had it for years, and the reason I usually have 100s of the same photo or pictures of my pockets.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

fstopx2

The Apple wired earbuds also act as a remote shudder release.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Rob-in-Alberta

does the iphone have megapickles?

Dec 14, 2019permalink

I don't think phones document enough - youtube taught me that you can drag to move the shutter button on samsung. Also (obvious in menus) you can set shutter to trigger on smile / wave / voice.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

@MySimplePhotosToday, of course all camera phones have multiple way to hit-the-button. I never said that Apple invented the wheel—just that they've improved it, from my POV. I use my Apple Watch's handy remote viewfinder/shutter release, all the time.

My comment was aimed at the Luddites who complain about no proper shutter button, not people who actually use Android/Apple phones.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

@kierenlon Absolutely nothing is intuitive, when it comes to technology. Technology companies need a simple Getting-Started booklet. You can't RTFM if there is no Effing manual to read!

YouTubers have saved me from a lot of time/frustration, over the years.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Gary Goodenough

If Apple included a help system on the iPhone more people would know more about how to use the camera instead of playing guessing games with their iPhone.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

mick232

They literally bought their edge over the competition.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Perhaps it was their Spectral.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Rob-in-Alberta

SPECTRE?

Dec 14, 2019permalink

S Yu

What's wrong with that? Worlds better than stealing.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

LOL at giving am owls pitute.

Jan 8, 2020permalink

skanter

A hybrid camera with phone technology is waiting to take the world by storm. Why hasn’t anyone invented it?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Which phone technology in particular?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

lightwriter

The mobile processors.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

And to use them differently how?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

lightwriter

My first thought was the artificial intelligence; the technology is getting better faster and faster.

I’m thinking also about the speed of the processors; nowadays they can process multiple images and deliver hdr results near instantly, not to speak about hdr video.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Things are moving fast in this space, it is pretty hard to put out something completely new in a convincing form.
Light has tried exactly this with the L16 ... but till they managed to put something on the market, it was just an expensive gimmick. I guess if it was production ready in the moment they started to work on it the impact would have been different.

For it to really work, it wold need that current camera manufacturers to implement these into the cameras, and we already see things here and there (like super-res, HDR, focus stacking, continuous rendering long-time exposure, etc.
Sony had brought AI to AF and it is a point they took by storm :) ... so probably they'll move fwd.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

Jon Stern

I can see how using edges from the NIR to fuse with the YUV image could improve edges in low light (there will be a high correlation between vis and NIR edges in real-world scenes), but in non low-light situations, I wouldn't expect to see any benefit, as the NIR channel would have lower MTF due to the higher diffraction limit.

Then there's the issue of features in the NIR which don't correlate to the vis. For example, certain fabrics become highly reflective in the NIR. If there's any texture to that NIR reflectivity that's missing in the vis, then the correlation will be broken.

Maybe a CNN can be trained to avoid errors. For example, a lot of the IR reflective fabrics are indigo or black, so recognizing the vis characteristics of these objects to avoid using NIR edges in those cases might help, but it could be tricky to generalize this to avoid failure cases.

Alos, there's not a lot of NIR in modern indoor scenes. An IR LED would help, but is that better than a white LED?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

fferreres

They will allow creative modes you and I aren’t thinking oboist. After some images become very popular, all would want to have the camera. It will become the next short term thing.

Camera makers are are dumbified to the point the only think of higher MF and Pixel Shift which actually doesn’t even work for most situations and setups.

They will die but a few cucañera makers will get “imaging” and lead a new era of applications, with mass market phones being a lesser but much more lucrative version.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

luigibozi

or maybe is just a new microsoft nokia deal?!

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Smartphone camera tech gets better all the time, and is surely the future path for photography, although right now the image quality from the tiny sensors is still far inferior to that from standalone cameras.

Unfortunately it isn't possible to take and merge multiple shots in a microsecond with conventional cameras, due to mechanical and electronic limitations, and that's unlikely to change until we get global shutters.

Equally unfortunate is the fact that smartphones remain far less versatile than conventional cameras (think wildlife, sports, landscape, architecture, all of which require specialised optics unobtainable via phones).

Smartphones have the advantage that they are pocketable, relatively affordable, and also serve as mini-computers and communication devices, but in order to make them more appealing to photographers they need to be produced in a form factor that allows easier control e.g. with regard to shutter release, zooming etc.

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

Entirely correct, but then you cannot have them in your pocket any more. And will therefore not carry around them all the time. And therefore they are no mobile phones.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Roland - Smartphones now are getting so huge that they barely fit in a pocket.

I think it's perfectly possible to design a smartphone that is pocketable, yet has better ergonomics.

By way of example, a conventional mechanical/electronic shutter button, mounted on the "edge" of a smartphone instead of (or in addition to) the panel touch switch would be beneficial.

Similarly an edge-mounted control wheel that only activated in photo-mode, would be a better way to zoom than "screen-pinching", which requires holding the phone with one hand, and pinching with the other.

I can think of several other examples.

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

My Sony Experia has a mechanical shutter button. It is very convenient. It is an improvement with a factor 10 in usability. This button is also used to activate the camera app.

But, there are other things.

One thing that annoys me is that the lens is not in the middle of the phone. So, when taking close ups you really do not align the camera correct.

Another thing is that it is very easy to drop the phone if someone bounces into you.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Roland - Yes, people have a habit of dropping phones - often down the toilet apparently!

It surprises me that such expensive, slippery and stealable devices don't have lugs for the attachment of a wrist strap.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

It is simply a numbers game. Most smartphone users want the phone to be able to take some images when needed, and not impact the other functions as much as possible.
Failure of sales of hybrids that were pretty decent as both cameras and phones (I think at least Samsung and Panasonic tried that niche) showed that a "too photo oriented" phone is not the best idea for selling millions of units.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

badi - Yes that's true. But fashions change. People change their minds about what is "cool". Given the fact that cameras are now the main selling feature of smartphones, a well-designed and stylish device that was more photography-orientated might sell very well.

It wouldn't require drastic changes - the tech is already there to provide image quality good enough to satisfy anyone who just views their photos on the phone, or on a laptop.

It's just a few minor tweaks to ergonomics that are needed, such as an edge-mounted shutter release, a rubberised rear panel to make the things less slippery, a lug for a wrist strap....

.... and an edge-mounted control wheel for zooming. Think about how much people like to zoom in on distant objects, and how very much easier and faster that would be if there was a slider or fly-by-wire control wheel to control zooming.

Dec 16, 2019*permalink

... actually I think the biggest differentiating factor between "smartphoneographers" and traditional photographers, is the viewing method.

Traditional photographers like to hold the camera to the eye. So they prefer an EVF or optical viewfinder. Smartphoneographers like to hold the thing at arms length and view on a screen.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

@entoman - I am not sure about that. For short focal lens lenses, the LCD is just fine. Use it all the time e.g. with my Sony RX100 III. But, if the lens gets longer it is very hard to use the LCD. Then you need the better visual/tactile control you get by looking into the viewfinder. And an optical view finder is even better.

But, I see lots of camera photographers that use the LCD, as do I.

I even use the LCD on my K-1, quite often.

Dec 16, 2019*permalink

Roland - Outdoors? In sunshine? With moving subjects?

I think an LCD is excellent as an * addition* to an eye-level finder, but IMO a camera without the latter is incredibly limiting (although the tiny EVFs on some compact cameras aren't much better).

There are of course times when one needs to shoot with the camera at chest level or even at ground level, and I'd agree that a tilting LCD is useful under such circumstances, but I much prefer the bright, magnified view that I get from the "Angle Finder C" that I use on my Canons.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

The LCD in my phone works in all but very bright environments. Kamer-LCD often are much worse.

But, yes, a moving target is also something that is hard to follow with an LCD.

Dec 16, 2019permalink

lambert4

I hope the Spectral Edge company got well compensated, and enjoys their success. I welcome any advances in cell phone camera quality. 15 years ago they were all but unusable, even up through my last smart phone it was nice for memories but not "fine art" level or printable. My current iPhone XR is leaps and bounds better, likely on par with my pocketable Panasonic and close to my Old ZX-1.

I love having a tool in my pocket so capable, even when I carry my DSLR I find myself reaching for my phone for context images, or wide angle images, even video clips.

Keep the innovations coming!

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Exactly what sony phones have .
IR sensor for WB .
Watch here ...
https://youtu.be/-XrMEde86GQ

S.A.R posted photos of a7s3 ....

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

You are kidding, right? Sony makes phones?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

They do. Those with fancy 4K HDR 120Hz screen and able to record 4K HDR 10bit. Something Apple lacks.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Wow, I bet they'll sell 3 of them.

Funny you mention 4K 10bit, something fairly common in ILCs these days. Um except for Sony. lol

Dec 13, 2019permalink

They dont need to sell phones to survive like many other companies, it is like a hobby.

Not only 4K 10bit, they gave Luts to the phone.
Two models have special app for video recording.
Courtesy of CineAlta.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

All I know is Sony was laughed out of the US market after an operating loss of $879.5 million.
Huawei who also is "no longer in the US" still sells more phones in the US than Sony does globally, and speaking of globally, Huawei sold 118 million smartphones in the first half of this year.
Last quarter Sony sold a whopping 600,000 phones while Huawei sold 60 million. That is 100 times more. Samsung sold 72 million or 120 times more than Sony. Sony has a less than 1% market share to show for their $879.5 million disaster.

Obviously more people shoot video with iPhones, and if you want better video than anything Sony offers, get a used GH5.

But hey, you seem to like Sony smartphones, so enjoy. I know I enjoy laughing at them, as do Apple, Samsung, Huawei, and everyone else.

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

It is the only option without stupid notches or screen hole.
They lost space to those cheap brands that sell cheap phones with cheap parts.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Sony has a giant thick bar of empty space across the top and bottom of their phones, making the ridiculous longer than they need to be. They look like phones from 2010. Give me a small notch any day.

Like I said, the one thing Sony smartphones are good for is to make jokes about.
I feel bad for the guy who has to tell the CEO, "we were able to increase losses to $900 million a year, while lowering sales to only 600,000 phones...while our competitors sold over 100 times that many while making billions in profit. "

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

Bezel of xperia 1 has size of iphone notch vertically.
No black parts for 21:9 videos.
Iphone has for any ratio.

Put Apple logo on sony phones and will sell 50 million units.

I dont know why in 2019 people think iphones are fancy.
Not even a gorilla glass on a $1500 phone, that costs over $2000 out of USA.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

"Put Apple logo on sony phones...."
And it would kill Apple's reputation. People love Apple and hate Sony phones.
Sony is known for having the worst ergonomics and menus for both cameras and phones. Most find Sony phones are unusable which is why they've only sold about 7 in the past year.

The market has spoken. Apple sells well over 100 times as many phones as Sony despite Sony spending half a trillion to make their junk phones.
Argue all you want, but Sony has embarrassed themselves again.

Dec 16, 2019*permalink

The snarky comments on here may reach epic levels of 'old man yelling at clouds' status on this story.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Imager of

More fake looking photos. Great! 🤨

Dec 13, 2019permalink

What a weird comment. You sound like a really positive person.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Polacofede

as long as they look good, it's great for me. who says what is fake and what is PP?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

(unknown member)

The zeroes and ones from a "normal" camera aren't more or less authentic than those from a smartphone.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Karroly

I find someone refusing to live in a fake world actually positive and comforting...
And I do not find the argument that photography is already "fake" in many aspects, a good one to continue to go the same route.
It is "sad" to see that many people are ready to accept a camera that "mystified" them just because they are flattered by a nice looking picture...
How far are you ready to be mystified in many other areas of your lives ?

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

McArchive

"who says what is fake and what is PP?"

The President.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Photography is not a reprography job to everyone…

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

desertsp

Imager - I think you have it backwards. This is a way to produce more REALISTIC photos.

Photos are just data, and the more input data the better the result.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Karroly

desertsp,
If you want to capture more data, use a bigger sensor...

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

Polacofede

@Karroly or two sensors... or three... or four... who cares?

Dec 14, 2019permalink

Karroly

Thinking that several small crappy sensors is like having a big one, is more or less thinking that several visually impaired persons can see all together as well as one person with a good vision... ;-)
Combining several images coming from different sensors introduces parallax or perspective errors that are impossible to correct by software, especially when shooting at short distances.

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

Androole

Can anyone explain to me how IR is supposed to improve upon the colour of conventional photography given that it is entirely outside the visible spectrum?

Is the idea that you collect more IR wavelength in order to get more pseudo-luminance data in order to reduce the exposure in the visible spectrum to ensure that none of the colour channels end up saturated, which skews colour accuracy?

Regardless, the only way that works is by using a ton of algorithmic gobbledygook, since we don't see in the IR spectrum in the first place. Why not cut out the middle man, don't bother collecting the IR light, and just subject all your images to intensive machine-learning 'AI' optimization where every photo you take is compared to similar-looking exemplars photographed by high-end photo gear scraped from the Internet? Seems like it would be about as realistic.

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

Horshack

Not sure but my guess is their ML algorithms were trained with the IR characteristics of various real-world subjects and they used that info to both identify/classify the subject and to characterize how the visible spectrum colors correlate to IR and then adjust those visible colors in actual photos based on that correlation in situations where the visible light is otherwise too low to get good or accurate color fidelity.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Are you implying that Apple is ill-informed and just buys companies on a whim?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

https://youtu.be/-XrMEde86GQ

@Androole

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

Androole

Honestly, I have no idea. I'm curious to learn how the technology can actually work, knowing what I know about photography. Horshack's theory seems feasible, using the IR light as identifiers rather than photographic data.

Heck, it could also be that smartphone companies have been reducing the strength on their IR cut filters more and more in order to let in more overall light at the cost of colour fidelity, and having a separate IR sensor lets them try and do some sort of back-calibration to remove the contaminating effects of too much IR. Who knows.

Honestly, all the major tech companies buy tons of small companies and sometimes use their products, sometimes don't. Based on the publicly available financial data, it sounds like Apple likely acquired this for the equivalent of a few loose nickels found in the couch cushions, so the stakes are not particularly high. The cost/benefit was obviously determined to be in favour of the acquisition.

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

pollup

Sounds like a technology that can see through thin objects or materials with IR and display the data underneath. Could be useful for surveillance, imagine someone robbing a bank and wearing a mask, well with such tech, we can see his face anyway ... what else could it be used for, any idea?

Dec 13, 2019permalink

The see-through-clothes for IR cameras is greatly exaggerated.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

another computer solution to balance the poverty of a tiny sensor and and a lentil sized plastic lens from a gumball machine

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Yes, that's the exact idea. We already have a computer in our pocket, let it do the heavy lifting so we don't have to carry so much camera.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Unless you think they have a work around of the laws of physics, then yes it is, and so what? You have a marvelous grasp of the obvious.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

my workaround is to not pretend cameraphones are serious cameras , i do grasp the obvious .... you should try it

Dec 13, 2019permalink

"Yes, that's the exact idea. We already have a computer in our pocket, let it do the heavy lifting so we don't have to carry so much camera."

you mean a camera period

Dec 13, 2019permalink

It's is difficult to see the obvious when your view is so narrow.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

LOL at needing to pretend, or even care, what the definition is of a 'serious' camera. They are all devices that take pictures. Maybe one of the dumbest things in the world to try and act like a snob about.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

BrentSchumer

As photography goes from hobby differentiated by budget to a hobby differentiated by skill, some people are sure getting upset.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Fly18

@cosinaphile

If it was for people like you, humans would've stayed in caves.
Who cares about that new thing called fire, I can get warm by wearing more animal leather.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

its amazimg how quickly consumers can adopt a stance about a product … cameras in a phone have been good just barely good , still with out working aperture or creative controls for maybe 5 years …. but to point out that a real camera is an order of magnitude better than the tiny sensor \plastic lens of whatever camera YOU CHERISH for the next 2 yrs until the unremovable battery poops out is a thought crime
a cave with a powerful laptop a superb camera maybe a state of the art tv
is preferable to be in the chains of a pathetic cellphone with whatever unholy corporation telling you whats good for you

enjoy you" computer "...err cellphone and your " camera " cellphone , without audio connectors without removable battery , without expandable storage , with a notched\bullet holed screen and await the next corporate dictate you'll be required to adopt to be a thoroughly modern " American idiot"

enjoy the poverty you so deeply crave

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

you love a cellphone for it social connectedness and for its pocketability
to love it for anything connected to image quality lens corner sharpness
sensor quality or its presence as an actual tool of photography is the
conduct of a fool... or a neophyte

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Fly18

@cosinaphile

Get over yourself. You're not special.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

yes I own a camera , and preferentially use it over a cellphone as a photographic tool..... ooo im a caveman

so what what are you when you social addiction and cellphone addiction is so great you see no other path in photography other than you pocket phone ?...lol anything else is a backwards camera ? ...lol

do you even proofread your thoughts ?….yikes !

id like to think of it as the collective head in the "cloud "

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

no its the camera that's special …. read a book

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Like31 hour agopermalink

Idontseegraininreallife said:
"...LOL at needing to pretend, or even care, what the definition is of a 'serious' camera. They are all devices that take pictures. Maybe one of the dumbest things in the world to try and act like a snob about..."

snob ? lol

by you reasoning a tricycle or a car can take you across town …they are both machine that move people . as with anything your choice is always a personal decision

Dec 13, 2019*permalink

I think cosinaphile needs not to get warm, whether by fire or animal leather, but to chill, on the contrary.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

first the whining of a fly..... now a lame witticism by a spider?

i think the "cellphones are everything", and "cameras are caveman stuff"
peanut gallery needs to get a life, and maybe learn how to use a camera so someday you can graduate to real photography with real photographic tools ....lol

see everyone has an opinion ! not just you two cellphone using invertebrates !

animal leather ? as opposed to what pleather ? Naugahyde ? alcantara ?

are you from PETA?

Dec 14, 2019*permalink

I am not sure how you got the idea that I used cellphones for photography. Did you feel attacked by my attempt at a joke, and then somehow concluded that I must have different opinions from yours on absolutely everything? Do you feel so alone in this world?

I was just trying to lighten the mood. Sorry if that offended you. I will try to remember that you prefer heavier moods.

Dec 15, 2019permalink

Fly18

@cosinaphile

I wrote 3 lines while you wrote TENS (probably hundreds) of lines and I am the whiner??!! Do you know what the word "whine" means?

Dec 15, 2019permalink

i do .... i wrote something and you whined about it ....own it

also im answering 5 people and you are only one of them... do the math .lol

Dec 15, 2019*permalink

@ spider...

no a chorus of 5 like minds against my simple comment , why would you get that idea?

also it was a joke at my expense , so there's that .... its all good and cheers

Dec 15, 2019*permalink

franzfifty

...in 3 years they will have invented it...:-)))

Dec 13, 2019permalink

JasonTheBirder

While I am impressed by the photographic advancements in small sensor phones like the iPhone, I am also saddened by the fact that these improvements will be an incentive for millions of people to upgrade, creating tons more environmental waste.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Polacofede

yeah there should be more serious tech recycle, not just paying a poor country to accept the technological garbage from rich ones.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

NetMage

Most iPhones will be handed down or traded in, and Apple will recycle them if they aren’t sellable.

Dec 14, 2019permalink

NOT INVENTED HERE has never been a problem for Apple. If someone else invents a Better-Mousetrap, Apple buys it. Simple as that.

CaNiSony could buy bleeding-edge technology ...

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Relaxed

Huh? They barely spend money on acquisitions. Especially large money. That’s googles forte.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

Microsoft, too.

Dec 13, 2019permalink

So what? Do you get extra credit if you came up with the idea? This place is snark central of the interwebs.

Dec 13, 2019permalink