T3

Lives in United States United States
Joined on Jul 1, 2003

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Total: 4069, showing: 861 – 880
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In reply to:

rfsIII: ¡Quel surprise! Who would think that kludging one of Canon's most exotic lenses onto another brand of camera wouldn't work out so well. Corvette engine in a Camry? What could go wrong?

@A-Sign - No, the capability I was talking about was AF with adapted lenses. You can't put a Canon lens on a Nikon body and have it AF. But you can put a Canon lens on an A9 have it AF. That's what we're talking about here: adaptability. Eventually, we'll get to a point where it doesn't matter if you're putting a Sony lens, a Canon lens, or a Nikon lens on a Sony body; they'll all just work. Maybe not at full-speed AF tracking, and maybe not with eye AF tracking, but they'll be able to AF just fine. That's what I'm talking about here: adaptability.

Right now, users are stuck in their particular lens systems. That's partly why we have these insane brand arguments: it creates a bunker mentality where it's "us against them". But a lot of that goes away when we have more wide-spread adaptability between systems. If I'm using a mirrorless body that can take any lens, every lens becomes an option for me. I can pick and choose as I please. No more "us vs them" mentality.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 23:57 UTC
In reply to:

bilcobarnes21: Really don't understand why people pay good money to purchase a lens then go stick it on a system body it was never designed for, stupid.

It's more a case of being able to use what we already own. I am a Canon user. I have a lot of Canon lenses. I think it's great to be able to also be able to use these Canon lenses on a Sony body. Also, there are certain Canon lenses that I wish had image stabilization. Putting them on a Sony IBIS body gives them image stabilization.

The other thing is that it eases the transition between systems. I can steadily migrate to the Sony system, without having to do it all at once, by using existing Canon lenses on new Sony bodies. Then, eventually I can sell off the lenses I don't want to keep, and replace them with native lenses.

It's really not so stupid when you think about it. It allows users to phase one system in while phasing another system out, as time, options, and money permits

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 23:48 UTC
In reply to:

rfsIII: ¡Quel surprise! Who would think that kludging one of Canon's most exotic lenses onto another brand of camera wouldn't work out so well. Corvette engine in a Camry? What could go wrong?

@oldfashioned - Which bloggers were saying that the A9 would be able to operate at full 20fps AF tracking with adapted lenses? Please cite the particular blog posting. The claim was simply that you'd be able to adapt Canon lenses, with AF. That's exactly what is being demonstrated. The fact that you can also achieve lower-frame-rate focus tracking is also a bonus. That's still well beyond the capacities of adaptability for any other camera brand.

What we're talking about here is a bonus feature developed by third-party vendors. I'd be perfectly happy to have 4-5 fps focus tracking with my Canon lenses on a Sony body with IBIS.

You are clearly a conspiracy theorist, LOL. What exactly is the conspiracy? What sin have bloggers committed? Again, please cite the credible claim that adapted super telephotos would be able to work at full 20fps AF tracking speed on Sony bodies?

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 23:38 UTC
In reply to:

rfsIII: ¡Quel surprise! Who would think that kludging one of Canon's most exotic lenses onto another brand of camera wouldn't work out so well. Corvette engine in a Camry? What could go wrong?

Apparently some people don't realize that Sony doesn't make *any* adapters to use Canon lenses on Sony bodies. All these adapters come from 3rd party vendors, independent of Sony's involvement. People seem to be assuming that Sony is "falling short" because they aren't able to achieve full-level performance with Canon lenses. People are forgetting that Sony bodies aren't designed to support Canon lenses. It's simply something that third party vendors are doing, by bridging the gap (electronically and physically) between Canon lenses and Sony bodies.

We also have to remember that it wasn't long ago that there was NO AF capability with adapted lenses. Then AF capability was decoded with these adapters. That, in an of itself, is a significant achievement. What people are complaining about now is that the focus tracking is a lower fps than what the A9 is capable of?!? Is that really such a thing to go nuts about? Focus tracking with adapted lenses, at all, is an achievement.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 23:25 UTC
In reply to:

Satyaa: This article itself, and all the comments on top of it, are just ridiculous. I feel that DPReview started posting all these news from other sites knowing very well the type of arguments that will come up in these comments. May be, the parent company is evaluating them by the number of page visits/clicks.

I am currently a Nikon system owner, but still have my 11 year old rebel that I don't use anymore. Sony system neither interested me, nor bothered me. Prompted by these comments, I went to look up what's available...

FE 16-35 F/4.0 OSS
FE 24-70 F/4.0 OSS
FE 70-200 F/4.0 OSS
FE 100-400 F/4.5-5.6 OSS
FE 24-240 F/3.5-6.3 OSS (often ignored, but good)

FE 24-70 F/2.8 (no OS?)
FE 70-200 F/2.8 OSS

FE 28, 35, 50, 85 and 90 mm primes
Some Batis and Loxia primes

Really? People have used those lenses, found that they are missing a 500 or 600 mm, and are worried that another brand lens won't work with an adapter?? That's what I call ridiculous.
...

"FE 24-70 F/2.8 (no OS?)"

Sony has In-Body Image Stabilization (IBIS), so you don't need OSS in the lens. Adding image stabilization elements to some lenses, such as the 24-70/2.8, can make they quite large. For example, take a look at the size differential between the Nikon 24-70/2.8 non-VR with the new Nikon 24-70/2.8 VR:

http://camerasize.com/compact/#567.327,567.479,ha,t

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 23:18 UTC
In reply to:

El abuelito: Canon lenses on Sony A9 work much better than Sony lenses on Canon body.

@J A C S - LOL, I think that's what you are wishing. But the reality is that Sony is clearly in it for the long haul. They started making sensors for other brands years ago to gain expertise in camera sensors. Now, other companies are dependent upon Sony for sensors, and Sony have stated that they will save the best sensor technology for themselves. https://petapixel.com/2017/03/22/sony-keeps-best-sensors-cameras/ They also own 50% of the worldwide sensor market, with most of their money coming from smartphone sensors, so they don't even need to sell their sensors to other camera brands.

They bought Minolta's system years ago to learn about the camera market. Then, after gaining experience, they launched into the new mirrorless market where they are the tech and system leaders well ahead of Canon/Nikon. I don't think any of this is an accident. I think it's been part of a long term plan.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 22:06 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

@A-Sign - I'm not the only one who realizes that Nikon is in a bit of trouble in the camera market. As Nikon watcher Thom Hogan wrote:
"The problem is that they shot for the moon with the Nikon 1, shot for a moon orbit with the KeyMission, shot for the moon again with DL but had a launch failure, got the D3400 and D5600 off the launch pad but not near the moon, and so on. All the dollars that the products below the D7200 would have brought in have collapsed into the nothingness of space. Negative growth."

He does optimistically say, "But will Nikon fail or be acquired or declare bankruptcy? No, no, and no. At present the best guess is that they're just going to get smaller. Have fewer products." Like I said, he's being optimistic. At best, they'll get smaller. At worst? Maybe bought out by another company. Maybe bankruptcy. Nikon has seen better days.
http://www.dslrbodies.com/newsviews/grim-nikon-financials.html

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 21:40 UTC
In reply to:

LightBug: Title is misleading. It's the combo of A9 plus adapter that are being evaluated, title seems to suggest A9 is solely responsible for the performance reported.

@A-Sign - It's about focus acquisition, and holding onto focus. When you have focus points in the corners, the camera can lock onto a subject earlier, as it enters the frame, before it moves into the central region. It also means that the camera can hold focus on the subject over a wider, broader area of the frame.

And yes, it does matter if the camera is full frame or not. DSLR phase detection modules only cover a certain amount of area. If you have a small frame, the PD unit can cover a larger area of the frame. If the frame is larger, the PD unit only covers a smaller area of the frame. That's why the focus point coverage area of a D5 is so much smaller than a D500, even though they share the exact same focus module (the Multi-CAM 20K focusing module).

D5 focus coverage area:
https://cdn.photographylife.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Nikon-D5-AF-System.png

D500 focus coverage area:
http://cdn.agilitycms.com/the-camera-store/Nikon%20D500-Focus%20Points.jpg

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 21:32 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

@A-Sign - You are a hopeless troll. LOL. Sony will be fine. Let's see if Nikon is even around a couple decades from now. Nikon is heavily dependent on DSLR sales, far more than any other company in the camera market. And their sales are declining, as all DSLR sales are. And in the mirrorless market, they spent millions on the ill-fated 1-series mirrorless system, which went nowhere. At last count, they made 13 different lenses for this near-dead system. A lot of time, money, and resources down the drain.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 21:16 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

@A-Sign - "that's why you see this problem on the A9 now not perfoming well because super telephoto lenses for the target market arent't available in native E-mount."

*Sigh* Let's talk when the 2020 Olympics roll around. Let's see how ignorant you'll look then. Heck, let's talk later this year, when Sony is supposed to release a 400mm lens. Clearly, you've proven you know very little about these camera companies.

The reality is that no company can produce every lens all at once. Every company has limited resources and a limited number of engineers. So they need to prioritize and knock out lenses over time. To give you an idea of just how new the Sony FE system is, Sony just released their 16-35/2.8, 24-70/2.8, and 70-200/2.8 lenses in the last year or so! Yep, that's how young the system is. Next up are obviously the super telephotos. So what you see as "this problem" of not knowing how to produce native lenses is really an issue of steadily working through a roster of lenses.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:59 UTC
In reply to:

LightBug: Title is misleading. It's the combo of A9 plus adapter that are being evaluated, title seems to suggest A9 is solely responsible for the performance reported.

@A-Sign - D500 is not a FF body. It's easier to get wider focus coverage in a DSLR when the frame is a lot smaller. Plus, it's a $2000 body. The Sony A6300 is a $900 body that has wider focus coverage, with 425 AF points. A lot less money, and much better focus coverage (truly into the corners) than the D500!

http://mirrorlesscomparison.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/a6300-AF-points-720x540.jpeg

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:40 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

Your statement "The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing in this company" was certainly ignorant. Sony certainly knows what it is doing. Sony has been playing the long game from the beginning. They started making sensors for others so they could learn the sensor market. Now, other companies are dependent on Sony for sensors. And they own 50% of the world wide sensor market. As for cameras, they bought Minolta to learn about the camera market. And rather than trying to compete in the old-tech DSLR market, they launched into the new mirrorless market where they are now the dominant force. DSLR sales continue to decline, while mirrorless sales are rising. Sony has positioned itself as a huge contender because they own the sensor market and they are the tech leader in mirrorless, well ahead of Canon/Nikon. None of this happened by accident. I think this has been part of Sony's long-term plan all along. The next stage in their strategy is the 2020 Olympics.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:30 UTC
In reply to:

El abuelito: Canon lenses on Sony A9 work much better than Sony lenses on Canon body.

@A-Sign - Like i've said before, that argument has a very limited life span. Cling to it while you can!

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:20 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

@A-Sign - You should at least know what you are talking about before posting. Otherwise you just sound ignorant.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:18 UTC
In reply to:

PVCdroid: Then use the A-mount lenses that do shoot 10fps continuous. Or, wait for Sony's new E-mount telephotos. I don't get why this is newsworthy at all.

@A-Sign - A-mount was the system that Sony inherited from Minolta for their DSLR system. E-mount is Sony's mirrorless system, which is the future for Sony. Sony chose to allow adaptability of their legacy A-mount system on E-mount bodies. A-mount was never designed for E-mount, so it shouldn't be expected to use the full potential of the A9 camera. It's not a situation where "the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing."

Any time you move to something new, the old system and products may not have full compatibility. For example, most new Nikon DSLRs no longer have screw-drive focus motors, so they no longer support screw-drive Nikon lenses. Or look at Canon: Canon abandoned their entire FD system when they went to EOS. Imagine being a Canon customer at that time!

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:12 UTC
In reply to:

LightBug: Title is misleading. It's the combo of A9 plus adapter that are being evaluated, title seems to suggest A9 is solely responsible for the performance reported.

@A-Sign - It's not all about you. We're talking about where things are headed. Companies that fail to heed the signs of change run the risk of falling behind, or being left behind. Look at Kodak, Nokia, and Blackberry. These companies absolutely dominated their markets. Now look at where they are now. Or look at Microsoft, which failed to see where things were headed in the mobile market. Now they are almost shut out of the mobile market. Former Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer famously laughed off the iPhone when it was introduced. All these companies only looked at the moment they were in, thinking "Oh, we'll be fine. Nothing to worry about. Nothing's going to change for another 20 years."

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 20:07 UTC
In reply to:

Rdefen: Can you test AF performance with Sony lens on Canon 1DXMKII. Thanks.

@Cthulion - Sony 100mm 2.8 STF, 135mm 2.8 STF

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 19:54 UTC
In reply to:

Keyboq: It's just a strategy to sell their soon-to-be-released lenses. Considering its price, A9 body is just more than a great deal that Sony can't make much of a profit out of it.

@A-Sign - Let's have this discussion again before the 2020 Olympics in Japan. Let's see if you still have a leg to stand on.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 19:50 UTC
In reply to:

El abuelito: Canon lenses on Sony A9 work much better than Sony lenses on Canon body.

@A-Sign - The Sony system is not "flawed" just because the A9 can't operate at full bore with lenses it's not even designed to support, LOL! The ability to adapt lenses is simply a supplemental capability offered by third-party smart-adapter vendors. No where in the Sony system is Sony offering a Canon adapter! Hahaha. All of these smart adapters are offered outside of what Sony is offering. It's the open, free market that is offering this supplemental capability. As the Sony system continues to grow, it will just be an added convenience and option for people who want to adapt lenses. Adaptability is just an option, not the foundation on which the Sony system is built! It would be a different story if Sony had announced that they weren't going to make lenses for their cameras, and the whole system would be dependent upon adapting other-system lenses! Obviously that's not the case.

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 19:43 UTC
In reply to:

T3: I think the fact that we're even talking about the focus capability of adapted lenses is pretty extraordinary. Up until very recently in camera history, the only "focus capability" of adapted lenses was manual focus! So I find it a rather silly thing to be complaining about. It's like complaining about that the new Image Stabilization feature in a body or lens only offers 2 or 3 stops of stabilization instead of 4 or 5 stops, when the prior alternative-- up until that moment in history-- was having no Image Stabilization at all.

@davev8 - My argument is that adaptability is an advantage. Plain and simple. It's an advantage now, and will be an advantage into the future, even as Sony fills out their lens system. We're going to get to a point where it doesn't matter if you're using a Sony lens or a Canon lens on a Sony body. So all those Canon EF mount lenses you speak of will work on a Sony body. That is an advantage. These lenses will also get the advantage of Sony's IBIS. That is an advantage. If you want to base your argument on this single moment in time, based on the limitation of cameras not being able to perform well beyond 5fps AF tracking, that's fine. But I'm thinking long term, and at the broader picture. Adaptability is better than no adaptability. (Advantage.) AF is better than no AF. (Advantage.) 5fps AF tracking is better than no AF tracking. (Advantage.)

Link | Posted on Jun 24, 2017 at 19:32 UTC
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