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On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

aftab: Looking at the body price only can be a bit misleading.
Let's add a commonly used lens, 24-70/2.8.
At B&H A7III + 24-70/2.8 GM = 4200 USD
D750+ 24-70/2.8 (non VR)= 3600 USD
For those who don't need video, A7III is quite expensive compared to D750. D750 is an extremely popular camera. I am sure A7III will be very popular too. But I doubt it will be as popular as it's Nikon counterpart, because price matters, lens collection matters, reputation matters, photographer matters, weather sealing matters, battery life matters and OVF and larger size (and ergonomics) matters to many.
(just a thought from a Canon user)

Conversely, one could say AF point coverage matters, face/eye AF matters, 5-axis IBIS matters, frame rate matters (10fps vs 6.5fps), silent electronic shutter matters, etc.

For me, as a DSLR shooter who now uses mirrorless, I'll never buy another camera that doesn't have face AF. I just find it too useful and effective to do without it. Focus point coverage also matters to me. D750's focus point coverage is pretty pathetic when compared to the A7III.

D750, focus points only in the center:
https://c1.staticflickr.com/4/3910/15231370695_030835e674_b.jpg

A7III, 693 AF points across the entire frame:
http://sonyalphalab.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/a7iii-af-points.jpg

The very limited AF coverage of the D750 only in the center of the viewfinder, combined with the lack of face/eye AF, would be a total deal killer for me. Of course, if that's all you've ever known, that might be good enough. But once you experience face/eye AF and wide area focus coverage, it's hard going backwards.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 06:54 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

trungtran: A DSLR will always be about pure photography. I hope Canon, Nikon and Pentax continue to build DSLRs.

Mirrorless will overtake DSLRs eventually and become that high resolution super high tech video camera it strives to become.

Just point and shoot, it will take 1000 frames incorporating pixel shift, aperture bracketing, exposure bracketing, focus bracketing, 3 secs before and after the moment so you don't miss anything. It will have a super battery, and connectivity so you can upload infinite amounts of data anywhere in the world to a server where AI will choose the best photo from that 1000 frames and also give you the lytro option to change things after the fact.

"A DSLR will always be about pure photography. I hope Canon, Nikon and Pentax continue to build DSLRs."

I remember when film shooters said the same thing about film cameras. "A film SLR will always be about pure photography." They were obviously trying to disparage DSLRs as not being about "pure photography." And now, people are using the same argument against mirrorless cameras! Haha, it's funny how history repeats itself!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 06:20 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

photoMEETING: Comparing apples with oranges, he?

"Opinion: the orange could be the new apple"

A more pointed remark:
D750 = camera
A7 III = toy

@vscd - My point is that older people like you or I will not determine the future of ILCs. It's the younger generation that will do that determining. And, yes, there will always be people who are interested in photography enough to buy an ILC. But my bet is that most of that next generation will opt for the more advanced technology of mirrorless cameras over the "old-fashioned" technology of DSLRs, much like my 15 year old nephew did. He has no interest in the clack of a flipping mirror, or the primitive featurelessness of an OVF. Looking at an electronic screen (in the viewfinder) is as natural to him as breathing because he's been looking at electronic screens all his life.

Here's my old Samsung NX30 I gave to my nephew. https://ibb.co/f3GWNS He was far more interested in this camera, and what it could do, than my old Canon DLSR that I was going to give him. The NX30 was, and still is, a great camera. This thing could do 10fps, but also 15 and 30fps at 5mp resolution!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 06:07 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

photoMEETING: Comparing apples with oranges, he?

"Opinion: the orange could be the new apple"

A more pointed remark:
D750 = camera
A7 III = toy

@vscd
"Let's wait if mirrorless will survive modern technology like smartphones, too."

The smartphone generation feels more comfortable with mirrorless. Things like face detect AF, real-time exposure preview, framing with an electronic screen, having focus points across the entire image frame...these are things that both mirrorless cameras and smartphones have in common. Therefore as we move forward the next generation of photographers are going to find mirrorless technology much more to their liking than DSLRs with flipping mirrors that block access to the features of the image sensor.

I have three nephews, 9, 13, and 15. They've seen me with both my DSLRs and mirrorless cameras. They naturally gravitate towards the mirrorless cameras with their intelligent EVF systems. To them, the DSLR seems "old-fashioned". The oldest one expressed interest in photography. I offered him one my older cameras. Rather than taking one of my old Canon DSLRs, he opted for my old Samsung NX30!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 06:04 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

@HowaboutRAW - And by the way, we are specifically talking about the D750 because that is the topic of this article-- the D750 vs the A7III! That's why no one is talking about Leica's or Oly's, you nut! This article and this thread pertains to the D750, not the Leica M8. We aren't talking about every camera or brand that has ever encountered a problem or defect!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 05:51 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

@HowaboutRAW - Dude, what is wrong with you? No one is "bashing" Nikon. Numerous sites all referred to it as a recall.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/nikon-d750-recall-updated-again/

https://petapixel.com/2017/07/14/nikon-recalls-d750-third-time-shutter-issue/

https://fstoppers.com/originals/nikons-shutter-shading-issue-might-be-best-thing-happen-d750-owners-187934 "While the shutter shading issues of the D750 don't plague every body, Nikon's recent service advisory (i.e., recall) does apply to quite a few of them. "

https://www.dpreview.com/news/5252259585/nikon-expands-d750-shutter-recall-yet-again-more-cameras-affected

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LmUge9VswI "NIKON D750 RECALL/ DEFECT EXPLAINED* WITH EXAMPLES & DETAILS"

https://nikonrumors.com/2017/07/13/important-nikon-expands-the-previous-d750-shutter-problem-recall-newer-cameras-could-also-be-impacted.aspx/

So were all these sites out to "bash" Nikon? Was it all a big conspiracy against Nikon? No. Grow up!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 05:45 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

HowaboutRAW, you would make a great PR spokesperson or Trump press secretary. The reality is that the D750 was having issues that other cameras didn't have, thus the "service advisory" (or whatever you want to call) was issued and unsold D750s were pulled.

And by the way, there have been plenty of recalls due to something that only affected "a small number." So that vain attempt at PR spin is neither here nor there.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 05:00 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

photoMEETING: Comparing apples with oranges, he?

"Opinion: the orange could be the new apple"

A more pointed remark:
D750 = camera
A7 III = toy

I remember a lot of manual focus SLR users considered auto focus cameras to be "toys" too.
Nikon F3 = a "real" camera!
Nikon F-501 (Nikon's first successful auto focus SLR) = toy! gizmo! gimmick!

It's deja vu all over again! Funny how history repeats itself. But in the end, progress and technology wins out. What was once considered the "toy/gizmo/gimmick" becomes the standard.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 04:49 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

@HowaboutRAW - You're just using Orwellian doublespeak. Nikon recalled a defective product in order to fix it. It was a recall. Sure, your camera wasn't going to explode if you didn't return it for service. But it was still, essentially, a recall. And numerous photography websites correctly referred to it as a recall.

Ultimately, the fundamental issue is this: there was a defect with the product. Whether you want to call it a "service advisory" (as in, "we really advise you to return this defective product for service, otherwise we wouldn't be sending you this notice") or you call it a "recall", the fundamental issue is the same: the D750 was plagued with a defect that needed numerous attempts to fix it. So now I guess you're going to argue against the word "defect" and "fix"? You're going to gin up alternative words that sound more pleasant to your fragile ears? :)

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 04:25 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

Mastering Light: The Sony is kind of a rip off when one considers the whole package. The A7iii and two f2.8 zooms is almost $7000. With just a 24-70/2.8 it is a whopping $4400. Worse, since so many Sony users buy Canon lenses, there are few Sony’s on the used market. So while anyone can find a D750 with a 24-70/2.8 got just over $2000, the Sony is more than double.
The D750, which focuses faster in low light and is weather resistant, is not only a better camera, but is a better value. Heck, a lot of people will have to pay even more just so they can get a decent grip and battery life with the Sony. Sony you pay THOUSANDS more for a camera that isn’t weather resistant and won’t take noticeably better pictures. Ouch.

@junk1 - It's not much of an argument to say that some people will spend less because they won't "buy ANY lenses." That's not an apples-to-apples comparison. Besides, at some point in time, these users had to buy these lenses from somewhere! It's not as if they fell out of the sky for free. As for Sony "selling expensive lenses...unlike Nikon", last time I checked Nikon was still selling plenty of expensive lenses.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 04:11 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

@HowaboutRAW - A "service advisory" is just another way of saying "recall". It's just corporate-speak to make things sound less alarming. They do that to lessen the PR impact. But it's still a recall. And yes, Nikon did physically "recall" unsold D750's that were on store and warehouse shelves. So let's stop with the Orwellian doublespeak! It's like when companies say they are "downsizing" or "right-sizing" their employee headcount rather than saying they are doing "layoffs". But it's still a layoff!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 03:58 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

AriesII: "Needing something reliable" and since when has a Sony Alpha camera been reliable? The Alpha cameras have been plagued from the Mark I to the A9 although there has been much improvements. The Mark I and Mark II have been plagued with crappy shutter design that gets stuck in slightest weathered conditions, firmware errors, banding, and overheating (although much has been fixed).

@HowaboutRAW - It wasn't a mandatory "recall", as if Nikon went out and confiscated every D750 that had been sold. That's not really how recalls work. Recalls are typically voluntary. The notice goes out, and it's up to the user/owner to voluntarily return the product to the manufacturer. That's what happened with the D750. It was still, effectively, a recall:

https://petapixel.com/2016/03/01/nikon-recalls-d750-shutter-issue/

https://petapixel.com/2017/07/14/nikon-recalls-d750-third-time-shutter-issue/

Nikon even pulled unsold D750's from store shelves:
https://petapixel.com/2015/01/14/nikon-d750-disappearing-stores-shelves-quiet-recall-underway/

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 03:40 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

Mastering Light: The Sony is kind of a rip off when one considers the whole package. The A7iii and two f2.8 zooms is almost $7000. With just a 24-70/2.8 it is a whopping $4400. Worse, since so many Sony users buy Canon lenses, there are few Sony’s on the used market. So while anyone can find a D750 with a 24-70/2.8 got just over $2000, the Sony is more than double.
The D750, which focuses faster in low light and is weather resistant, is not only a better camera, but is a better value. Heck, a lot of people will have to pay even more just so they can get a decent grip and battery life with the Sony. Sony you pay THOUSANDS more for a camera that isn’t weather resistant and won’t take noticeably better pictures. Ouch.

Plus, have we all forgotten about the D750 quality issues?

https://petapixel.com/2017/07/14/nikon-recalls-d750-third-time-shutter-issue/

The D750 has had a tumultuous, defect-plagued history. I'm surprised Nikon still has the audacity to charge so much for it after all these years and all these issues. But then again, they probably have to to make up for the losses and costly recalls they've endured with it. So, to paraphrase what you said, "The Nikon D750 is kind of a rip off when one considers the whole package." Ouch.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 03:22 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

Mastering Light: The Sony is kind of a rip off when one considers the whole package. The A7iii and two f2.8 zooms is almost $7000. With just a 24-70/2.8 it is a whopping $4400. Worse, since so many Sony users buy Canon lenses, there are few Sony’s on the used market. So while anyone can find a D750 with a 24-70/2.8 got just over $2000, the Sony is more than double.
The D750, which focuses faster in low light and is weather resistant, is not only a better camera, but is a better value. Heck, a lot of people will have to pay even more just so they can get a decent grip and battery life with the Sony. Sony you pay THOUSANDS more for a camera that isn’t weather resistant and won’t take noticeably better pictures. Ouch.

BTW, the D750 is nearly four years old (introduced September 2014), and Nikon still wants $1800 for it. The A7III is brand new, has better specs, and it's only $200 more. You can bet that Sony will be selling the A7III for a lot cheaper four years from now! Sony has lowered the price of the prior-generation A7II (introduced November 2014) to only $1400. The D750, which is actually older than the A7II, is still priced at $1800. So maybe it is the D750 that is the "rip-off"?

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 02:59 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

Mastering Light: The Sony is kind of a rip off when one considers the whole package. The A7iii and two f2.8 zooms is almost $7000. With just a 24-70/2.8 it is a whopping $4400. Worse, since so many Sony users buy Canon lenses, there are few Sony’s on the used market. So while anyone can find a D750 with a 24-70/2.8 got just over $2000, the Sony is more than double.
The D750, which focuses faster in low light and is weather resistant, is not only a better camera, but is a better value. Heck, a lot of people will have to pay even more just so they can get a decent grip and battery life with the Sony. Sony you pay THOUSANDS more for a camera that isn’t weather resistant and won’t take noticeably better pictures. Ouch.

Nikon 24-70/2.8 VR: $2,396.95
https://www.amazon.com/Nikon-24-70mm-Vibration-Reduction-Cameras/dp/B013D1BMFE

Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM: $2,198.00
https://www.amazon.com/Sony-FE-24-70mm-2-8-Lens/dp/B01BESQYJW/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1523846118&sr=1-1&keywords=sony+24-70%2F2.8+fe

Nikon 70-200/2.8 VR: $2,589.00
https://www.amazon.com/Nikon-70-200mm-Nikkor-Digital-Cameras/dp/B002JCSV8U/ref=sr_1_2?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1523846199&sr=1-2&keywords=nikon+70-200%2F2.8+VR

Sony 70-200/2.8 GM OSS: $2,598.00
https://www.amazon.com/Sony-70-200mm-2-8-OSS-Lens/dp/B01IDQEQ34/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1523846237&sr=1-1&keywords=sony+70-200+2.8

Sony body + lens total: $6,794
Nikon body + lens total: $6,782

They are the same price. But the A7III gives you 693 AF points covering 93% of the viewfinder, 5-axis IBIS, face/eye AF, 10fps vs 6.5 fps, silent electronic shutter, a better sensor, touchscreen, multi-system lens compatibility, 4K video, etc. Rip-off? Nope. Try again.

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 02:50 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)
In reply to:

Shangri La: Tow words: lens selection.

@Shangri La - Three words: Canon EF compatibility.

So the A7III has access to Sony E-mount, Sony A-mount, Canon EF, as well has a lot of retro glass including Nikon F manual focus glass, and even Leica rangefinder glass! Seems like the Sony has much greater lens selection! And it should be noted that the Sony A7III adds image stabilization to all of this glass, thanks to IBIS!

Link | Posted on Apr 16, 2018 at 00:51 UTC
In reply to:

Thoughts R Us: This could be a premature epitaph. Here's an analogy I like from another thread by someone else: think of the microwave oven. In the 1970s how many predicted that the conventional oven would go away? Now the microwave is great and has its uses, but we still use conventional ovens, esp. for serious cooking.

I think it's premature to declare the end of the DLSR.

Vinyl records is a perfectly fine analogy. The point is that there is ALWAYS a time when someone can say, "Look at the ratio right now! Change is never going to happen!" The problem is that it can change dramatically in the following year. Or it can happen very steadily. But change will happen! By next year, Canon and Nikon will probably have their FF mirrorless systems released. Let's talk at that time! By then, every manufacturer (possibly with the exception of Pentax) will be pushing mirrorless hard. And we will see an industry-wide shift, especially with the marketing and brand might of Canon/Nikon promoting their new mirrorless systems.

Link | Posted on Apr 15, 2018 at 23:04 UTC
In reply to:

Thoughts R Us: This could be a premature epitaph. Here's an analogy I like from another thread by someone else: think of the microwave oven. In the 1970s how many predicted that the conventional oven would go away? Now the microwave is great and has its uses, but we still use conventional ovens, esp. for serious cooking.

I think it's premature to declare the end of the DLSR.

"Your analogy with gas combustion cars... is fraud. Just like the other guy, you have no way of supporting your claim."

I pointed out what the manufacturers are saying. Car manufacturers have announced target dates for phasing out gas cars. These are pretty serious commitments. Did you even read any of the articles I linked? I don't have to "support my claim" other than to say that major car manufacturers are, in fact, making it a goal to phase out gas cars! They have said that this is the direction they are headed in! Likewise, the same can be said of camera manufacturers. We should really heed what they are saying.

As for DSLR/mirrorless coexistence, DSLRs will certainly be around for years to come. They are like vinyl records and record players: even though the dominance of vinyl ended many years ago, vinyl is still available and new albums are still being released on vinyl. Vinyl didn't go away. The same will apply do DSLRs. Even Sony says they'll still continue with A-mount.

Link | Posted on Apr 15, 2018 at 18:03 UTC
On article Opinion: the Sony a7 III could be the new Nikon D750 (1214 comments in total)

With every passing year, mirrorless keeps getting better and better. As for the A7III vs D750, the A7III now holds too many advantages over the D750: 693 AF points covering 93% of the viewfinder, face/eye AF, facial recognition/registration, 5-axis IBIS, 10fps vs 6.5 fps, silent electronic shutter, compatibility with Canon EF lenses, no need for micro-adjust, a body size that doesn't stick out like a sore thumb everywhere you go, etc, all for only $200 more than the nearly 4 year old D750.

Link | Posted on Apr 15, 2018 at 17:54 UTC as 167th comment
In reply to:

Thoughts R Us: This could be a premature epitaph. Here's an analogy I like from another thread by someone else: think of the microwave oven. In the 1970s how many predicted that the conventional oven would go away? Now the microwave is great and has its uses, but we still use conventional ovens, esp. for serious cooking.

I think it's premature to declare the end of the DLSR.

@Alex Sarbu - "There can be no end of the dominance while that technology remains dominant."

That can be said of any technology...until it's not dominant. Things are dominant until they aren't. Wow, thanks for the incredible insight! So you basically said nothing. No one wins forever. And few technologies stay dominant forever, especially when a new technology brings something better, that does more, or is less mechanically complex, etc. For example, gas cars will eventually lose their dominance to electric cars. You may not believe it right now based on sales, but the people who actually make the cars are saying otherwise:

https://www.nbcnews.com/business/autos/gm-going-all-electric-will-ditch-gas-diesel-powered-cars-n806806

https://www.theverge.com/2017/7/5/15921208/volvo-all-electric-by-2019

https://futurism.com/toyota-just-announced-a-deadline-for-the-phasing-out-of-gas-engines/

We have to look at where the manufacturers are headed. The same goes for the camera industry.

Link | Posted on Apr 15, 2018 at 17:26 UTC
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