Composition is about a whole lot more than the 'rule of thirds' or the 'golden spiral.' If you really want to understand what makes a photograph stand out, you need to dive deeper into the art of photography and photo composition... which is exactly what Ted Forbes did in this old episode of his aptly-titled YouTube channel The Art of Photography.
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The episode was dug out of the archives by Fstoppers, and it was part of a larger series on composition, which is elaborated on in a blog Forbes was maintaining at the time called Composition Study.
But this episode in particular stands out, because it's one of the deeper video dives out there on the subject of simplicity, minimalism, and negative space. Forbes starts with figure/ground relationships, and expands from that to explain how you create dynamism in a photograph, let your subject/figure breathe while drawing your viewers eye to that subject, and much much more.
Check out the full episode below, and then share your favorite minimalist composition in the comments down below:
Considering the elements: color, form, line, shape, space, texture, and value; and the principals: balance, emphasis, movement, proportion, rhythm, unity, and variety; there's plenty of objective ways to evaluate art, including the thirds and fibonacci. Chill. Enjoy the art.
How would one describe elephant exctement at the circus? Is there a proper way it should fall to the ground. Once on the ground..... Analysis of art is pretentious, self serving, ego centric and biased. How you like your elephant excrement to look in the middle of the winter on a blank sheet of white paper should determine your elephant poop techniques. Analysis starts with "Anal".... for a reason ;)
analysis of art by high minded critics with wardrobes filled with emperors suits and artist thinking about visual dynamics the Arabesque... light and dark movement.. color and all the other concerns of an artist ...
ARE quite different things ..... it behooves anyone possessing a soul capable of an aesthetic emotion or wishing to ...., to grasp the difference ,,,and to think clearly and unemotionally about the topic itself and its merits ...its strength and its weaknesses ... you can over analyze anything , but just as easily dismiss analysis and thought .....
. you either command them or you don't you look and think and feel until it part of your soul .... but to poop on the idea of understanding are is a sure path to
GIGO or for some EI EI EOOOO
and you will never command or understand or know the joy of something you've made up you mind never to think about
@tvstaff - Ecxtement? I can't get past your anal-ysis because you can't even spell the crap right that you're using. No, art analysis per this article isn't biased, it's quite measurable and objective.
Ted does a pretty good job here presenting figure/ground relationship(s) and the general effect of 'simplification' in an approachable, conversational tone. As an academic with years addressing the subject of composition, I could quibble over some detail - particularly the conflation of some terminology - but choose not to go into that here. Largely the general dialog and considerations are good ones, aided by including examples of work by photographers employing a reduced economy of elements and minimalism in their work. And I think these types of examples help to show that there can often be a rich range of approaches to form, from that which appears very calculated to that which seems to draw more from intuition.
My experience in teaching photography has been that, whatever the reason, students tend to think about composition as 'framing', almost exclusively. (And in this way, rule of thirds or golden ratio are viewed as dogmatic template rather than suggestion) It has always been a bit of effort to get them to regard the wider group of concerns that constitute composition - the various potential elements and organizational principles that can present in photographic 'form', and, very importantly, how that impacts the reading of overall 'content'.
The video was uploaded in 2012. I watched the video 2 years back maybe, and subscribed to that channel. Looks like Ted puts loads of resources towards his YouTube channel. He even started reviewing cameras(his most viewed, but worst videos IMHO).
Well I quite liked it. I'm guessing such compositional opportunities are going to be few and far between, especially if you shoot very wide. Some of the comments look like negativity for the sake of negativity.
IMHO . . . the more rules and ideas you learn, the more complex your pictures can become. You don't need to apply each and every single rule you know to every picture. Just pick what you think accentuates the subject you are taking. :)
But negative space is IMHO one of those things that affects most pictures.
Even if you crop into a subject so there is no background, then the elements within the space become the subject, and the space around it can be considered the negative space. LOL.
the more great image s we experience and intelligently internalize even perhaps unconsciously ... the better chance we have of making great discoveries in composition subject mood and form that van tap and use these ideas ....
If you’re going to lecture 100,000 people on a subject it’s a good idea to read up on the definitions of the terms you’re using.
Figure/ground: i.e. the human figure (or subject of the painting) versus its background. Often used to discuss the “figure-ground relationship” or “composition”. Negative space: similar to background, is used to describe the “shapes” around the subject. If you cut out the human figure from an image, you’re left with the negative space. Often those shapes are interesting in themselves, and so it’s worth considering them in a composition.
art is what I like or what I say it is.... is a common misconception...what this guy is trying to make you think more deeply in a visual language you can internalize and eventually command remember the lesson of learning to ride a bike .... you waver and struggle to keep balance to not fall over and not shake the front wheel back and forth....and then finally all the uncertainty falls away and riding effortlessly come from within... without consciously analyzing balance.
but first, you learn ... you don't arrogantly suggest bike riding knowledge is just what you say it is ... but you can't do one without the other .., in art... bike riding or motorcycle maintenance
learning about art and visual dynamics can be learned.... I'm amazed that anyone should think it otherwise
..
whats most amazing to me is how some people are so sure that something they don't know does not need to be learned ?...what other human quest is so flippant and without knowledge or principles ???
I enjoy your analogy, as long as we acknowledge that the visual mechanics of art might present as someone riding a bicycle in an unorthodox, perhaps even perplexing, manner.
there are many ways to ride a bike as there are rules in art to break intelligently
I'm reminded of suspension bridges that don't fall down so well they are widely emulated .. yet there are a few suspension bridges in the world where all the conventions were broken and novel approaches of strength beauty and integrity were taken by someone "breaking the rules " with purpose and wisdom ... such bridges stand too
there are no simple answers and one size fit all solutions to aesthetics and creation .. it just needs to done with success
Cosinaphile --those bridges were built by people who understood the prevailing technology, and that of previous examples, thoroughly...and no laws of physics were broken.
I found this useful. Although I sometimes strive for simplicity composition, thinking about it in terms of 'negative space' is new to me. Minimalism is not new to me as a general concept, but I hadn't heard of Michael Kenna before, and quite like some of his images used in the video. The idea of placing your 'figure' close to the edge of a frame to emphasise it is also new to me - like the concepts of 'negative space' and 'minimalism', it goes against my instinctive desire to fill the frame with detail, tone and colour. Anything that makes me reconsider my approach is useful.
This was a lot easier on the ears. 6 minutes of verbal diarrhoea before deigning to show us the first piccie; someone doesn't understand their medium. Please, DPR, tune the robot a little finer than linking to anything with the word Photo in it.
Keep it simple. Don't follow any rules. Just do whatever looks good for the subject you're shooting and don't worry about it. Some people put way too much philosophy and thought into photography. We're not saving a drowning child here. We're just making photos. That's it. Enjoy it but don't overthink it ;-)
That's one way of looking at it, if you are 'just making photos'. But if you're struggling to show something in a particular way, maybe as part of a larger body of work, or to learn how to use the medium in a way you find original and exciting and maybe worth doing for a lifetime, it's going to be more than just snapping without rules or thought.
"Keep it simple. Don't follow any rules. Just do whatever looks good for the subject you're shooting and don't worry about it. Some people put way too much philosophy and thought into photography. We're not saving a drowning child here. We're just making photos. That's it. Enjoy it but don't overthink it ;-)"
Just press the shutter release button.
Continue and you'll get elected to the highest office.
"Just do whatever looks good for the subject" -- whatever.
@D200_4me, in some ways I agree with what you say, and in some ways I don't. I suspect that some composition rules are based off how our brains work, like feeling if something is balanced or not. It is built into us. We don't need to learn it. But to use an analogy. I may know I like Pho Noodle soup. Me liking that dish might be built into me, or it may be learned. But just because I know I like Pho Noodle soup doesn't mean I can make it. LOL. For that, I need a recipe. And even with a recipe, I can't make it as good as the cook at the restaurant. To me, composition tools, are recipes for composition. They are just a starting point to get you thinking in terms of design. Or to be able to explain why you like a picture. But it is not the reason it works. And I suspect, good photographers, like good cooks, once they know the recipe, they can deviate from it and make something better. For me, I struggle just following the recipe to make Pho Noodle soup. And it doesn't even taste good. :(
the ability to enjoy cheeze beer wine or hot food ....?
one of the strange things about sights is if sight is medically restored to someone past a certain age they remain blind because their mind never was able to wire itself developmentally to allow adult sight
I know people from every category n the first sentance above and im certain it isn't just different taste it was a childish abandonment that prevented and development of appreciation of nuance in certain foods and drinks they have crippled their taste buds thru childish avoidance until its an inescapable part of their character the roots of aesthetic principles every potential in the human panoply of abilities and the understanding of the visual may lie at the center of each human ... buy if you don't consciously cultivate it withers and dies like a neglected garden until even the possibility of growth is forgotten
some wise souls have learned to grow as an artist by following the route provided by previous work and learning from it in a noneducational setting but if knowlege is out there why not tap it ,,,??
very very very few can make the journey in a vacuum
One more comment. I'm not saying you shouldn't know the rules and start out with that in mind because that's what I do. I use the rule of thirds very much. I was just more or less commenting on how some people (especially on social media) take the 'deep thoughts' part of photography a little too far. Every photo of a beach or isolated flower people on social media doesn't need a deep thought posted along with it. I love photography and I try to have some kind of emotional connection to my photos when I'm capturing them (if it's not just a quick snapshot I need for a memory on vacation, etc)...but I don't feel the need to post a 'deep thought' along with every image I post.
It's also very good to be inspired because if you're not inspired or passionate about what you do, you're not going to do as well with it.
d 200 good point ... not every photo is or should strive to be a god touched work of art
just as my sketch pencil can dash off a note of record... or a sublime drawing does not diminish the value of either ... photos can just record for record's sake,,,to be a notation of a personal history .
or whatever .. thay can also be a personal quest to create a meaningful body of art
both are fine .... just fine ............
. and why not? The function of a camera can intelligently be exploited for either ...
but doing both with excellence would be a sane person's best possible option.
.. unless,....like me...you are sometimes just really.... really tired ....lol
Sorry. I mistook your original post as meaning, don't learn the rules. :)
But as far as taking vacation pictures . . . I still find myself fiddling with composition. LOL.
I don't take as much time to get a shot. I will make lots of compromises. But . . . in the end, I still find myself quickly looking around the frame and making minute adjustments.
I find, having learned some composition ideas, it's hard to simply turn it off.
It, to me, is like riding a bike or catching a ball. Once you learn it and you can do it, it is kinda second nature and is almost automatic after a while. :)
So, even though I don't take my dSLR on vacation all the time, even if I'm shooting with my lowly Fujifilm XP80 waterproof camera, I still find myself exploring composition. :)
Anyone with no training in visual arts should be happy with taking snapshots that are "sharp". One can spend thousands of dollars on camera body and lenses, but one cannot bullsh!t to make up for a lack of artistic foundation and creativity. DPR is all about buying and testing gear -- in other words, fooling around with technical specs on paper and with an actual device.
I can see that to someone who has never studied this stuff, much less even thought about it that it comes of as some kind of BS feng shui nonsense. I assure you that it isn't. If you were to study any of the visual arts be it painting, sculpture, architecture and yes, photography you'd be learning these concepts. The fact is that if you want to be really good at what you do you develop a method for doing it, rather than just making it up each time. Folks' methods are all individual but the concepts talked about on this video is kind of thing that those methods tend to be built upon.
I think that maybe learning this kind of stuff from a short video isn't the best way to go about it though. Much better would be to take a basic design course with a good teacher. You'd then likely be completing a series of assignments with either black ink or cut black paper where you'd be working out ideas of figure/ground, negative space, etc for yourself.
Poor terminology in my humble opinion. The term negative space is something of a misnomer. As we don't use the word "positive space" in the world of art and just say "subject", one can say only "space" rather than negative space. Works just as well.
Ted says, negative space helps the portrait to breath a little more. ???
I like him and all his work especially on analog photography podcasts years ago before he got in to digital photography. But I find the termininology he uses not inspiring.
Ιt is..! A very sentimental expression to define space not due to existing elements but from elements that describe its presence/form. The same way we say "negative/positive energy" describing the effects and not the physical meaning of the term. Personally I dislike both...
It's really just a term and I don't see what it's called as being vitally important to the subject. What we call "rules" of design might more accurately be called "principles," so it seems silly to point that in art there are no rules (there isn't some sort of governing body that's going to slap you with a fine for ignoring some regulation). I just don't see it being all that useful to get caught up to much on the terminology, it's the concepts that are important.
An algorithm is not Art, nor can a formula for aesthetics be normalized. Anyone touting their bias, is doing just that... Everyone has an opinion... Thank God for that :)
No, an algorithm isn't art, but neither is what's being discussed in this video. It's about some fundamental principles of design, which is not the same thing as an algorithm. I feel like there's a bit of a misunderstanding that some folks have regarding science vs art. There's a feeling that since is all about quantifiable stuff and art is always an anything goes proposition. The truth is that many people and probably even a majority of folks involved in the arts be they painters, graphic designers, architects or photographers have a framework that helps them to shape the work that they do. That framework is shaped by the kind of fundamental principles that this video explains. The fact that most any school program that teaches design/art is going to be dealing with the very same concepts that this guy explains in the video would seem to show that there is something that's valid in the information presented.
Leica makes jewellery. Nikon is dead in the water. Canon sensors are ancient tech. Sony lenses are sh*t. Fuji's are for old men. M43 are too small to be any good. Pentax are dead too. SLR's are history. Hipsters, fools and ignoramuses!
@aramgrg: For everything you say about m43, you have to say it twice. For everything you say about m43, you have to say it twice. And, in print, use font size 24 while everyone else uses 12. And, in print, use font size 24 while everyone else uses 12.
Hi, analyzing art is not silly, it's overwhelming complicated and often badly done. Photographs should solicit a clear emotional response but this can vary greatly with viewers of different cultures, life experiences, levels of education and exposure to artwork. This video identifies some common factors of this genre of photography and does not say that it should be everyone's cup of tea. There is one point though that no-one is making: becoming sensitive to it is natural when photographing existing, minimalist subjects. I love Winter photography in snow and ice where many subjects are already minimal. The same happens with other simple, stark landscapes (desert dunes, seascapes, etc) and some interior designs including art galleries and museums. A similar emotional response can be achieved in the studio with intentionally minimalist compositions. I believe that people become fed up with a genre when it is stretched beyond its true relevance. Pls don't be rude in your comments.
"amazingly great, or ugly junk" - But expressing uncorroborated value judgements on artworks is as far from 'analysis' as you can get. That is what is, as you say, "truly silly".
Did you watch the video btw? It's quite enjoyable and informative.
I think that if you're only getting "analyzing art good/bad" from this video, you're really not understanding what's being put across. Do you think that novelists and film makers don't analyze other work that's come before them to understand how it was put together and to see why elements might work well or fail... and to learn from all of this in their own work? Analyzing writing and film seem to be a more commonly done exercise, but the idea is the same. This is really just how it works... No joke.
Analyzing how a car or a rocket is put together is one thing, analyzing a piece of art is totally different ... like comparing apples to chairs. Art, as well as novels and films come in all sorts of crazy different shapes and tastes which are both loved and hated depending on the viewer/reader. If someone loves a piece of art you just can't say its bad art, and vice versa. Mixing science and emotions is a fools game, unless of course you are chasing maximum profits.
quietrich - Yes, I did watch it, as I have watched dozens of similar ones in the past. A bit of advice though ... be careful, too many art instructions may confuse you and make your head spin.
art is what I like or what I say it is.... is a common misconception...what this guy is trying to make you think more deeply in a visual language you can internalize and eventually command
remember the lesson of learning to ride a bike .... you waver and struggle to keep balance to not fall over and not shake the front wheel back and forth....and then finally all the uncertainty falls away and riding effortlessly come from within... without consciously analyzing balance.
but first, you learn ... you don't arrogantly suggest bike riding knowledge is just what you say it is ... but you can't do one without the other .., in art bike riding or motorcycle maintenance
learning about art and visual dynamics can be learned.... I'm amazed that anyone should think it otherwise
..
whats most amazing to me is how some people are so sure that something they don't know does not need to be learned ?...what other human quest is so flippant and without knowledge or principles ???
cosinaphile - good points. It seems that people are all to quick to put down the idea of studying something that they really don't know enough about to make an informed opinion about it. It's like if I said that all there is to being a pharmacist is putting pills into bottles or that all a florist does is cut the ends of flower stems and put them in containers of water. Clearly there's more going on to doing either of these kinds of things than is what is immediately obvious. Photography is no different and learning these kinds of design principles isn't the kind of "qualifying of taste" that folks are accusing it of but more of a building of a methodology for the medium.
Interesting video, thanks for posting it. Whilst most experienced photographers are aware of minimalism and 'negative space', Forbes has used very appropriate examples from some of the most fascinating photographers. It was particularly nice to be reminded of Man Ray's negative kiss.
Surely, up to two minutes, there is almost zero information for someone who is not a true beginner who have never viewed photos, never mind having taken them. Spending two minutes or more beating about the bush seems to be what a lot of these videos do. So the OP has some point rather than being a fanboy or anything. Where the OP has erred is the fact that this is a video, and there is a bar for you to pull to the right if you are not inspired by the lengthy irrelevant beginning. And to damn the whole thing because the two minutes do not inspire you shows impatience.
"Saurat - You're obviously one of those people who want instant answers and quick fixes. No doubt your photos are utterly ****." --- Agressive, ad hominem reply. Not endearing.
" Spending two minutes or more beating about the bush seems to be what a lot of these videos do." --- I agree generally. I've seen tutorial videos where nothing at all happens for four minutes.
That's why i prefer reading very much over viewing a video. On a text-image combination it is much easier to skip dull passages and get to the interesting bit.
There are other video disadvantages such as unclear voice, dislikable presenter's attitude, music etc. that wouldn't bother you in a text-photo format.
I don't like the trend to put information into video instead of into text. But certainly, it will go on.
Thank you to all those who provided positive replies. h2k gets exactly where I'm coming from. Most of these videos can be summarised in half a page of text!
Saurat: Yes, patience is important in a photographer. However, I prefer to spend my time waiting for the light, rather than watching someone's face on YouTube - to each their own. People have paid good money to use my photographs on the covers of calendars, on devices, on TV and even on billboards.
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