denial of autofocus problem

[Darko Juvan]

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool, so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.
• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot in RAW, adjust ISO...
• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.
• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of frame.
• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.
• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond - ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is solved..

Darko

PS

I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his review.

 

[Daniella68313]

the bottom line that I have find after using it for 2 months is that the 300d is much less predictable and reliable than my 300$ point and shoots. very simple and straightforward.

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to
make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose
in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool,

so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.

• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot

in RAW, adjust ISO...

• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to

avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.

• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative

photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of
frame.

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do
focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in
their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond -
ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is
solved..

Darko

PS
I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based
upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil
about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his
review.

--
I am not an English native speaker and I am not a God!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[advid]

...... agree with you 100% Daniella..... I've now gone back to almost total shooting with my trusty/reliable/'boring' Olympus E10....absolutely reliable both indoors with/without flash and outdoors - superb -

• My 1 month old 300D is so unpredictable (underexposure - flash problems - focus/re-focus issues... etc etc).... Definately wish i'd brought a 10D but could not justify the extra cost....

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to
make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose
in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool,

so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.

• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot

in RAW, adjust ISO...

• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to

avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.

• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative

photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of
frame.

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do
focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in
their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond -
ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is
solved..

Darko

PS
I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based
upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil
about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his
review.

--
I am not an English native speaker and I am not a God!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

--
OLY- E10 OLY-2100 CANON 300D
http://www.pbase.com/gallery/advid/2100

 

[DannyV]

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to
make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose
in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool,

so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.

• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot

in RAW, adjust ISO...

• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to

avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.

• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative

photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of
frame.

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do
focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in
their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond -
ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is
solved..

Bug no, poor choice on Canon's part, yes. Canon will not respond and nothing will get changed, unless one of the hackers figures out the firmware (highly unlikely). If this is a "showstopper" for you then my best advice is to get a 10D, or consider the Fuji, Pentax, Oly, or Nikon offerings. Probably not what you wanted to hear, but IMO this is the reality of it.

Darko

PS
I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based
upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil
about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his
review.

--
Daniel
http://www.pbase.com/dvogel11

 

[Brian D. Schneider]

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

--Works for me every time.
Brian Schneider

 

[Sandman]

advid,

...... agree with you 100% Daniella..... I've now gone back to
almost total shooting with my trusty/reliable/'boring' Olympus
E10....absolutely reliable both indoors with/without flash and
outdoors - superb -

You have got to be kidding? I have the same other two camera. I had to consciously remove the batteries from both due to total lack of use! They will be up for sale soon, as I cannot justify letting them go so neglected.

I have the same camera as you and shoot exclusively in the "creative zone" too. But I have no exposure or focus problems. I am permitting all focus points to remain active unless I absolutely cannot get a focus lock on my intended target. Then and only then do I manually select a focus target. I try to select a target that is aligned with where my subject is in relationship to the frame so I do not have to do a focus-recompose-shoot (FRS) manouver. Occasionally I do have to do a FRS and occasionally the A1 Servo will kick in, but I can usually salvage even that shot.

So 90%: All 7 focus targets active
8%: manually select a single focus target aligned with my subject.
1.95%: manually select a single focus target requiring a FRS.

0.05%: manually select a single focus target requiring FRS and ruined by inappropriate A1 Servo.

Seriously, this is not a difficult strategy to use. Do me a favor and give this a try and let me know your results. I know we may not be shooting the same scenes and we do not have the exact same camera and level of experience, but honestly this is not hard to do. And there is one secret benefit to shooting with this strategy: the camera meters FAR better! While I still have no emperical data to support my hypothesis, I believe you get better Evaluative Metering when the camera selects the active focus point. YMMV.

Cheers,

jim

PS: I loved my UZI and my E-10, but there is no way I'm dealing with all of that noise again. There is simply no comparision in image quality.

--
Shoot more, ***** less!
galleries at: http://www.pbase.com/sandman3

 

[MarcosV]

I'm still in denial about the specific auto focus problem you are talking about, namely the camera switch over to AI Servo when doing the focus lock and recompose.

I haven't experienced this problem. This is based on my experience and given what I've being doing with this camera.

I'm not saying you're lying, but, let's try to figure this out. Here's some questions:

1. Is this problem repeatable for you? If so, can you go to another 300D body like one at a camera store and get the same results?

2. Could it be due to user error or something can be avoided with a change in technique?

3. Could be during some unusual set of conditions that most of us aren't using? This would explain how few people are having this problem.

4. Does the 300D suffer from significant quality issues? After all they are bult in Taiwan using presumably cheaper parts and possibly with lower quality standards.

5. Can someone come up with a set of tests we can all do? More data would be good. If nothing else, ideally we should all be testing all the equipment we buy within the return period as thoroughly as we can. It's easy to calibrate A/V equipment. How to do the same for photo equipment without a test lab setup like what is used in Phil's reviews.

6. For more test data, can we draw on the experiences of 10D owners? To do so, we need to be able to say that the AF system, sensor, DIGIC chip, etc., of the 300D behaves the same way as the 10D's.

Should we take a poll of all readers in this forum? If we get enough responses, that could go a long way towards resolving denial or to at least talk to problems with the camera or camera's build quality.

• Marcos

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to
make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose
in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool,

so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.

• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot

in RAW, adjust ISO...

• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to

avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.

• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative

photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of
frame.

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do
focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in
their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond -
ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is
solved..

Darko

PS
I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based
upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil
about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his
review.

 

[Ulysses]

Two simple questions:

What lenses are you using?
What apertures are you using with the above lenses?

--

Ulysses

 

[RATPhoto]

the bottom line that I have find after using it for 2 months is
that the 300d is much less predictable and reliable than my 300$
point and shoots. very simple and straightforward.

Daniella, if you really mean that, I honestly wish you would go back to your 300$ point and shoot and be happy. Personally, I think you would be insane to do so, but my requirements may not match yours.

As it is, your bitterness is very unpleasant to be around.

--
If you are a new user chances are good your question is answered in the FAQ at:
http://www.marius.org/eos300dfaq.php

For a small gallery of my photographs, see:
http://ratphoto.home.comcast.net/
See my profile for my equipment

 

[Wild-Mike]

I was surprised and confused when I read this post because I have not experienced this. How do I get it to happen? I tried it in P, AV, TV, and M modes.

I have done the following with every lens and I just tested them all again in different lighting and contrast situations. I focus on a spot and then pan to the right or left and the focus has not re-focused. If i focus on a subject and then move forward it will re-focus but not when panning.

I am not sure what I am doing wrong here but it isn't happening for me. Please explain.

Thanks,
Mike

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

--
300D Gallery:
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/

Boat Party Pics:
http://wnyboaters.com/

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as judge in the field of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods. -- Albert Einstein

 

[TomCee]

Sandman wrote:
Hi Jim,

I believe you get better
Evaluative Metering when the camera selects the active focus point.

Interesting thought! Could it be that in your way often the (by the camera) selected focus point is the most contrasty point. That could explain the different metering. Have to give this some tests next week too.

I still find it very difficult to get the right focus with all 7 points active. In the beginning (well, 1 month ago) Doug Kerr plead for letting the camera do most of the thinking. I think we (or at last me) have our head full of years of experience where we learned all kind of tricks, and now we try to outsmart the camera. I sure gonna give it a try for a while to let the camera steer the most.

--



Regards,
Tom

http://clik.to/tomcee
Canon 300D FAQ: http://www.marius.org/fom-serve/cache/3.html

 

[hunter]

Its like any complicated tool where they make zillions of them. Some of them will be faulty and need to be fixed or replaced, and some users don't want to spend the time to learn how to use the tool.
hunter
--
Nikons for 40 yrs, Canon since D-Reb

 

[Jurc]

you're trying the right way, but lucklily you don't have problems. same here - servo only kicked in 2 times while recomposing and i've taken like a 1000 pictures so far. when i'm testing it, it never kicks in.

I have done the following with every lens and I just tested them
all again in different lighting and contrast situations. I focus on
a spot and then pan to the right or left and the focus has not
re-focused. If i focus on a subject and then move forward it will
re-focus but not when panning.

I am not sure what I am doing wrong here but it isn't happening for
me. Please explain.

Thanks,
Mike

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

--
300D Gallery:
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/

Boat Party Pics:
http://wnyboaters.com/

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as judge in the field of truth
and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods. -- Albert
Einstein

 

[Paul Worden]

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond - ignorance > wont help since this problem is here to stay until is solved..

THERE IS NO BUG

I don't think what I say here will persuade you, because you and some others don't understand what happens and how to stop it.

(I'll confess it took me a couple of days to fully understand and I did so by CAREFULLY reading what others have to say in this Forum.)

Canon have fitted the 300D with a predictive, multi-point auto-focus system.

For point and shoot amateurs, this works very well. It tracks movement and focusses on the nearest moving object. It will continue to adjust focus and there is no way WITH MULTI POINT SENSORS ACTIVE to disable that.

BUT

If you deselect all but one focus sensor point, the camera can't detect movement. With only one point active, you can focus on one object, half press the shutter and recompose.

The focus does not unlock - I have tested this by RUNNING around after focussing on a close object and THE AF STAYS LOCKED.

There's no "bug."

If Canon are at fault, it's by not explaining this more thoroughly in the manual. It IS explained on page 62 and I quote

"Manual AF point selection

You can select any one of the seven AF points manually. This is best when you want to be sure to focus on a particular subject, or to use quick AF function to help you compose a particular shot quickly."

Canon know how predictive AF works and they know how focus lock works and they've told you about it in the manual.

I believe the expression is "Sheeeeeez"
--
Paul Worden

 

[ToddAP]

Some members of this forum deny 300D autofocus problem. I want to
make simple clear case upon just one problem - autofocus, recompose
in 300D in creative Av or Tv mode. Here we go:

• 300D is $1000 camera
• $1000 cameras should allow people to be creative with their tool,

so 300D has creative modes - like Av and Tv.

• creative modes, like Av and Tv, allow you to control DOF, shoot

in RAW, adjust ISO...

• one of the first thing you learn about taking pictures is to

avoid putting your subject in dead center of the frame.

• focus-recompose is one of the basic functions in creative

photography and technique to avoid putting subject in center of
frame.

• to be able to reliably focus on desired spot you have to know

where camera will focus so we will use center AF spot.

• to reliably focus-recompose:
• frame your target-spot in center of frame
• half-press shutter button and lock focus on target spot
• recompose your picture
• press shutter button all the way down

This is basic of the basic technique in taking pictures. I have
problem with this technique with my 300D. Half of the time I have
pictures that are out of the focus because AI Servo will kick in
and change focus.

Anybody think that Canon made $1000 camera that cannot do
focus-recompose?

Anybody think that Canon deliberately put such a limitation in
their camera?

I think it's a bug - huge one and IMHO Canon must respond -
ignorance wont help since this problem is here to stay until is
solved..

Darko

PS
I respect this site and my decision to buy 300D was mainly based
upon 300D review from this site. I would like to hear from Phil
about this problem since I didn't find anything about it in his
review.

--
Todd Putman
http://www.dataserv.net/~toddp/gallery

 

[dboogie]

What you are saying is that if you can't get your subject focused by letting the 7 focus points automatically focus on the subject, you then manually select a focus point that has an object along the same plane as your intended subject, so that you can get the focus that way......is my interpretation correct?

If my interpretation is correct, I"m assuming that when you are manually selecting a focus point you are keepin your camera still so that your intended subject remains composed the way you want........correct?

AND in those cases where you don't have a object along the same plane as your intended subject thats when you do the FRS method........right??

dboogie
--
Ooops Up Beside Your Head

 

[TomCee]

Paul Worden wrote:
I think you have a defective camera, or I do.

I can easily trigger the servo to kick in when the single, central, focus point is selected. I can do it on command, repeatedly.

And I hope you read this carefully: I said mine or yours could be defective. I did not, as you did, insult anyone here!!!

--



Regards,
Tom

http://clik.to/tomcee
Canon 300D FAQ: http://www.marius.org/fom-serve/cache/3.html

 

[Wild-Mike]

AND in those cases where you don't have a object along the same
plane as your intended subject thats when you do the FRS
method........right??

Focus on your subject and then move the camera (while still holding the shutter button 1/2 way down) and compose your picture.

For example, in this photo I focused on my grand-daughter in the pictue linked below and then moved the camera to the right so that she wasn't in the center of the photo for composition reasons.
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/113_1371.jpg

--
300D Gallery:
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/

Boat Party Pics:
http://wnyboaters.com/

Whoever undertakes to set himself up as judge in the field of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the Gods. -- Albert Einstein

 

[DavidP #28649]

Actually, it's a breath of fresh air to see somebody who challenges the fact that her expensive DSLR can't do simple things that a point/n/shoot handles with ease.

And I'm not talking about things that follow from physics: eg, greater DOF for the point/n/shoot because of the smaller sensor (and thus, smaller focal length).

As it is, your bitterness is very unpleasant to be around.

--
http://www.outboundmusic.com
Your link to independent music!

 

[MartinM2]

Just a suggestion.

At times, I'll focus and flip the focus mode to Manual, recompose and shoot. I still use AF to get to focus for me as it's better than my eye, but switch it to manual when it's job is done.

Kind of a work around but it seems to do the trick?