R5 Settings for Soccer

Ive noticed that shooting my son's soccer games have proven more challenging due to face detection being turned on. Sometimes, it focuses on other players in the foreground/background or other objects during the fast fast game. Have you all found settings that make it easier to focus on the intended subject? Do you turn face detection off, shoot in servo mode or one shot AF? I am using the R5 with a 100-400 4.5-5.6L lens.

I don't use face detect at all for soccer, just a medium sized square.  Other than that I use minimum 1/1000 shutter (during day though it is usually 1250 to 1600 usually) and wide open shooting with the RF100-500 or a 70-200 if a night game and too dark.

Also electronic shutter is much easier to get a shot at the peak.

Abe27 wrote:

Ive noticed that shooting my son's soccer games have proven more challenging due to face detection being turned on. Sometimes, it focuses on other players in the foreground/background or other objects during the fast fast game. Have you all found settings that make it easier to focus on the intended subject? Do you turn face detection off, shoot in servo mode or one shot AF? I am using the R5 with a 100-400 4.5-5.6L lens.

There are already good suggestions but I'll jump in.

Depending on your distance and the lens used can dictate on how to shoot. There is a whole menu section on focus, a ton of options for your this very reason. The farther away you are the less need for eye focus and most times it shuts itself off if an eye is too far away. it will switch to a larger box. You can also adjust your tracking speed in the menu so it doesn't bounce around so much if a player runs in front of your intended subject. Sorta of a delayed focus reaction to make sure a changed really happened if that makes sense.

Moving subjects usually always work better in servo focus mode. Kinda why there's a mode for that.

Sports can be challenging to master but keep shooting and learn from what doesn't work. These new cameras are so configurable you should find your sweet spot for your style. Remember, you have "Custom" setting options when selecting shooting mode labeled C1, C2 and C3. So you can set your C1 to be for those soccer games. Say Av mode and aperture of 2.8 or whatever, servo mode and human eye detect. C2 could be say landscapes and set things that is your default starting point for that. I used to do kids sport portraits, I set a custom mode to be full manual, ISO at 200, shutter at 1/200 and one shot focus and an aperture of f/8. That was my starting point and tweak for the days ambient light and set my strobe output to match. It's real flat lighting but it looks good for the kids sports portrait.

Good luck and hope I gave you a few things to try that works for you. After you get the settings figured out, try back button focus. It takes a bit to get used to after years of shutter button focus but after a few shoots it becomes second nature and your shooting will improve with less missed focus shots.

sintos wrote:

Hello,

I don't shoot soocer games but my son's hockey on grass games and I guess it's quite the same. It is challeging but I use AF with face detection but I start with a single AF spot on the center and I have tuned my OK button to place this start AF spot in the middle when I push Ok button.

I also use AF case 2...

Pssst, a straight push down on the joystick will also center your AF point (camera comes defaulted this way).

For the OP… This saves you a button, which lets me use the SET button for “Aspect Ratio.” So when the action gets further away (and Eye/Face detect gets sketchier), pressing SET and invoking 1.6x Crop Mode improves AF acquisition and tracking substantially. You do only get 17 MP tho, but if you were going to crop those distant shots anyway…

Happy shooting!

R2

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

I'm not sure that it will works on R5 and I was so upset when I found that out.

That will work on R3 and that's the reason that I have tuned my initial Servo AF spot on small center AF (AF 5 Menu) instead of all the frame. In that way I put the small af spot on the player I want and then let the camera follow him with the face detection. I also use the joystick to put this small AF spot in the center back.

What part won’t work on the R5?  I had one for 2 years and posted my experience shooting that way.

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

I'm not sure that it will works on R5 and I was so upset when I found that out.

That will work on R3 and that's the reason that I have tuned my initial Servo AF spot on small center AF (AF 5 Menu) instead of all the frame. In that way I put the small af spot on the player I want and then let the camera follow him with the face detection. I also use the joystick to put this small AF spot in the center back.

What part won’t work on the R5? I had one for 2 years and posted my experience shooting that way.

I do believe that with R5 you have to choose between AF Face detection or different af spot but not AF spot with AF detection.

Correct. The R5 does not have eye AF in any AF mode except for Whole Area. That does not matter. You can still use Single, Spot or Zone to override eye AF to make your camera focus on the subject you want. The Fro is doing that with Expansion AF in that video. You can see that because there is no AF preview white square or blue AF point within the centre AF point.

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

I'm not sure that it will works on R5 and I was so upset when I found that out.

That will work on R3 and that's the reason that I have tuned my initial Servo AF spot on small center AF (AF 5 Menu) instead of all the frame. In that way I put the small af spot on the player I want and then let the camera follow him with the face detection. I also use the joystick to put this small AF spot in the center back.

What part won’t work on the R5? I had one for 2 years and posted my experience shooting that way.

I do believe that with R5 you have to choose between AF Face detection or different af spot but not AF spot with AF detection.

Correct. The R5 does not have eye AF in any AF mode except for Whole Area. That does not matter. You can still use Single, Spot or Zone to override eye AF to make your camera focus on the subject you want. The Fro is doing that with Expansion AF in that video. You can see that because there is no AF preview white square or blue AF point within the centre AF point.

Thank you ! That's the reason I have tuned my initial Servo AF on small spot in the center and use face detection in the same time and I like it.

I could try in another way as you wrote, using smaller AF spot but I'm not sure that I will see where the camera will keep on focusing. I just want to chose the player on which I want to focus and make sure that the camera stay on it.

Personally I see no gain using Spot for that purpose. All you are doing is trying to get your subject in focus as as step to Eye Focus. Anywhere on the body will do as you can with the Fro's examples. A larger AF area has more contrast to work with.

If your is far away and Single point is so big that outside edges are picking up the background then yes Spot would be a good choice. Of course this is my opinion and I don't care what anyone uses. Try everything out and see what works best for you.

Nina Bailey worked for Canon in a technical role. Rudy Winston says the same thing.

https://www.eos-magazine.com/shop/#!/Understanding-the-Canon-EOS-R5-camera-eBook-by-Nina-Bailey/p/504363220/category=141126006

About Spot focus from the above link.

This very naturally brings about a change in how we’re using this way of focusing. Traditionally this may have been used for very precise focusing with portraits where you’re shooting with a wide aperture lens and it’s critical to focus on the eye and it was also used a lot for wildlife where you need to get through small gaps in foliage or reeds to focus on the subject.

Photographers often assume that smaller AF areas have to be better, the thing to remember is that all focusing systems need contrast better known as detail to focus upon. So the smaller the area we choose to use, the harder it can be for the camera to focus. Generally speaking, the slightly larger focusing areas are the ones that will focus the best.

I have stated that Single and Spot focus areas are larger on the R6II and R7. I don't know about the R3 as I don't have it. The R5 are smaller so I was on Single point most of the time, Zone for BIF and Spot for tight areas like Nina describes.

The key to this is you don't need to get the head or eye in focus to use the pre focus technique. All you need the body of the subject you want to track. Once that is in focus let the the system do it's job when to comes to eye focus.

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

I'm not sure that it will works on R5 and I was so upset when I found that out.

That will work on R3 and that's the reason that I have tuned my initial Servo AF spot on small center AF (AF 5 Menu) instead of all the frame. In that way I put the small af spot on the player I want and then let the camera follow him with the face detection. I also use the joystick to put this small AF spot in the center back.

What part won’t work on the R5? I had one for 2 years and posted my experience shooting that way.

I do believe that with R5 you have to choose between AF Face detection or different af spot but not AF spot with AF detection.

Correct. The R5 does not have eye AF in any AF mode except for Whole Area. That does not matter. You can still use Single, Spot or Zone to override eye AF to make your camera focus on the subject you want. The Fro is doing that with Expansion AF in that video. You can see that because there is no AF preview white square or blue AF point within the centre AF point.

Thank you ! That's the reason I have tuned my initial Servo AF on small spot in the center and use face detection in the same time and I like it.

I could try in another way as you wrote, using smaller AF spot but I'm not sure that I will see where the camera will keep on focusing. I just want to chose the player on which I want to focus and make sure that the camera stay on it.

Personally I see no gain using Spot for that purpose. All you are doing is trying to get your subject in focus as as step to Eye Focus. Anywhere on the body will do as you can with the Fro's examples. A larger AF area has more contrast to work with.

If your is far away and Single point is so big that outside edges are picking up the background then yes Spot would be a good choice. Of course this is my opinion and I don't care what anyone uses. Try everything out and see what works best for you.

Nina Bailey worked for Canon in a technical role. Rudy Winston says the same thing.

https://www.eos-magazine.com/shop/#!/Understanding-the-Canon-EOS-R5-camera-eBook-by-Nina-Bailey/p/504363220/category=141126006

About Spot focus from the above link.

This very naturally brings about a change in how we’re using this way of focusing. Traditionally this may have been used for very precise focusing with portraits where you’re shooting with a wide aperture lens and it’s critical to focus on the eye and it was also used a lot for wildlife where you need to get through small gaps in foliage or reeds to focus on the subject.

Photographers often assume that smaller AF areas have to be better, the thing to remember is that all focusing systems need contrast better known as detail to focus upon. So the smaller the area we choose to use, the harder it can be for the camera to focus. Generally speaking, the slightly larger focusing areas are the ones that will focus the best.

I have stated that Single and Spot focus areas are larger on the R6II and R7. I don't know about the R3 as I don't have it. The R5 are smaller so I was on Single point most of the time, Zone for BIF and Spot for tight areas like Nina describes.

The key to this is you don't need to get the head or eye in focus to use the pre focus technique. All you need the body of the subject you want to track. Once that is in focus let the the system do it's job when to comes to eye focus.

It's very nice to have this kind of discussion just to think about how Af works into our cameras !

We have to try different things to find out which is the best according to our style of pictures. For example, it's not the same thing to shoot jumping horses than hockey players. It's easier to shoot jumping horses because there is only one subject. It's another challenge when there are a lot of hockey players all around and crossing each another...

There is no way I use all frame af spot when I shoot hockey, the camera will pick up the nearest player. That's the reason I use small Servo Af initial spot and face detection. I will try with jumping horses all frame af spot.

I guess the cameras use contrast but also AI to find shape like heads, faces, eyes...

Yes you can't use all frame with spot with the R5. It is either all area eye AF or Single,  Spot, etc. You can use Spot, Single, etc to pre focus.

Other bodies like the R3, R62 and R7 offer eye focus with Single, Spot, Expansion and zone which obviously would narrow down the AF are eye AF is working in. You can customize the size of the 3 zone areas as well which is very handy.

If you are using Spot AF with the R5 it is no different than using a DSLR but you need to do what you need to do to get the job done. With my method I can be in eye AF and by pressing a BBF will override it and go into Single, Spot, etc. Best of both words with split second changes.

Hockey is tough with all the players. When in eye AF Switching Tracked Subjects could be se to 0 but there is a warning in the manual about erratic movement for that selection which I have not really tested out. I use 0 for static and slow moving targets. 1 for erratic.

The only other thing is Tracking Sensitivity to avoid obstructions. I have been it -2 since 2009 when I got my 7D. For hockey I'd have Accel/Decel maxed out. I'd use those settings for both Eye AF and the other AF modes.

Outside of that we are still limited to the current tech which is pretty damn good for first releases. We won't be having these conversations in 10 years.

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

sintos wrote:

Zeee wrote:

Here is another approach that I use. Don't get hung up on just using spot focus. I primarily use single or zone just to get the subject I want in focus before initiating Eye AF.

For example if I'm on eye focus and the camera is picking up the wrong subject or can't find a subject I'll press AF-On that is set to single point to override eye focus. Once the body is in focus I release the AF-On and the eye snaps in. I just need to get the AF point anywhere on the body.

I can shoot 5 perched birds using eye focus and I can get anyone I want in focus in a split second.

Notice how he does this using Expansion AF. Minutes 2:30 to 6:00. 3:10 has the best example. It's a R3 vs Sony shootout but the concept is the same for all ML bodies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGrEWOZYgDw

It may or may not work for you but another option you may want to try.

I'm not sure that it will works on R5 and I was so upset when I found that out.

That will work on R3 and that's the reason that I have tuned my initial Servo AF spot on small center AF (AF 5 Menu) instead of all the frame. In that way I put the small af spot on the player I want and then let the camera follow him with the face detection. I also use the joystick to put this small AF spot in the center back.

What part won’t work on the R5? I had one for 2 years and posted my experience shooting that way.

I do believe that with R5 you have to choose between AF Face detection or different af spot but not AF spot with AF detection.

Correct. The R5 does not have eye AF in any AF mode except for Whole Area. That does not matter. You can still use Single, Spot or Zone to override eye AF to make your camera focus on the subject you want. The Fro is doing that with Expansion AF in that video. You can see that because there is no AF preview white square or blue AF point within the centre AF point.

Thank you ! That's the reason I have tuned my initial Servo AF on small spot in the center and use face detection in the same time and I like it.

I could try in another way as you wrote, using smaller AF spot but I'm not sure that I will see where the camera will keep on focusing. I just want to chose the player on which I want to focus and make sure that the camera stay on it.

Personally I see no gain using Spot for that purpose. All you are doing is trying to get your subject in focus as as step to Eye Focus. Anywhere on the body will do as you can with the Fro's examples. A larger AF area has more contrast to work with.

If your is far away and Single point is so big that outside edges are picking up the background then yes Spot would be a good choice. Of course this is my opinion and I don't care what anyone uses. Try everything out and see what works best for you.

Nina Bailey worked for Canon in a technical role. Rudy Winston says the same thing.

https://www.eos-magazine.com/shop/#!/Understanding-the-Canon-EOS-R5-camera-eBook-by-Nina-Bailey/p/504363220/category=141126006

About Spot focus from the above link.

This very naturally brings about a change in how we’re using this way of focusing. Traditionally this may have been used for very precise focusing with portraits where you’re shooting with a wide aperture lens and it’s critical to focus on the eye and it was also used a lot for wildlife where you need to get through small gaps in foliage or reeds to focus on the subject.

Photographers often assume that smaller AF areas have to be better, the thing to remember is that all focusing systems need contrast better known as detail to focus upon. So the smaller the area we choose to use, the harder it can be for the camera to focus. Generally speaking, the slightly larger focusing areas are the ones that will focus the best.

I have stated that Single and Spot focus areas are larger on the R6II and R7. I don't know about the R3 as I don't have it. The R5 are smaller so I was on Single point most of the time, Zone for BIF and Spot for tight areas like Nina describes.

The key to this is you don't need to get the head or eye in focus to use the pre focus technique. All you need the body of the subject you want to track. Once that is in focus let the the system do it's job when to comes to eye focus.

It's very nice to have this kind of discussion just to think about how Af works into our cameras !

We have to try different things to find out which is the best according to our style of pictures. For example, it's not the same thing to shoot jumping horses than hockey players. It's easier to shoot jumping horses because there is only one subject. It's another challenge when there are a lot of hockey players all around and crossing each another...

There is no way I use all frame af spot when I shoot hockey, the camera will pick up the nearest player. That's the reason I use small Servo Af initial spot and face detection. I will try with jumping horses all frame af spot.

I guess the cameras use contrast but also AI to find shape like heads, faces, eyes...

Yes you can't use all frame with spot with the R5. It is either all area eye AF or Single, Spot, etc. You can use Spot, Single, etc to pre focus.

Other bodies like the R3, R62 and R7 offer eye focus with Single, Spot, Expansion and zone which obviously would narrow down the AF are eye AF is working in. You can customize the size of the 3 zone areas as well which is very handy.

If you are using Spot AF with the R5 it is no different than using a DSLR but you need to do what you need to do to get the job done. With my method I can be in eye AF and by pressing a BBF will override it and go into Single, Spot, etc. Best of both words with split second changes.

Hockey is tough with all the players. When in eye AF Switching Tracked Subjects could be se to 0 but there is a warning in the manual about erratic movement for that selection which I have not really tested out. I use 0 for static and slow moving targets. 1 for erratic.

The only other thing is Tracking Sensitivity to avoid obstructions. I have been it -2 since 2009 when I got my 7D. For hockey I'd have Accel/Decel maxed out. I'd use those settings for both Eye AF and the other AF modes.

Outside of that we are still limited to the current tech which is pretty damn good for first releases. We won't be having these conversations in 10 years.

Just to add these conversations are excellent because it gives people alternative methods to try. May or may not work but you don't know until you try.

For hockey you can be in eye AF for face offs and when less players are in the frame and then flip to another mode when more players are in the frame. That can become a pain after a while. I shot hockey games with DSLR's and did fine. Eye AF is just so much fun to play with. My mission is to not let it get best of me. Doesn't aways work

Of course paid jobs and commitments are a different story. You have to get the shots.