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G16 For Macro Photography

Started 3 months ago | Questions
Pete E New Member • Posts: 4
G16 For Macro Photography
1

I have a G16 which I would like to use for Marco photography, specifically for photographing small coins of around 8mm 3/8" in diameter...

I realise that a DSLR with a macro lens along with the appropriate sized copy stand is probably the best option, but I am looking for a compact set up that won't take much room on a windowsill.

What I have so far is:

G16 and adaptors for 58mm filter. (Digital zoom disabled in menus)

CS320 compact copy stand plus quick detach plate.

+3 Marumi close up lens.

Remote release.

The problem I am having is that I still can't get the subject to fill the frame.

I go into the Macro mode and set the zoom to its widest setting. However, when I do this, to get focus, I have no working distance between the coin and the close up lens...This is causing me issues with lighting the coin...

If I move the camera back to get say a 4" working distance, I end needing to use the zoom and then I have problems with the close focus distance.

I have tried the manually controlled focus option, but there seems to be set focus ranges that relate directly to the zoom being used..

I feel I am making a basic mistake somewhere and not setting things up correctly...

I also wondered if I need a lens that allows me to set the optical zoom to maximum, and at the same time, allows the camera to achieve focus at about 4" if such a thing exists?

If anybody could walk me through setting up for shooting small coins ie distance camera to coin, and the various settings on the camera, that would be much appreciated..

Regards, Peter

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Canon PowerShot G16
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Cyril Catt Veteran Member • Posts: 5,453
Re: G16 For Macro Photography
1

Peter, I'm sorry that I can't help with a specific answer to your query, but as a (lapsed) coin collector myself, I can suggest you might find a second-hand Canon Powershot TX1 might meet your needs; if you can find one!

Although it was announced as far back as 22 February 2007, I still find this unusual, robust, versatile, and tiny, 'pistol-grip' style model my go-to for really closeup shots. Though its I / 2.5" 7 Mp CCD sensor is a lower resolution than current models, its F3.5 - 5.6 lens, with a 39-390 zoom (extendable by a x 1.9 in-lens modification to an acceptable 741mm) can also be adjusted in a 'Super-Macro' setting to focus to zero from the front of the lens! The shutter has an adequate 15 - 1 /2500 second range.

When turned off, the lens fully retreats into the playing-card-box-sized solid metal body behind a rigid metal shield. Its other advantages are 1280 x 720 or 640 x 480 video at 30 fps, and stereo sound: the TX1 can also be used simply as a sound recorder.

As well as extracting individual frames from video, higher resolution stills are available from continuous drive at 2.2 fps. An in-camera facility also allows a series of individual frames to be properly aligned and stitched into a single image.

The main drawbacks are a very small 1.8" screen of only 115,000 dots, and lack of a viewfinder. The small, closely set, controls also proved difficult for some people with large hands, resulting in several negative reviews - and, unfortunately, the first iPhone was announced just four months later: which I find adequately replaces the TX1!

Here are a few examples:

Taken with front of TX1 lens touching computer screen!

Part of a USA 'nickel' 5 cent coin

20mm long Notodontid moth caterpillars on Eucalyptus leucoxylon shrub

A children's hockey match, from centre of the sideline

A frame from a video clip

Riddarholmskyrkan ( Knights' island church spire) & Stadhuset tower from 2.4 km

Stockholm's Stadhuset (Town Hall) tower, with the golden triple crown emblem.

from same place as above

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Cyril

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Jon_T
Jon_T Veteran Member • Posts: 6,393
Re: G16 For Macro Photography
1

Pete E wrote:

I have a G16 which I would like to use for Marco photography, specifically for photographing small coins of around 8mm 3/8" in diameter...

I realise that a DSLR with a macro lens along with the appropriate sized copy stand is probably the best option, ...

True. Possible to find a used Canon DSLR and a "true" Macro lens for your budget. "Close Focusing" lenses will never match the image quality of a "true" Macro lens
(see "What Is a Macro Lens?" HERE).

... but I am looking for a compact set up that won't take much room on a windowsill. ....

"Assuming" you're using the "... window sill ..." for soft lighting?

There are many simple inexpensive DIY light box options online; e.g.; HERE. And inexpensive "daylight" color temp LED lighting available.

IMO a light box will provide greater shooting options than using "window sill"—been there, done that many times 'decades' ago.

What I have so far is:

G16 and adaptors for 58mm filter. (Digital zoom disabled in menus)

CS320 compact copy stand plus quick detach plate.

+3 Marumi close up lens.

Remote release.

The problem I am having is that I still can't get the subject to fill the frame. ....

May want to look into a Lens Adapter that attaches to the G16's 'body mount'; e.g., HERE; so you can attach a macro lens more securely:

One of the popular macro attachment lens is the Raynox DCR-250 Super Macro Snap-On Lens; e.g., HERE.  Might be able to find a used one in good condition.

... I go into the Macro mode and set the zoom to its widest setting. However, when I do this, to get focus, I have no working distance between the coin and the close up lens...This is causing me issues with lighting the coin.

If I move the camera back to get say a 4" working distance, I end needing to use the zoom and then I have problems with the close focus distance.

I have tried the manually controlled focus option, but there seems to be set focus ranges that relate directly to the zoom being used..

Yep, with most compact cameras the max close focusing is at the lens' WA focal length and with a small "front of lens to subject distance". In case not aware the term "Macro" used by camera Mfg's, a fallacy—just their incorrect abbreviated terminology for
"Close Focusing".

As you increase the focal length, the minimum close focusing distance increases.

I feel I am making a basic mistake somewhere and not setting things up correctly...

I also wondered if I need a lens that allows me to set the optical zoom to maximum, and at the same time, allows the camera to achieve focus at about 4" if such a thing exists?

... If anybody could walk me through setting up for shooting small coins ie distance camera to coin, and the various settings on the camera, that would be much appreciated..

To save the need for a LOT of typing, and not knowing your photog experience, there are numerous on-line articles/ tutorials you can find HERE.

Cheers,
Jon

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OP Pete E New Member • Posts: 4
Re: G16 For Macro Photography

Thanks Cyril, I will keep a look out for one of those and see what they go for..

Love your images and they certainly showcase the versatility of that camera....

OP Pete E New Member • Posts: 4
Re: G16 For Macro Photography

Hi Jon,

Many thanks for your detailed reply...

I have tinkered about with photography on and off for years, but have never really

managed to produce results that I was happy with. I thought going digital and being able to review my efforts immediately would be my saviour but it alas it wasn't too be as I found I really really struggled with the Photoshop side of things and still do...I much prefer to get was much done in camera so to speak and keep any editing to a minimum.

So if anybody asks about my experience now, I say I know enough to know I have no talent for it! lol

Getting back to your post, I do like using natural light and a reflector, but have some LED lights of various types as well, including an LED light panel...I didn't mention these because I need to sort the macro side of things first....

As a bit of background, my main passion is metal detecting, and I am looking to be able to take two sorts of pictures..

The first are more casual quick grabs using my mobile to share on a couple of forums I frequent..I use my mobile on the CS320 and get acceptable results..I have included an example at the end of this post.

The second are more "formal" shots to submit to a local museum for ID and recording purposes.

The museum want the objects on a plain white background with no shadow. I have looked at some of the pics  staff from various country wide museums have taken and submittedm on the central data base and the quality is very mixed.

From a photography point of view, they tend to flood the object with light from two lights, and light from underneath via an LED light panel.

The results are flat and uninteresting but a record of the object in their preferred style.

I need to be able to submit photos in that required style, but I am hoping to be more sympathetic with the top lighting to bring out the best in the item..

I don't have a light box/ tent yet, but I have it on good authority I may be getting one for Christmas so I will see what turns up...

I have the various two adaptors mentioned for the G16 and have been considering the Raynox 250, but wanted to hear any other suggestions from people more experienced than I...

Thanks for the links at the end of your post; I haven't had a chance to look at them yet but will do shortly.

Again many thanks for the help,

Regards

Peter

Peter in Canberra Senior Member • Posts: 1,346
Re: G16 For Macro Photography

Cyril Catt wrote:

Peter, I'm sorry that I can't help with a specific answer to your query, but as a (lapsed) coin collector myself, I can suggest you might find a second-hand Canon Powershot TX1 might meet your needs; if you can find one!

Although it was announced as far back as 22 February 2007, I still find this unusual, robust, versatile, and tiny, 'pistol-grip' style model my go-to for really closeup shots. Though its I / 2.5" 7 Mp CCD sensor is a lower resolution than current models, its F3.5 - 5.6 lens, with a 39-390 zoom (extendable by a x 1.9 in-lens modification to an acceptable 741mm) can also be adjusted in a 'Super-Macro' setting to focus to zero from the front of the lens! The shutter has an adequate 15 - 1 /2500 second range.

When turned off, the lens fully retreats into the playing-card-box-sized solid metal body behind a rigid metal shield. Its other advantages are 1280 x 720 or 640 x 480 video at 30 fps, and stereo sound: the TX1 can also be used simply as a sound recorder.

As well as extracting individual frames from video, higher resolution stills are available from continuous drive at 2.2 fps. An in-camera facility also allows a series of individual frames to be properly aligned and stitched into a single image.

The main drawbacks are a very small 1.8" screen of only 115,000 dots, and lack of a viewfinder. The small, closely set, controls also proved difficult for some people with large hands, resulting in several negative reviews - and, unfortunately, the first iPhone was announced just four months later: which I find adequately replaces the TX1!

Here are a few examples:

Taken with front of TX1 lens touching computer screen!

Part of a USA 'nickel' 5 cent coin

20mm long Notodontid moth caterpillars on Eucalyptus leucoxylon shrub

A children's hockey match, from centre of the sideline

A frame from a video clip

Riddarholmskyrkan ( Knights' island church spire) & Stadhuset tower from 2.4 km

Stockholm's Stadhuset (Town Hall) tower, with the golden triple crown emblem.

from same place as above

nice pics.

Cyril Catt Veteran Member • Posts: 5,453
Re: G16 For Macro Photography
1

Peter in Canberra wrote:

Cyril Catt wrote:

nice pics.

Thanks, Peter. And they were taken with a metal cased, robust, pocketable, easy to hold, camera about the size of a standard pack of cards.

If only Canon could update the model with an EVF and higher resolution screen and sensor - and a smart phone attached...Winner!

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Cyril

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OP Pete E New Member • Posts: 4
Re: G16 For Macro Photography
3

Just for the sake of anyone else reading this thread in the future, I can confirm I bought the Raynox DCR -250 and I am very pleased with it.

I went this route because I like my G16 and didn't want to buy another camera if I could avoid it.

I have only played with the Raynox a little bit, but the extra magnification offered is way more than I will ever need.

In hindsight, I could probably have gone with the less powerful (and slightly cheaper) 150, but the 250 will work for me.

When using the 250, I have found by zooming in up to X10 power, I get fantastic close ups, but still have a reasonable working distance to the subject.

I now need to play about with ithe 250 fitted some more to find a sweet spot set up using no more than the X5 optical zoom on the camera.

One thing this close up lens has highlighted is I need a better copy stand set up, preferably something which allows easy fine adjustment of the camera position to allow for fine focusing..

I have ordered a short focus rail and will try that in the short term,and then look at a better copy stand when I understand exactly what I need...

Thanks again for everybody's help,

Regards

Peter

KEG
KEG Veteran Member • Posts: 4,910
Re: G16 For Macro Photography

As something bit different, you can always get a M and EF-M 28 mm macro...

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KEG

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Mark9473 Veteran Member • Posts: 6,425
Re: G16 For Macro Photography

A bit off topic, but I thought this was cool - among the images that made global news headlines about the fusion milestone at Livermore laboratories, was a short clip of a scientist taking a picture of the heart of the device using an old Canon Powershot.

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Mark

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