Pixel 7 Pro: Advantages of RAW

Getting warm with my Pixel 7 Pro I've shot some pictures both in RAW (DNG) and JPG to see how the RAW files look and how the differences between those two are.

After several tests in different conditions I have to say:

• The JPG engine of the Pixel 7 Pro works well in shots with very low light; noise then visible in the DNG files is really hard to combat with the tools I have at hand (mostly I use Topaz DenoiseAI) and so the JPG comes out better.
• In all other cases it depends what you want to do with the shots: If you're okay to see them on a smartphone display, on a standard HD monitor (1920*1080) and if you want do some normal small sized prints, they're okay. But if you want to crop or want to print larger, then it's really a good idea to shoot JPG + RAW, because you gain a lot if you have the RAW at hand.

That's because the JPG engine of the Pixel 7 Pro leaves something to be desired; Pixel peeping at 100% shows that details are lost, fine structures like grass look unnatural, and that there are a lot of sharpening artifacts and sometimes even halos introduced.

A few samples:

First a UWA shot in challenging conditions against the sun in full resolution:

At first it looks clear with nicely balanced highlights and shadows in really challenging conditions. But look at it at 100%, e.g. at the region on the left side near the horizon where you can see the outlines of a larger person with a child (?) on the left. That region is particularly smeared and without much detail. Also the grass looks pixelated here and in other regions of the pic.

Now compare that to the picture developed from the DNG file using Lightroom, again at full resolution (same shot, in spite of slightly different ISO and angle of view, more on that below):

If you look again at the region at the horizon you see a more natural look with some more detail - not too sharp, but much more agreeable to look at IMO.

Note that the DNG has a slightly wider viewing angle and very slightly smaller resolution compared to the JPG - don't know why that is; the slight resolution difference between DNGs and JPGs shows itself with all rear cameras of the Pixel 7 Pro (haven't tested the front one yet). Also - a very strange thing IMO - DNG and JPG pairs show different ISOs - beats me why, I triple checked and made sure that I got the right pairs of  JPGs and DNGs. I saw a slight ISO difference in all pairs.

What you can gain in detail for cropping purposes you can see in this example taken with the 5x tele camera -  it's a 100% crop of the central part of a tele shot. The JPG version is shown above, below the version gleaned from the DNG file:

Do look closely at the feathers and feet of the chicken, and do so at 100%. The increase in detail and sharpness is pretty obvious IMO.

As a last sample again a shot taken with the tele camera - this time JPG on the left, DNG on the right in full resolution (JPG slightly downscaled to match the DNG's resolution):

Here crops from these two pics comparing the region around the feet and especially the feathers there - note the artifacts of the JPG version compared to the more detailed rendition of the DNG version:

Apart from artifacts and detail issues the DNG files give you much more room to adjust shadows and highlights, color temperature etc. to your liking; I tried to match more or less the JPGs renditions here, but if you go for e.g. a less contrasty or warmer picture look, it's easy to do with the DNGs too.

As I said the examples I posted here were developed from the Pixel's DNGs using Lightroom Classic; I PP'ed the DNGs including mild denoising/sharpening if I thought that was necessary; the JPGs were not PP'ed. Since there are no camera profiles for the Pixel 7 Pro available yet in the current version, I applied the one for the Pixel 6 Pro instead. Results may be different when the Pixel 7 Pro profiles arrive with one of the next LR updates.

My conclusion: I will regularly shoot JPG+RAW just to have the DNG around in case I see a reason to crop or to print big.

One last note: If you use the zoom of the Pixel 7 Pro for anything above 10x, the resulting DNG files are simply crops of the native sensor resolution available. Only the JPGs get upscaled - with IMO not very impressive, "watercolor"-like results, so I'm fine with that.

Phil

The advantage of RAW even shows itself when you compare JPG and DNG of a 30x zoom picture. Here a full rez example: on the left the 30x JPG directly from the Pixel 7 Pro, on the right the DNG (that sports a resolution of only 952x1268) sharpened in Topaz Sharpen AI and then upscaled in Gigagpixel AI to the same size of the JPG. Not a perfect pic of course (upscaled more than three times), but much better than the Pixel's JPG engine IMO. More detail visible especially in the leaves:

Interesting to see (but not surprising) that the difference is less severe if you downscale the JPG to the DNG's original resolution:

But even at this low rez the difference is still there. Look for example at the detail of the wood grain (platform of the birdhouse) in this comparison - JPG on top, DNG below (100% crop):

Phil

fujit3 wrote:

philzucker wrote:

Getting warm with my Pixel 7 Pro I've shot some pictures both in RAW (DNG) and JPG to see how the RAW files look and how the differences between those two are

Thank you for sharing and for the well detailed report!

Glad to!

How big are the RAW files produced by the Pixel?

Around 10 MB.

Thanks for your kind comment!

Phil

fujit3 wrote:

philzucker wrote:

fujit3 wrote:

philzucker wrote:

Getting warm with my Pixel 7 Pro I've shot some pictures both in RAW (DNG) and JPG to see how the RAW files look and how the differences between those two are

Thank you for sharing and for the well detailed report!

Glad to!

How big are the RAW files produced by the Pixel?

Around 10 MB.

Thanks for your kind comment!

Phil

I have no experience with android / iPhone RAW files.

I am currently learning a lot because I need a new smartphone and I wanted a good camera phone.

Are Pixel RAW files “pure RAW” at the opposite what ProRAW are ?

I'm not sure here, but I think the Pixel 7 Pro's RAW files are also based on basic "computational photography"; at least I assume that, because else it would be really hard to get close to the JPGs in terms of dynamic range and noise (and especially low light performance); so I think the DNGs are derived not from single exposures, but from combined ones. But I happily stand corrected, if someone knows better.

If you use advanced computational modes - like the action shots or portrait shots with blurred background - you don't get a DNG file, so here definitely RAW is out of the picture.

Since you asked about the file size of the DNG pictures: my first answer "around 10 MB" still stands, but I can be more precise now, looking at it more closely: The range is between 10 and 15 MB for normal 12 MP files, and as low for 1.5 MB for those "superzoom" crops.

May I ask you what bring you to take the Pixel over another phone? Why not the iPhone 14PM ?

No particular reason, save the truly excellent camera. The iPhones are very fine photographic tools too, but of course more expensive. As far as photography is concerned I find the Google's phones very reliable and convincing. I've owned Nexus 5 & 5X, Pixel 2, 5 and 6a before, and all of these had excellent cameras.

I am in Germany and the Pixel ist currently not available to be ordered…

Hmm, looking in the German Google Store I see most versions of the Pixel 7 Pro as available (for the 256 GB hazel and white ones there's a waiting list though), and if I trust some shopping portals you can get it from several retailers too ... And if you want a hazel or white 256 GB one: after slapping on a case (and IMO you have to - the thing is to slippery at least in my hands without a case) you won't see much of the devices color anyway, so the black one could also be an option.

The pixel in the EU is also not available in the 512GB version

That's true, but for my use case - mainly photography and only the occasional video - I'm even fine with the 128 GB version I got. YMMV of course.

Phil

philzucker wrote:

The advantage of RAW even shows itself when you compare JPG and DNG of a 30x zoom picture. Here a full rez example: on the left the 30x JPG directly from the Pixel 7 Pro, on the right the DNG (that sports a resolution of only 952x1268) sharpened in Topaz Sharpen AI and then upscaled in Gigagpixel AI to the same size of the JPG. Not a perfect pic of course (upscaled more than three times), but much better than the Pixel's JPG engine IMO. More detail visible especially in the leaves:

Phil, would you be willing to post the DNG on Dropbox or elsewhere so I could give it a go?

I'm wondering if there would be less artifacting with different Topaz settings. Thanks.

fujit3 wrote:

philzucker wrote:

May I ask you what bring you to take the Pixel over another phone? Why not the iPhone 14PM ?

No particular reason, save the truly excellent camera. The iPhones are very fine photographic tools too, but of course more expensive. As far as photography is concerned I find the Google's phones very reliable and convincing. I've owned Nexus 5 & 5X, Pixel 2, 5 and 6a before, and all of these had excellent cameras.

Thank you Phil!

There's also the Samsung S22 Ultra, which has excellent zoom lenses although I'm not fond of the Samsung bloatware that comes with it.

The Pixel 7 Pro is odd because it's about half the price of either, and might have the best in-phone camera processing, although the jury is still out. Too bad DPreview does not shoot their test scene with various cellphones.

CAcreeks wrote:

philzucker wrote:

The advantage of RAW even shows itself when you compare JPG and DNG of a 30x zoom picture. Here a full rez example: on the left the 30x JPG directly from the Pixel 7 Pro, on the right the DNG (that sports a resolution of only 952x1268) sharpened in Topaz Sharpen AI and then upscaled in Gigagpixel AI to the same size of the JPG. Not a perfect pic of course (upscaled more than three times), but much better than the Pixel's JPG engine IMO. More detail visible especially in the leaves:

Phil, would you be willing to post the DNG on Dropbox or elsewhere so I could give it a go?

I'm wondering if there would be less artifacting with different Topaz settings. Thanks.

Check your PM's - I gave you a download link there. Let us know how you succeed!

Phil

philzucker wrote:

CAcreeks wrote:

Phil, would you be willing to post the DNG on Dropbox or elsewhere so I could give it a go? I'm wondering if there would be less artifacting with different Topaz settings. Thanks.

Check your PM's - I gave you a download link there. Let us know how you succeed!

Thanks, Phil. Here is my Gigapixel 4x version. Using Darktable, I attempted to imitate color balance, contrast, and saturation.

CAcreeks wrote:

Thanks, Phil. Here is my Gigapixel 4x version. Using Darktable, I attempted to imitate color balance, contrast, and saturation.

Wow, very good result. I'm impressed. What did you do in Gigapixel to suppress the artifacts? Or was maybe Darktable doing a better job with the DNG?

Phil

Hank Photo wrote:

Thanks so much! I got my 7 pro a few days ago. Upgraded from Pixel 6 pro. So many improvements. Loving it.

Your detailed analysis that I know took a lot time, is so valuable. I am going to start shooting jpg+dng.

You answered the major question. The .dng files do have the dynamic range and other improvements likely from the multiple shots. Wonder how a low light shot will work.

Again thanks!

You're welcome! Thanks very much for your kind comment - and have fun with your 7 Pro!

Phil

philzucker wrote:

CAcreeks wrote:

Thanks, Phil. Here is my Gigapixel 4x version. Using Darktable, I attempted to imitate color balance, contrast, and saturation.

Wow, very good result. I'm impressed. What did you do in Gigapixel to suppress the artifacts? Or was maybe Darktable doing a better job with the DNG?

Actually I think Darktable shows worse highlight recovery than in your version, and it also has a bit of purple fringing along the birdhouse white paint.

Probably the main difference is that I moved the sliders for Remove Noise and Remove Blur almost all the way to maximum. Gigapixel is darn good for cellphones!

Interesting that the DNG is pre-cropped for these overzealous zoom factors.

CAcreeks wrote:

philzucker wrote:

CAcreeks wrote:

Thanks, Phil. Here is my Gigapixel 4x version. Using Darktable, I attempted to imitate color balance, contrast, and saturation.

Wow, very good result. I'm impressed. What did you do in Gigapixel to suppress the artifacts? Or was maybe Darktable doing a better job with the DNG?

Actually I think Darktable shows worse highlight recovery than in your version, and it also has a bit of purple fringing along the birdhouse white paint.

Probably the main difference is that I moved the sliders for Remove Noise and Remove Blur almost all the way to maximum. Gigapixel is darn good for cellphones!

Indeed. Thanks for the explanation! Will have a closer look at those sliders.

Interesting that the DNG is pre-cropped for these overzealous zoom factors.

Yeah ... I think Google's engineers realized that upscaling for a DNG made no sense, and I really have to agree with them seeing what their upscaling algorithm does to the JPGs.

Phil

I have pixel 7 and i am most bother by oversharpening jpeg especially in daytime outdoor shot

so far I found a easy solution by loading all RAW in Capture One, push color saturation to 80-100 (depend on your taste), than auto HDR to recover shadow and highlight, export the jpeg

It will remove the oversharpening that I really hated

I am not doing this on indoor or low light shot because oversharpening don't seem so bothering as in daytime shot and I doubt Capture One NR can beat Google NR

This is my first pixel phone. if anynone know how to easily get non-oversharpen jpeg please tell me.

My way is simple but just uploading lots of RAW file to the cloud is time consuming

Is there an app like Open Camera (never try it before) that can get me non-oversharpen jpeg?

Jefftan wrote:

I have pixel 7 and i am most bother by oversharpening jpeg especially in daytime outdoor shot

so far I found a easy solution by loading all RAW in Capture One, push color saturation to 80-100 (depend on your taste), than auto HDR to recover shadow and highlight, export the jpeg

It will remove the oversharpening that I really hated

I am not doing this on indoor or low light shot because oversharpening don't seem so bothering as in daytime shot and I doubt Capture One NR can beat Google NR

This is my first pixel phone. if anynone know how to easily get non-oversharpen jpeg please tell me.

My way is simple but just uploading lots of RAW file to the cloud is time consuming

Is there an app like Open Camera (never try it before) that can get me non-oversharpen jpeg?

Custom google camera (GCam) helps you reduce sharpening and generally gives more organinc DSLR-like look of jpegs. Most common Gcam for Pixel is MWP. I don't know if it works on Pixel 7 but I suppose it does since it works on Pixel 6 which has the same main camera senosor.

You can find optimal settings for Gcam on telegram channel "Google Pixel 6 Series - Google Camera"

You can also find info regarding settings on XDA forum

https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/app-no-root-required-modified-google-camera-8-4-300-v1-beta3-by-mwp.4448463/

sqn888 wrote:

Jefftan wrote:

Is there an app like Open Camera (never try it before) that can get me non-oversharpen jpeg?

Open Camera does  have a settings for Edge mode algorithm that can be turned off. There's also a High Quality settings, but documentation doesn't explain what that is.

Custom google camera (GCam) helps you reduce sharpening and generally gives more organic DSLR-like look of jpegs. Most common Gcam for Pixel is MWP. I don't know if it works on Pixel 7 but I suppose it does since it works on Pixel 6 which has the same main camera senosor.

You can find optimal settings for Gcam on telegram channel "Google Pixel 6 Series - Google Camera". You can also find info regarding settings on XDA forum

In the Android (play) store, I can find neither GCam nor XDA. Are they Pixel only cameras?

I use Open Camera in DRO mode, which seems quite good on my $250 Moto 5G phone.

CAcreeks wrote:

sqn888 wrote:

Jefftan wrote:

Is there an app like Open Camera (never try it before) that can get me non-oversharpen jpeg?

Open Camera does have a settings for Edge mode algorithm that can be turned off. There's also a High Quality settings, but documentation doesn't explain what that is.

Custom google camera (GCam) helps you reduce sharpening and generally gives more organic DSLR-like look of jpegs. Most common Gcam for Pixel is MWP. I don't know if it works on Pixel 7 but I suppose it does since it works on Pixel 6 which has the same main camera senosor.

You can find optimal settings for Gcam on telegram channel "Google Pixel 6 Series - Google Camera". You can also find info regarding settings on XDA forum

In the Android (play) store, I can find neither GCam nor XDA. Are they Pixel only cameras?

I use Open Camera in DRO mode, which seems quite good on my $250 Moto 5G phone.

Gcam is not only for Pixels. It's a port of Google Camera from Pixel. It works on Pixels and on many other phones among others also on Mototorola smartphones

You can find Gcam and read about it on: https://www.celsoazevedo.com/