Best small camera with good viewfinder?

Aberaeron wrote:

Disdain wrote:

Aberaeron wrote:

Disdain wrote:

I've just sold my FZ1000 II. The view finder was excellent, but found I wasn't taking it enough to places as it's too big. I don't mind big if I'm going to an airshow or a zoo, but I don't always want it that big and heavy.

I want to return to M43 after trying a Sony A6000, but not really getting on with the handling or EVF. I've previously owned lots of M43 cameras - GX800, GX85, GX7, GX9, OM-D EM10 II, PEN E-PL9. I haven't been convinced by the view finder on any of those, to the point that I never used to use it.

Is the G85 as good a viewfinder as the FZ1000? I know it's still a big heavy camera. Has the viewfinder improved on the EM10 III or IV over the II?

Are the EM5 II, III, or even GX8 or original EM1 I worth looking at?

I honestly don’t see anything wrong with the E-M10 MkII viewfinder. It is much better than that fitted to the Sony A7III for instance.

Not as good as that of the Leica Q2, but that camera has its limitations of course, not the least of which are a fixed 28mm lens and its price

They all need adjusting of the diopter now and again in order to suit the shooter’s eye for best focus.

I found it too small to enjoy. Might be worse if wearing glasses as you are then further away. It certainly didn't compare to my old FZ1000 mark 1 viewfinder.

Ah yes. I remove my glasses with every viewfinder. However, finding a small camera with a big viewfinder is a tall order. It all relative though I suppose, even the size of the camera. My E-M1 MkII isn’t big by my standards but the viewfinder is certainly bigger than the M10’s and that is much bigger than the GX80’s.

There is a camera, recently launched, that has an adjustable size of display in the viewfinder to accommodate different eye distances from it, especially for spectacle wearers but I don’t remember what brand or model it is. It probably makes the actual display area in the EVF smaller, so that the whole area can be seen when wearing glasses.

I think that’s the G9 though I’ve never used that feature. I did fit the larger rubber eyecup, which can make a difference when the sun is very bright and from the side. Availability of a larger eyecup might be a factor for the OP.

I use the G80 and G9 with spectacles on, no bother. On earlier models G6 and 7, my prescription was a strong factor influencing my choice of Panasonics, with the -4 diopter adjustment , which is a tad more than most cameras at -3.

Bassam Guy wrote:

GutiWong wrote:

E-M5 III EVF is quite good

...especially if you wear glasses:

"The long 27 mm eyepoint offers a vignette-free view even when wearing glasses for a perfect view across the entire viewfinder." -- https://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em5mk3/feature4.html

That's the same viewfinder as the one on the E-M10 II no?

M43Hero wrote:

Bassam Guy wrote:

GutiWong wrote:

E-M5 III EVF is quite good

...especially if you wear glasses:

"The long 27 mm eyepoint offers a vignette-free view even when wearing glasses for a perfect view across the entire viewfinder." -- https://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em5mk3/feature4.html

This. The EM5-III's EVF is small (.68 magnification), but it has a long eyepoint, which means you don't have to jam your eye into the EVF to see the full picture. This makes for a better experience than a large magnification EVF with shorter eyepoint.

we call that "long eye relief" in the world of binoculars and telescope eyepieces!

joeletx wrote:

I played with a Sony RX100 version at Best Buy and was amazed by the shear size and usability. I didn't buy it because I didn't need one, but this is what I probably buy when I decide to downsize. I have not owned a GM-1 but I can't imagine it would do better despite sensor size advantages. The RX100 have usable EVF too.

Thats the one with the 24-600mm lens right?

I like the EVF on my E-M5 III, it's nowhere near as good as the one on my A7R IV, heck it's slightly smaller than my E-M5 II's, but paper specs aren't everything. The eyepoint on the Mk III is deeper so I have less trouble seeing the corners with Rx glasses on (myopia so I prefer not taking them off constantly), and it's OLED so I can use it without issue with Rx sunglasses on (unlike the Mk II's). The E-M5 bodies are somewhat smaller than the G85/95 but each have their pros/cons.

Those EVFs should be a step up from the GX & E-M10 bodies which have smaller or lower res EVF and/or field sequential displays w/different ARs (GX7/85/9). If you're really picky you're gonna end up with a larger body tho. If money is no object and you're looking at the G95 then you might as well look at the OM-1, they're about the same size tho the OM is heavier, still slightly smaller than the G9 tho and has an better / higher res EVF.

You should definitely be taking into account the lenses, nothing awkward about small lenses on large bodies IMO, I use stuff that's almost the size of a pancake or as small as the smallest M4/3 primes on my A7R IV without issue. That body is about the size & weight of the OM-1, I can still cram it into a tiny non-decrepit Quicksilver waist pouch with the right combination of 2-3 tiny primes, so no reason to leave it behind on any outing.

On M4/3 you've got all kinds of options even when it comes to zooms, instead of packing a 14-140 or anything larger you can grab a 35-100 f4-5.6, the 9-18 is as tiny as it gets for UWAs, and there's of course loads of primes to choose from. Something like a PD 3L Sling can give you a bit more flexibility as far as what you keep mounted on the body without still being a big swinging bag that gets cumbersome to carry, so you can more comfortably go for something like the 14-140.

I prefer the PD 5/6L Sling when I'm using mid-sized stuff, just cause I can then pack 3 medium sized lenses or even 4 if I stack a couple smaller ones, I reach for the kinda waist pack I mentioned before (Quicksilver Lone Walker, etc.) when I wanna keep things even less conspicuous... People use those surf apparel bags here for their wallet, phone, etc. all the time so nobody really has to guess I've got $2-4K worth of camera gear in one.

OutsideTheMatrix wrote:

Bassam Guy wrote:

GutiWong wrote:

E-M5 III EVF is quite good

...especially if you wear glasses:

"The long 27 mm eyepoint offers a vignette-free view even when wearing glasses for a perfect view across the entire viewfinder." -- https://asia.olympus-imaging.com/product/dslr/em5mk3/feature4.html

That's the same viewfinder as the one on the E-M10 II no?

Different magnification? AFAIK they hadn't really played with the eyepoint much until the E-M5 III...

Aberaeron wrote:

Disdain wrote:

Aberaeron wrote:

Disdain wrote:

I've just sold my FZ1000 II. The view finder was excellent, but found I wasn't taking it enough to places as it's too big. I don't mind big if I'm going to an airshow or a zoo, but I don't always want it that big and heavy.

I want to return to M43 after trying a Sony A6000, but not really getting on with the handling or EVF. I've previously owned lots of M43 cameras - GX800, GX85, GX7, GX9, OM-D EM10 II, PEN E-PL9. I haven't been convinced by the view finder on any of those, to the point that I never used to use it.

Is the G85 as good a viewfinder as the FZ1000? I know it's still a big heavy camera. Has the viewfinder improved on the EM10 III or IV over the II?

Are the EM5 II, III, or even GX8 or original EM1 I worth looking at?

I honestly don’t see anything wrong with the E-M10 MkII viewfinder. It is much better than that fitted to the Sony A7III for instance.

Not as good as that of the Leica Q2, but that camera has its limitations of course, not the least of which are a fixed 28mm lens and its price

They all need adjusting of the diopter now and again in order to suit the shooter’s eye for best focus.

I found it too small to enjoy. Might be worse if wearing glasses as you are then further away. It certainly didn't compare to my old FZ1000 mark 1 viewfinder.

Ah yes. I remove my glasses with every viewfinder. However, finding a small camera with a big viewfinder is a tall order. It all relative though I suppose, even the size of the camera. My E-M1 MkII isn’t big by my standards but the viewfinder is certainly bigger than the M10’s and that is much bigger than the GX80’s.

There is a camera, recently launched, that has an adjustable size of display in the viewfinder to accommodate different eye distances from it, especially for spectacle wearers but I don’t remember what brand or model it is. It probably makes the actual display area in the EVF smaller, so that the whole area can be seen when wearing glasses.

I think the Sony A1 has that but it might not be the only one, maybe the Nikon Z9 too?

Disdain wrote:

Hatstand wrote:

Disdain wrote:

Is the G85 as good a viewfinder as the FZ1000? I know it's still a big heavy camera.

I have both G80 (G85) and FZ1000*...

The G80 body alone is not so big and heavy compared to the FZ1000?

It's your choice of lens that will determine whether it's bigger/heavier or smaller/lighter overall...

As for the viewfinders, I personally find them very similar. Which I guess is not surprising given their technical specs are pretty much the same? (G80 maybe slightly higher magnification? I dunno, different sites seems to list different values for each)

BTW, G85 is 16MP sensor. If the resolution is important to you, that would be a step back vs the FZ1000's 20MP. Note that the G90 (G95) has 20MP sensor.

*I'm using a G90 instead of the G80 now though, and only using the FZ1000 for its high-speed video these days. (G90 has high speed video but no autofocus for it whatsoever - manual focus only, or use the mode dial to switch to a mode that autofocuses, then switch to movie mode to start recording. That's almost useless for my purposes, where the FZ1000 at least autofocuses until you start recording, then fixed-focus)

Yeah if I use small primes it will keep the G80 down in size, although it might look silly with small lenses attached. Do you find the G90 a big improvement over the G80? I know it's bigger again in size and weight.

In addition to the improvements mentioned by Hatstand, the G95 did incur more of a crop on 4K video than the G85 IIRC, so that might be a potential downside, the Sony 20MP sensor also handles long exposures much better than the previous gen 16MP Pana sensor tho so that's another improvement.

Disdain wrote:

I've just sold my FZ1000 II. The view finder was excellent, but found I wasn't taking it enough to places as it's too big. I don't mind big if I'm going to an airshow or a zoo, but I don't always want it that big and heavy.

I want to return to M43 after trying a Sony A6000, but not really getting on with the handling or EVF. I've previously owned lots of M43 cameras - GX800, GX85, GX7, GX9, OM-D EM10 II, PEN E-PL9. I haven't been convinced by the view finder on any of those, to the point that I never used to use it.

Is the G85 as good a viewfinder as the FZ1000? I know it's still a big heavy camera. Has the viewfinder improved on the EM10 III or IV over the II?

Are the EM5 II, III, or even GX8 or original EM1 I worth looking at?

If all else fails to appeal, this add-on works with most Oly E-PL models thru' to the PL8 and also with the E-P5....

https://www.mirrorlessons.com/2013/07/24/olympus-electronic-viewfinder-vf-4-review/

Makes the camera's handling less convenient, but is a real gem - I find it much easier to get cosy with than one integral to the camera body!

Peter