X-E3 or X-E4 in 2022?

CheckT wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

It’s really in the eye of the beholder. Suggest you try to get hands on with the X-E4 and see if that works for you.

Personally, I own X-E3 and could live/adapt with the X-E4 changes. After all the X-E4 AF-C performance is far superior than X-E3.

I originally purchased the X-E3 as a smaller camera to my X-T3 body. It certainly does the job and visually looks amazing. The AF-C accuracy has always been disappointing, I have just found different ways to “mitigate it”.

So unsure how you shoot with your Sony, you might be disappointed in this department.

Could you please provide more info about the AF-C? E.g., how many photos are usable for taking 5 pics? I may take some photos of my dog when hiking...

I am surprised how well X-E3 used prices have held up though !

Yes, that's why I'm hesitant now. It is only about an extra 200 dollars to get X-E4 over X-E3. But I guess it is not a good sign to consider "only extra".

And the IF you can find 1.

rla1022 wrote:

CheckT wrote:

rla1022 wrote:

CheckT wrote:

Hello, I'm now considering getting an X-E camera as my daily camera for photos only (not video). I need some suggestions about picking X-E3 or X-E4 in 2022.

First, it has been years after X-E3 has been released. Is it still good to get X-E3 over X-E4 for the price (see the following section) and the similar/close performance? I have read several posts about X-E4 being considered as a downgrade for certain people. And compared to the upgrade by Sony, it seems that the improvement is incremental for me as well.

Second, price. Since I have two Sony cameras as my prime set, I'm not expected to spend too much on this one. Actually, I considered getting X100V before. But it was too expensive (>$1200) right now. For X-E, I can get X-E3 with 23f2 for $760, or X-E3 with 18-55 2.8-4 for $800, or X-E4 for $749, or X-E4 with 27f2.8 for $949. All these three lens have both positive and negative reviews. Compared to Sony EF users, it seems that Fujifilm users have more varied preferences and it is what makes me hesitant to select one. I mainly use 28mm and 35mm lens in Sony. So both 23f2 and 27f2.8 seem to be good for me. The only drawback of 23f2 is that the lens is longer to fit in the bag compared to the lens on X100V. So even after getting 23f2, I may sell/trade it for the smaller lens for the daily carry. (Please correct me if 23f2 is not big as my expectation!)

In the end, what's your opinion/suggestion? Thanks a lot!

What Sonys? What are your Sonys not doing for you ? Why not an a6xxx series and use your existing stuff.

I have A7II set for photos and ZV1 for video now. But I sometimes feel that A7 with lens is a little bit heavy/big for me to carray every day. Even my shortest/lightest Zessis 25F2 lens is still heavier/longer than the heaviest XF18-55 of those three listed lenses.

I’d say track down an A7c or an a6400. They’re compatible with your lenses. If we had government regulations that worried about universal lens compatibility like they do for charging cables I’d jump. But that’s a rabbit hole where you have to kind of go all in. Most of the fujis are getting harder to find reasonably priced.

With my current lens, they are not lightweight and A7C (~$1700) is definitely not in my budget for this time.

CheckT wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

It’s really in the eye of the beholder. Suggest you try to get hands on with the X-E4 and see if that works for you.

Personally, I own X-E3 and could live/adapt with the X-E4 changes. After all the X-E4 AF-C performance is far superior than X-E3.

I originally purchased the X-E3 as a smaller camera to my X-T3 body. It certainly does the job and visually looks amazing. The AF-C accuracy has always been disappointing, I have just found different ways to “mitigate it”.

So unsure how you shoot with your Sony, you might be disappointed in this department.

Could you please provide more info about the AF-C? E.g., how many photos are usable for taking 5 pics? I may take some photos of my dog when hiking...

For reference I also posted my X-E3 camera settings on this thread - https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4622313

It depends on the situation (lighting on subject, lens used) but in general I have found my strike rate to be 40-60%. I think the most important process is to know what to look out for in the EVF/rear screen when reviewing the pictures.. specifically back focused shots (they may look in focus, until you process them!)

I just try to focus on my technique and be patient, that was acceptable for me, but it does get tiring and I do lose confidence with my camera (i.e. did I get the shot ? Should I review the photo?)

e.g. My Fujifilm 23mm 1.4  on X-E3 AF-C very nervously on the X-E3.. i can feel the lens pulse back and forth, surprisingly it performs "OK", but just the pulsing doesn't give me much confidence (note: it's a different lens on the X-T3 - much more confident)

I am surprised how well X-E3 used prices have held up though !

Yes, that's why I'm hesitant now. It is only about an extra 200 dollars to get X-E4 over X-E3. But I guess it is not a good sign to consider "only extra".

Raymond L wrote:

CheckT wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

It’s really in the eye of the beholder. Suggest you try to get hands on with the X-E4 and see if that works for you.

Personally, I own X-E3 and could live/adapt with the X-E4 changes. After all the X-E4 AF-C performance is far superior than X-E3.

I originally purchased the X-E3 as a smaller camera to my X-T3 body. It certainly does the job and visually looks amazing. The AF-C accuracy has always been disappointing, I have just found different ways to “mitigate it”.

So unsure how you shoot with your Sony, you might be disappointed in this department.

Could you please provide more info about the AF-C? E.g., how many photos are usable for taking 5 pics? I may take some photos of my dog when hiking...

For reference I also posted my X-E3 camera settings on this thread - https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4622313

It depends on the situation (lighting on subject, lens used) but in general I have found my strike rate to be 40-60%. I think the most important process is to know what to look out for in the EVF/rear screen when reviewing the pictures.. specifically back focused shots (they may look in focus, until you process them!)

I just try to focus on my technique and be patient, that was acceptable for me, but it does get tiring and I do lose confidence with my camera (i.e. did I get the shot ? Should I review the photo?)

Thanks a lot for the link! It seems that it is a 'general' issue so everyone has their own solutions to avoid the problem.

e.g. My Fujifilm 23mm 1.4 on X-E3 AF-C very nervously on the X-E3.. i can feel the lens pulse back and forth, surprisingly it performs "OK", but just the pulsing doesn't give me much confidence (note: it's a different lens on the X-T3 - much more confident)

It sounds like X-E4 would be a better choice for using X-TRANS 4 sensor. Really appreciate that! I definitely can not know about it via the quick testing in the camera shop.

jhorse wrote:

CheckT wrote:

jhorse wrote:

CheckT wrote:

Hello, I'm now considering getting an X-E camera as my daily camera for photos only (not video). I need some suggestions about picking X-E3 or X-E4 in 2022.

First, it has been years after X-E3 has been released. Is it still good to get X-E3 over X-E4 for the price (see the following section) and the similar/close performance? I have read several posts about X-E4 being considered as a downgrade for certain people. And compared to the upgrade by Sony, it seems that the improvement is incremental for me as well.

Second, price. Since I have two Sony cameras as my prime set, I'm not expected to spend too much on this one. Actually, I considered getting X100V before. But it was too expensive (>$1200) right now. For X-E, I can get X-E3 with 23f2 for $760, or X-E3 with 18-55 2.8-4 for $800, or X-E4 for $749, or X-E4 with 27f2.8 for $949. All these three lens have both positive and negative reviews. Compared to Sony EF users, it seems that Fujifilm users have more varied preferences and it is what makes me hesitant to select one. I mainly use 28mm and 35mm lens in Sony. So both 23f2 and 27f2.8 seem to be good for me. The only drawback of 23f2 is that the lens is longer to fit in the bag compared to the lens on X100V. So even after getting 23f2, I may sell/trade it for the smaller lens for the daily carry. (Please correct me if 23f2 is not big as my expectation!)

In the end, what's your opinion/suggestion? Thanks a lot!

Here's my experience having entered the XE line with a XE3 and upgraded to the XE4. Both are great cameras and in side by side image comparison, I doubt many people could tell any image quality difference (lens and technique will have a larger influence of IQ). There is one noticeable difference/improvement from the XE3 to XE4 - AF.

So, here is my take. While the XE4 ostensively has a few less physical controls, it can be set up to taste and shooting style. I do not understand the so-called dumbing down view, but in fairness I changed my mined. See:

XE4 - I was wrong: Fujifilm X System / SLR Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review (dpreview.com)

In fact, if one shoots stills and in aperture priority, the ergonomics, in my opinion, on the XE4 are faster, easier and better.

I opted for the kit: XE4/27WR. I did consider a X100V, but for lens flexibility opted for the XE4/27.

I also have a XT4, but I have to say that the XE4, often with the 18-55, does get more use and is carried more often. Hope that helps.

Thanks for your post! It is very helpful!

Yes, I can't tell the difference between XE3 and XE4 images posted online and that's why I think the improvement from 3 to 4 is incremental.

For 27WR, based on your post and the sample images posted online, somehow I feel that the image quality of 27F2.8 is observable low compared to the F2 lens. Would you think 27F2.8 makes you hard to take some photos at some certain places/time (e.g., indoor/evening before sunset)?

Hi, I bought the XE4 with the 27WR as a kit, primarily because of the lower price of the lens in the kit. It's a really handy lens and I use it a lot. I also have the 16/f2.8, 23/f2 and 50/f2. I use the 27 more simply for convenience as an every day carry, but if I want one lens in an urban setting, I tend to take the 23/f2. If I want versatility and have time to change lenses then in a small bag the 16, 23 and 50 are a great set up. However, do I see much discernible IQ difference between them? Not really, but then I do not pixel peek nor do I have a high end monitor, which might show more of a difference. We shall see, as I am in the process of swapping my seven year old all-in-one PC for an Apply mini and studio display. That might show a difference (for the cost of change I hope it does!).

Well, another minor reason for me to try the Fuji camera is I may not need to post-process the photos and can share them directly on my phone after the simple editing. It sounds 27/f2.8 should be identical to 23/f2 for me.

For AF improvement, how do you feel about the AF on X-E3 before? Was it difficult to accurately and fast capture the object? Because I didn't see many complaints about the Fuji AF after Xpro1, if it can work, it won't be a problem IMO.

In my experience, the AF on the XE3 is fine for all static and all slow moving subjects. The only times I have seen an advantage for the XE4 was with running dogs or galloping polo ponies. If your subjects are primarily static or slow moving, then in my experience the XE3 is fine. That said, there is no doubt that the confidence the newer AF generation gives is nice to have.

I see. Thanks! I'll check the XE4 kit for the newer sensor with the better AF.

CheckT wrote:

Yes. Instead of upgrading to the newer A7(M4), I'd prefer to get one lightweight camera first so that I can really carry it daily.

Get an XE-4 with the 27mm pancake it gets bundled with, and perhaps spring for the 18mm pancake as well. That'd be a perfect set.

Fuji has no GR-type compact in the mix, and it's a good substitute, albeit a bit larger. The slimmed-down body is aimed at portability and daily shooters.

Otherwise, get an X100V. I own the latter as my daily carry around and love it.

Souciantmag wrote:

CheckT wrote:

Yes. Instead of upgrading to the newer A7(M4), I'd prefer to get one lightweight camera first so that I can really carry it daily.

Get an XE-4 with the 27mm pancake it gets bundled with, and perhaps spring for the 18mm pancake as well. That'd be a perfect set.

Fuji has no GR-type compact in the mix, and it's a good substitute, albeit a bit larger. The slimmed-down body is aimed at portability and daily shooters.

Otherwise, get an X100V. I own the latter as my daily carry around and love it.

I did check the X100V at the beginning. But its price is out of my budget and I'll get XE-4 with the pancake as the "cheaper X100V" by trading the lens performance for the money..

maltmoose wrote:

a_c_skinner wrote:

This - Sony APS-C. Nice and small, backup to a big camera, interchangeable. I think Fuji is a really good brand but if you are already a Sony or Nikon user their APS ranges make more sense.

The funny thing is the a6xxx series have better ergo and controls than the xe4.. xe4 looks nice though until it goes in some crappy Chinese leather case.

I have the x-e4 and had a couple of Sony a6xxx cameras and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. X-e4 is superior to me than the Sony's in almost every way

Holden75 wrote:

maltmoose wrote:

a_c_skinner wrote:

This - Sony APS-C. Nice and small, backup to a big camera, interchangeable. I think Fuji is a really good brand but if you are already a Sony or Nikon user their APS ranges make more sense.

The funny thing is the a6xxx series have better ergo and controls than the xe4.. xe4 looks nice though until it goes in some crappy Chinese leather case.

I have the x-e4 and had a couple of Sony a6xxx cameras and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. X-e4 is superior to me than the Sony's in almost every way

Did you have a hand grip and/or thumb grip on the X-E4 ?

maltmoose wrote:

Robmas4229 wrote:

FWIW, I recently a 27mm R WR at a non-inflated price. I tried it on my XE3 and my XT30-II and found the focusing speed and accuracy much improved on the newer camera. I didn't notice the difference as much on the f/2.0 lenses.

Sure the AF is better but If you put the AF and the tilt screen on the xe3, would anyone buy the xe4? cant see why they would.. id just settle for the AF..

Yes, I would, Why? Because having experienced both and admittedly having been sceptical initially, I actually now prefer the simplicity of the XE4's ergonomics (having had a XE3 and now the XE4). Each to their own...

maltmoose wrote:

a_c_skinner wrote:

This - Sony APS-C. Nice and small, backup to a big camera, interchangeable. I think Fuji is a really good brand but if you are already a Sony or Nikon user their APS ranges make more sense.

The funny thing is the a6xxx series have better ergo and controls than the xe4.. xe4 looks nice though until it goes in some crappy Chinese leather case.

As to ergos, better is a relative not an absolute term. Some people like the ergos of one over the other, vice versa, so one cannot say X is definitively better. I tried a Sony in the shop and preferred the Fuji. Each to their own.

There are some quality leather cases too. I have one and it looks good (quality leather stitching in the same colour -  black and a good/snug fit), feels good and provides a little protection. I actually made some design proposals to the manufacturer when the XE4 was announced (I already had one on my XE3), which they incorporated into the XE4's design. Not the cheapest, but I preferer a leather half case to a metal grip or thumb rest. Again, others prefer the grip/rest - choice is great!

Raymond L wrote:

Holden75 wrote:

maltmoose wrote:

a_c_skinner wrote:

This - Sony APS-C. Nice and small, backup to a big camera, interchangeable. I think Fuji is a really good brand but if you are already a Sony or Nikon user their APS ranges make more sense.

The funny thing is the a6xxx series have better ergo and controls than the xe4.. xe4 looks nice though until it goes in some crappy Chinese leather case.

I have the x-e4 and had a couple of Sony a6xxx cameras and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. X-e4 is superior to me than the Sony's in almost every way

Did you have a hand grip and/or thumb grip on the X-E4 ?

No, it isn't necessary. Not for me anyway. There is a lot said about the x-e4 which put me off buying one but now I have one I think those concerns are exaggerated. It is true that there isn't a protruding grip but it doesn't mean you can't hold it comfortably or safely. I find the minimalism to be huge benefit of the camera not a downside. The Sony cameras feel good in the hand for a while then I found them to be more of a pain later (fingers pushed up against lenses, or forcing your hand to be a certain way - it is horses for courses but for me in the end I didn't find the Sony's to be well designed) and as for the buttons the x-e4 can be customised a million times more than the Sony's. You have one wheel on the top (most used as an aperture dial) and a terrible wheel on the back (dpad) that is awkward and slow to use, there are some function buttons but you mostly have to use their version of the q menu. The x-e4 has the aperture ring, a front dial, a shutter speed dial, and a exposure compensation dial and function buttons. It is superior in every way - you have a dial for the exposure triangle and more and I hardly ever use the q menu. You don't have that on the Sony which makes it great as a point and shoot but I found it so annoying if you wanted any kind of manual control.

Holden75 wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

Holden75 wrote:

maltmoose wrote:

a_c_skinner wrote:

This - Sony APS-C. Nice and small, backup to a big camera, interchangeable. I think Fuji is a really good brand but if you are already a Sony or Nikon user their APS ranges make more sense.

The funny thing is the a6xxx series have better ergo and controls than the xe4.. xe4 looks nice though until it goes in some crappy Chinese leather case.

I have the x-e4 and had a couple of Sony a6xxx cameras and I couldn't disagree more with this statement. X-e4 is superior to me than the Sony's in almost every way

Did you have a hand grip and/or thumb grip on the X-E4 ?

No, it isn't necessary. Not for me anyway. There is a lot said about the x-e4 which put me off buying one but now I have one I think those concerns are exaggerated. It is true that there isn't a protruding grip but it doesn't mean you can't hold it comfortably or safely. I find the minimalism to be huge benefit of the camera not a downside. The Sony cameras feel good in the hand for a while then I found them to be more of a pain later (fingers pushed up against lenses, or forcing your hand to be a certain way - it is horses for courses but for me in the end I didn't find the Sony's to be well designed) and as for the buttons the x-e4 can be customised a million times more than the Sony's. You have one wheel on the top (most used as an aperture dial) and a terrible wheel on the back (dpad) that is awkward and slow to use, there are some function buttons but you mostly have to use their version of the q menu. The x-e4 has the aperture ring, a front dial, a shutter speed dial, and a exposure compensation dial and function buttons. It is superior in every way - you have a dial for the exposure triangle and more and I hardly ever use the q menu. You don't have that on the Sony which makes it great as a point and shoot but I found it so annoying if you wanted any kind of manual control.

Interesting. I only used Sony's cameras and am familiar with its menu. Although I heard tons of complaints about Sony's menu, I didn't expect that there is such a huge difference between Sony's cameras and others' cameras.

CheckT wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

CheckT wrote:

Raymond L wrote:

It’s really in the eye of the beholder. Suggest you try to get hands on with the X-E4 and see if that works for you.

Personally, I own X-E3 and could live/adapt with the X-E4 changes. After all the X-E4 AF-C performance is far superior than X-E3.

I originally purchased the X-E3 as a smaller camera to my X-T3 body. It certainly does the job and visually looks amazing. The AF-C accuracy has always been disappointing, I have just found different ways to “mitigate it”.

So unsure how you shoot with your Sony, you might be disappointed in this department.

Could you please provide more info about the AF-C? E.g., how many photos are usable for taking 5 pics? I may take some photos of my dog when hiking...

For reference I also posted my X-E3 camera settings on this thread - https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/4622313

It depends on the situation (lighting on subject, lens used) but in general I have found my strike rate to be 40-60%. I think the most important process is to know what to look out for in the EVF/rear screen when reviewing the pictures.. specifically back focused shots (they may look in focus, until you process them!)

I just try to focus on my technique and be patient, that was acceptable for me, but it does get tiring and I do lose confidence with my camera (i.e. did I get the shot ? Should I review the photo?)

Thanks a lot for the link! It seems that it is a 'general' issue so everyone has their own solutions to avoid the problem.

e.g. My Fujifilm 23mm 1.4 on X-E3 AF-C very nervouslyii on the X-E3.. i can feel the lens pulse back and forth, surprisingly it performs "OK", but just the pulsing doesn't give me much confidence (note: it's a different lens on the X-T3 - much more confident)

It sounds like X-E4 would be a better choice for using X-TRANS 4 sensor. Really appreciate that! I definitely can not know about it via the quick testing in the camera shop.

I just found a new xe3 and I've decided to buy it as a second camera. I like the buttons and dials better.