Which macro equipment option for "bugs" and flowers.

I would consider close-up lenses on your 18-250. If you get an RX10IV you could use the same close-up lenses on that too.

There are two sorts of close-up lenses. You mentioned a close-up filter kit. these have the advantage of being cheap and flexible in terms of the range of magnifications you can achieve with them. However, each of the three or four filters in the set is constructed from a single piece of glass and will tend to suffer from colour fringing, softness, and distortion, especially away from the centre of the image. Sometimes you may not notice, and sometimes it may be so serious that you wouldn't want to use the image.

The second sort of close-up lens is an achromatic close-up lens ("achromat"). These are generally sold singly and typically cost significantly more than a close-up filter set, each one costing perhaps three or four times as much as a filter set. However, achromats can produce very good image quality.

I used achromats for over 10 years for insects, spiders etc, and for almost as long for flowers. I used them on a 55-250 lens on an APS-C Canon 70D (similar to your A77 with 18-250) and used them even more, mainly for insects, spiders etc on a Panasonic FZ200 and FZ330 (both being 25-600mm like the RX10IV, but with a smaller 1/2.3" sensor compared to the RX10IV's 1" sensor).

Another alternative might be a legacy macro lens used with a converter on your A77. Can the A77 use legacy lenses? I don't know. If you can this may be cheaper than using achromats, of which you would need at least two, a low power one for flowers and a higher power one for insects, spiders etc. With a 1:1 macro lens you would get from infinity focus down to 1:1 without adding/removing anything such as a close-up lens or extension tube, and you would presumably be able to use your extension tubes to get more magnification beyond 1:1.

I am very curious as to what this 10X macro lens is for $80. I would not think that a 10X lens would be suitable at this stage. 10X is a lot of magnification, more than is sensible for a beginner to be using.

If you are going to photograph insects, spiders etc you may find you need to use flash, in which case you will then need to find out about, and experiment with, diffusion for the flash. The higher the magnification you use, the more likely you are to need flash.

It may turn out that the precise equipment you use is the least important factor in making good looking images of flowers and insects, spiders etc. More important may be fieldcraft (knowing where to find subjects and knowing enough about their behaviour to be able to photograph them without frightening them away), illumination (whether natural light, flash, continuous lighting or some combination), composition and post processing.

....

Another alternative might be a legacy macro lens used with a converter on your A77. Can the A77 use legacy lenses? I don't know. If you can this may be cheaper than using achromats, of which you would need at least two, a low power one for flowers and a higher power one for insects, spiders etc. With a 1:1 macro lens you would get from infinity focus down to 1:1 without adding/removing anything such as a close-up lens or extension tube, and you would presumably be able to use your extension tubes to get more magnification beyond 1:1.

I am very curious as to what this 10X macro lens is for $80. I would not think that a 10X lens would be suitable at this stage. 10X is a lot of magnification, more than is sensible for a beginner to be using.

....

Thank you very much. By legacy lens did you mean an existing A-Mount lens?

B&H has a Venus Optics Laowa 60mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro Lens for Sony A-Mount that is $399. I'm not sure I want to invest that much at this point. E bay as Sony 100mm lens but they a even a little more.

The 10x is on Ama zon and is a 10x High Definition 2 Element Close-Up (Macro) Lens for Nikon, Canon, Sony, Panasonic, Fujifilm, Pentax & Olympus DSLR's (72mm).

GinAZ wrote:

....

Another alternative might be a legacy macro lens used with a converter on your A77. Can the A77 use legacy lenses? I don't know. If you can this may be cheaper than using achromats, of which you would need at least two, a low power one for flowers and a higher power one for insects, spiders etc. With a 1:1 macro lens you would get from infinity focus down to 1:1 without adding/removing anything such as a close-up lens or extension tube, and you would presumably be able to use your extension tubes to get more magnification beyond 1:1.

I am very curious as to what this 10X macro lens is for $80. I would not think that a 10X lens would be suitable at this stage. 10X is a lot of magnification, more than is sensible for a beginner to be using.

....

Thank you very much. By legacy lens did you mean an existing A-Mount lens?

No, I'm thinking of old lenses from film or early dSLR days which are fully manual, such as lenses for mounts such as Canon FD, Minolta etc.  Something like this (at eBay) for example (not a macro lens in this case, but there are lots of legacy macro lenses available. Be aware that just because a lens is described as "macro" doesn't mean it goes to 1:1. Quite often it will only be half that, 1:2, or sometimes even less magnification).

You need to use an adaptor of the right type for any legacy lens you want to mount on your camera.

B&H has a Venus Optics Laowa 60mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro Lens for Sony A-Mount that is $399. I'm not sure I want to invest that much at this point. E bay as Sony 100mm lens but they a even a little more.

I would do low cost experiments to begin with. You have extension tubes and you could get an inexpensive four filter close-up filter set. With these, and the kit you already have, you will be able to experiment with various magnifications and see how you get on. You won't get great image quality from the close-up filters but that wouldn't be the point at this stage. You would benefit from a bit of experience so  you are better placed to make a sensible decision as to what else, if anything, you could best spend some more money on to pursue close-up/macro.

The 10x is on Ama zon and is a 10x High Definition 2 Element Close-Up (Macro) Lens for Nikon, Canon, Sony, Panasonic, Fujifilm, Pentax & Olympus DSLR's (72mm).

That isn't what is normally regarded as a macro lens, which is a lens that fits on to your camera. That 10X is a close-up lens which fits on to a camera lens. Being "2 element" probably means that it is an achromat.

gardenersassistant wrote:

GinAZ wrote:

....

Another alternative might be a legacy macro lens used with a converter on your A77. Can the A77 use legacy lenses? I don't know. If you can this may be cheaper than using achromats, of which you would need at least two, a low power one for flowers and a higher power one for insects, spiders etc. With a 1:1 macro lens you would get from infinity focus down to 1:1 without adding/removing anything such as a close-up lens or extension tube, and you would presumably be able to use your extension tubes to get more magnification beyond 1:1.

I am very curious as to what this 10X macro lens is for $80. I would not think that a 10X lens would be suitable at this stage. 10X is a lot of magnification, more than is sensible for a beginner to be using.

....

Thank you very much. By legacy lens did you mean an existing A-Mount lens?

No, I'm thinking of old lenses from film or early dSLR days which are fully manual, such as lenses for mounts such as Canon FD, Minolta etc. Something like this (at eBay) for example (not a macro lens in this case, but there are lots of legacy macro lenses available. Be aware that just because a lens is described as "macro" doesn't mean it goes to 1:1. Quite often it will only be half that, 1:2, or sometimes even less magnification).

You need to use an adaptor of the right type for any legacy lens you want to mount on your camera.

....

I have lenses from a Canon AE-1 film camera. They are FD lenses. I have a 50 mm 1:1.8, a 35-105 mm 1:3.2-4 macro focusing, and a 70-205 close focusing 1:3.8. The FD to A-mount adapter is available for $44.95. Non of my lenses have a manual aperture ring so it says it will be fully open or fully stopped down.

The FD mount was 42mm. Does it sound this might be worth a try?

Thanks!

GinAZ wrote:

gardenersassistant wrote:

GinAZ wrote:

....

Another alternative might be a legacy macro lens used with a converter on your A77. Can the A77 use legacy lenses? I don't know. If you can this may be cheaper than using achromats, of which you would need at least two, a low power one for flowers and a higher power one for insects, spiders etc. With a 1:1 macro lens you would get from infinity focus down to 1:1 without adding/removing anything such as a close-up lens or extension tube, and you would presumably be able to use your extension tubes to get more magnification beyond 1:1.

I am very curious as to what this 10X macro lens is for $80. I would not think that a 10X lens would be suitable at this stage. 10X is a lot of magnification, more than is sensible for a beginner to be using.

....

Thank you very much. By legacy lens did you mean an existing A-Mount lens?

No, I'm thinking of old lenses from film or early dSLR days which are fully manual, such as lenses for mounts such as Canon FD, Minolta etc. Something like this (at eBay) for example (not a macro lens in this case, but there are lots of legacy macro lenses available. Be aware that just because a lens is described as "macro" doesn't mean it goes to 1:1. Quite often it will only be half that, 1:2, or sometimes even less magnification).

You need to use an adaptor of the right type for any legacy lens you want to mount on your camera.

....

I have lenses from a Canon AE-1 film camera. They are FD lenses. I have a 50 mm 1:1.8, a 35-105 mm 1:3.2-4 macro focusing, and a 70-205 close focusing 1:3.8. The FD to A-mount adapter is available for $44.95. Non of my lenses have a manual aperture ring so it says it will be fully open or fully stopped down.

The FD mount was 42mm. Does it sound this might be worth a try?

I wouldn't go down that route. You will need to have control of the aperture. Neither fully open nor fully stopped down is likely to be what you want to use.

Thanks!

GinAZ wrote:

I've decided to start doing some macro photography and I would like recommendations on equipment.

I currently have a Sony A77V APS-C (the one from way back in 2011!) with these A-mount lenses:
Sigma 18-250 which has macro capability at the 250mm zoom. F3.5-6.3. Minimum focus 13.8". Magnification 1:.29. 62mm filter thread.
Sony 16-50. F2.8. Minimum focus 1'. Magnification 0.2x. 72mm filter thread.
Tokina 11-16. F 2.8. Minimum focus 11.81". 77mm filter thread.
I have macro extension tubes 13, 20, and 36mm.
In 2015 I purchased a .43x wide angle add on lens but unfortunately I can't locate it now. It has 62mm threads.

I also have an Olympus TG-6 which I purchased for underwater photography but it has macro and "microscope" options. 25-100mm 1/2.3" sensor, There is a 0.5x wide angle lens available with macro mode (the lens has two parts). The lens doesn't have very good reviews.

I took some test pictures with each of the above (except the .43x wide angle lens and I only tried the 13mm extension tube) but I wasn't very happy with the results. Mostly due to narrow DOF (which I know is an issue with macro photography) and having to get so close to the item being photographed.

I'm considering purchasing a Sony RX10M4 with a 1" sensor. 24-600mm. F2.4-4. 72mm filter thread. So this may be better for my future macro photography.

Options seem to be adding a close-up filter kit about $20, or a 10x macro lens for about $80, or a lens for the Sony A77V around 100mm. A new Sony lens is questionable due to high cost (~$400) and since A-mount is dead and my Sony A77 is getting older. I'm not sure which lens would work best with a close-up filter kit or the 10x macro lens.

Although I wasn’t happy with my test pictures, maybe something I already have should be good enough and I just need to learn to use it better.

Finally, if it would be a good choice, I can keep searching for my lost .43x lens.

You seem to be describing the old 2-piece wide angle/macro conversion lenses. Combined, 0.43x/0.5x would make 18mm seem like 8/9mm. With the front section removed, it's a +10 diopter. They aren't very good, but you'll get the same magnification and distance with any +10  diopter/close-up lens added. That seems to be what you're calling 10x.

Add the 36mm extension tube to the 16-50 and you should get close to 1:1 at 50mm for a test to see what the high magnification is like. The depth of field is going to be narrow, regardless of how you achieve it.

At 1:1 or 1x, you would be filling the frame with a US quarter. 10x would fill the frame with an aspirin for a rough example.

BBbuilder467 wrote:

GinAZ wrote:

I've decided to start doing some macro photography and I would like recommendations on equipment.

I currently have a Sony A77V APS-C (the one from way back in 2011!) with these A-mount lenses:
Sigma 18-250 which has macro capability at the 250mm zoom. F3.5-6.3. Minimum focus 13.8". Magnification 1:.29. 62mm filter thread.
Sony 16-50. F2.8. Minimum focus 1'. Magnification 0.2x. 72mm filter thread.
Tokina 11-16. F 2.8. Minimum focus 11.81". 77mm filter thread.
I have macro extension tubes 13, 20, and 36mm.
In 2015 I purchased a .43x wide angle add on lens but unfortunately I can't locate it now. It has 62mm threads.

....

Add the 36mm extension tube to the 16-50 and you should get close to 1:1 at 50mm for a test to see what the high magnification is like. The depth of field is going to be narrow, regardless of how you achieve it.

At 1:1 or 1x, you would be filling the frame with a US quarter. 10x would fill the frame with an aspirin for a rough example.

I just had time to try your suggestion. With the 36mm and the 16-50 lens, I couldn't get close enough to the object to focus on a leave on a plant. I tried the 18-250 with the 36mm extension and the 36+20mm extensions. Both worked! the focus distance was about 3 1/2" from the lens. I use the 250mm and  I used a tripod and manually focused. I used the a77 remote.

I wasn't sure of the manual focus technique so I went back and forth trying to hit as many focus points as possible.

The 250mm images do not look very good but the 135mm ones with the 36mm ET came out pretty good. I'll try 100mm when I have time.

I took pictures of a small Christmas Cactus plant. It has just started growing its first new leaf. The new leaf is about 3/8" life size. The plant was near a window but today was a little bit cloudy.

The original images were by Sony a77 APS-C, 6000x3376 pixels, 1/4sec @ f/6.7. ISO 1600. Lens focal length 135mm (202mm for 35mm).

This picture is a stack of 14 jpg images. I included all I took but maybe I should have left out the ones that are clearly out of focus. I'm surprised at how good the result is. I exported as jpg max quality and as a png from PhotoShop.

I then stacked the raw images. I exported as a jpg and png.

The stacked images are similar in quality. The leaf on the left has a grey area around it. This is less obvious on the arw stacked png image. I've attached the jpg stacked from the 14 jpgs. It is 8.15 mb. The png from the raw images was 39.4 mb.

Christmas Cactus with new leaf from 14 stacked images. 135mm. ISO1600, 1/4 sec @ f6.7

Below is the best single image.

D Cox wrote:

The Raynox 250 is +8 dioptres if I remember correctly.

Yes, it is.

Thinking about it, +10 isn't much more than that, so perhaps +10 wouldn't be too bad for a beginner after all. Perhaps I got that wrong. That said, I do remember having a lot of trouble initially when I started out with a Raynox 250 as the first close-up lens I used, and I have come across others who had a similar experience. (But some people get on fine with the 250 straight away.)

As it happens for most of what I wanted to do with invertebrates the less powerful and easier to use Raynox 150 (+4.8) was more suitable, and that is often what I suggest to a beginner that they might start with if they are interested in photographing insects etc (but something less powerful around +2 or  +3 if they are more interested in flowers etc).