E-M1 II EVF brightness

Henry Richardson wrote:

A couple of weeks ago I got an E-M1 II. Like it a lot, of course, but I am somewhat disappointed in the EVF. I would rate it worse than my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) EVFs with regards to accuracy of the image that is recorded. It is a bit too bright and sort of washed out compared to the image displayed in playback on the rear screen and when displayed on the computer later. The rear display and my 2 computers match reasonably well. It is only the EVF that is not as good as I am accustomed to with m4/3 going back to 2012.

I looked through the menu and I found that in the cog menu there is something called EVF Auto Luminance and it was set to On. You have the option of turning it off and manually adjusting it. I tried that and for some scenes it is better, I think, but now, of course, it no longer auto adjusts so for some scenes it is even worse.

I checked my PEN-F and E-M10 II and they have the same EVF Auto Luminance option (except in the J menu) and it is set to On on both of them. Never had any problem with the EVF being a pretty close match to my rear screen and on the computer. With the E-M1 II pretty often white/brighter areas -- which are not blown out (I check the histogram) -- will lose detail in the EVF, but on playback on the rear screen and on the computer I verify there are no blown highlights and that, in fact, I can now see detail in those white/brighter areas.

For illustration purposes only, here are 2 photos that give you sort of an idea of what I often see. No blown highlights in either one. This is an uninteresting photo taken as a JPEG and how it looks on the rear screen and on the computer:

rear screen and computer

And here is approximately how it looks in the EVF:

EVF

Sometimes the EVF seems okay, but I guess that is because EVF Auto Luminance is On so it is dynamically adjusting. Sometimes it does a reasonably good job, often it does not though. All my other m4/3 cameras though do a good job.

Any ideas? Thanks!

Yes, the EVF can indicate exposure is off when the LCD playback shows its fine. I have just learned to ignore this and also to keep an eye on the histogram. I don't know how to "fix" this.

UrbanHobbit wrote:

I found the picture quality of the EVF of the E-M1 II to be washed out and low-res until I switched it from the higher fps setting to the lower one.

I cannot find an fps setting for the EVF in the menu. In D2 I found something called Frame Rate though and mine is already set to Normal, which is the default. The other choice is High. Is this what you are talking about?

Expecting the EVF to provide an accurate rendering of the image exposure and at the same time to match the rear screen may be expecting too much. The image in the EVF depends on the conversion of raw data to jpg. And so, I think the result also depends on your camera's jpg settings. I have always been more interested in an optimal raw exposure to the right, meaning full exposure with no blown highlights. I achieve this in the vast majority of my images by the use of the real-time histogram, post exposure histogram and the over-, under- warnings that appear in the EVF. In order to account for the fact that these histograms are also based on the jpg image, I adjust the camera's jpg parameters to give lower contrast, lowest sharpening, low saturation, etc. I find that the overexposure indicator is very accurate. In many cases, you can crank up the exposure till the overexposure index just appears in the EVF image; or, if you want to be more cautious, you can roll back the exposure 1/3 to1/2 stop.

for what its worth...

I usually shoot manual or aperture priority and I try to make the best of it.

I don't fully rely on the Evf or back screen for obvious reasons so for comparison I set my omd em1.2 on iAuto and take the same picture this kind of gives me an a rough idea of what the camera perceives (color wise) and what I perceive.  This at least allows me to compare the histogram and other settings.  I find it very useful.

just my 2 cents.

regards,

Henry Richardson wrote:

A couple of weeks ago I got an E-M1 II. Like it a lot, of course, but I am somewhat disappointed in the EVF. I would rate it worse than my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) EVFs with regards to accuracy of the image that is recorded. It is a bit too bright and sort of washed out compared to the image displayed in playback on the rear screen and when displayed on the computer later. The rear display and my 2 computers match reasonably well. It is only the EVF that is not as good as I am accustomed to with m4/3 going back to 2012.

I looked through the menu and I found that in the cog menu there is something called EVF Auto Luminance and it was set to On. You have the option of turning it off and manually adjusting it. I tried that and for some scenes it is better, I think, but now, of course, it no longer auto adjusts so for some scenes it is even worse.

I checked my PEN-F and E-M10 II and they have the same EVF Auto Luminance option (except in the J menu) and it is set to On on both of them. Never had any problem with the EVF being a pretty close match to my rear screen and on the computer. With the E-M1 II pretty often white/brighter areas -- which are not blown out (I check the histogram) -- will lose detail in the EVF, but on playback on the rear screen and on the computer I verify there are no blown highlights and that, in fact, I can now see detail in those white/brighter areas.

For illustration purposes only, here are 2 photos that give you sort of an idea of what I often see. No blown highlights in either one. This is an uninteresting photo taken as a JPEG and how it looks on the rear screen and on the computer:

rear screen and computer

And here is approximately how it looks in the EVF:

EVF

Sometimes the EVF seems okay, but I guess that is because EVF Auto Luminance is On so it is dynamically adjusting. Sometimes it does a reasonably good job, often it does not though. All my other m4/3 cameras though do a good job.

Any ideas? Thanks!

What lens and picture mode were you using? I’ve just gotten a used 14150 mark II and feel that the scenes are a bit washed out but had no sense of this before when using the 1245. I was using natural mode.

Alseyn wrote:

Pen-F and E-M10 II have OLED viewfinders. I was also disappointed with E-M1 II viewfinder when I switched from Pen-F. It was bigger yes but colors are way worse.

E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Nathaniel Alpert wrote:

Expecting the EVF to provide an accurate rendering of the image exposure and at the same time to match the rear screen may be expecting too much.

The EVFs of my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are fine, as I wrote in the first paragraph.

The image in the EVF depends on the conversion of raw data to jpg. And so, I think the result also depends on your camera's jpg settings. I have always been more interested in an optimal raw exposure to the right, meaning full exposure with no blown highlights. I achieve this in the vast majority of my images by the use of the real-time histogram, post exposure histogram and the over-, under- warnings that appear in the EVF. In order to account for the fact that these histograms are also based on the jpg image, I adjust the camera's jpg parameters to give lower contrast, lowest sharpening, low saturation, etc. I find that the overexposure indicator is very accurate. In many cases, you can crank up the exposure till the overexposure index just appears in the EVF image; or, if you want to be more cautious, you can roll back the exposure 1/3 to1/2 stop.

Michael Meissner wrote:

Note, the E-m1 mark II viewfinder uses a TFT LCD type display, similar to the display used in most cameras rear screen. The E-m1 mark I/III, E-m1x, E-m5 mark I/II, E-m10 mark I and Stylus-1 all use a similar screen.

The E-m10 mark II/III/IV, E-m5 mark III, and Pen-F all use a different type of screen (OLED).

The EVFs of my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are fine, as I wrote in the first paragraph. E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Typically the rear screen of Olympus cameras uses a TFT LCD display. The only two cases where I know Olympus used an OLED display is the E-m5 mark I and Tough TG-2.

One 'feature' of TFT LCD screens is that if you wear polarized sunglasses, one orientation has distortions or is completely opaque while the other orientation is fine. For Olympus viewfinders (including the old VF-2/VF-3/VF-4) the problematical orientation is horizontal or landscape orientation. For the rear display, the problematical orientation is vertical or portrait orientation.

With the exception of the E-m5 mark II and the VF-2/VF-3/VF-4 external viewfinders, I tend to see the distortion in the viewfinder as being horizontal waves, where some parts of the screen are readable, and others are not. When I tested them, the E-m5 mark II and the VF-2 viewfinders were completely opaque when I used polarized sunglasses. I find in practice, if I use a single focus point in the area that is not distorted, I can get shots letting the camera autofocus. I would not be able to manually focus with the distortion (but I rarely use manual focusing anyway).

Due to photophobia being a major migraine trigger for me, I need to wear polarized sunglasses all of the time when I'm outdoors in daylight, so for me this is an important issue. Others just take off the sunglasses to shot.

As to why Olympus uses the TFT LCD viewfinders in the higher end (and older) cameras is that they can get a faster refresh rate with TFT LCD (120fps for the E-m1 mark II if memory serves compared to 60fps). When I tested my E-m1 mark II, I found that the camera used about 16% more power when I used the higher refresh rate. Note, there are other cameras (notably the Panasonic G9) that claims to have OLED displays with faster refresh rates. Olympus does not seem to use these types of displays.

I have talked to other migraine sufferers that didn't need the polarized sunglasses, but for them the faster refresh rates were important, and they liked the TFT LCD displays for that reason. I think in older cameras, Olympus used 30fps for the OLED displays and 60fps for the TFT LCD displays.

I find in general, that cameras with OLED viewfinders (or OLED rear displays like the E-m5 mark I) that the colors seem to be a little supersaturated. I mentally have to tone down the saturation when I'm trying to evaluate what the photo will look like, or if I liked the saturation, I would have to bump up the levels in post processing.

Back when I got my refurbished E-m5 mark I, I had the viewfinder fail on me when I went on a vacation to Disney World in 2014 (just t the 90 day mark where the normal warranty expired). In this case, the backlight on the display failed, which meant I could bearly read the display. Fortunately the camera was covered under the extended warranty I bought, and when I got home from the trip, I sent it in and got it repaired. It is still working as of 2021.

Perhaps in your E-m1 mark II the backlight has failed. I've seen another report of the E-m1 mark II viewfinder fail in this way, so perhaps there was a bad batch made. While I recently bought an E-m1 mark II, I haven't used it that much due to covid issues as well as other health issues that kept me house bound.

FWIW, OLED displays do not use a backlight, so they wouldn't see this type of issue. Also OLED displays tend to show true black better than TFT LCD displays.

Henry Richardson wrote:

Alseyn wrote:

Pen-F and E-M10 II have OLED viewfinders. I was also disappointed with E-M1 II viewfinder when I switched from Pen-F. It was bigger yes but colors are way worse.

E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Alseyn said em10 mk Ii, which does have an OLED evf

victorav wrote:

Henry Richardson wrote:

Alseyn wrote:

Pen-F and E-M10 II have OLED viewfinders. I was also disappointed with E-M1 II viewfinder when I switched from Pen-F. It was bigger yes but colors are way worse.

E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Alseyn said em10 mk Ii, which does have an OLED evf

Yes, I know that.  He didn't seem to have read the first paragraph of my post though.  So, saying this is an OLED vs. LCD issue is incorrect.

The EVFs of my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are fine, as I wrote in the first paragraph. E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

I have the EVF set to auto luminance, off; evf adjust temp+1 brightness -1. Elsewhere, 'keep warm colours, off.

Works for me and I think it is an excellent viewfinder and far better than on my Sony A7III. I do find that set as above the viewfinder accurately reflects the captured image. As well as any of my Panasonics.

Henry Richardson wrote:

victorav wrote:

Henry Richardson wrote:

Alseyn wrote:

Pen-F and E-M10 II have OLED viewfinders. I was also disappointed with E-M1 II viewfinder when I switched from Pen-F. It was bigger yes but colors are way worse.

E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Alseyn said em10 mk Ii, which does have an OLED evf

Yes, I know that. He didn't seem to have read the first paragraph of my post though. So, saying this is an OLED vs. LCD issue is incorrect.

The EVFs of my PEN-F, E-M10 II, E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are fine, as I wrote in the first paragraph. E-M10, E-M5, and GX7 II (GX85) are not OLED.

Ah I see sorry.

Aberaeron wrote:

I have the EVF set to auto luminance, off; evf adjust temp+1 brightness -1. Elsewhere, 'keep warm colours, off.

I played around with turning off Auto Luminance yesterday, but I will play some more today with it. In my quick check yesterday I saw that for some scenes it was better than having it On (On is turned on by default from the factory for all my Olympus cameras). I did notice that for some scenes though having it Off resulted in a worse view, but this was just a quick check. I will do more today. Thanks for the suggestion.

Works for me and I think it is an excellent viewfinder and far better than on my Sony A7III. I do find that set as above the viewfinder accurately reflects the captured image. As well as any of my Panasonics.

Thanks, again. I will spend some time with Auto Luminance turned Off today and hope that the result is much better. It is strange that Auto Luminance is On by default on my E-M10, E-M10 II, PEN-F, and E-M5 and I never had a problem with it on those cameras.  Only the E-M1 II.