Macro working distance 30mm vs 45mm vs 60mm and focus breathing

I have had my Olympus 60mm since 7 years now and used it extensively underwater

There have been situations (not macro targets) where I felt the angle of view was too narrow underwater so I recently procured a Panasonic 45mm.

Finally this week I have also acquired the 30mm 2.8 macro for tabletop photography

Reading the specs you see that the working distance is respectively

19 cm for the 60mm

15 cm for the 45mm

10.5 cm for the 30mm

What is not that obvious is that this distance is from the focal plane not from the front of the lens so once you subtract the lens size the actual working distances are

87mm for the 60mm

65.6mm for the 45mm

24mm for the 30mm

The 30mm needs you to be on top of subjects and is clearly a good choice for things that do not move however is a bit surprising that the increased working distance between the 45mm and 60mm is only 21.4 mm

When you are far away from targets the difference of field of view is obvious however as you get close the benefit is somehow lost.

I believe this is due to the effective focal length dropping more for the 60mm than the 45mm as you get closer so the increased focus breathing and size of the lens eats out the working distance as you get to 1:2 or 1:1 reproduction ratio.

I thought it was interesting to share this as I have found that except for small bugs 45mm is more effective for close up work of flowers where you need more field of view

Interceptor121 wrote:

I believe this is due to the effective focal length dropping more for the 60mm than the 45mm as you get closer so the increased focus breathing and size of the lens eats out the working distance as you get to 1:2 or 1:1 reproduction ratio.

You can tell this is the case by the minimum focus distance.  At 1:1, a symmetrical 60mm lens would have a subject distance to sensor distance of 240mm instead of 190mm.  Designing focal length breathing into the lens allows it to be smaller, focus more quickly, and provide a larger effective aperture at macro distances, which is why almost all modern macro lenses are designed that way.

Samyang makes a 100mm macro in MFT mount, but it's manual focus.  My "solution," such as it is, is to use a Nikon 105mm f/2.8 on a Viltrox NF-M1 adapter.  My SIgma 180mm f/2.8, is, alas, not compatible with that device.

Chris DC wrote:

I currently own and use the Oly 60mm macro, the Sigma 105mm macro (43rds mount) and the Sigma 150mm macro (43rds mount).

Each has its merits and unique uses. I love the extra working distance of the Sigmas and I love the in-camera focus stacking and auto focus bracketing of the Olympus 60mm.

The Sigma 105 and the Oly 60 extend when focusing close. The Sigma 150 does not extend (at least externally the lens overall length does not change).

All three work very well on the EM1x which has capable PDAF focus.

I look forward to the Oly 100mm macro.

Chris DC

Interesting to look at this

https://photonstophotos.net/GeneralTopics/Lenses/OpticalBench/OpticalBench.htm

The olympus 60mm goes from 60mm to 37mm when it goes from infinity to 1:1 ratio 61%

The sigma 150mm becomes a 78mm lens ratio 52%

The panasonic 45mm from 45mm to 33mm ratio 73%

So your sigma has more focus breathing than the Olympus 60mm which in turn has more than the Panasonic 45mm. At 1:1 distance the real focal length ratio between the olympus 60mm and the panasonic 45mm has increased from 75% to 90% so in effect there is very little left in it

The panasonic lens is also smaller so am not totally bought into the idea that more focus breathing makes the lens smaller. The Olympus lens is sharper across almost the entire field of view the panasonic instead drops at the edges

The 30mm lens is optically better than both but you are just too close for comfort

All lenses work fine with focus bracketing on my G9

Chris DC wrote:

Are you saying you have the Sigma 150 in the 43rds mount and that focus bracketing works on the G9?

On the Oly cameras, only a select few mFT lenses will bracket focus.

CDC

No the MFT lenses all work regardless of brand

43 lenses may work but don’t support CAF so I have not explored that route I have a canon 8-15mm EF mount that I use underwater in saf depth of field is immense so no problems

I would prefer a 100mm native lens so that all functionality works

Chris DC wrote:

Are you saying you have the Sigma 150 in the 43rds mount and that focus bracketing works on the G9?

On the Oly cameras, only a select few mFT lenses will bracket focus.

CDC

Focus bracketing should work with any AF lens . In-camera focus stacking is limited to a certain set of lenses .

DonBMichigan wrote:

Chris DC wrote:

Are you saying you have the Sigma 150 in the 43rds mount and that focus bracketing works on the G9?

On the Oly cameras, only a select few mFT lenses will bracket focus.

CDC

Focus bracketing should work with any AF lens . In-camera focus stacking is limited to a certain set of lenses .

Do they need to be MFT though as it needs to be able to control the steps on the motor no just to get in focus?

Interceptor121 wrote:

DonBMichigan wrote:

Chris DC wrote:

Are you saying you have the Sigma 150 in the 43rds mount and that focus bracketing works on the G9?

On the Oly cameras, only a select few mFT lenses will bracket focus.

CDC

Focus bracketing should work with any AF lens . In-camera focus stacking is limited to a certain set of lenses .

Do they need to be MFT though as it needs to be able to control the steps on the motor no just to get in focus?

I don't know! I've used 4 different MFT lenses and those have worked. Not sure if other adapted mounts work...

Interesting to know thank you